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Odeko

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Mar 22, 2018
15,180
West Blue
EDIT: I'm pleased that my thread has caused a bunch of people to be interested in picking up Hitman 2, but now everyone is running into the exact same confusing mess of different versions and packs. Purchasing this game is bizarrely complex, so here's my flow chart of how to know what to purchase.

HOW TO BUY HITMAN 2

Basically, there are 4 groups of content lumped into a fully featured Hitman 2 install. These are the major features of each:

1. The Hitman 1 base game — this is 6 maps + a tutorial (with a connecting story mode). These are Paris, Sapienza, Marrakesh, Bangkok, Colorado, and Hokkaido. These maps have been updated with new Hitman 2 features — hiding in crowds and tall grass, adding briefcase drops around the level, and new security camera behavior. (YOU DEFINITELY WANT THIS)
2. The Hitman 1 DLC — this is the Patient Zero campaign, and alternate story campaign of remixed missions on the Bangkok, Sapienza, Colorado, and Hokkaido maps. (THIS IS PRETTY SKIPPABLE)
3. The Hitman 2 base game — this is another set of 6 maps with a continuation of the first game's story. These are New Zealand, Miami, Colombia, Mumbai, Vermont, and Isle of Sgaìl. Also includes a sniper mini-game mission in Austria. (YOU DEFINITELY WANT THIS)
4. The Hitman 2 DLC — this is two full additional maps with more story following the events of Hitman 2, not just remixes like H1's DLC. These are New York (released) and "The Resort" (coming Fall 2019). This also includes two new sniper mini-game maps, Singapore and Siberia. (YOU PROBABLY WANT THIS, BUT MIGHT WANT TO WAIT FOR A SALE)

So those are the 4 products, all of which are high quality. But that's only half the battle. Here's how you know what to buy:

"I own all of Hitman 1, including the Patient Zero campaign DLC, on the same console"
For the H2 base game alone buy Hitman 2 - Standard Edition. For H2 base game + DLC buy Hitman 2 - Gold Edition. You will get updated versions of all the Hitman 1 content for free.

"I own all of the Hitman 1 maps, but not Patient Zero, on the same console"
For the H2 base game alone buy Hitman 2 - Standard Edition. For H2 base game + DLC buy Hitman 2 - Gold Edition. If you want Patient Zero, buy the Hitman GOTY Legacy Pack Upgrade. You will get updated versions of all the Hitman 1 content you own for free.

"I don't own Hitman 1/only own some of the Hitman 1 maps/own Hitman 1 on a different console"
For the H2 base game alone buy Hitman 2 - Standard Edition. For H2 base game + DLC buy Hitman 2 - Gold Edition. If you want the Hitman 1 content (includes H1 basegame + DLC), buy the Hitman GOTY Legacy Pack.

"I already own the Hitman 2 base game"
For the DLC buy the Expansion pass, for Hitman 1 content buy the Hitman GOTY Legacy pack.

Sorry for the convoluted explanations, I tried my best to type it all out but it's obviously still pretty confusing!

————
ORIGINAL THREAD:
Happy 4th Resetera!

(Thanks to /u/dontironit on Reddit for all the beautiful zoomed out pics. I'll link to his specific post on each one.)

Hitman 2016 and its follow-up Hitman 2 are two of the finest games ever made. Hitman 2 actually might be my game of the generation, which before I got on the bandwagon I never would have imagined could be the case in a gen with Hollow Knight, Nier: Automata, and Wonderful 101. You could single out any single game-design element and I'm sure write a 10 page thesis on how brilliant it is, but as I was (for the thousandth time) wandering around Sapienza on my day off work this morning it struck me that one often overlooked element is how much work goes into making the locations feel like real places.

Don't get me wrong, Hitman isn't a realistic game. It's a game about genetically-engineered clone with the gameplay super power that all other humans react in perfectly predictable ways to all stimuli when he's around. The main antagonist is basically the Illuminati and on its version of Earth CEOs and politicians just stand around constantly and congratulate each other on how evil they are.

However the world still feels real. It's like the overused marketing phrase "a living, breathing world" was the game design document for this game. If Zelda is a series about Miyamoto romanticizing exploring the woods behind his house growing up, then Hitman feels like the fantasy of wandering off as a kid into the employee-only section of a hotel and seeing the other world that exists beyond those closed doors.

Sure many levels have the sexy fantasy high-class exclusive areas — the black-tie invite only parties, the private executive suites, the beautiful vacation spots. But each is just as full of bathrooms, laundry rooms, maintenance tunnels, staff quarters, kitchens, construction areas, closets, and all other manner of mundane service rooms. And these are just as lovingly rendered and just as full of NPCs going about their business. You'd never get to see how the sausage is made like that in James Bond movie, for example, but Hitman lets you in on every aspect of the intricate clockwork that makes up these levels and lets explore every last cog and spring.

Rather than keep repeating myself or try to dissect a specific map (honestly Hitman maps tend to be so dense with info they're almost illegible: e.g.) to show it off, here's some beautiful shots of a handful of Hitman levels from above. I think it also shows off how they don't really look like video game levels, just normal locations until you look too close at a low-poly model in the background.

MIAMI —
tfj8ywpmcrx21.jpg

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/HiTMAN/comments/bnnlpa/wheres_baldo_miami_2_gigapixel_aerial_photo/

SAPIENZA —

VERMONT —

I know this post is a little meandering, but I was just in the mood to gush about one of my favorite games. For the rare few out there that have played it, do you enjoy sneaking around in laundry rooms as much as I do? What else is great about this criminally underrated series?
 
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N.47H.4N

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,096
Hitman 1/2 has one of the best level design ever,it is just incredible crafted and realized,one of my favorites games of this gen.
 

Salty Catfish

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
2,776
Florida
The clockwork design of Miami and Mumbai in particular is just incredible. Like the fact that in Miami there's a single opportunity that requires you to: rig the race, disguise yourself as the second place finisher, meet the winner for a drinking game, poison the milk in the kitchen BEFOREHAND, win the challenge by forcing the target to drink the a chili shot, causing her to run to the poisoned milk to cool off her tongue.

So many of these things happen regardless of your involvement, it's just up to you to manipulate them to your advantage at the right time. The world really does feel real and alive.
 

Spring-Loaded

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,904
If Zelda is a series about Miyamoto romanticizing exploring the woods behind his house growing up, then Hitman feels like the fantasy of wandering off as a kid into the employee-only section of a hotel and seeing the other world that exists beyond those closed doors.

that'sgoodthat'sdamngood.gif
 
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Odeko

Odeko

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Mar 22, 2018
15,180
West Blue
Hitman 1/2 has one of the best level design ever,it is just incredible crafted and realized,one of my favorites games of this gen.
Sapienza deserves to go down in all future clickbait list articles as one of the best level designs of all time. That moment on like my second or third playthrough where I was exploring the city square and started to wander down the main street and discovered the level was actually three times as big as I had thought was genuinely incredible. I kept expecting a "LEAVING MISSION AREA" pop-up or something but it just keeps going.
 

.exe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,240
Totally get what you mean. My favorite thing about these two new Hitman games is just watching the world play out around me. The mechanisms that are in place are so fascinating.
 

Acorn

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,972
Scotland
Really annoys me that the hitman 2 gold edition goes on sale but never the expansion pass. Anyway, yeah I tend to agree they've been hitting it out the park the last few years.
 

Mezentine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,976
The reason why I've called the Hitman games, in a weird way, the spiritual successor to the Thief games, is precisely because of this. Both series understood how to create a space that's compelling to explore and that it was important that even if the architecture wasn't technically realistic it still felt spatially plausible. So many other stealth games revolve around levels where I'm infiltrating a "research facility" or "magical library" but one glance at the map reveals that its a mostly linear path with a few rooms to the sides and it completely takes me out of the experience because it ruins the impression that people actually live, work, and otherwise do things in these spaces
 

Salty Catfish

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
2,776
Florida
Really annoys me that the hitman 2 gold edition goes on sale but never the expansion pass. Anyway, yeah I tend to agree they've been hitting it out the park the last few years.
Yeah, it's been frustrating seeing the entire Gold edition available cheaper on PC than the expansion pass is by itself on PS4. The bank level looks fun but not sure if I'm willing to shell out $40 for that and a sniper map right now.
 
Mar 29, 2018
7,078
I still feel so guilty for not buying HITMAN 2 at launch. The first was such a masterclass and the sequel evidently even better.

FYI though, Sapienza is a HITMAN (2016) level.

Unless it's significantly reworked in HITMAN 2 (and I wasn't aware of it)?
 
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Odeko

Odeko

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Mar 22, 2018
15,180
West Blue
Really annoys me that the hitman 2 gold edition goes on sale but never the expansion pass. Anyway, yeah I tend to agree they've been hitting it out the park the last few years.
On PC for the Steam sale it's currently 50% off, but yeah I've heard that console prices aren't as good.

I still feel so guilty for not buying HITMAN 2 at launch. The first was such a masterclass and the sequel evidently even better.

FYI though, Sapienza is a HITMAN (2016) level.

Unless it's significantly reworked in HITMAN 2 (and I wasn't aware of it)?
Yeah I was trying to figure out how to word the title. I originally had "The Unsung Realism of Hitman (2016) Levels" but that's even clunkier and has the same issue. Since both games are basically the same idea and all the 2016 levels have been ported in to 2 with a few enhancements, I just went with the newest one.
 

DSP

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,120
that's my problem with open world games, they never feel like real places people live/work in like in hitman. it's not realistic but it sells you the fantasy that it could be an actual location instead of a game level.
 
Oct 25, 2017
11,481
IO Interactive, Arkane and From designed some of the most amazing levels ever this gen. Masters of their craft. Hitman is awesome, there's nothing quite like it.
 
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Odeko

Odeko

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Mar 22, 2018
15,180
West Blue
Contract mode is a nice start, but my if I had a video game genie that would grant me any video game wish, it would be for either a level editor or mod support to take it to the next level. It's totally fine that IO doesn't seem interested in making total level remixes in H2 like The Icon, A House Built on Sand, or Landslide, but I'd love if players could try their hand at it. Those seem like the perfect way to take advantage of all these lovingly crafted in-depth areas.
 

Deleted member 1656

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,474
So-Cal
Contract mode is a nice start, but my if I had a video game genie that would grant me any video game wish, it would be for either a level editor or mod support to take it to the next level. It's totally fine that IO doesn't seem interested in making total level remixes in H2 like The Icon, A House Built on Sand, or Landslide, but I'd love if players could try their hand at it. Those seem like the perfect way to take advantage of all these lovingly crafted in-depth areas.
Mod support for Hitman would be so fucking cool, dude. It's just the kind of thing that would kind of "plug in" perfectly with the kind of freeform, replayable game it's meant to be.

I would kill hit a man for a mod that made Stone & Knight playable in regular singleplayer mode. And can you imagine how awesome custom voiced targets would be—like custom soldiers in XCOM? I want to assassinate Bob Ross & Tommy Wiseau.
 
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Odeko

Odeko

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Mar 22, 2018
15,180
West Blue
Mod support for Hitman would be so fucking cool, dude. It's just the kind of thing that would kind of "plug in" perfectly with the kind of freeform, replayable game it's meant to be.

I would kill hit a man for a mod that made Stone & Knight playable in regular singleplayer mode. And can you imagine how awesome custom voiced targets would be—like custom soldiers in XCOM? I want to assassinate Bob Ross & Tommy Wiseau.
Knight especially would be great as basically a totally diegetic hard mode. Suddenly all those lone male guards standing next to a wardrobe that we've learned to beeline for would drop unusable disguises, and we'd have to learn to seek out the rarer female NPCs. Maybe she'd be more athletic than 47, so her playstyle relies on more traditional stealth and evasion while 47's is disguise-based.
 

Nappuccino

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
13,018
So, if I've never really played a Hitman game, what's the best way to start enjoying the game(s)?

Should I just pick up Hitman 2 and buy the season 1 DLC later (once I know I enjoy it), or are the season 1 maps better to learn on?
 

Roy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,471
The Sapienza beach music festival is great. The sound design is fucking incredible, sounds exactly like a real outdoor concert.
 

Spring-Loaded

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,904
So, if I've never really played a Hitman game, what's the best way to start enjoying the game(s)?

Should I just pick up Hitman 2 and buy the season 1 DLC later (once I know I enjoy it), or are the season 1 maps better to learn on?
Get Hitman 2, and start with the Hitman 1 missions because all the improvements and additions added to 2's base game get applied everywhere (crowd hiding, functional mirrors, briefcases, etc.).

Maybe start with the Hitman 2 introductory mission since it's cooler than the training in Hitman 1, but once you know you want to keep playing (and you realize you'd be interested in replaying missions for different challenges), start from the beginning of 1. I'd recommended starting with hints set to "on" or "minimal" at first until you get a feel for how the game works, then just turning them off because figuring out how to complete certain challenges is the fun part. The escalations challenges (e.g. round 1: kill target, round 2: kill target + no disguise changing, round 3: kill target + no disguise changing + ______, etc.) help teach how the game works and force you to learn the levels better.

The most important takeaway is that these two games are the best the series has been and there are no other games that do better at what these do. And if you're into the idea or replaying these maps and remixed challenges, then all the content for Hitman 2 (which includes everything from 1) is worth full price, straight up. Look for a discount if you need it, but if/whenever tou're Sure you want to play them, you're not wasting money getting everything. And you miss out on elusive targets the longer you wait.
 

Nappuccino

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
13,018
Get Hitman 2, and start with the Hitman 1 missions because all the improvements and additions added to 2's base game get applied everywhere (crowd hiding, functional mirrors, briefcases, etc.).

Maybe start with the Hitman 2 introductory mission since it's cooler than the training in Hitman 1, but once you know you want to keep playing (and you realize you'd be interested in replaying missions for different challenges), start from the beginning of 1. I'd recommended starting with hints set to "on" or "minimal" at first until you get a feel for how the game works, then just turning them off because figuring out how to complete certain challenges is the fun part. The escalations challenges (e.g. round 1: kill target, round 2: kill target + no disguise changing, round 3: kill target + no disguise changing + ______, etc.) help teach how the game works and force you to learn the levels better.

The most important takeaway is that these two games are the best the series has been and there are no other games that do better at what these do. And if you're into the idea or replaying these maps and remixed challenges, then all the content for Hitman 2 (which includes everything from 1) is worth full price, straight up. Look for a discount if you need it, but if/whenever tou're Sure you want to play them, you're not wasting money getting everything. And you miss out on elusive targets the longer you wait.
Awesome, thanks for the detailed write up. I'd like to think it's a game I'll want to replay a bunch. I definitely love watching people play it (like the Giant Bomb crew) and listening to Idle Thumbs talk about the escalation missions made them seem incredible. I'll probably just have to bite the bullet and I'll keep these tips in mind!
 

Sotha_Sil

Member
Nov 4, 2017
5,067
I made a similar post in another thread not to long ago singing the praises of Hawke's Bay. Right now, I think there are three developers on another level from everyone else when it comes to level design:

1. Arkane Studios
2. IO Interactive
3. From Software

From Software is a recent addition due to Sekiro. Their previous games weren't as strong in this regard, but they're there now. No other developer comes remotely close, imo. What separates them from the rest is how they integrate gameplay mechanics into their levels (for From Soft, this really only applies to Sekiro). Additionally, all three developers have great artistic departments who make their worlds really stick out visually.

While all Hitman levels are great, I actually find myself preferring the smaller levels the most. Here's my post on Hawke's Bay:

I was thinking about the best examples of level design I've seen this generation. Of course, Talos-1, The Witness' island, Camp Omega, Clockwork Mansion, and Crack in the Slab immediately came to mind, but there's another I'll put up alongside those: Hawke's Bay.

hitman-2-hawkes-bay-guide-header.jpg


First off, I love the visual design. The stormy night on the beach, the modern style house, opening that garage door for the first time, and the contrast from the flare; it's just a beautiful and cohesive look.

Second, it's the perfect introduction. The level can be completed in under a few minutes for experienced players, and might take a new player trying to pull off the stealth mechanics upwards of 20-25 minutes. The house is filled with a surprising number of ways to get your kill. Chasing after the different feats and challenges will introduce newcomers to all things Hitman, and why the franchise is so special. It does everything the level needed to do, and nothing it didn't.

Third, the actual design is great. Lots of good stealth routes, high attention to detail in the house's layout, etc. I've probably played it 20 times now chasing all the different challenges.... and it still feels fun to play. Nothing is wasted here, every item is placed for a purpose.

Overall, I think it's a level most people play for 20 minutes and overlook, but it's worth a lot more than that.

tl;dr version - this game is so fucking good.
 

Crazymoogle

Game Developer
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
2,884
Asia
Ultimately the reason I always love to quote for Sapienza is that if you escape in the small car, there's a chance that you will run over someone in the exit cutscene. Which does count against you. 🤣
 

Salty Catfish

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
2,776
Florida
I made a similar post in another thread not to long ago singing the praises of Hawke's Bay. Right now, I think there are three developers on another level from everyone else when it comes to level design:

1. Arkane Studios
2. IO Interactive
3. From Software

From Software is a recent addition due to Sekiro. Their previous games weren't as strong in this regard, but they're there now. No other developer comes remotely close, imo. What separates them from the rest is how they integrate gameplay mechanics into their levels (for From Soft, this really only applies to Sekiro). Additionally, all three developers have great artistic departments who make their worlds really stick out visually.

While all Hitman levels are great, I actually find myself preferring the smaller levels the most. Here's my post on Hawke's Bay:



tl;dr version - this game is so fucking good.
Hawke's Bay is such a tight, perfect tutorial level -- instead of guiding you by the hand, it gives you all the tools you need, lets you loose in a small-scale sandbox, and says have at it. Exactly the kind of intro level this game needs.
 

Damn Silly

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,194
There's a level or two that maybe doesn't hit the heights -- Colorado is my least favourite -- but the rest of them are all just terrific. Some masterful level design.

Can't wait for the Noclip doc.
 

stn

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,603
This is great reminder that I should get around to playing 2 more. Always been a huge fan of the Hitman games since the very first released on PC many years ago.
 
Oct 28, 2017
1,520
Australia
Hitman 2 gold was on sale for $20 a month or so ago on Xbox. But honestly, the amount of content that's available for this game even without the gold pass is frankly overwhelming, and increases every month. Definitely my game of the generation and I wasn't really a fan of the series before (I started with Absolution, which I really enjoyed, so there). Almost endless fun. I was really skeptical about the online and the GAAS aspects but damn it does everything so well it's hard to complain. I started playing it in November last year and didn't touch anything else for literally 4 months. Cannot recommend it enough.
 
Oct 27, 2017
187
The mundane realism makes more grounded moments interesting to watch, you have a reason to expect to find an isolated disguise victim in an isolated room with one entrance and no windows. Finding a free disguise in a locker room and then the npc who it belonged to naturally walking into the situation feels seamless, not like vision cones on a soliton radar. Guards at invisible boundary checkpoints reference the occasions and reasons for guarding the area, and you often stumble into the VIP that hired the guards at the exact event the guards described in a non essential part of the map unrelated to your objective.
 

BigWeather

Member
Nov 4, 2017
1,426
Hitman is on Game Pass -- is that basically just the introductory missions of Hitman (2016)? I'd really like to dive in and figured that'd be a good way to start but if all of the levels (even if it is only a couple) are better in Hitman 2 perhaps I'm better off just waiting for a sale on Hitman 2 Gold Edition ($100 now, what does it typically go on sale for)?

Edit: I see terminaljeremy said it was on sale for $20 earlier (likely during E3) -- drat, hate that I missed that! Hopefully will go that low again soon.
 

tryagainlater

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,251
Both games are a masterclass in level design and the new Bank level is great even if it's a bit lacking in kill opportunities.

I'm gonna ramble on about how great Mumbai is that no one will read but god damn, it's such an incredible level.

Mumbai can be divided into a market, the slums which has a hill area that feels separate, a currently being built tower, a laundry area, an underground bunker, a old trainyard, and chawls which are a sort of apartment block.

You have 3 targets: Rangan who is in the tower, Shah who is in the trainyard and The Maelstrom who is said to be wandering around the slums and isn't identified at the start of the mission.

Default starting area will put you near the chawls with the tower looming above you. Rangan is in the tower so let's start there. There is 7 entrance/exit points to the tower grounds. Some require disguises, others are more traditional stealth approaches, some need a lockpick or crowbar to get in and most have guards in the way. You can get a disguise such as the dancer which can be found in the laundry area if you've ventured over there. There is also a specific actor who's clothes you can take who can be found vomiting in the slums. He is used for a specific kill opportunity that involves 47 being in a Bollywood photoshoot.

Once you're in the tower grounds, there's then many points on entry into the tower itself. You can use the main entrances or the security guard entrance or climb up various point of entry around the building. Right, you're in the building and working your way up to find Rangan. Now, as I mentioned earlier, the tower is currently being built so there's all manner of places to push targets off ledges or drop stuff on them. More specific kills involve getting Rangan to pose for a painting. You can dress as a painter and take him while he's posing. There's other stuff you can do with the painter kill but more on that later. My personal favourite kill involves dressing up as a Bollywood crewman and blowing him off the building with a giant industrial fan while he's filming a scene.

Alright, Rangan is down and you escape the tower. To pick one of the 7 entrance/exit points mentioned earlier, let's say you take the route over a short barge which will bring you to the edge of the slums. It's not obvious but you are right next to a building that is one fo the many entry points to the underground bunker which is one of the places to kill The Maelstrom but we haven't even identified him yet so let's go onto Shah next. The barge will put you on the perimeter of the map which will give you an easy run to the trainyard without having to enter the slums.

Approaching the trainyard, you are again met with a number of entry points. There's a wide open space near the traintracks, there's some entry points through some traincars, you can get in through the laundry area, you can get in from a bridge and there's also a way to get in through a run-off. The mosst obvious point of entry is well guarded but wandering nearby, you'll hear some talk about a tailor who is terrified to go measure Shah since the previous tailors met with some unfortunate ends. Let's follow the tailor. He'll eventually isolate himself wandering through the slums. Knock him out, take his clothes and get your measuring tape. This allows you to waltz right in the main entrance to the trainyard as the tailor that suddenly found his courage. Get to Shah and give her a private measuring and put that tape to good use. Wandering around the trainyard, you can find many more opportunities that involve poisoning, dropping bird cages or just blowing stuff up.

Alright, 2 targets down. Now onto The Maelstrom but that's a problem. We don't know who he is and he isn't marked on your map and doesn't show up in instinct. It's an interesting wrinkle in a Hitman mission and unsurprisingly, there's a number of ways to deal with it. A first time player will wander around the slums where he is supposed to be and hopefully be pointed in his direction. One thing about the slums though; The Maelstrom's guards are looking for suspicious people they don't know and 47 fits that description. When wandering around the slums, you'll be met with many enforcers (these are people with white dots over their heads who can see through your disguises) that can see through almost all disguises, even just your default clothes. You can use crowds and blending spots to remain hidden while the guards patrol but the more observant people might notice certain people in the slums with their faces covered. The metal workers. Who can be suspicious of metal workers when they're hard at work. Either knock out a metal worker or find a free disguise in one of their apartments and boom, now you can walk around the slums freely and unmolested.

Now, how the hell do you find The Maelstrom? He's a unique target in the games. He'll spawn with different clothes and different facial hair so even in replays, it's not entirely obvious who he is. There are a number of ways to recognise him. Wandering around the slums you'll hear conversations of two people who have a picture of him that you can get your hands on. Thanks to the great level and mission design, there's pictures of him in Rangan's Tower and the trainyard you can find if you go take care of those targets first. There's also a way to manipulate him to come meet his ex-girlfriend which he will also do in the natural course of the mission if you just wait. Although I said he has a random set of clothes and facial hair, his facial model is still the same. On subsequent playthrough, he still won't be marked on the map until you've officially recognised but if you see the guy with the eye scar wandering the slums, you can just kill him and your handler will be "oh, I guess that guy you just killed was The Maelstrom". Wandering around the slums, there will be plenty of opportunities to poison him at food stalls. A personal favourite is dressing up as the local barber and wait for him to come in for a shave. 3 targets down, now just exfiltrate to one of the many exits and you're done.

Now if you're thinking "that's all great, but that if I don't want to go after all 3 targets separately every time I play this amazing achievement in video game design?" I'm glad you asked. You want to kill the Maelstrom but doing both the tower and trainyard stuff can be exhausting. In the underground bunker (which again has many point of entry from various angles), you can find a purple brick and hear a conversation about its smoke being a signal for something or other. Throw it in a metal furnace and purple smoke will rise. Rangan and Shah will leave their respective areas and meet by a boat rental hut...right under a boat. That's a twofer.


You down for some trainyard skulking but not in the mood for chasing the Maelstrom through the slums or climbing the tower? If you have explored the chawls area, you will find a room that shows that Rangan and Shah have actually put out hits on each other. Once Shah is down, you can call Rangan at a payphone which will lead to Rangan and The Maelstrom meeting on the barge outside the tower, which I'll remind you is still being built. If you find the crane controls, you can position a giant building cylinder over your two targets and hit the button. That's a twofer.


You happy to climb up the tower but want to get Shah and The Maelstrom together? Then you can set up my favourite kill in the entire series. Ring Shah and she will meet up with our good friend, The Maelstrom at her trainyard. Now, this trainyard may have been converted into a palace of sorts but there is an active train line right next to it. A train line that you can converge to run right through where Shah and The Maelstrom are meeting. It's some beautiful Wil E. Coyote shit. Also, while the cutscene showing the train barrel through your targets is playing, you can hold whatever button you use to exit missions is which will have 47 jump on the train and use it as an exit. That's a twofer and a quick exfiltration.


But there's one more thing I want to share. What was that about Rangan and Shah putting hits out on each other? Does that mean there's rival assassins out there. Yes, but only one. Our boy, The Kashmirian. However, he is a complete bonehead. You can find him in the chawls which is likely an area a first time player will wander into first from the default starting location. It offers an insight to the brilliant clockwork nature of Hitman levels that requires multiple playthroughs to piece together. When he's not looking, you can refocus his sniper rifle that's pointed towards the tower. Will Rangan wander in front of his scope? Not naturally, but he will if you make him. The painter I mentioned 27 paragraphs ago is our means of manipulation since the scope is trained on his studio in the tower. Now, you can dress as the painter and fetch Rangan to pose in the studio (which I mentioned as a separate opportunity earlier) and watch him get headshot right in front of you. Or you can find the set of paint that the painter is missing which is why his painting is being held up. If you give him the paint, he'll go fetch Rangan himself and you can be on the other side of the map when the Kasmirian gets his snipe kill steal in.


Following this through, what about Shah. After killing Rangan, The Kashmirian will wander to another room in the chawls and have his sights trained on the bridge overlooking the laundry area. Shah is set to meet the new laundry manager here but again, it requires some manipulation. But again...again, you can play out this meeting by dressing as the manager and requesting the meeting (which is a kill opportunity in itself) and then act surprised when she gets shot. Or you can go for a lighter touch and find the files that the manager needs so he can have the meeting and let it play out while you watch from afar.

Damn, The Kashmirian has taken care of two of your targets. It would be great if he could help with the third....and he does. You can follow him to a payphone where he will call the Maelstrom and request a meeting. He will have a meeting in the underground bunker so you won't have to bother with trying to find The Maelstrom in the slums. And of course, you can take out The Kashmirian on route and take his clothes and get your own private meeting with your third target. There's also an exfiltration point in the bunker which is nice and convenient.


If you're a person who has read this all the way through, god bless you. If you don't know much about Hitman, all this stuff is found out by exploring the level, listening to dialogue, experimenting and many playthroughs. All this depth is just for the main mission but every area in a map has its own detailed layouts and NPCs with their own routing. It means the maps have life beyond their main mission that allow for great variation in player made contracts, escalations which are a sort of challenge mode with increasingly difficult parameters and elusive targets which are timed, one shot only contracts that often feature the less used parts of the map.

TL;DR: The game is amazing and you'll struggle to find better level design in other games especially with Mumbai as a showcase. I could probably eqully long insane ramblings about Sapienza and Miami but I won't because people won't even read the one above.
 

Captain of Outer Space

Come Sale Away With Me
Member
Oct 28, 2017
11,351
Really annoys me that the hitman 2 gold edition goes on sale but never the expansion pass. Anyway, yeah I tend to agree they've been hitting it out the park the last few years.
Yeah, it's been frustrating seeing the entire Gold edition available cheaper on PC than the expansion pass is by itself on PS4. The bank level looks fun but not sure if I'm willing to shell out $40 for that and a sniper map right now.
It's not really useful now, but the expansion pass was on sale during E3 in NA/SA.
 

daninthemix

Member
Nov 2, 2017
5,024
These are the only stealth games that I actually enjoy. Definitely a huge part of it is the intricate world of each level, and the massive variety between the levels.
 

Nemesis-T Type

Alt account
Banned
Jan 19, 2019
253
Sapienza has a James Bond feel to it with the town and the hidden bio lab underground and the water exit with the seaplane.
 

Sotha_Sil

Member
Nov 4, 2017
5,067
These are the only stealth games that I actually enjoy. Definitely a huge part of it is the intricate world of each level, and the massive variety between the levels.

Probably because traditional stealth elements (noise, line of sight, etc) are pretty basic in the Hitman games. Hitman's brand of stealth is more about solving the puzzle of how to gain access to different areas via disguises and assassinating targets in often darkly hilarious ways without drawing attention to yourself.

RewardingAngelicKillerwhale-size_restricted.gif
 

Love Machine

Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,228
Tokyo, Japan
If Zelda is a series about Miyamoto romanticizing exploring the woods behind his house growing up, then Hitman feels like the fantasy of wandering off as a kid into the employee-only section of a hotel and seeing the other world that exists beyond those closed doors.
I'm totally stealing this.
Now I want to reinstall Hitman!

Edit:
Holy shizzle tryagainlater! Now I really want to play again.
 
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exaByte

Banned
Jun 19, 2019
55
Truly, Hitman 2 has some of the best level designs in games. Also, I am waiting for the next 2 locations to be released for the Gold Edition owners. AFAIK, the New York one needs to be released or it was already released...have a lot of work lately and I am not up2date.
 
OP
OP
Odeko

Odeko

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Mar 22, 2018
15,180
West Blue
Both games are a masterclass in level design and the new Bank level is great even if it's a bit lacking in kill opportunities.

I'm gonna ramble on about how great Mumbai is that no one will read but god damn, it's such an incredible level.


Mumbai can be divided into a market, the slums which has a hill area that feels separate, a currently being built tower, a laundry area, an underground bunker, a old trainyard, and chawls which are a sort of apartment block.

You have 3 targets: Rangan who is in the tower, Shah who is in the trainyard and The Maelstrom who is said to be wandering around the slums and isn't identified at the start of the mission.

Default starting area will put you near the chawls with the tower looming above you. Rangan is in the tower so let's start there. There is 7 entrance/exit points to the tower grounds. Some require disguises, others are more traditional stealth approaches, some need a lockpick or crowbar to get in and most have guards in the way. You can get a disguise such as the dancer which can be found in the laundry area if you've ventured over there. There is also a specific actor who's clothes you can take who can be found vomiting in the slums. He is used for a specific kill opportunity that involves 47 being in a Bollywood photoshoot.

Once you're in the tower grounds, there's then many points on entry into the tower itself. You can use the main entrances or the security guard entrance or climb up various point of entry around the building. Right, you're in the building and working your way up to find Rangan. Now, as I mentioned earlier, the tower is currently being built so there's all manner of places to push targets off ledges or drop stuff on them. More specific kills involve getting Rangan to pose for a painting. You can dress as a painter and take him while he's posing. There's other stuff you can do with the painter kill but more on that later. My personal favourite kill involves dressing up as a Bollywood crewman and blowing him off the building with a giant industrial fan while he's filming a scene.


Alright, Rangan is down and you escape the tower. To pick one of the 7 entrance/exit points mentioned earlier, let's say you take the route over a short barge which will bring you to the edge of the slums. It's not obvious but you are right next to a building that is one fo the many entry points to the underground bunker which is one of the places to kill The Maelstrom but we haven't even identified him yet so let's go onto Shah next. The barge will put you on the perimeter of the map which will give you an easy run to the trainyard without having to enter the slums.

Approaching the trainyard, you are again met with a number of entry points. There's a wide open space near the traintracks, there's some entry points through some traincars, you can get in through the laundry area, you can get in from a bridge and there's also a way to get in through a run-off. The mosst obvious point of entry is well guarded but wandering nearby, you'll hear some talk about a tailor who is terrified to go measure Shah since the previous tailors met with some unfortunate ends. Let's follow the tailor. He'll eventually isolate himself wandering through the slums. Knock him out, take his clothes and get your measuring tape. This allows you to waltz right in the main entrance to the trainyard as the tailor that suddenly found his courage. Get to Shah and give her a private measuring and put that tape to good use. Wandering around the trainyard, you can find many more opportunities that involve poisoning, dropping bird cages or just blowing stuff up.


Alright, 2 targets down. Now onto The Maelstrom but that's a problem. We don't know who he is and he isn't marked on your map and doesn't show up in instinct. It's an interesting wrinkle in a Hitman mission and unsurprisingly, there's a number of ways to deal with it. A first time player will wander around the slums where he is supposed to be and hopefully be pointed in his direction. One thing about the slums though; The Maelstrom's guards are looking for suspicious people they don't know and 47 fits that description. When wandering around the slums, you'll be met with many enforcers (these are people with white dots over their heads who can see through your disguises) that can see through almost all disguises, even just your default clothes. You can use crowds and blending spots to remain hidden while the guards patrol but the more observant people might notice certain people in the slums with their faces covered. The metal workers. Who can be suspicious of metal workers when they're hard at work. Either knock out a metal worker or find a free disguise in one of their apartments and boom, now you can walk around the slums freely and unmolested.

Now, how the hell do you find The Maelstrom? He's a unique target in the games. He'll spawn with different clothes and different facial hair so even in replays, it's not entirely obvious who he is. There are a number of ways to recognise him. Wandering around the slums you'll hear conversations of two people who have a picture of him that you can get your hands on. Thanks to the great level and mission design, there's pictures of him in Rangan's Tower and the trainyard you can find if you go take care of those targets first. There's also a way to manipulate him to come meet his ex-girlfriend which he will also do in the natural course of the mission if you just wait. Although I said he has a random set of clothes and facial hair, his facial model is still the same. On subsequent playthrough, he still won't be marked on the map until you've officially recognised but if you see the guy with the eye scar wandering the slums, you can just kill him and your handler will be "oh, I guess that guy you just killed was The Maelstrom". Wandering around the slums, there will be plenty of opportunities to poison him at food stalls. A personal favourite is dressing up as the local barber and wait for him to come in for a shave. 3 targets down, now just exfiltrate to one of the many exits and you're done.


Now if you're thinking "that's all great, but that if I don't want to go after all 3 targets separately every time I play this amazing achievement in video game design?" I'm glad you asked. You want to kill the Maelstrom but doing both the tower and trainyard stuff can be exhausting. In the underground bunker (which again has many point of entry from various angles), you can find a purple brick and hear a conversation about its smoke being a signal for something or other. Throw it in a metal furnace and purple smoke will rise. Rangan and Shah will leave their respective areas and meet by a boat rental hut...right under a boat. That's a twofer.



You down for some trainyard skulking but not in the mood for chasing the Maelstrom through the slums or climbing the tower? If you have explored the chawls area, you will find a room that shows that Rangan and Shah have actually put out hits on each other. Once Shah is down, you can call Rangan at a payphone which will lead to Rangan and The Maelstrom meeting on the barge outside the tower, which I'll remind you is still being built. If you find the crane controls, you can position a giant building cylinder over your two targets and hit the button. That's a twofer.



You happy to climb up the tower but want to get Shah and The Maelstrom together? Then you can set up my favourite kill in the entire series. Ring Shah and she will meet up with our good friend, The Maelstrom at her trainyard. Now, this trainyard may have been converted into a palace of sorts but there is an active train line right next to it. A train line that you can converge to run right through where Shah and The Maelstrom are meeting. It's some beautiful Wil E. Coyote shit. Also, while the cutscene showing the train barrel through your targets is playing, you can hold whatever button you use to exit missions is which will have 47 jump on the train and use it as an exit. That's a twofer and a quick exfiltration.



But there's one more thing I want to share. What was that about Rangan and Shah putting hits out on each other? Does that mean there's rival assassins out there. Yes, but only one. Our boy, The Kashmirian. However, he is a complete bonehead. You can find him in the chawls which is likely an area a first time player will wander into first from the default starting location. It offers an insight to the brilliant clockwork nature of Hitman levels that requires multiple playthroughs to piece together. When he's not looking, you can refocus his sniper rifle that's pointed towards the tower. Will Rangan wander in front of his scope? Not naturally, but he will if you make him. The painter I mentioned 27 paragraphs ago is our means of manipulation since the scope is trained on his studio in the tower. Now, you can dress as the painter and fetch Rangan to pose in the studio (which I mentioned as a separate opportunity earlier) and watch him get headshot right in front of you. Or you can find the set of paint that the painter is missing which is why his painting is being held up. If you give him the paint, he'll go fetch Rangan himself and you can be on the other side of the map when the Kasmirian gets his snipe kill steal in.



Following this through, what about Shah. After killing Rangan, The Kashmirian will wander to another room in the chawls and have his sights trained on the bridge overlooking the laundry area. Shah is set to meet the new laundry manager here but again, it requires some manipulation. But again...again, you can play out this meeting by dressing as the manager and requesting the meeting (which is a kill opportunity in itself) and then act surprised when she gets shot. Or you can go for a lighter touch and find the files that the manager needs so he can have the meeting and let it play out while you watch from afar.


Damn, The Kashmirian has taken care of two of your targets. It would be great if he could help with the third....and he does. You can follow him to a payphone where he will call the Maelstrom and request a meeting. He will have a meeting in the underground bunker so you won't have to bother with trying to find The Maelstrom in the slums. And of course, you can take out The Kashmirian on route and take his clothes and get your own private meeting with your third target. There's also an exfiltration point in the bunker which is nice and convenient.



If you're a person who has read this all the way through, god bless you. If you don't know much about Hitman, all this stuff is found out by exploring the level, listening to dialogue, experimenting and many playthroughs. All this depth is just for the main mission but every area in a map has its own detailed layouts and NPCs with their own routing. It means the maps have life beyond their main mission that allow for great variation in player made contracts, escalations which are a sort of challenge mode with increasingly difficult parameters and elusive targets which are timed, one shot only contracts that often feature the less used parts of the map.

TL;DR: The game is amazing and you'll struggle to find better level design in other games especially with Mumbai as a showcase. I could probably eqully long insane ramblings about Sapienza and Miami but I won't because people won't even read the one above.
Great post. My favorite memory of my first H2 playthrough was slowly and methodically exploring this level without mission stories and actually getting silent assassin. I think my end time was over 2 hours, and I used the industrial fan for Rangan, the barber for the Maelstrom, and set up an electrocution for Shaw. It felt truly immense then and even now I still constantly get lost in it.

Truly, Hitman 2 has some of the best level designs in games. Also, I am waiting for the next 2 locations to be released for the Gold Edition owners. AFAIK, the New York one needs to be released or it was already released...have a lot of work lately and I am not up2date.
New York is actually out now, it was released about a week ago. The Resort is the last one and that's set for the fall.
 

Gelf

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,310
I've run out of things to say about how much I love the design of these games. There is really nothing like them, they are my games of generation and in a just world they would have sold way more.
 
OP
OP
Odeko

Odeko

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Mar 22, 2018
15,180
West Blue
It's worth noting that the Colorado level wasn't made by IO Interactive, it was outsourced to Sumo Digital
God this makes so much more sense now
They more than redeemed themselves though, I believe the same designers behind Colorado also made Sgail.

Edit: Also, this makes me sound more negative about Colorado than I actually am. I don't think it plays as much to the series's strengths, but I'm totally fine with it as a different type of level that mixes things up. It's a good change of pace for what it is, tornado bunker exit not withstanding.
 
Last edited:

kiguel182

Member
Oct 31, 2017
9,441
Both games are a masterclass in level design and the new Bank level is great even if it's a bit lacking in kill opportunities.

I'm gonna ramble on about how great Mumbai is that no one will read but god damn, it's such an incredible level.


Mumbai can be divided into a market, the slums which has a hill area that feels separate, a currently being built tower, a laundry area, an underground bunker, a old trainyard, and chawls which are a sort of apartment block.

You have 3 targets: Rangan who is in the tower, Shah who is in the trainyard and The Maelstrom who is said to be wandering around the slums and isn't identified at the start of the mission.

Default starting area will put you near the chawls with the tower looming above you. Rangan is in the tower so let's start there. There is 7 entrance/exit points to the tower grounds. Some require disguises, others are more traditional stealth approaches, some need a lockpick or crowbar to get in and most have guards in the way. You can get a disguise such as the dancer which can be found in the laundry area if you've ventured over there. There is also a specific actor who's clothes you can take who can be found vomiting in the slums. He is used for a specific kill opportunity that involves 47 being in a Bollywood photoshoot.

Once you're in the tower grounds, there's then many points on entry into the tower itself. You can use the main entrances or the security guard entrance or climb up various point of entry around the building. Right, you're in the building and working your way up to find Rangan. Now, as I mentioned earlier, the tower is currently being built so there's all manner of places to push targets off ledges or drop stuff on them. More specific kills involve getting Rangan to pose for a painting. You can dress as a painter and take him while he's posing. There's other stuff you can do with the painter kill but more on that later. My personal favourite kill involves dressing up as a Bollywood crewman and blowing him off the building with a giant industrial fan while he's filming a scene.


Alright, Rangan is down and you escape the tower. To pick one of the 7 entrance/exit points mentioned earlier, let's say you take the route over a short barge which will bring you to the edge of the slums. It's not obvious but you are right next to a building that is one fo the many entry points to the underground bunker which is one of the places to kill The Maelstrom but we haven't even identified him yet so let's go onto Shah next. The barge will put you on the perimeter of the map which will give you an easy run to the trainyard without having to enter the slums.

Approaching the trainyard, you are again met with a number of entry points. There's a wide open space near the traintracks, there's some entry points through some traincars, you can get in through the laundry area, you can get in from a bridge and there's also a way to get in through a run-off. The mosst obvious point of entry is well guarded but wandering nearby, you'll hear some talk about a tailor who is terrified to go measure Shah since the previous tailors met with some unfortunate ends. Let's follow the tailor. He'll eventually isolate himself wandering through the slums. Knock him out, take his clothes and get your measuring tape. This allows you to waltz right in the main entrance to the trainyard as the tailor that suddenly found his courage. Get to Shah and give her a private measuring and put that tape to good use. Wandering around the trainyard, you can find many more opportunities that involve poisoning, dropping bird cages or just blowing stuff up.


Alright, 2 targets down. Now onto The Maelstrom but that's a problem. We don't know who he is and he isn't marked on your map and doesn't show up in instinct. It's an interesting wrinkle in a Hitman mission and unsurprisingly, there's a number of ways to deal with it. A first time player will wander around the slums where he is supposed to be and hopefully be pointed in his direction. One thing about the slums though; The Maelstrom's guards are looking for suspicious people they don't know and 47 fits that description. When wandering around the slums, you'll be met with many enforcers (these are people with white dots over their heads who can see through your disguises) that can see through almost all disguises, even just your default clothes. You can use crowds and blending spots to remain hidden while the guards patrol but the more observant people might notice certain people in the slums with their faces covered. The metal workers. Who can be suspicious of metal workers when they're hard at work. Either knock out a metal worker or find a free disguise in one of their apartments and boom, now you can walk around the slums freely and unmolested.

Now, how the hell do you find The Maelstrom? He's a unique target in the games. He'll spawn with different clothes and different facial hair so even in replays, it's not entirely obvious who he is. There are a number of ways to recognise him. Wandering around the slums you'll hear conversations of two people who have a picture of him that you can get your hands on. Thanks to the great level and mission design, there's pictures of him in Rangan's Tower and the trainyard you can find if you go take care of those targets first. There's also a way to manipulate him to come meet his ex-girlfriend which he will also do in the natural course of the mission if you just wait. Although I said he has a random set of clothes and facial hair, his facial model is still the same. On subsequent playthrough, he still won't be marked on the map until you've officially recognised but if you see the guy with the eye scar wandering the slums, you can just kill him and your handler will be "oh, I guess that guy you just killed was The Maelstrom". Wandering around the slums, there will be plenty of opportunities to poison him at food stalls. A personal favourite is dressing up as the local barber and wait for him to come in for a shave. 3 targets down, now just exfiltrate to one of the many exits and you're done.


Now if you're thinking "that's all great, but that if I don't want to go after all 3 targets separately every time I play this amazing achievement in video game design?" I'm glad you asked. You want to kill the Maelstrom but doing both the tower and trainyard stuff can be exhausting. In the underground bunker (which again has many point of entry from various angles), you can find a purple brick and hear a conversation about its smoke being a signal for something or other. Throw it in a metal furnace and purple smoke will rise. Rangan and Shah will leave their respective areas and meet by a boat rental hut...right under a boat. That's a twofer.



You down for some trainyard skulking but not in the mood for chasing the Maelstrom through the slums or climbing the tower? If you have explored the chawls area, you will find a room that shows that Rangan and Shah have actually put out hits on each other. Once Shah is down, you can call Rangan at a payphone which will lead to Rangan and The Maelstrom meeting on the barge outside the tower, which I'll remind you is still being built. If you find the crane controls, you can position a giant building cylinder over your two targets and hit the button. That's a twofer.



You happy to climb up the tower but want to get Shah and The Maelstrom together? Then you can set up my favourite kill in the entire series. Ring Shah and she will meet up with our good friend, The Maelstrom at her trainyard. Now, this trainyard may have been converted into a palace of sorts but there is an active train line right next to it. A train line that you can converge to run right through where Shah and The Maelstrom are meeting. It's some beautiful Wil E. Coyote shit. Also, while the cutscene showing the train barrel through your targets is playing, you can hold whatever button you use to exit missions is which will have 47 jump on the train and use it as an exit. That's a twofer and a quick exfiltration.



But there's one more thing I want to share. What was that about Rangan and Shah putting hits out on each other? Does that mean there's rival assassins out there. Yes, but only one. Our boy, The Kashmirian. However, he is a complete bonehead. You can find him in the chawls which is likely an area a first time player will wander into first from the default starting location. It offers an insight to the brilliant clockwork nature of Hitman levels that requires multiple playthroughs to piece together. When he's not looking, you can refocus his sniper rifle that's pointed towards the tower. Will Rangan wander in front of his scope? Not naturally, but he will if you make him. The painter I mentioned 27 paragraphs ago is our means of manipulation since the scope is trained on his studio in the tower. Now, you can dress as the painter and fetch Rangan to pose in the studio (which I mentioned as a separate opportunity earlier) and watch him get headshot right in front of you. Or you can find the set of paint that the painter is missing which is why his painting is being held up. If you give him the paint, he'll go fetch Rangan himself and you can be on the other side of the map when the Kasmirian gets his snipe kill steal in.



Following this through, what about Shah. After killing Rangan, The Kashmirian will wander to another room in the chawls and have his sights trained on the bridge overlooking the laundry area. Shah is set to meet the new laundry manager here but again, it requires some manipulation. But again...again, you can play out this meeting by dressing as the manager and requesting the meeting (which is a kill opportunity in itself) and then act surprised when she gets shot. Or you can go for a lighter touch and find the files that the manager needs so he can have the meeting and let it play out while you watch from afar.


Damn, The Kashmirian has taken care of two of your targets. It would be great if he could help with the third....and he does. You can follow him to a payphone where he will call the Maelstrom and request a meeting. He will have a meeting in the underground bunker so you won't have to bother with trying to find The Maelstrom in the slums. And of course, you can take out The Kashmirian on route and take his clothes and get your own private meeting with your third target. There's also an exfiltration point in the bunker which is nice and convenient.



If you're a person who has read this all the way through, god bless you. If you don't know much about Hitman, all this stuff is found out by exploring the level, listening to dialogue, experimenting and many playthroughs. All this depth is just for the main mission but every area in a map has its own detailed layouts and NPCs with their own routing. It means the maps have life beyond their main mission that allow for great variation in player made contracts, escalations which are a sort of challenge mode with increasingly difficult parameters and elusive targets which are timed, one shot only contracts that often feature the less used parts of the map.

TL;DR: The game is amazing and you'll struggle to find better level design in other games especially with Mumbai as a showcase. I could probably eqully long insane ramblings about Sapienza and Miami but I won't because people won't even read the one above.

I'm currently in Mumbai wondering how they would meet and how the train would play into it or the Kashmiri and altought this spoiled me I'm also now super excited to go try and do all this stuff later on!