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Oct 25, 2017
11,039
So I've played every Battlefield, and in every single one, the way you get tanks/planes completely sucks. It just sucks.

In BF1942 up to BF3, all vehicles spawned on the map. So you would just have to camp the runway and wait until a vehicle popped up while other people camp as well.
In BF4, I forget how they do this one. I think they spawn on the map as well, but you can select to go into one directly from the map screen. Leading to camping as well.

Now we come to BF1 and V, and this one REALLY blows. The only way to get into a vehicle is from the map screen. And there are a ton of people not playing and just looking at this fucking map screen, waiting for a vehicle to be selected.

I was playing BFV today on the new pacific maps, and I wanted to try and fly a plane. The only viable way to do that is to sit on the map screen and just wait.........and wait. Then the plane icon will pop up for LITERALLY 1 NANOSECOND and someone will already have taken it. It's like.......this is fucking ridiculous. I have 2 options. Play the game and pretty much resign myself to never flying, or not play and just watch the map screen, and hope to win the lottery. Its a tiny bit better with tanks because rather than only 2 per team, there is more I think. It's still pretty difficult because tanks are being played for longer.

And I just hate this system. I really do. With a passion.

And I hate because it is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY better in Battlefront 2. None of this bullshit.

In Battlefront 2, you gain points by playing the game. Then, you can use those points to use a tank, plane, hero class. So you can't just camp the the respawn screen. You actually have to play the game and objectives to get points, to be able to use vehicles/heroes. I've actually been able to use spaceships, been a hero class, use at-st's, etc. And I didn't have to feel pressured to camp a screen.

I just can't believe Dice reverted back to this terrible system in BFV. I mean..........does the community not care? Am I missing something? In my eyes, they fixed this problem in Battlefront 2, but apparently this garbo system in BFV is ok???
 

Inugami

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,995
Vehicles always felt like the worst part of those games to me, maybe because I never got them long enough to learn how to 'get gud'. That said, yeah it sucks for those that DO want to do it and you'd think there'd be some sort of participation system or something.
 

No_Style

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,795
Ottawa, Canada
I thought the Battlefield community hated the Battlefront system where you just spawn into something. I think they wanted the feeling of getting in something and taking off.

Vehicles always felt like the worst part of those games to me, maybe because I never got them long enough to learn how to 'get gud'. That said, yeah it sucks for those that DO want to do it and you'd think there'd be some sort of participation system or something.

For me, the planes always felt like they existed in a completely different world with little to no influence on what's happening on the ground. At least choppers and tanks felt like they interacted with the ground game.
 

Conkerkid11

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
13,967
That would be an interesting approach. While they're at it, they should also borrow the flight controls from Battlefront 2.
 

kurisub

Member
Oct 27, 2017
27
Yeah, the tanks/planes do not spawn on the map.

If you select a plane, you spawn into it mid-flight.
Well, in the Pacific maps you do actually take off of aircraft carriers or airstrips…but I get what you're saying, it's not like the old games where you could just walk up to an unmanned aircraft and then take off.
 

a916

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,838
Did the trend start with Battlefront?

Anyways, hate it too. Love the idea of running up to a plane and taking off.
 

Cocolina

Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,990
I much preferred the vehicles spawning on the map itself than both the Battlefront killstreak perk method and BFV's spawn straight-in-the-vehicle-with-a-bunch-of-shitty-weapons-instead method
 

Ralemont

Member
Jan 3, 2018
4,508
Well, vehicles are the equivalent of Heroes and Villains in Battlefront, and in 2 days of playing I've never even seen one of those highlighted for me to pick because the match already has the max amount on the field.

So...
 

SpottieO

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,618
Stealing vehicles from capture points was always one of my favorite things. They kind of brought it back in the pacific update but I absolutely hate spawning from the map.
 

Ralemont

Member
Jan 3, 2018
4,508
Vehicles are the equivalent vehicles.

No, because Heroes and Villains are the most desired way to use your points, so of course the vehicles will be more open for use in Battlefront 2. There's no equivalent in Battlefield to those, so everyone would just use their points on the things they are already camping now.
 

Deleted member 4783

Oct 25, 2017
4,531
Fuck, yes... I hate it. I want back an hybrid system, where you can select them from the menu, but they also spawn in the map, ala BF4.

Other thing, bring back airfields and CONQUEST ASSAULT!

CONQUEST ASSAULT was my jam im BF2, BF2142.
 

PeskyToaster

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,314
I want to take off in my vehicle and I also want them to have to balance the amount and type of vehicles per team. BF4 was the best system because they were on the ground but you could spawn right in them if you wanted. I don't think camping them was a huge problem, they get camped regardless.
 

Jakisthe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,583
OTOH, a points system strikes me as too uneven across the way these vehicles are interacted with; they shouldn't feel like powerups, they should feel like equally valid, equally basic ways of playing, just with different handling and different strengths/weaknesses. Thats the sort of approach which can give them more depth, vs something like CoD or Battlefront where it's just a piece of candy given out for playing infantry well. Infantry is no more pure than vehicles are, and someone who wants to play with a vehicular approach shouldn't have to rack up a score on that front.

There's not much that can be done about camping. People are going to wait to use the tools they want to use, be that from a respawn screen or while on the ground, and adding a points system only partially alleviates that but introduces the whole mess I mention above.

Having to manually take off with a plane is a good thing, but just spawning into one in flight doesn't strike me as some big affront. As usual, Battlefield 4 did it best.
 
OP
OP
Oct 25, 2017
11,039
No, because Heroes and Villains are the most desired way to use your points, so of course the vehicles will be more open for use in Battlefront 2. There's no equivalent in Battlefield to those, so everyone would just use their points on the things they are already camping now.

Well, not most desired for me. I had a lot of fun with a lot of the powered up soldier classes and vehicles. Yeah, maybe getting Darth Vader would be hard, but at least there was still a lot of selection on other things you could use.
 

Ralemont

Member
Jan 3, 2018
4,508
Well, not most desired for me. I had a lot of fun with a lot of the powered up soldier classes and vehicles. Yeah, maybe getting Darth Vader would be hard, but at least there was still a lot of selection on other things you could use.

Battlefront 2 does have a wide array of options besides basic infantry, it's true.

I think maybe what Battlefield actually needs is lots of different fun vehicles again. This series sorely misses helicopters, for example. In BF4, maybe I couldn't always get the vehicle I wanted, but I could always get either a tank OR a plane OR a chopper OR a gunboat.
 

Cocolina

Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,990
Can I ask why you hate the Battlefront 2 method?

I don't hate it, just prefer the original Battlefield skirmish. The vehicles just being there at the base makes it feel more organic to me, you have the freedom to just run and get into a vehicle rather than it being tied behind a progression system. If I'm having a bad round I'm locked out of trying something else.
 

Swiggins

was promised a tag
Member
Apr 10, 2018
11,452
There are pluses and minus to both systems.

I know a lot of people really like air-bases in BF3 and before, but there's a reason they were removed...and that reason is spawn-killing/base-reaping.

Dogfighting in BF3 boiled down to who won the first dogfight at the start of the match, followed by being spawn killed every single time the jet spawned till the end of the game. A halfway decent pilot could completely control the air game for an entire match, and if you wanted to get EXTRA sweaty, you could steal aircraft out of the enemy's base and deny them the ability to even TRY. Jets might not have done a lot to infantry, but they were devastating against armor and could often be the deciding variable in a conquest or rush game.
 

SapientWolf

Member
Nov 6, 2017
6,565
In Battlefield 1942 / Battlefield 2, people used to camp the runway for planes and try to ram your plane with a jeep while you were taking off. I remember taking off in a bomber in 42 and watching a jeep start approaching full speed, aiming at my wing. But in a moment of instant karma, the jeep ended up exploding on contact and I was able to take off. It was so funny I wasn't even mad.

The map system is better, but there's still the issue of bad players using the armor to try to camp from the spawn. This can make it next to impossible to push on certain points in Frontlines / Breakthrough. The squad vehicles are a good counter to this, but they're a little too costly and they can only be used in the spawn screen, so they don't get much use.
 

elenarie

Game Developer
Verified
Jun 10, 2018
9,821
There are positives and negatives to both systems. Will see what happens for the next one. ;)