The budget is certainly increasing, so I imagine actors with a better grasp on large-scale action scenes and character handling will be brought on to helm some episodes.
Imagine an invasion of Mandalore episode directed by Miguel Sapochnik...
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The Mandalorian - Season 2 |OT| Wherever I go, he goes [SPOILERS ON EPISODE DROP]
- Thread starter WadiumArcadium
- Start date
- OT
Imagine an invasion of Mandalore episode directed by Miguel Sapochnik...
I like it fine as-is (though I am bothered that they seem to be setting up way more than they could ever pay off) but I am curious what changes they'd do. Maybe they'd push episodes to be slightly more arc based.
I would like that actually.
I mean, I enjoy the show for what it is, but a bigger focus on an overarching storyline and, yes everyone will hate me for it, Mando without the helmet would elevate the show for me personally.
Yeah, basically every episode this season has been that. Hopefully it changes up to end it though.
Also I don't think the child will want to leave the mandalorians side of he has a choice
That isn't even close to an accurate summation of people's problems with TLJ Luke.
Nice straw man though.
"They" ... George Lucas would have done Luke dirty too according to his outlines for the ST. Rian Johnson executed that concept better than GL ever could have.
i think the bar for quality television has moved far beyond something like that
Even just it being one long quest with complications instead of a very "princess in another castle" story would do wonders for my itty bit of frustration with the show. Admittedly this CAN be done well, because Samurai Jack did it every single episode, so maybe it'd just require the episodes themselves to stand out more (which 1, 3, and 5 did, admittedly, 2 and 4 were just kind of standard).
I think the problem with Mando and MOTW episodes is that the season is REALLY short so the MOTWs need to be spectacular to be worth the time (which I'd say they 'mostly' are this season? I think things might be better in retrospect once it's over).
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I'm not sure what bar you are referencing but I struggle to imagine a show that is 100% focused. Even non scifi like breaking bad take detours to side stories
The point is these side missions show more of the universe, which is good.
And I can't see the mission being a straight line on it would have been over by now. Its understood Mando is going to be traveling everywhere to find a home for Grogu
i mean at the very least they could probably come up with an alternative premise for an episode? more than "ill help you but only if you help me kill x / escort x"
it's also not like the narrative of the show has to be specifically just about mando bouncing around from person to person, it can be whatever they want and not like the same repetitive premise every episode
‘The Mandalorian’: Rosario Dawson Tells All About Ahsoka Tano
The actress and writer-director Dave Filoni discuss bringing the animated hero to live-action, Baby Yoda’s name, and real-life controversies and influences.www.vanityfair.com
Interview with Filoni and Rosario.
I am very okay with this explanation, to be honest.
In many ways she is as the Jedi should be, even if she isn't a card carrying member of the order technically.
I loved the absolute hell out of this episode. It convinced me to get back into the expanded universe.
He 100% would not be, lol. Not without a giant freaking paycheck.
Speaking broadly, I think this is a misreading of things. The definition of quality television has changed to exclude procedural/Thing Of The Week shows in favor of more heavily serialized stories, but that's not a lifting of standards, just a changing of them. A lot of my favorite shows of all time have been case of the week sorta deals without much serialization, and I think they hold up very well, for the most part, due to the focus on characters over plot. Stuff like Psych or the other Blue Skies USA shows come to mind. Leverage, too.
Cross posting my response from the OT thread
To expand on this: why would Ahsoka be looking for Thrawn? She knows he disappeared into the Unknown Regions with Ezra, and that's where she'd expect him to be. Unless there are rumors that he's returned and she'd expect to find a clue to Ezra's whereabouts if she found Thrawn. That's another clue that the Rebels scene is after Chapter 13...
I honestly prefer MotW format over heavily serialized shows where you can have half a season just tablesetting for the finale.
Good shows can do both. MotW episodes can give character insights or details that can be extremely important later on in unexpected ways. I prefer more episodic content too, but I think, just as with the previous animated series, we're going to find that Mandalorian is more serialized than was given credit at the time. It's just not obvious now as the episodes stream week to week.
‘The Mandalorian’: Rosario Dawson Tells All About Ahsoka Tano
The actress and writer-director Dave Filoni discuss bringing the animated hero to live-action, Baby Yoda’s name, and real-life controversies and influences.
Interview with Filoni and Rosario.
The ending caught my eye the most:
I had the theory that this takes place before Ahsoka appears to Sabine at the end of Rebels.
Yeah people have a lot of mix interpretation of what a main journey is
I would hate to see these people try and sit through an episode of Star Trek Voyager they'd go insane not knowing what stopping at different planets has to do with getting home!
First 6 eps of TCW season 4:
3 x Mon Cala
1 x Jar-Jar/Grievous
2x droids on weird planets, including one with short people with stereotypical French accents
Man. Can't wait for the Umbara arc to start next episode. You could easily skip these and not miss anything terribly important, though they're not unwatchable by any stretch.
3 x Mon Cala
1 x Jar-Jar/Grievous
2x droids on weird planets, including one with short people with stereotypical French accents
Man. Can't wait for the Umbara arc to start next episode. You could easily skip these and not miss anything terribly important, though they're not unwatchable by any stretch.
Grogu is just a random ass name, really who cares
Ahsoka was called out 2 episodes earlier and he made a detour in the previous episode for repairs. If you've been following you know she'll be in that ep.
This is virtually the only show, as far as I'm aware, that has this type of structure and only produces 8 episodes a year. Also, 99% of shows that use this format have a greater level of character work and serialized threads than this series seems to be interested in.
‘The Mandalorian’: Rosario Dawson Tells All About Ahsoka Tano
The actress and writer-director Dave Filoni discuss bringing the animated hero to live-action, Baby Yoda’s name, and real-life controversies and influences.
Crazy that Filoni invited George to see Ahsoka come to life the day that photo of him with Baby Yoda was taken haha.
Also I was on point with my read of Ahsoka being "The Jedi". Filoni is 100% on the "The Jedi lost their way and ain't shit camp"...Good.
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Right. And even those Blue Skies USA series have greater serialization and character work than The Mandalorian. If The Mandalorian was even hitting the level something like Psych or Leverage did, that would instantly make the show much better.
So pretty much what we suspected.
First episode of the Umbara arc is already better than anything in season 4 of TCW. :D Krell is such an egomaniacal asshole. Stand up to him, Rex!
OP
OP
Better character work, certainly, but idk about serialization. Every episode does advance the core plot in some way. Mando's big asset is huge production values, but some of the actual writing... well, that leaves a lot to be desired.
Well yeah, I think we completely agree here. The USA Blue Skies shows did very much slow roll serial plot advancement, but it still usually progressed at a greater rate than what we are seeing in The Mandalorian. And character work there's almost no comparison.
Mando's production values and the Star Wars brand are essentially what is amplifying it to a greater degree compared to any other given show -- which is why it could be insanely better if it just -tried- to do a few of these other things to even a moderate degree.
The thing to remember here is that the Blue Sky shows had like 2x more eps per season than Mando, so from a per-episode count, I think it's basically keeping pace. Gets crazier per-minute.
Honestly I think that the king of the issues with Mando is that the writing we do get tends to be very middling. There's cool moments, but they're mostly visual. The mostly-silent, 50% faceless main cast means that they're relying on side characters to provide most of the character work in any given episode, and they really just don't seem to be up to the job.
The Umbara Arc is easily my most rewatched arc. It's the one I point to when people dismiss Clone Wars as a kid's show. I damn near turned it off when I watched it first run because it was edging real, real close to being too intense for my 7-year old daughter. That last episode is an emotional gut punch.
there is a relationship with the production values on the pace of the plot though. I think the pacing is fine personally but episodic shows have a lot more episodes and you can't make a show look this good with this much special effects with 15-22 episode seasons. Or Disney just has to ramp up production to a ridiculous level.
I expect the budget to increase each subsequent season. Apparently the MCU D+ series each cost between 150-200 million to produce while mando costs 100 million. My hope is that when everyone at LF/ILM is well adjusted to what the Volume can or can't do they will start focusing on more character work. I did not expect s2 to change the template too much since it was in production at the same time as s1.
Source
(The increased budget for the MCU might just be because of location shooting tho and A-list actors)
Source
(The increased budget for the MCU might just be because of location shooting tho and A-list actors)
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Imma need Cassian to be a 200 mil show pls. At least one huge space battle a season a la how GoT handled big battles
Kathleen pls
Kathleen pls
Also actors' contracts are probably higher in the MCU stuff considering they're A-listers and such.
Probably spent a good portion of that doing research and dev work for The Volume. Now that that's done, more of the share of budget goes to each episode I'm sure. So even if they didn't increase it, the overall quality of the show should go up, at least $$ spent per frame or whatever.
People making hollow posts about Grogu that do not generate a discussion, just upset a potential reveal for someone else, are annoying. Same with Ashoka. Just because you were cool with it, doesn't mean others were.
Sure there are less episodes here than on USA (typically 14-16) or network (usually 22), but to say that it is okay here because there are only 8 episodes feels like a cop out. You adjust your season story to your episode order. That is how the hundreds of other 8 or 10 episode TV series out there tell satisfying season-long stories. Right now it is clear they just don't have much story to tell per season, or an interest in telling much story per season. And the production budget has nothing to do with the quality of the story you're telling. Good writing does not cost extra (well, beyond hiring good writers).
Oh, I absolutely agree. Those are all problems. The truth is the show has many issues. Like I said, it is very much enjoyable -- but entirely on the very shallow ground of high production values and the Star Wars brand. There's virtually nothing strong beyond that and the music.
I keep forgetting that they're making a Cassian show. Really kind of funny how much Star Wars media keeps jumping back and forth through the timeline.
Yeahhhh that would be dope. I'm kinda picturing the Cassian show being a live action rebels basically anywayYou know who should play a large role in that series
With the talent behind the Cassian show I'd be a billion times more hyped for it if it wasn't about Cassian. I know how his story ends, I don't about a prequel for him.
Just keep Diego Luna and say it's Cassian's twin brother. Or he's a clone, I don't care.
Just keep Diego Luna and say it's Cassian's twin brother. Or he's a clone, I don't care.
There is a difference between what is happening, and how and why it's happening. Depending on who you are talking to, these can be seen as plot versus story.
You can jam a lot of plot into a film or TV show, and still end up with no story being told. So I think trying to quantify the amount creates a standard that is not worth following. Storytelling isn't a numbers game.
In regards to The Mandalorian, I don't think anyone told Favreau and Filoni they had to make 8 episodes. That is a choice they made, or really Favreau as he originated the project. Favreau said he wrote 4 scripts before even being hired. So he probably knew how far long his story was and how many more episodes he figured would be in season 1. He likely had an idea of where the series as a whole would go. He was writing Season 2 before Season 1 premiered, and was writing Season 3 before 2 premiered. My point is, the story he is telling takes into account the episode order because that was designed by him.
I don't know if Favreau and crew have "an interest in telling much story per season" and I don't care. I'm going to judge this based on what is presented to me. And what I see is a lot of how and why in each of the 13 episodes. In every episode we are shown why this era of Star Wars is the way it is and how it is leading to what we see in TFA (And beyond). Since the end of the 1st episode, and every episode since, we have seen Din and The Child's relationship evolve in some way. We have seen why Din acts the way he does and how he interacts with the world around him. The world is changing around him and sometimes he is the cause of it, and sometimes it changes him right back. This has not been a straightforward journey, but no good journey every is. Din is a bounty hunter, so much of his life has been literally episodic. It's how he makes a living. For a show about a bounty hunter this makes a lot of sense, even when he isn't hunting bounties. He lives his life by having short term goals. So it makes sense why the audience is seeing short adventures every week.
The show is a bonafide cultural phenomenon. And it's not because of the high production values and Star Wars brand. People like these characters. Yes The Child is a beautiful piece of technology, but that would only go so far if people didn't genuinely connect with him and Din and their relationship. Paring up this ruthless bounty hunter that is living day to day with little attachment to anything else, to a precious little baby that he now has to care for is a fascinating dynamic. It's not groundbreaking, but it's managed to rise to level where a lot of people that don't typically like Star Wars are watching this and Star Wars fans that have specific pieces they like about the franchise are seemingly coming together and enjoying this show.
We can talk about the issues and shallow ground, it's good to be critical, but as always with art it's going to come down to how the audience feels about it. If you make the connection then the faults don't matter so much. Or the faults just melt in to the identity of the show and become inseparable from the essence. So this "lack of story" simply isn't a negative to a lot of people. The identity of this show is built around Mando going on adventures with The Child and the audience anticipate seeing each step of that journey, the route and destination are just that little carrot pulling it along.