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Will you buy in now seeing it's possible at some point in the future?

  • Yes. That was the main thing holding me back.

    Votes: 5 5.0%
  • Yes, but I need more improvements first.

    Votes: 18 17.8%
  • Unsure. I will wait and see

    Votes: 26 25.7%
  • No. I will never buy into VR.

    Votes: 52 51.5%

  • Total voters
    101

ClarkusDarkus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,725
If my arguments are so 2016 and VR had solved all the issues then you should have a single headset to show me that does that without lame insults.

The criteria you speak of is straight up what we all heard in 2016, Cost, Motion sickness, Comfort of wear.

The cost is ridiculously cheaper now compared to what it was in 2016, Motion sickness is minor and happens to people who play pancake gaming still, And the PSVR/Quest has glasses spacers.

Mate whatever happens, I truly hope VR/AR reaches a point where you can jump in and enjoy it.
 
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DarthBuzzard

DarthBuzzard

Banned
Jul 17, 2018
5,122
It helps a bit in that I won't bump in to them as quickly, but nah not really, I'd still be wearing a helmet and won't really be there when they look at or try to talk to me.
You would be there because your visual and auditory systems would be engaged with them, if you headphones pick up background noise.
 

Cyclonesweep

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
7,690
The criteria you speak of is straight up what we all heard in 2016, Cost, Motion sickness, Comfort of wear.

The cost is ridiculously cheaper now compared to what it was in 2016, Motion sickness is minor and happens to people who play pancake gaming still, And the PSVR/Quest has glasses spacers.

Mate whatever happens, I truly hope VR/AR reaches a point where you can jump in and enjoy it.
So Occulus Quest is cheap, most people do not get motion sickness, has great non gimmicky games, fits comfortable and isnt uncomfortable to wear with great audio?
 

Finalrush

Member
Dec 7, 2017
729
That's false. You can walk around like a normal human in VR in the same space as you so in VR. Why do you have to make up things just to make one look better than the other? I posted a gif in this thread showing this, but apparently most people here love to ignore all the gifs I post.

And no, most of what I mentioned was not largely visual. Headaches/eye-strain certainly aren't. Hand tracking is a form of input. Eye tracking has non-visual uses. Body tracking is both visual and psychological. If people are scared of VR, they'll be less so when they actually have a proper body inside as it's more natural.

If people don't want to opt in because they need some AR features, they'll be more tempted to opt in to the device, which means VR gets a higher installbase. The whole point is you can shift to whatever you want. We can argue semantics, and you are right in that, but that's never been the core issue here.

Easily, no to make it less isolating? That's a weird statement. You can argue how much it helps, but surely it helps at least a little which would make your statement hyperbolic.
Ok first off you need to stop accusing people of lying when you misunderstand them. You can have an AR app take place in an entire city, and you can walk around like a normal human, meaning you're not relegated to a little VR room. If it's like your example, that is AR, not VR.

Second paragraph didn't even try to respond to my point but nitpicked my semantics. The point I was making is we need actual physical movement to be comfortable and able to expand outside of a space set up specifically for VR.

For the last point, VR and AR are a *bit* of a spectrum but not entirely. People enjoy the real world. AR adds to the real world, VR substitutes. The substitute needs to match or exceed what it is substituting before I believe it will become mainstream. That goal is decades off.

I almost feel like what you're really asking at this point is "would people like VR more if it was AR?".
 
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DarthBuzzard

DarthBuzzard

Banned
Jul 17, 2018
5,122
I've worked in both VR/AR, so I have some experience with them and also a lot of experience with seeing peoples' reactions to both, as well as the drawbacks. A big part of AR enjoyment is experiencing/enjoying the AR world, then turning away from that AR experience to react/discuss with friends, and in that moment you're back out of it. People are very excited to *try* VR because it's new tech, but they're not very likely to want to continuously use it. And the novelty of enjoying it requires each person to have a headset, while AR's enjoyment of mixed reality can be had even viewing it on a 2D screen.


Not sure if I get what this is saying. The OP's question was about VR, not AR, so I'm not sure I know what you're getting at.
That's not true unless everyone has their own AR device. Alex Kipman talked about this before, about how his wife felt disconnected from him using HoloLens. Quite literally you have the HoloLens project lead disagreeing with you.

If you want to go with the argument of VR not being enjoyable for those around you, the same is true of AR. Both can be fixed by engaging them through party apps/games or asymmetrical gameplay.
 

Kinggroin

Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
6,392
Uranus, get it?!? YOUR. ANUS.
I think the ability to make the VR go away in an instant and see through the visor as normal glasses with an AR UI overlay, would be a huge step in the right direction. Another function I'd love to see would be "the knock" a way for people outside of the VR to call your attention without touching or approaching you. It would be like a b bluetooth button you set up nearby. That way if your kids or loved ones need you for something, they can knock and pull you out of the game without risking injury and without startling you. The above seems a bit awkward to me.

Yeah the knock is already a thing.

If you're in VR on PC, someone hits a button on the keyboard a knocking sound and notifiyshow up in your world
 

ClarkusDarkus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,725
So Occulus Quest is cheap, most people do not get motion sickness, has great non gimmicky games, fits comfortable and isnt uncomfortable to wear with great audio?

PSVR also fits that criteria too, If anything it's still the most comftable wearing headset depending on size of you're dome. You keep bringing up Motion sickness like your a GP or something. 2016 all over again, Dont you use your own headset for audio?
 

Cyclonesweep

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
7,690
Everyone I know who has bought VR probably touches it once every month for 30 and remembered that it was uninteresting.

I'm done with this.

VR is fun tech that for most people get bored of relatively quick that after some playing with I and many others have little to no interest want or need in.

Cool for the niche boring for the majority.
 

Garcia el Gringo

Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,661
NJ
Add me to the camp of already owning a PSVR, but don't play it as much because I can't communicate to people I live with easily, and because I can't access social media messaging easily, which I do predominantly on my phone - basically it's a dealbreaker often that I'm cut off from my phone when using PSVR.

If I did VR on PC, the messaging thing would be solved for me.
 

Finalrush

Member
Dec 7, 2017
729
That's not true unless everyone has their own AR device. Alex Kipman talked about this before, about how his wife felt disconnected from him using HoloLens. Quite literally you have the HoloLens project lead disagreeing with you.

If you want to go with the argument of VR not being enjoyable for those around you, the same is true of AR. Both can be fixed by engaging them through party apps/games or asymmetrical gameplay.
You do realize AR is also on phones, tablets, and laptops and not just headsets right? That was my point.

PS. Your argument is that VR can be less isolating with the ability to see family but now you're telling me even in AR where you can see your family it's isolating?
 
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DarthBuzzard

DarthBuzzard

Banned
Jul 17, 2018
5,122
Everyone I know who has bought VR probably touches it once every month for 30 and remembered that it was uninteresting.

I'm done with this.

VR is fun tech that for most people get bored of relatively quick that after some playing with I and many others have little to no interest want or need in.

Cool for the niche boring for the majority.
That's exactly how usage of consoles, PCs, and smartphones were like in the early days. People aren't using VR that often? Total shocker. Or it would be if I didn't already know the obvious and expectation of any fledgling technology.
 
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DarthBuzzard

DarthBuzzard

Banned
Jul 17, 2018
5,122
You do realize AR is also on phones, tablets, and laptops and not just headsets right? That was my point.

PS. Your argument is that VR can be less isolating with the ability to see family but now you're telling me even in AR where you can see your family it's isolating?
Yes, however that's a stop-gap. Glasses AR is meant to outright replace mobile AR.
 

Finalrush

Member
Dec 7, 2017
729
Fair enough. I just wanted to point out that AR and VR HMDs have that same issue there.
I agree, honestly I wasn't even thinking of HMDs cause I see one of ARs advantages being that you don't need one to enjoy it.

Find me people using PCs often in the 70s. Many people back then thought the main use was to store recipes on them.
Ehhh this is shaky reasoning because lots of things people don't use consistently also just don't catch on.
 

Cyclonesweep

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
7,690
Find me people using PCs often in the 70s. Many people back then thought the main use was to store recipes on them.
Sigh.

You go on and say that people should have no issues with VR cause all those issues don't actually matter or exist because they are being worked on so there is no issues. Constantly handwaving legit issues away.

Then now there are issues but it's okay because this new.

VR is new tech that is a massive gimmick at the moment and does not have mainstream interest because of the multitude of issues with it which can be fixed but won't be in the near future.

That's it that's all.
 

chrisypoo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,457
I often feel like taking the VR leap could be fun, but I have a little girl that's going on 8 soon, and I feel that playing VR games instead of spending more time with her/watching her in general would just make me seem like such a sad individual. If she could be more involved somehow, then yeah I do think it would appeal to me more. The biggest turn off about VR is definitely that it just kind of has that sad lonely basement dweller kind of connotation to it, just for me personally. Not calling VR enthusiasts here that, it's just that's how I know I'd see myself if I were to use it, and I just don't want to be that kind of father.

I remember my first wife's dad being something of a WoW addict, and despite being a huge gaming enthusiast, I found him really pathetic. Every time I'd go over to her house to pick her up, he'd be down in his basement with his two ferrets and his multiple screens just playing WoW, and his daughters never saw him. When he did come up every once in a while, there was definitely an air of disrespect shown to him from his daughters, and the whole thing just kind of bothered me. I worry sometimes about turning out to be that kind of dad, as I love gaming too and I'm definitely susceptible to losing some hours to it. As such, I've made real efforts to make gaming a much more inclusive and social activity in my home, so I'd need VR to fit that as well for me to truly adopt it.
 
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DarthBuzzard

DarthBuzzard

Banned
Jul 17, 2018
5,122
Sigh.

You go on and say that people should have no issues with VR cause all those issues don't actually matter or exist because they are being worked on so there is no issues. Constantly handwaving legit issues away.

Then now there are issues but it's okay because this new.

VR is new tech that is a massive gimmick at the moment and does not have mainstream interest because of the multitude of issues with it which can be fixed but won't be in the near future.

That's it that's all.
I never said there are no issues. I even literally stated there are issues in the simpleist way one could, and given the overall positive consensus from those that have tried VR, few people that have tried high-end headsets see it as a gimmick.
 

Godzilla24

Member
Nov 12, 2017
3,371
Sitting back and reading lots of these responses just reinforces that so many share my views of VR in general. It just has a long long ways to go.
 

ClarkusDarkus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,725
Sigh.

You go on and say that people should have no issues with VR cause all those issues don't actually matter or exist because they are being worked on so there is no issues. Constantly handwaving legit issues away.

Then now there are issues but it's okay because this new.

VR is new tech that is a massive gimmick at the moment and does not have mainstream interest because of the multitude of issues with it which can be fixed but won't be in the near future.

That's it that's all.
You keep reverting back to 2016, Now your at gimmick levels.


VR isn't just about gaming, Mainstream applies to other caveats.

Everyone I know who has bought VR probably touches it once every month for 30 and remembered that it was uninteresting.

I'm done with this.

Clearly not.
 

Cyclonesweep

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
7,690
You keep reverting back to 2016, Now your at gimmick levels.


VR isn't just about gaming, Mainstream applies to other caveats.



Clearly not.
Oh wow an article about the future! I literally said a gimmick at the moment. Maybe you need to learn to reading comprehension again

Also what's with your obsession with 2016? Is that the last time you left VR?

Enjoy your cult
 

Hokey

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,164
The issue with VR for me has always been the wearing of bulky equipment, I don't mind holding a controller but I don't want to really wear anything else unless it is some very light clothing (like gloves, light glasses).
 

ClarkusDarkus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,725
Oh wow an article about the future! I literally said a gimmick at the moment. Maybe you need to learn to reading comprehension again

Also what's with your obsession with 2016? Is that the last time you left VR?

Enjoy your cult

You took us on that trip down memory lane with the inane rhetoric regurgitated, Since your in 2016 let us know the Tflops of this PS4pro they mentioned.
 

Cyclonesweep

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
7,690
User Banned (1 week): Antagonising other members over a series of posts
You took us on that trip down memory lane with the inane rhetoric regurgitated, Since your in 2016 let us know the Tflops of this PS4pro they mentioned.
Since you are in the future how is it being with your VR girlfriend? Does she make your haptic body suit tingle?
 

ClarkusDarkus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,725
The issue with VR for me has always been the wearing of bulky equipment, I don't mind holding a controller but I don't want to really wear anything else unless it is some very light clothing (like gloves, light glasses).

But to reach those levels you have to go through each gen. Iterating upwards. And to be fair the PSVR is actually not heavy at all on your dome.

Since you are in the future how is it being with your VR girlfriend? Does she make your haptic body suit tingle?

Says the guy in the past still using chaterbate and running out of swipes on tinder, You was done 30 mins ago and here you are still insulting.
 

Cyclonesweep

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
7,690
But to reach those levels you have to go through each gen. Iterating upwards. And to be fair the PSVR is actually not heavy at all on your dome.



Says the guy in the past still using chaterbate and running out of swipes on tinder, You was done 30 mins ago and here you are still insulting.
You come at me I come at you. Simple as that prick
 

Hokey

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,164
Then VR is for you! Cause in the future it's all possible and more!
I actually really like augmented reality because it still allows you to see the world around you, I kinda feel like VR should've been a bridge between normal displays and AR but it seems they've all developed their own markets so there is room for all however I prolly won't get into VR until all the equipment is wire free and very light.
 

ClarkusDarkus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,725
You've been a prick since you entered this coversation and you know it

You mentioned VR is a gimmick not me, Which we heard in 2016, How is that coming at you when here you are calling names and degrading VR to gimmick talk while getting aggressive. How can one be a prick just entering a conversation, Seems to me you just don't like VR and get aggressive when someone proves you wrong.

Now this looks like an old VR thread on Resetera. It's been a while.

Like i keep telling him, It's 2016 all over again.
 

blitzblake

Banned
Jan 4, 2018
3,171
This and wireless and I'm in. I just don't wanna be caught with my pants down and a hdmi cord wrapped around my dick.
 

SweetBellic

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,414
VR, in its current form, sucks with or without AR. The reason it is such an unsatisfying experience has nothing to do with isolation and everything to do with the fact that you have to drape some cumbersome piece of hardware onto your head that, in my experience, has a tendency to fog up and capture condensation on your face after extended sessions. How anyone finds that remotely enjoyable is beyond me.

Another problem with VR (at least for gaming) is the absence of high fidelity games, or any compelling apps really. Sure, there are great games on the platform, but everything I've played in VR, such as Thumper or RE7, has been much more enjoyable playing in higher resolution with better IQ on a TV/monitor without some bulky, increasingly damp headset and wires all around my face. VR hasn't been an enhancement, but a hindrance to my enjoyment of these games.

So to answer your question, OP, AR enhancements will not suffice to get me to invest my time or money into VR. It would be a necessary feature for me for sure, not because I need to see anyone (I usually game alone in my office anyway), but to see the drinks and snacks I consume during a long stretch of vidya. However, I would also need VR "headsets" to be much less obtrusive and as easy to put on and remove as a pair of contact lenses. And they will also need to be capable of high fidelity graphics as well (I need to feel like I'm there in a living, breathing world--not the jaggy, blurry, or basic looking crap we're getting now). Not sure I see that happening in my lifetime but would love to be wrong.
 
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DarthBuzzard

DarthBuzzard

Banned
Jul 17, 2018
5,122
VR, in its current form, sucks with or without AR. The reason it is such an unsatisfying experience has nothing to do with isolation and everything to do with the fact that you have to drape some cumbersome piece of hardware onto your head that, in my experience, has a tendency to fog up and capture condensation on your face after extended sessions. How anyone finds that remotely enjoyable is beyond me.

Another problem with VR (at least for gaming) is the absence of high fidelity games, or any compelling apps really. Sure, there are great games on the platform, but everything I've played in VR, such as Thumper or RE7, has been much more enjoyable playing in higher resolution with better IQ on a TV/monitor without some bulky, increasingly damp headset and wires all around my face. VR hasn't been an enhancement, but a hindrance to my enjoyment of these games.

So to answer your question, OP, AR enhancements will not suffice to get me to invest my time or money into VR. It would be a necessary feature for me for sure, not because I need to see anyone (I usually game alone in my office anyway), but to see the drinks and snacks I consume during a long stretch of vidya. However, I would also need VR "headsets" to be much less obtrusive and as easy to put on and remove as a pair of contact lenses. And they will also need to be capable of high fidelity graphics as well (I need to feel like I'm there in a living, breathing world--not the jaggy, blurry, or basic looking crap we're getting now). Not sure I see that happening in my lifetime but would love to be wrong.
Sounds like you have a rare view. I get your take on RE7 because it shows it's low resolution, but Thumper is quite crisp in VR. Not 1080p crisp, but nothing that I've ever seen someone complain about. If you still need more pixels there, then a HP Reverb would likely satisfy anyone's standards for Thumper.

There are a bunch of amazing VR games including true GOTY contenders like Astro Bot, but for you, comfort appears to be destroying the experience.

Contact lenses will do, but sunglasses won't? There's little difference in comfort as you'd potentially not even notice wearing anything when you are in a state of presence.
 
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Linkeds2

Member
Nov 15, 2017
453
North Bay, CA
VR is still novelty and the fact that family/friends have it would support my decision to not buy one because I could just play it for a bit when visiting them
 

Waffle

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,823
I never understood this problem personally, because most people I've seen just focus on their games and Oculus and Valve are both going for audio solutions that don't cover your ears so you'd be able to hear the people in the same room fine. Also, Vive always had this and now Oculus does too, where you can easily get a view of the real world through the cameras. Plus it's not like it takes real effort to lift the headset off your face to address something. Couch co-op I can kinda understand, but do people really need more than the stuff listed above to have an experience similar to when they play games like Uncharted or other single player games or online games?
 

jrDev

Banned
Mar 2, 2018
1,528
Watch it be 10 years after VR launches and it still doesn't catch on...I think it will forever be a niche...AR seems to be a more mainstream viable...
 
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DarthBuzzard

DarthBuzzard

Banned
Jul 17, 2018
5,122
Watch it be 10 years after VR launches and it still doesn't catch on...I think it will forever be a niche...AR seems to be a more mainstream viable...
Their fates are pretty closely tied together though, and since VR has a lot of general use for consumers and enterprise alike, it only seems likely that it will be hugely mainstream at some point.
 

Aztechnology

Community Resettler
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
14,139
Sounds like you have a rare view. I get your take on RE7 because it shows it's low resolution, but Thumper is quite crisp in VR. Not 1080p crisp, but nothing that I've ever seen someone complain about. If you still need more pixels there, then a HP Reverb would likely satisfy anyone's standards for Thumper.

There are a bunch of amazing VR games including true GOTY contenders like Astro Bot, but for you, comfort appears to be destroying the experience.

Contact lenses will do, but sunglasses won't? There's little difference in comfort as you'd potentially not even notice wearing anything when you are in a state of presence.
Not true for me glasses fog up, eyelashes brush the lenses with oil etc. I need Lasik and VR will probably be the reason i finally got pushed over the edge.
 

Prine

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
15,724
Their fates are pretty closely tied together though, and since VR has a lot of general use for consumers and enterprise alike, it only seems likely that it will be hugely mainstream at some point.
Doubtful, its application isnt for the gaming mainstream. Education perhaps.
 
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DarthBuzzard

DarthBuzzard

Banned
Jul 17, 2018
5,122
Doubtful, its application isnt for the gaming mainstream. Education perhaps.
Consumers can use it for telepresence, socialization, media consumption and computing, entertainment, art expression, and more. It has more uses than any device we use today, so that's a pretty good advantage for it's adoption rate.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,681
The Quest has been pretty good for me in terms of reducing isolation. Even with the volume turned way up you can still hear what's happening around you, and sticking your head through the guardian flips over to the passthrough camera pretty seamlessly. I've been using the Quest much more than I used my old Rift since my wife can come up and talk to me without startling me while I'm using the headset.

Besides, not having to fiddle with cameras or the setup on my PC means that it's much less of an issue to just pop off the headset for a few minutes if someone needs me and then pop it back on.

Index is doing the same thing. I think this is the direction future headsets are heading in with the headphones audible but away from your ears so you can still hear the real world. And the valve index headphones get super loud too without others being able to hear. TBH I'm not sure how they do it