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The PS5 is the first PlayStation platform to launch in Japan without any retail 3rd party JP game alongside it [Discussion]
- Thread starter Lelouch0612
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OP
Dragon Quest 11 Will be an Offline Game for Home Console - IGN
The series creator continues to talk about what the future holds for Dragon Quest fans.
"Dragon Quest XI will be an offline game for home consoles" said Horii
Like I mentionned earlier, support will come eventually but it might take some time and it might slow down transition.
Edit: What do you mean by "next-gen exclusive" for Ryza ? It is a multiplatform and cross-gen game.
Dragon Quest 11 Will be an Offline Game for Home Console - IGN
The series creator continues to talk about what the future holds for Dragon Quest fans.www.ign.com
"Dragon Quest XI will be an offline game for home consoles" said Horii
Like I mentionned earlier, support will come eventually but it might take some time and it might slow down transition.
Edit: What do you mean by "next-gen exclusive" for Ryza ? It is a multiplatform and cross-gen game.
Dragon Quest XI was originally PS4-only, 3DS version was added later on
Dragon Quest XI will be launching on 3DS alongside a PlayStation 4 version in July. That wasn’t the original plan, however. In a pamphlet provided to fans at the Dragon Quest XI “Countdown Carnival” hands-on events, it’s revealed that the 3DS version was added later on in development...
nintendoeverything.com
There's also this, but it's very possible Nintendo Everything mistranslated or straight up misreported it. That's not unusual for them.
Launch may not be strong but more titles will come over time and it will eventually be a strong platform in Japan. I don't see why it would be any different from this gen, it's going to get all the major titles from Capcom, Square Enix, Bandai Namco, Sega/Atlus etc.
Japan Studio is involved as well. Gavin Moore (director of Puppeteer) has been working on it to some capacity and has featured in blog posts talking about the remake.
That's most likely referring to revenue since the PS4 version was more expensive than the 3DS version. Also that was basically 1st-2nd week of shipments.
Google translate of the picture they provided yields this:There's also this, but it's very possible Nintendo Everything mistranslated or straight up misreported it. That's not unusual for them.Dragon Quest XI was originally PS4-only, 3DS version was added later on
Dragon Quest XI will be launching on 3DS alongside a PlayStation 4 version in July. That wasn’t the original plan, however. In a pamphlet provided to fans at the Dragon Quest XI “Countdown Carnival” hands-on events, it’s revealed that the 3DS version was added later on in development...
Of course it's google translate + it's reading an image, so...
Day one Japanese produced 3rd party launch titles this century for comparison:
PlayStation 2
edit: Adding 1st parties:
PlayStation 2
PlayStation 2
- A6: A-Train 6 (ArtDink)
- drumMania (Konami)
- Eternal Ring (From Software)
- Kakinogi Shogi IV (ASCII)
- Kessen (Koei)
- Mahjong Taikai III (Koei)
- Morita Shogi (Yuki Enterprise)
- Ridge Racer V (Namco)
- Street Fighter EX3 (Capcom)
- Stepping Selection (Jaleco)
- Boku wa Koukuu Kanseikan (Tamsoft)
- Castlevania: Circle of the Moon (Konami)
- ChuChu Rocket! (Sega)
- ESPN Final Round Golf 2002 (Konami)
- EZ-Talk Shokyuuhen 1 (Keynet)
- Fire Pro Wrestling (Spike)
- GT Advance Championship Racing (MTO)
- J.League Pocket (Konami)
- Konami Krazy Racers (Konami)
- Mega Man Battle Nework (Capcom)
- Momotaru Matsuri (Hudson)
- Monster Guardians (Konami)
- Mr. Driller 2 (Namco)
- Pinobee: Wings of Adventure (Hudson)
- Play Novel: Silent Hill (Konami)
- Power Pro Kun Pocket 3 (Konami)
- Super Dodge Ball Advance (Atlus)
- Top Gear GT Championship (Kemco) *
- Tweety & the Magic Gems (Kemco) *
- Winning Post for Game Boy Advance (Koei)
- Yu-Gi-Oh! DungeonDice Monsters (Konami)
- Super Monkey Ball (Sega)
- AirForce Delta: Storm (Konami)
- Dead or Alive 3 (Tecmo)
- ESPN International Winter Sports 2002 (Konami)
- ESPN Winter X Games Snowboarding 2002 (Konami)
- Genma Onimusha (Capcom)
- JSRF: Jet Set Radio Future (Sega)
- Nobunaga no Yaibou: Ranseiki (Koei)
- Silent Hill 2: Restless Dreams (Konami)
- Wreckless: The Yakuza Missions (Bunkasha Soft)
- Cool 104 Joker & Setline (Aruze)
- Feel the Magic: XY-XX (Sega)
- Kenshuui Tendo Dokuta (Spike)
- Mahjong Taikai (Koei)
- Mr. Driller: DrillSpirits (Namco)
- ZooKeeper (Success)
- Armored Core: Formula Front - Extreme Battle (From Software)
- DarkStalkers Chronicle: The Chaos Tower (Capcom)
- Lumines: Puzzle x Fusion (Bandai)
- Mahjong Fight Club (Konami)
- Ridge Racer (Namco)
- Ridge Racer 6 (Namco)
- Tetris: The Grand Master ACE (AQinteractive)
- Miyazato San Kyoudai Naizou: Sega Golf Club (Sega)
- Mobile Suit Gundam: Crossfire (Bandai Namco Games)
- Ridge Racer 7 (Bandai Namco Games)
- Crayon Shin-Chan: Saikyou Kazoku Kasukabe King Wii (Banpresto)
- Elebits (Konami)
- Ennichi no Tatsujin (Bandai Namco Games)
- Escape from Bug Island (Spike)
- Kororinpa: Marble Mania (Hudson)
- SD Gundam: Scad Hammers (Bandai Namco Games)
- Super Monkey Ball: Banana Blitz (Sega)
- Super Swing Golf (Tecmo)
- Tamagotchi Party On! (Bandai Namco Games)
- Trauma Center: Second Opinion (Atlus)
- Wing Island (Hudson)
- Bust-A-Move Universe (Square Enix)
- Pro Evolution Soccer 2011 3D (Konami)
- Professor Layton and the Miracle Mask (Level 5)
- Ridge Racer 3D (Bandai Namco Games)
- Samurai Warriors Chronicles (Koei Tecmo)
- Super Street Fighter IV 3D Edition (Capcom)
- Army Corps of Hell (Square Enix)
- BlazBlue: Continuum Shift Extend (Arc System Works)
- Disgaea 3: Absence of Detention (Nippon Ichi Soft)
- Dream C Club Zero Portable (D3Publisher)
- Dynasty Warriors Next (Koei Tecmo)
- Lord of Apocalypse (Square Enix)
- Mahjong Fight Club: Shinsei Zenkoku Taisen Han (Konami)
- Ridge Racer (Bandai Namco Games)
- Shin Kamaitachi no Yoru: 11-ninme no Suspect (Chunsoft)
- Shinobido 2: Revenge of Zan (Spike)
- Touch My Katamari (Bandai Namco Games)
- Ultimate Marvel Vs. Capcom 3 (Capcom)
- Virtua Tennis 4: World Tour Edition (Sega) *
- Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate (Capcom)
- Ninja Gaiden 3: Razor's Edge (Koei Tecmo)
- Tekken Tag Tournament 2: Wii U Edition (Bandai Namco Games)
- Warriors Orochi 3 Hyper (Koei Tecmo)
- Dynasty Warriors 8 Xtreme Legends: Complete Edition (Koei Tecmo)
- Nobunaga's Ambition: Sphere of Influence (Koei Tecmo)
- Ryu Ga Gotoku: Ishin! (Sega)
- Dead Rising 3 (Capcom) *
- Warriors Orochi 3 Ultimate (Koei Tecmo)
- Disgaea 5 Complete (Nippon Ichi Soft)
- Dragon Quest Heroes I & II for Nintendo Switch (Square Enix)
- I am Setsuna (Square Enix)
- Nobunaga no Yaibou: Souzou with Power-Up Kit (Koei Tecmo)
- Puyo Puyo Tetris (Sega)
- Super Bomberman R (Konami)
- none
- none
edit: Adding 1st parties:
PlayStation 2
- Fantavision
- F-Zero: Maximum Velocity
- Kurukuru Kururin
- Napoleon
- Super Mario Advance
- Luigi's Mansion
- Wave Race: Blue Storm *
- Sneakers
- Daigasso! Band Brothers
- Pokémon Dash!
- Polarium
- Super Mario 64 DS
- WarioWare: Touched!
- Hot Shots Golf: Open Tee
- Every Party
- Genji: Days of the Blade
- The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess
- WarioWare: Smooth Moves
- Wii Play
- Wii Sports
- Nintendogs + Cats
- Hot Shots Golf: World Invitational
- New Super Mario Bros. U
- Nintendo Land
- Knack
- none
- 1-2-Switch
- The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild
- Demon's Souls *
- none
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I think they see the writing on the wall. Their audience is in the west. The Switch came out nearly four years after the PS4 and promptly went to outsell the PS4 in Japan. They'll still get Japanese games, but I bet the Switch starts to pull some of that output.
Kind of surprised there isn't any Monster hunter remake or deluxe port on PS5 for Japan audience at launch. That probably could move some units.
MS has gone after Tales of Arise and Yakuza and whatever other deals they have out there with Sega, etc. Like they were trying to do during the 360 era. I mean, I love Japanese games but they are mostly niche on consoles at this point because of Ninty/Switch. I mean, how many 3rd party pubs are still making full console games (not portable/Switch) in Japan?
Capcom
Bamco
SEGA
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Konami doesn't anymore...
But yeah, Sony relying way too much on the West now, but it makes business sense...
Capcom
Bamco
SEGA
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Konami doesn't anymore...
But yeah, Sony relying way too much on the West now, but it makes business sense...
For sure.
I'm reminded of the press release announcing the PlayStation 4 version of Brigandine: The Legend of Runersia, in which the publisher specifically mentions the game is also playable on PlayStation 5. For some games, it may just not make sense to develop a PlayStation 5 version, especially if the PlayStation 4 game might already natively run better when played on PlayStation 5. Release one SKU = less costly, playable on both systems. Release two SKUS = more costly, one version has a limited audience. The only downside is that your PlayStation 5 audience is probably looking for games with that shiny new PlayStation 5 packaging and may skip out on your game if they see it's "only a PS4 game."
Maybe not the best label --- just meant that it's the only one of the two next-gen platforms that the game is available on.
The PS4 version of Dragon Quest XI had sold 1,347,582 retail copies when it was last seen on Media Create's sales charts in September 2017, and the 3DS version sold 1,741,582 retail copies when it was last seen in October 2017.
According to Square Enix, shipments + digital sales across both SKUs topped three million in Japan in August 2017. At that point, the game had sold 1,148,888 retail copies on 3DS and 950,315 retail copies on PlayStation 4, meaning about 900,797 units were either shipped + not yet sold or digital.
Considering the high digital attach rate Monster Hunter: World would welcome half a year later (650,000~ digital copies in three days), it's not too out there to guess that the majority of those 900,797 unaccounted-for units were digital PlayStation 4 sales.
The quote is fine, but I don't think the implication isn't "We thought it wouldn't sell on PS4, so we created a 3DS version to make up for it." It's more so, "We decided to create two versions to reach as wide an audience as possible."
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DQ11 came out earlier in Japan, and the PS4 version was day and date with the 3DS version.
Should be noted that "sales" for SE is used for revenue. They refer to units sold when referring to copies of the game sold. This terminology is used heavily in their financial reports. There's a reason they didn't release a breakdown when hitting the 3 million sold.
MHW's high digital sales were because the title was supply constrained. Same happened to MH4 in fact, or a better 3DS example (longer term) would be Animal Crossing: New Leaf. The higher than usual digital rate for all these titles isn't indicative of general platform trends and the vast bulk of that 900k DQXI units was undoubtedly packaged units in channel. Famitsu digital estimates (which are NOT great admittedly) give lifetime tracked digital sales as 159k PS4, 80k 3DS and (surprisingly) 111k Switch.
Anecdotal but living in Japan this is what I see from the perspective of my office. Only three in my office including myself were lucky to get pre-orders, all of us foreigners. None of the Japan staff seem interested at all. I was the only one to grab a Xbox Series X preorder as well. Japan staff are all on the Switch train and that is the only system they care about. PS5/XSX are mostly for western audiences, fans of western games it seems so I don't think it matters there isn't any 3rd party JP games. Delaying launch like the PS4 would have been a mistake though.
I'm admittedly not much of a sales buff, though judging by the quotes from Square Enix regarding PS4 sales > 3DS sales, it does sound like they're talking about actual unit sales versus revenue. But again, I'm not the biggest sales guy.
Thanks for the insight on Famitsu's estimated digital sales numbers for Dragon Quest XI. I should've looked for that information myself considering the comparison I was making.
Even if you're talking a slim majority of that 900k being PS4 downloads(so ~500k) that is really unlikely. For one thing Monster Hunter World(and other games that have done numbers that high) have all been supply constrained which DQXI wasn't.
It would also means sales outside of Japan were TERRIBLE. DQXI shipped 4m copies as of November 2018:
Dragon Quest XI: Echoes of an Elusive Age shipments and digital sales top four million
Total worldwide shipments and digital sales for Dragon Quest XI: Echoes of an Elusive Age have exceeded four million units, Square Enix announced.
www.gematsu.com
At that point the game had sold through over 3m units in Japan, so if you include those digital sales + whatever digital sales 3DS and unsold copies on Japanese shelves that would point to sales being well <500k for the rest of the world.
Even later on the 5.5m including Dragon Quest XIS would imply Japanese shipments + digital were well over 4m units(as retail sell through of DQXI + DQXIS was already over 3.5m as of December 2019).
... This happened fast. I mean, once upon a time this sentiment was reserved for the Xbox, and now its Sony?
Okay I guess...
Just to add on to what others said, looking back at the old neogaf media create thread with the first week sell through, 3ds would have had over 1.5 million FW shipment and PS4 had over 1.1 million. Given SE would have probably sent another shipment before the announcement, that doesn't leave much room for a huge digital amount.
Yeah, it's a bummer, but that's the reality of the situation. I think to compete with Nintendo in Japan you need a compelling handheld device with a compelling software library. That's not Sony's lane, so Nintendo has essentially no competition in that regard.
With that said, it doesn't mean PS5 can't do well for itself in Japan, all things considered.
I'm not sure why it's surprising that they appeal to their largest market. PS4 has had a lot of Japanese games, but at the end of the day, Japan sales will account for less than 10% of the overall unit sales. Shouldn't be too hard to understand their strategy. And I say this as an avid fan of Japanese games.
A lot of doom and gloom and FUD all around. Japanese games in the PS3 era became more scarce not just because of a shrinking console market in Japan, but because of the difficult transition to HD, and Japanese devs typically would make their own game engines. Unity and UE were not really a thing, yet. I'd imagine PS5 will have around the same amount of Japanese thoroughput, with some of the more quirky games going multi platform, especially to Nintendo. I do worry about Sony's overall apparent complacency, though.
I think they have made a well though out decision.
Japanese players are more keen on FPShooters and enjoy both high quality AAA and indie-games from the West these days. For Japanese games they play on Switch or Mobile. That is my impression.
The Neptunia and Otaku-visial novels and stuff are very niche games which still looks like Vita/PS3-games so anyone interested in those games won't need a PS5 to play it.
But that dual sense will of course get its hentai games along with PSVR2 but the developers needs to learn how to make use if it and there must be enough possible buyers who owns a console before they can launch such games.
PSVR2 could really sell well in Japan where high end PC's are more expensive than consoles and people live in small homes without being able to travels as much. PSVR2 has a strong potential in Japan is my guess.
Eventhough Japan get PS5 before EU and same time as USA they probably won't get any large amount so many JPN players won't have a PS5 until next year - as podcast 8-4 was guessing the other day.
Japanese developers will probably try to launch something nice before golden week in Spring 2021.
Japanese players are more keen on FPShooters and enjoy both high quality AAA and indie-games from the West these days. For Japanese games they play on Switch or Mobile. That is my impression.
The Neptunia and Otaku-visial novels and stuff are very niche games which still looks like Vita/PS3-games so anyone interested in those games won't need a PS5 to play it.
But that dual sense will of course get its hentai games along with PSVR2 but the developers needs to learn how to make use if it and there must be enough possible buyers who owns a console before they can launch such games.
PSVR2 could really sell well in Japan where high end PC's are more expensive than consoles and people live in small homes without being able to travels as much. PSVR2 has a strong potential in Japan is my guess.
Eventhough Japan get PS5 before EU and same time as USA they probably won't get any large amount so many JPN players won't have a PS5 until next year - as podcast 8-4 was guessing the other day.
Japanese developers will probably try to launch something nice before golden week in Spring 2021.
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I think we will still see the big mass-appeal (Japan + ROW) game or two a year but the middle budget by-japan-for-japan (and a little bit of ROW) and niche games are going to become more and more rare as they either shift to Nintendo, mobile, or PC or cease to exist all together.
Ehh I kind of disagree there. PS3 had weaker Japanese support because there were at least three other platforms competing for software and all three were more successful, and cheaper to develop for, than PS3(that didn't last for Wii of course). On the contrary PS4 managed to consolidate all that support PS3 didn't have because Wii U and Vita were dismal failures and the 3DS performed really well in Japan but was a mediocre performer outside of Japan and the consensus was handhelds were done, and couldn't compete with mobile.
In that sense PS5 might have a harder time than PS4, Switch is much more viable than Wii U, Vita and 3DS ever were. However it should probably fare better than PS3 by virtue of the fact that Switch & PS4/PS5 can more easily share games and that's much more commonplace now.
Of course the risk with Sony being "complacent"(which I don't think they are tbh) is that they could risk losing the critical mass of users and create a negative feedback loop. If PS5 sales are slow enough to hold back software sales third parties will be slower to support the system, which will then slow the adoption of platform, which obviously then will prompt more caution from third parties. I definitely doubt that will happen though, simply due to the guaranteed install base outside of Japan.
Ironic that Compile Heart/Neptunia are one of the only PS5 exclusives so far, but it does indeed look like a Vita game(it's a re-re-remaster of a PS3 game).
Also FWIW Sony has clamped down on sexualisation so it's extremely unlikely they will get "hentai games".
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No I mentionned it in the OP. It is just that I was refering to 3rd party games and DS is 1st party.
This is a very dramatic take. I'm sure Japanese publishers will jump onto the PlayStation 5 once there's a dedicated install base.
This isn't like the PlayStation and PlayStation 2 era where SD games could be pumped out easily from third parties. Titles are taking longer to make as Japanese third parties familiarise themselves with the new technology and the increased costs of developing a game for next-gen systems.