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Those of us who lived through PS2's dominance of the sixth gen should count ourselves as lucky
- Thread starter ScOULaris
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PS2 wasn't even the best thing that gen, it was the gamecube because it has F-Zero GX also known as the best racing game ever made.
I do agree however, that there definitely seems to be a lack of smaller scale games nowadays. A lot of the times it feels like things are either indie or huge projects, there seems to be no middle ground at times.
I do agree however, that there definitely seems to be a lack of smaller scale games nowadays. A lot of the times it feels like things are either indie or huge projects, there seems to be no middle ground at times.
Videogames are such a recent thing that if you were born in the 70s you can have experienced the whole thing from beginning to present.
PS2 and the DS were really the peak for variety for a console and I agree that they were amazing. Specifically on those two platforms the amount of new A, AA and AAA content the was being released consistently was amazing. Every genre was so well covered.
The Xbox was pretty cutting edge at that time and the GameCube probably had the best value of any console in a long time. They always had deals on the Cube where you could get a new one with an extra controller and Mario Kart for $99. That is almost the price of a PS5 game these days!
PS2 and the DS were really the peak for variety for a console and I agree that they were amazing. Specifically on those two platforms the amount of new A, AA and AAA content the was being released consistently was amazing. Every genre was so well covered.
The Xbox was pretty cutting edge at that time and the GameCube probably had the best value of any console in a long time. They always had deals on the Cube where you could get a new one with an extra controller and Mario Kart for $99. That is almost the price of a PS5 game these days!
I love the PS2 library but the system itself is kind of dreadful. The image quality on all PS2 models is just dark, blurry and awful and it only really looked passable on a 480i composite input and the lack of any anti aliasing made games played on anything sharper than that look awful. PS2 and Xbox versions of games literally looked a generation apart sometimes. Makes it a real bummer trying to revisit PS2 today unless you have a CRT, whereas GameCube and Xbox can both look pretty decent on a modern TV.
Still that library overall is amazing, I just recommend playing any third party that released elsewhere there instead, especially original Xbox.
Still that library overall is amazing, I just recommend playing any third party that released elsewhere there instead, especially original Xbox.
I found that the PS2 gen had less of the 2D-style games I like, whereas modern games have way more of a variety of those being put out again due to the indie resurgence that followed the digital distribution that goes hand in hand with all the downsides of the modern era too. If you liked mid-budget 3D games though, PS2 was obviously really good. There's a far greater variety now as long as you look outside of the much smaller range of mid-to-high budget games that come on discs.
The PS1 era is the era you should feel fortunate enough to live through. There was so much absolute garbage that got thrown out there that I can live through anything now. Anthem wasn't a bad game when you lived through stuff like this.
I bought this game and fully understand the suffering you went through, I remember struggling to pretend it wasn't awful and that I hadn't wasted my money.
And that's just the worst game my memory isn't repressing. There were worse games than that.
GT 7 and Forza 8 are coming.
Ace Combat 7 came out in 2019.
There is a new Dark Alliance announced, but the trailer looked pretty bad.
So you're right, there are solid equivalents for most games in the OP.
I know I'm probably in the minority, but when I see this picture posted it does nothing for me - I didn't at the time, nor do I now find it that impressive. I played GT3, GTA3, MGS2, and Silent Hill 2 at or shortly after launch (thanks to my brother's PS2) and think they're great games, but I don't have any reverence for the PS2 or it's library.
This picture shows up a lot online when discussing the PS2's legendary library, and this was only one year into its historic run.
After the failure of the Dreamcast, I switched to PC gaming and mostly viewed this console generation from the sidelines with indifference. Because of my biased viewpoint I tend to think of PC having the definitive best library this gen, and I consider myself lucky to have had a capable gaming PC at the time.
This picture shows up a lot online when discussing the PS2's legendary library, and this was only one year into its historic run.
If anyone ever wonders why the PS2 was such a hit, this image sums it up. Sure, the DVD player at the time was compelling, but as usual, it was the software.
Ico, Jak and Daxter, Metal Gear Solid 2, Silent Hill 2, Final Fantasy X, Gran Turismo 3, and Grand Theft Auto III....all in the first year of the PS2's life - and all exclusive. That kind of exclusive lineup in the first year of a console's life is just unheard of these days.
Sixth gen was great but not perfect. And I am not a fan of the ps2 being the most remembered console of the sixth gen, it was far from perfect and while gaming was great on the sixth gen we also had.
- Worst IQ of all the sixth gen consoles. Almost all games looked muddy even on a good CRT. In retrospective the sixth gen would be much better remembered if all those ps2 third party only games were released on the Xbox and Gamecube.
- The sixth gen was the start of the gray/brown military shooter era fueled by 9/11. Its amazing how people always associate this with the 360 and ps3 but forget about the tons of military shooters and "realistic" GTA clones that were released on the ps2.
- A general dudebro/thug/gangsta aesthetic during that era fueled by all those terrible GTA clones/Fast and Furious and 50 cent and the like.
- A generation where save some exceptions high end 2D gaming died. You wanted 2D games, you had to get a portable system.
- I think that the sixth generation can be split in 2: From 1999 to 2003 and 2003 to say 2008: At first I think we had the best games of the era, all those colourful arcade perfect games on the Dreamcast, plus stuff like Shenmue and Code Veronica. Then the wonderful 2001 on the ps2 plus the arrival of the GameCube and Xbox. Japanese devs were still really strong. But then on the second half of the generation I noticed that western devs started to dominate consoles and japanese devs started releasing run of the mill JRPGs and catering to their home market gradually reducing their footprint on the best sellers of each console I think the crisis of japanese gaming associated with the seventh gen really started during the second half of the first.
- LOTS of shovelwhare and licensed titles by the hundreds. Yeah, we all want AA games to make a comeback. But at times this meant having console games for everything, the type of games you now find on the Google Play store (Crazy Frog, EVERY single Pixar movie released, TV series and more)
- Genres dying or almost dead during the second half of the sixth gen like Survival Horror and Fighting games.
- Worst IQ of all the sixth gen consoles. Almost all games looked muddy even on a good CRT. In retrospective the sixth gen would be much better remembered if all those ps2 third party only games were released on the Xbox and Gamecube.
- The sixth gen was the start of the gray/brown military shooter era fueled by 9/11. Its amazing how people always associate this with the 360 and ps3 but forget about the tons of military shooters and "realistic" GTA clones that were released on the ps2.
- A general dudebro/thug/gangsta aesthetic during that era fueled by all those terrible GTA clones/Fast and Furious and 50 cent and the like.
- A generation where save some exceptions high end 2D gaming died. You wanted 2D games, you had to get a portable system.
- I think that the sixth generation can be split in 2: From 1999 to 2003 and 2003 to say 2008: At first I think we had the best games of the era, all those colourful arcade perfect games on the Dreamcast, plus stuff like Shenmue and Code Veronica. Then the wonderful 2001 on the ps2 plus the arrival of the GameCube and Xbox. Japanese devs were still really strong. But then on the second half of the generation I noticed that western devs started to dominate consoles and japanese devs started releasing run of the mill JRPGs and catering to their home market gradually reducing their footprint on the best sellers of each console I think the crisis of japanese gaming associated with the seventh gen really started during the second half of the first.
- LOTS of shovelwhare and licensed titles by the hundreds. Yeah, we all want AA games to make a comeback. But at times this meant having console games for everything, the type of games you now find on the Google Play store (Crazy Frog, EVERY single Pixar movie released, TV series and more)
- Genres dying or almost dead during the second half of the sixth gen like Survival Horror and Fighting games.
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Not the whole thing (the '70s had a lot more going on in gaming than it gets credit for) but most of it. It has been a wild ride.
Totally agree, OP. And I'm sorry so many people think you're comparing 6th gen games to modern games rather than comparing the experience of enjoying games during the 6th gen with the experience of enjoying them in the generations that followed.
The PS2 era was glorious. So much weird shit, so many experiences like nothing that had come before. I think that the new gen will be similar, though. We're now in a place where indie game developers have the tools to craft experiences that no longer feel like they're generations behind the mainstream, and the industry isn't squeezing out smaller studios due to an explosion in development costs like it did during the transition to HD.
You're right about the satisfaction of buying a complete product, but I feel we're now at a point where players benefit as much as publishers from the ability to patch games and add new content over time.
I honestly feel like the last generation was the worst for consumers in terms of predatory practises, a lack of innovation, and a general dearth of diverse games. There were some amazing experiences to be had, but it wasn't until the very end of the generation that we started to see the plethora of really exciting games releasing across all genres that set up where we are now, in gen 9. People like to mock gen 7, and it's often well deserved, but I feel like publishers only became so risk averse during gen 8 because they tried so many interesting things in gen 7. Problem was that when expensive games flopped in gen 7, everyone paid for it in gen 8.
The PS2 era was glorious. So much weird shit, so many experiences like nothing that had come before. I think that the new gen will be similar, though. We're now in a place where indie game developers have the tools to craft experiences that no longer feel like they're generations behind the mainstream, and the industry isn't squeezing out smaller studios due to an explosion in development costs like it did during the transition to HD.
You're right about the satisfaction of buying a complete product, but I feel we're now at a point where players benefit as much as publishers from the ability to patch games and add new content over time.
I honestly feel like the last generation was the worst for consumers in terms of predatory practises, a lack of innovation, and a general dearth of diverse games. There were some amazing experiences to be had, but it wasn't until the very end of the generation that we started to see the plethora of really exciting games releasing across all genres that set up where we are now, in gen 9. People like to mock gen 7, and it's often well deserved, but I feel like publishers only became so risk averse during gen 8 because they tried so many interesting things in gen 7. Problem was that when expensive games flopped in gen 7, everyone paid for it in gen 8.
I'm a firm believer that you'll always love the gen that occurred between when you were 14-18 the most, regardless if it was actually good or not. Dunno if OP was around that age for the mentioned gen, but for me 2007 will always be the best year in gaming.
My god that was an amazing generation. We still grt awesome games but I feel there was more diverse and mid tier games. Indies try to fill that slot but it doesn't feel the same.
Just selling you a great game for 60 bucks isn't enough anymore. Now its all about trying to keep getting more money out of you and keep you playing the same fucking game with shitty tactics.
Just selling you a great game for 60 bucks isn't enough anymore. Now its all about trying to keep getting more money out of you and keep you playing the same fucking game with shitty tactics.
Honestly I feel fortunate to have been able to live through the NES gen and all of the ones afterwards (technically the Atari 2600 was my first console but I hardly have any memories of it). It was great to see the evolution of everything. I bet many of you younger gamers in here can't even relate to the wonder of being in a fully 3d polygonal world for the first time or seeing a tree model that had individual leaves or a hand with individual fingers or when textures where sharp enough you could read them. Heck, the first time you had spoken dialogue. These are the things that younger gamers take for granted. I was able to see open world games develop and watched the story telling in games become more and more sophisticated. I was able to have to my mind blow by something like Snatcher on Sega CD while a game like that wouldn't make an impression on anyone who started gaming on PS2 or later.
As for the PS2/GC/Xbox gen, It actually ranks lower for me (I prefer the PS1/N64 and PS3/360/Wii generations) but I think that has more to do with my stage in life. PS2 gen was in the middle of college and I was either stressing with my engineering degree, enjoying college life or spending time with my girl friend who eventually became my wife.
As for the PS2/GC/Xbox gen, It actually ranks lower for me (I prefer the PS1/N64 and PS3/360/Wii generations) but I think that has more to do with my stage in life. PS2 gen was in the middle of college and I was either stressing with my engineering degree, enjoying college life or spending time with my girl friend who eventually became my wife.
This is a lot of what makes PS4 so good to me. Sony really captured that PS2 energy in many ways. Not all ways, mind you, but it had a great mix of indie/smaller developers and publishers right along side SIE's heavy hitters and third party exclusives. There are a lot more avenues to engage fans of smaller series as well, via Kickstarter and the like, episodic gaming, etc. The 7th gen didn't quite figure out how to consistently support lesser known games despite the right pieces (online connectivity, store fronts, bulk storage) either due to tech limitations or straight-up fear of circumventing the traditional publishing model (slow DL speeds, limited file sizes).
Personally, I found Gen 6 to be rather bland outside of Halo and a few other gems. I tend to favor Gen 5 over it, but only slightly because I felt the GameCube's Super Mario and Mario Kart games weren't as good as the ones on the N64. That whole first decade of consoles capable of full 3D graphics out of the box was a rough one for me. I didn't own an N64 or PS1 until I was 18, and the PS2 was released when I was 20, so I don't exactly have any childhood nostalgia over those systems like I do with the NES, SNES, and Genesis. Maybe a bit of early adulthood nostalgia (which I guess you can have when you're in your 40s), but that's it.
I never felt like the industry as a whole had a good grasp on how to make good quality 3D games at the time, with Nintendo and N64-era Rare really being the only standouts to me. So many 3D games at the time were plagued with bad controls and terrible cameras, and in all honesty even back then I wasn't terribly impressed by the graphics of most games from that gen, and time has done them no favors (old 3D games with stylized, "cartoon-y" graphics and flat textures hold up the best). I still remember the first time I saw a game running on the PS2 and not really liking what I saw. The GameCube and especially Xbox fared better on the graphics department, but even then there were a lot of games that weren't exactly pleasing to the eye. I guess I wasn't as impressed by the jump to 3D as a lot of other people were.
Despite shady industry bullshit and other annoyances like the increased focus on "live service" titles, I've felt gaming to be more enjoyable over the past 10-15 years than during Gens 5 & 6. The vast majority of my play time in Gen 6 was probably spent on just Halo. Now I've put a lot of time into a much bigger variety of games, and I've bought more games in Gen 8 than in any other generation. Games play better now. They're going to hold up a lot better visually over time. Even the ability to patch games is something I feel is a net positive. Despite "patch culture" being a thing, I think it's better than a game that releases in a rough state is able to be fixed after the fact instead of simply being broken forever.
I never felt like the industry as a whole had a good grasp on how to make good quality 3D games at the time, with Nintendo and N64-era Rare really being the only standouts to me. So many 3D games at the time were plagued with bad controls and terrible cameras, and in all honesty even back then I wasn't terribly impressed by the graphics of most games from that gen, and time has done them no favors (old 3D games with stylized, "cartoon-y" graphics and flat textures hold up the best). I still remember the first time I saw a game running on the PS2 and not really liking what I saw. The GameCube and especially Xbox fared better on the graphics department, but even then there were a lot of games that weren't exactly pleasing to the eye. I guess I wasn't as impressed by the jump to 3D as a lot of other people were.
Despite shady industry bullshit and other annoyances like the increased focus on "live service" titles, I've felt gaming to be more enjoyable over the past 10-15 years than during Gens 5 & 6. The vast majority of my play time in Gen 6 was probably spent on just Halo. Now I've put a lot of time into a much bigger variety of games, and I've bought more games in Gen 8 than in any other generation. Games play better now. They're going to hold up a lot better visually over time. Even the ability to patch games is something I feel is a net positive. Despite "patch culture" being a thing, I think it's better than a game that releases in a rough state is able to be fixed after the fact instead of simply being broken forever.
Everything is more refined especially controls, the latter is what puts me off the most from revisiting the 5th/6th gen consoles, has anyone tried replaying the MGS games?
Absolutely ghastly, remember when reading a manual and actually having to"learn the controls" was a part of the process of playing a game?
Fucking tedious, I'm glad we have a more homogenised controller mapping.
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I liked the fact that there were so so so many weird jrpgs and I happened to have the time to play them. Now I have to choose carefully before committing. Which in itself it's not a bad thing but I miss playing absolute turds to completion and pretend I didn't waste my time lol
What an awesome gen that was, so many franchises in their peak. Back when Sony gave a damn about JRPG's and platformers were still king, and arcade racers were plentiful. It was truly the age of throw all your ideas on the wall and see what sticks.
I still love gaming and relish how indie games fill the void AA left behind, but everything is just so analysed now; cinematic games work, fps are popular- let's make more of those, service games? Gotta make more money etc.
I was 12 when that gen started so yeah definitely holds a special place in my heart. I look at my nephew and he has the same of joy when playing minecraft, roblox, and Fortnite as I did playing metal Gear Solid, Streets of Rage and Tekken.
I still love gaming and relish how indie games fill the void AA left behind, but everything is just so analysed now; cinematic games work, fps are popular- let's make more of those, service games? Gotta make more money etc.
I was 12 when that gen started so yeah definitely holds a special place in my heart. I look at my nephew and he has the same of joy when playing minecraft, roblox, and Fortnite as I did playing metal Gear Solid, Streets of Rage and Tekken.
I lived through the gen but owned a Gamecube instead.
I'll never not consider that my one of my biggest gaming mistakes. I loved and still love the Gamecube but the PS2 was JRPG paradise and I'm a big JRPG fan, especially at that age when I had a lot of free time and considered games with more content basically automatically better. But I thought the PS2 was basically just GTA + sports games + first-party Sony stuff + FF/KH until like 2005-2006ish. Oh well, we can always go back and play older games.
I'll never not consider that my one of my biggest gaming mistakes. I loved and still love the Gamecube but the PS2 was JRPG paradise and I'm a big JRPG fan, especially at that age when I had a lot of free time and considered games with more content basically automatically better. But I thought the PS2 was basically just GTA + sports games + first-party Sony stuff + FF/KH until like 2005-2006ish. Oh well, we can always go back and play older games.
I dont fully agree, the golden age of gaming was the 90s to early 2000s, it was the start during the PS2 generation till atleast the PS3 to around the mid 2010s, to 2014 or so that gaming stagnated. No doubt the PS2 had a great library, but I would say the PS1 and the PS4 were even better. Personally for me the new golden age of gaming again started around 2015 continuing upto now.
I missed years as a PS2 owner and when all the other kids in class were hyping up final fantasy x and kingdom hearts, I had a gamecube because some gaming mag said Dragonball budokai was coming for the gamecube not PS2, me being 10 and feeling the level of angst because all my friends had a ps2 and I was playing mario sunshine, it felt awful. JRPGs sounded like an adventure of a lifetime and here I am hosing stuff down.
Right? I was in college during the 6th gen. This thread is full of youngsters.
Speaking of college, while we had and loved our PS2, the Gamecube was by far the most popular console in the dorms. You couldnt walk down the hall without stumbling into a game of Melee or Double Dash. And I think I knew one person in total that had an Xbox at the time.
It does feel a bit weird. I can still easily find threads dating back to the early 2000s, while this gen was going on. So it makes it seem much more recent than it is.
I'm in the same camp.
I loved the Ps2, but the breadth, diversity, and quality of games now are unprecedented.
The equivalent for me would be making a thread about the Genesis/SNES era as my cutoff for era's i got into late
And it's only going to get better, I really think apps like Gamepass are going to define gaming this decade the way online/Steam/XBL defined 00's gaming.
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Its weird. I never liked the PS2 at the time because all the anticipated sequels I played felt inferior to me at the time.
Soul Reaver > Soul Reaver 2
MGS > MGS 2
GT/GT2 > GT A Spec
Pro Evo 2 > Pro Evo 3
All PS1 FF > FFX
I recognise the games it has, but the games I was looking forward I found massively underwhelming.
It was pretty much only GTA 3 and Vice City that kept me interested until I switched to Xbox and got obsessed with Halo CE LAN parties and the beggining of Xbox live when I first went to Uni.
PS1 will always be my favourite console.
Soul Reaver > Soul Reaver 2
MGS > MGS 2
GT/GT2 > GT A Spec
Pro Evo 2 > Pro Evo 3
All PS1 FF > FFX
I recognise the games it has, but the games I was looking forward I found massively underwhelming.
It was pretty much only GTA 3 and Vice City that kept me interested until I switched to Xbox and got obsessed with Halo CE LAN parties and the beggining of Xbox live when I first went to Uni.
PS1 will always be my favourite console.
I don't fully agree with this. I would say the games that have been released have taken advantage of the time and advancements that newer hardware, game design, development techniques, etc. provides. However, there are genres and series that have flat out died compared to the 6th due to budgets increasing, anti-competitive practices, and the like. Three genres (two close to my heart) that were particularly decimated in terms of variety are arcade racing games, sports games, and JRPGs.
2005 was a bit of a tipping point overall in sports games. With the NFL license being exclusive to EA, other NFL games fell to the wayside. Even outside NFL games, we used to have a greater variety of physically published sports games from 2K, 3DO, Midway, Acclaim, even Microsoft. At least Sony kept up The Show, 2K does NBA, and Konami PES, but outside of that it's all EA. Madden has been criticised for years for being stagnant and abusing the fact they are the only game in town. Dive deep enough into other communities you'll learn games like FIFA and NHL are mired with similar lackluster efforts. Competition kept EA in check back then. Conversely, we have seen an increase in Manager style games, but not everyone want to play those aspects.
PS2 was a JRPG monster. PS4 is not even close. Atlus alone had 7 unique SMT games, 8 if you want to count P3 FES. We got one on PS4, and a rerelease. Along side giants from Square-Enix, there was Xenosaga, Shadow Hearts, Rogue Galaxy, Dark Cloud, etc. etc. It's thankfully slightly better than the PS3 days at least.
And finally arcade racers. The PS3/360 had some great games from EA, and the beginning saw more variety from Sega, Bizzare, and Rockstar. But the genre died on PS4 and Xbone. Stone cold classics like Burnout Paradise and Hot Pursuit 2010 are merely remastered. We haven't got a Need For Speed you haven't had to make and excuse for since 2012. Midnight Club is dead. Sega only brings their kart racers to console now. Project Gotham is dead. Blur is dead. Pure is dead. Wipeout is dead ish, again its corpse trotted out in remasters as reminders. Motorstorm is dead. Driveclub was born and subsequently snuffed out. Compared to the PS2 generation? Good lord the last gen is lacking. A new, brilliant Need For Speed for five years straight. The perfection that is Burnout 3 and Revenge. Three Midnight Clubs. Test Drive, Tokyo Xtreme Racer! Weird shit like auto Modellista. PGR was alive and well back then. Sega had the AGES line along side arcade ports like Initial D Special Stage or Sega Rally 2006. The list is endless. Arcade racers like that don't exist in the space anymore - it's either 90s love letters like Hotshot Racing, or sim-lites like GRID or Forza Horizon. Nothing really hits that itch of real(ish) cars but arcade handling. NFS fans have been asking for remasters or remakes of the Underground games for years.
A true golden age for me would be to apply the tech and knowledge of today to all genres, all sorts of games. Part of my gripes might be that the market has moved on. What's popular these days is not what was back then. Indies are making up the slack but there are gaps. In some situations, like sports games, we have a wider variety of play styles (i.e.: Manager games) but not a deep variety to pull from. To apply brushstrokes to assume we are all better now? Definitely not.
Games are technically better now than they ever have been, but they just don't have the soul of the PS2 library.
In that sense, they just don't make 'em like they used to.
In that sense, they just don't make 'em like they used to.
Having lived thru it, I would place the arcade scene/ home console scene of the late 70's-late 80's to be an even more lucky to be alive and play thru than the PS2 generation, but that's me. The Commodore 64 also released around then and it was mind blowing for its time.
Agreed. Even the PS1/N64 era was an even more exciting time to be a gamer as technology was seriously expanding at the time, PC, Video cards, failed tech/consoles. It was bananas.
Agreed. Even the PS1/N64 era was an even more exciting time to be a gamer as technology was seriously expanding at the time, PC, Video cards, failed tech/consoles. It was bananas.
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