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Vote for your favourite moment of Season 2!

  • Din and Cobb Vanth take on the Krayt Dragon

    Votes: 61 5.5%
  • Din, Bo-Katan and her Mando allies storm the Imperial freighter

    Votes: 37 3.3%
  • Ahsoka reveals the child's name and the mystery of the Force to Din

    Votes: 119 10.7%
  • Boba Fett reacquires his armour

    Votes: 89 8.0%
  • Mayfeld snaps and kills his old commander, Valin Hess

    Votes: 234 21.0%
  • Slave 1 drops a seismic charge

    Votes: 52 4.7%
  • Luke Skywalker comes to the rescue

    Votes: 521 46.8%

  • Total voters
    1,113

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
43,028
Ahsoka is not a Jedi tho. She is not bound to the Alliance. She helps them sure but essentially is free to do her own thing. Why should she go to Luke?

Citation needed.

She left the Jedi Order in CW, but then they blew up. So, her whole "I'm no Jedi" schtick no longer had any relevance. In this episode, Mando calls her a Jedi and she doesn't deny it and she seemed perfectly willing to train Grogu had he not failed the test. So, it seems she's back to being a Jedi.

Regardless, Jedi or not the entire galaxy was fighting a war against the evil Empire and she just decided to...sit it out?
 

Ryan.

Prophet of Truth
The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
12,889
So the recent leaks regarding the backstory of the Child ended up being true and they were backed by Corey from Kessel Run Transmissions...

AnguishedGorgeousHarlequinbug-size_restricted.gif
 

Arta

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,445
As someone not fully into Star Wars that was a great episode. Ahsoka Tano was a badass!
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
43,028
Also, is this the first time ever it's been confirmed that Force Powers/Sensitivity fades if you don't either learn to master it or don't consistently use it?
 

Deleted member 7051

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,254
Citation needed.

She left the Jedi Order in CW, but then they blew up. So, her whole "I'm no Jedi" schtick no longer had any relevance. In this episode, Mando calls her a Jedi and she doesn't deny it and she seemed perfectly willing to train Grogu had he not failed the test. So, it seems she's back to being a Jedi.

Regardless, Jedi or not the entire galaxy was fighting a war against the evil Empire and she just decided to...sit it out?

She never "sat it out". She was Fulcrum for years, for most of the Imperial era in fact, and worked in secret to gather information and combat the Empire. She clashed against Inquisitors many times and even stopped them kidnapping Force-sensitive babies and, of course, fought (and even died, technically) to stop the Empire taking the Sith Temple on Malachor.

The fact that the next time we see her she's hunting Thrawn implies Ahsoka has always been fighting the Empire and is doing a lot to prevent them coming back, even now.
 

Ryan.

Prophet of Truth
The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
12,889
Also, is this the first time ever it's been confirmed that Force Powers/Sensitivity fades if you don't either learn to master it or don't consistently use it?
Was she saying they would fade or that he would simply just forget about it by not using it and him still being a young child?
 

Hella

Member
Oct 27, 2017
23,409
Does this show not have subtitles? I tried watching S2E1 last night but even though I had chosen English subtitles it wasn't showing any. I watched Ant-man & The Wasp to check if subtitles were working on that and they were, so it can't be a general Disney+ problem.
I had subtitles when watching this ep, but IIRC I've also had D+ flake out on displaying them before, for some shows. I think it's a bug on D+'s side.
 

Jersey_Tom

Banned
Dec 2, 2017
4,764
Last edited:

Deleted member 7051

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,254
Also one very neat touch was that Ahsoka pretty much instantly won when she reverted back to her reverse grip stance. She was totally screwing with the spear lady. 🤣
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
43,028
She never "sat it out". She was Fulcrum for years, for most of the Imperial era in fact, and worked in secret to gather information and combat the Empire. She clashed against Inquisitors many times and even stopped them kidnapping Force-sensitive babies and, of course, fought (and even died, technically) to stop the Empire taking the Sith Temple on Malachor.

The fact that the next time we see her she's hunting Thrawn implies Ahsoka has always been fighting the Empire and is doing a lot to prevent them coming back, even now.

All that shit was before the Rebellion kicked off and Ezra took Thrawn out before the Rebellion kicked off. Prevent the Empire from coming back? Thrawn was one dude in the Imperial Army and got shipped away on one ship to who knows where. He's not a threat that would require occupying the entire Galactic Civil War when Ezra already took him out of the picture.

Alderaan has been destroyed. Anakin Skywalker's son has been revealed and is seeking to become a Jedi. The entire galaxy has taken up arms against the Empire. Mandalore is being purged. And you just gonna leave the galaxy to figure that out all by themselves. You good with that, Ahsoka Tano?

Was she saying they would fade or that he would simply just forget about it by not using it and him still being a young child?

She said better to let it fade, which implies Force Sensitivity can go away with time.
 

Callibretto

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,495
Indonesia
All that shit was before the Rebellion kicked off and Ezra took Thrawn out before the Rebellion kicked off. Prevent the Empire from coming back? Thrawn was one dude in the Imperial Army and got shipped away on one ship to who knows where. He's not a threat that would require occupying the entire Galactic Civil War when Ezra already took him out of the picture.

Alderaan has been destroyed. Anakin Skywalker's son has been revealed and is seeking to become a Jedi. The entire galaxy has taken up arms against the Empire. Mandalore is being purged. And you just gonna leave the galaxy to figure that out all by themselves. You good with that, Ahsoka Tano?



She said better to let it fade, which implies Force Sensitivity can go away with time.
I think it's assumed she also fight the empire during OT, we just never saw it. Like it's just been revealed Grogu is in coruscant in PT era, we just never see him until now.
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
43,028
i think cere junda from jedi fallen order went through the same thing

Nah, she seemed more like Luke. She willingly cut herself off after reaching to the Dark Side.

I think it's assumed she also fight the empire during OT, we just never saw it. Like it's just been revealed Grogu is in coruscant in PT era, we just never see him until now.

Yeah, but as far as we know Luke never heard of her, never met her. That would be weird to have her fighting and just not try to help the only other Jedi out there, it also ruins the specialness of Luke.
 

Ryan.

Prophet of Truth
The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
12,889
All that shit was before the Rebellion kicked off and Ezra took Thrawn out before the Rebellion kicked off. Prevent the Empire from coming back? Thrawn was one dude in the Imperial Army and got shipped away on one ship to who knows where. He's not a threat that would require occupying the entire Galactic Civil War when Ezra already took him out of the picture.

Alderaan has been destroyed. Anakin Skywalker's son has been revealed and is seeking to become a Jedi. The entire galaxy has taken up arms against the Empire. Mandalore is being purged. And you just gonna leave the galaxy to figure that out all by themselves. You good with that, Ahsoka Tano?



She said better to let it fade, which implies Force Sensitivity can go away with time.
I think that might be too literal of a translation. I read that as he would just forget it.


i think cere junda from jedi fallen order went through the same thing
I thought she just disconnected herself from the force like Luke?
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
43,028
I think that might be too literal of a translation. I read that as he would just forget it.

How do you "forget" an innate power though? That's like forgetting to breathe. The Force isn't some skill you learn through practice, its innate. You have it whether you use it or not, whether you know what it is or not.
 

ket

Member
Jul 27, 2018
12,984
I think it's assumed she also fight the empire during OT, we just never saw it. Like it's just been revealed Grogu is in coruscant in PT era, we just never see him until now.

i think grogu was trained in secret since ashoka says that she's never seen him before and she trained at the jedi temple for over a decade. i guess yoda had a secret apprentice?
 

Starphanluke

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Nov 15, 2017
7,337
That's my point. It would seem odd if they were like "well actually she started her search early". I just want to know what she's been up to. That being said I don't need a whole series based on stuff that's happened pre-ROTJ. I'm just a sucker for knowing what everyone's been up to between stories.

Oh my bad. I misread what you were saying.
 

Deleted member 7051

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,254
All that shit was before the Rebellion kicked off and Ezra took Thrawn out before the Rebellion kicked off. Prevent the Empire from coming back? Thrawn was one dude in the Imperial Army and got shipped away on one ship to who knows where. He's not a threat that would require occupying the entire Galactic Civil War when Ezra already took him out of the picture.

Alderaan has been destroyed. Anakin Skywalker's son has been revealed and is seeking to become a Jedi. The entire galaxy has taken up arms against the Empire. Mandalore is being purged. And you just gonna leave the galaxy to figure that out all by themselves. You good with that, Ahsoka Tano?

What? No. The Rebellion began almost immediately after the Empire rose. The crew of the Ghost was merely one "cell" within the Rebellion and there were many of them, but they were kept in the dark about the full scale of the Rebellion and its commanders so they couldn't tell the Empire anything if they were captured.

As for Thrawn, he was a Grand Admiral before the Empire fell. Dude had basically more pull than anyone in the Empire besides Palpatine, Vader and Tarkin. Now the Empire has fallen it seems a lot of Imperials are gravitating towards Thrawn, which means he probably has a vast military that even the New Republic doesn't fully know about yet and you can be certain Gideon answers to him (and maybe even got his Star Destroyer from him), which means Thrawn is the overall Big Bad of The Mandalorian.
 

TheGamingNewsGuy

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 5, 2017
31,496
I see Ahsoka Tano more akin to Valeera Sanguinar from Warcraft - more in the background/gathering intellgence and help her allies in anyway she can rather than being on the front lines of the Rebellion
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
43,028
What? No. The Rebellion began almost immediately after the Empire rose. The crew of the Ghost was merely one "cell" within the Rebellion and there were many of them, but they were kept in the dark about the full scale of the Rebellion and its commanders so they couldn't tell the Empire anything if they were captured.

As for Thrawn, he was a Grand Admiral before the Empire fell. Dude had basically more pull than anyone in the Empire besides Palpatine, Vader and Tarkin. Now the Empire has fallen it seems a lot of Imperials are gravitating towards Thrawn, which means he probably has a vast military that even the New Republic doesn't fully know about yet and you can be certain Gideon answers to him (and maybe even got his Star Destroyer from him), which means Tarkin is the overall Big Bad of The Mandalorian.

1. The Rebellion didn't start until Rogue One. This is stated in the title crawl of ANH. What we see in Rebels and all media prior to that are disparate rebel attempts, uncoordinated. The Galactic Civil War didn't officially start until the Battle over Scarif. That's when the disparate, uncoordinated rebel cells formed the Rebel Alliance. So, Ahsoka, as far as we know, did not fight in the Galactic Civil War.

2. Thrawn was out of the picture before the start of the war, so who cares where he is? He was gone. Now, we can apparently now see that he managed to escape from Ezra and possibly helped reform the defeated Imperial Army. But, that's all post-Civil War. As far as we can tell, Thrawn was out of the picture the entire war. So, what exactly was Ahsoka accomplishing if she was searching for him the entire war and after?

I see Ahsoka Tano more akin to Valeera Sanguinar from Warcraft - more in the background/gathering intellgence and help her allies in anyway she can rather than being on the front lines of the Rebellion

I don't need her on the frontlines. I do need her to have at least spoken to Luke fucking Skywalker about his FATHER and what it means to be a Jedi.
 

Tavernade

Tavernade
Moderator
Sep 18, 2018
8,636
That episode was fantastic. I absolutely adore the Japanese aesthetic they went whole hog on for it.

Citation needed.

She left the Jedi Order in CW, but then they blew up. So, her whole "I'm no Jedi" schtick no longer had any relevance. In this episode, Mando calls her a Jedi and she doesn't deny it and she seemed perfectly willing to train Grogu had he not failed the test. So, it seems she's back to being a Jedi.

Regardless, Jedi or not the entire galaxy was fighting a war against the evil Empire and she just decided to...sit it out?

Jedi is a code and an ethos and whatnot. She never rejoined the Jedi, and she doesn't consider herself bound by any of their laws or rules. She's not a Jedi, but no one besides her alive right now is going to care about that difference, so why bother insisting on it. It's not like anyone else alive (including Luke, Ezra, etc) would know the difference anyways.

How do you "forget" an innate power though? That's like forgetting to breathe. The Force isn't some skill you learn through practice, its innate. You have it whether you use it or not, whether you know what it is or not.

The Force itself is innate but how to use it is not. Just like any talent it needs upkeep or it will fade.

I don't need her on the frontlines. I do need her to have at least spoken to Luke fucking Skywalker about his FATHER and what it means to be a Jedi.

Ashoka never knew Padme was pregnant and on the off chance she did the fact he had children was covered up (AS WAS the fact Anakin was now Vader). She would have had to make the connection that the Like Skywalker who blew up the Death Star was related to Anakin, which in a galaxy of trillions is a big leap since Luke being a Jedi isn't regarded as a big deal by the Rebels anyways.

Neither Yoda nor Obi told Luke to seek her out (because she didn't exist yet, but in universe likely because they either didn't know she was alive or thought her situation was far more dangerous). Plus Rebels implies she's stuck on Malachor for awhile after being saved.
 
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0VERBYTE

Banned
Nov 1, 2017
5,555
Decent episode, but the Thrawn name drop is kinda eye rolling. Are we really going Heir to the Empire? Outside of the lore dumps, the writing remained as bland as ever.

I do just have to wonder even more now what the hell Ahsoka was doing when Luke Skywalker was out there saving the entire galaxy?

Also, as I've stated, I don't see the end game being Grogu being left with any Jedi. He's staying with Mando.
I'd like to believe she was there but was doing little things in the background to help, unbeknownst to Luke and crew. Like she did some things on Endor for the setup with Luke and Vader. Or she was on hoth with a mission of her own to help out Leia and them, always staying in the shadows but in commune with Obi Wan the entire time.
 

TheGamingNewsGuy

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 5, 2017
31,496
I'd like to believe she was there but was doing little things in the background to help, unbeknownst to Luke and crew. Like she did some things on Endor for the setup with Luke and Vader. Or she was on hoth with a mission of her own to help out Leia and them, always staying in the shadows but in commune with Obi Wan the entire time.
Do we know if Ahsoka knew that Obi Wan was alive?
 

Woozies

Member
Nov 1, 2017
19,003
How do you "forget" an innate power though? That's like forgetting to breathe. The Force isn't some skill you learn through practice, its innate. You have it whether you use it or not, whether you know what it is or not.
What? if using the force was just like breathing, there'd be no force techniques.

Having the force may be like breathing, being able to use it definitely is not.

Do we know if Ahsoka knew that Obi Wan was alive?

No, like demonstrably no. They made it very clear she was not aware who among the jedi besides herself was still alive.
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
43,028
That episode was fantastic. I absolutely adore the Japanese aesthetic they went whole hog on for it.

Jedi is a code and an ethos and whatnot. She never rejoined the Jedi, and she doesn't consider herself bound by any of their laws or rules. She's not a Jedi, but no one besides her alive right now is going to care about that difference, so why bother insisting on it. It's not like anyone else alive (including Luke, Ezra, etc) would know the difference anyways.


The Force itself is innate but how to use it is not. Just like any talent it needs upkeep or it will fade.

If she was truly no longer a Jedi then I don't see why she would consider training Grogu. Also, nothing we see suggests she abandoned the Jedi Code even if she left the Order in CW. She never becomes some dumb Grey Jedi. In this very episode she prioritizes saving the civilians over getting information, you know the Jedi way. Even if she doesn't call herself a Jedi, she follows everything about them.

As for The Force, it's not a "talent" thought, it's innate. It is literally like breathing to someone sensitive to it. You don't forget how to breathe. So, Grogu just "forgetting" he can feel The Force all around him doesn't seem right. It seems to make more sense that sensitivity can fade under a set of circumstances.

What? if using the force was just like breathing, there'd be no force techniques.

Having the force may be like breathing, being able to use it definitely is not.

Saber Forms don't mean much, they are just different expressions of The Force. You can learn to control your breathing and even extend the time you can hold your breath, but you don't forget how to breathe.

tumblr_inline_pakhmaGXJV1qkfcf5_1280.gifv


DaringFavorableHorsechestnutleafminer-size_restricted.gif
 

TheGamingNewsGuy

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 5, 2017
31,496
What? if using the force was just like breathing, there'd be no force techniques.

Having the force may be like breathing, being able to use it definitely is not.



No, like demonstrably no. They made it very clear she was not aware who among the jedi besides herself was still alive.
One expection. She 100% knew Yoda was alive
 

Woozies

Member
Nov 1, 2017
19,003
If she was truly no longer a Jedi then I don't see why she would consider training Grogu. Also, nothing we see suggests she abandoned the Jedi Code even if she left the Order in CW. She never becomes some dumb Grey Jedi. In this very episode she prioritizes saving the civilians over getting information, you know the Jedi way. Even if she doesn't call herself a Jedi, she follows everything about them.

As for The Force, it's not a "talent" thought, it's innate. It is literally like breathing to someone sensitive to it. You don't forget how to breathe. So, Grogu just "forgetting" he can feel The Force all around him doesn't seem right. It seems to make more sense that sensitivity can fade under a set of circumstances.
Jedi code isn't just about being a good person. And being a grey jedi isn't about being pragmatic in all things.

One expection. She 100% knew Yoda was alive
Yeah, but that's cause she straight up met him.
 

0VERBYTE

Banned
Nov 1, 2017
5,555
Do we know if Ahsoka knew that Obi Wan was alive?
Why wouldn't he appear before her as a force ghost at anytime after his death? She dosnt necessarily have to know he was alive. Or they could have been in contact while Obi Wan was on tattooine at some point and sent her on missions to look out for him but never to reveal herself?
 

Ryan.

Prophet of Truth
The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
12,889
How do you "forget" an innate power though? That's like forgetting to breathe. The Force isn't some skill you learn through practice, its innate. You have it whether you use it or not, whether you know what it is or not.
He's still a young child that can forget what they did during their infancy. He may have the force but he can still forget how to use or even forget what it is.
 

Woozies

Member
Nov 1, 2017
19,003
Saber Forms don't mean much, they are just different expressions of The Force. You can learn to control your breathing and even extend the time you can hold your breath, but you don't forget how to breathe.

tumblr_inline_pakhmaGXJV1qkfcf5_1280.gifv


DaringFavorableHorsechestnutleafminer-size_restricted.gif

You're being god damn fucking pedantic with this shit. You know damn well what she means by letting him lapse. She isn't saying let the force leave his body. She's saying let him forget how to levitate the rocks.

You likely aren't going to forget how to walk, you'll probably forget how to ride a bike.
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
43,028
Jedi code isn't just about being a good person. And being a grey jedi isn't about being pragmatic in all things.

Grey Jedi is nonsense that Lucas never accepted and I doubt Filoni would ever let happen. A Grey Jedi is, by definition, in between Light and Dark. They will actually turn to the Dark Side when necessary. Ahsoka does not and would never do that. She's a Jedi in everything but name, and we aren't even sure she doesn't consider herself a Jedi again.

Yoda boiled down the code to its simplest form: "A Jedi uses The Force for knowledge and defense, never to attack."

He's still a young child that can forget what they did during their infancy. He may have the force but he can still forget how to use or even forget what it is.
You're being god damn fucking pedantic with this shit. You know damn well what she means by letting him lapse. She isn't saying let the force leave his body. She's saying let him forget how to levitate the rocks.

You likely aren't going to forget how to walk, you'll probably forget how to ride a bike.

Alright, so he "forgets" how to lift rocks but still has The Force right?

Okay, so what happens when he gets much older and someone does something that really angers him. So, he just reaches down in the pit of his anger at anything to hurt this person. You're saying in that situation The Force wouldn't come exploding out of him?
 

Tavernade

Tavernade
Moderator
Sep 18, 2018
8,636
If she was truly no longer a Jedi then I don't see why she would consider training Grogu. Also, nothing we see suggests she abandoned the Jedi Code even if she left the Order in CW. She never becomes some dumb Grey Jedi. In this very episode she prioritizes saving the civilians over getting information, you know the Jedi way. Even if she doesn't call herself a Jedi, she follows everything about them.

As for The Force, it's not a "talent" thought, it's innate. It is literally like breathing to someone sensitive to it. You don't forget how to breathe. So, Grogu just "forgetting" he can feel The Force all around him doesn't seem right. It seems to make more sense that sensitivity can fade under a set of circumstances.

Saving the citizens over getting information is a normal "not being an asshole" thing. It has nothing to do with a code. Superman and Batman do it all the time. She was trained as a Jedi so she can still teach Grogu how to use the Force, regardless of whether she considers herself a Jedi or not. If I recall Luke taught Rey while insisting he was no longer a Jedi.

Feeling the Force and using the Force are very different, which is why Jedi hey trained to begin with. If he never goes beyond what he can do now, it's going to fade through disuse.
 

Woozies

Member
Nov 1, 2017
19,003
Grey Jedi is nonsense that Lucas never accepted and I doubt Filoni would ever let happen. A Grey Jedi is, by definition, in between Light and Dark. They will actually turn to the Dark Side when necessary. Ahsoka does not and would never do that. She's a Jedi in everything but name, and we aren't even sure she doesn't consider herself a Jedi again.

Yoda boiled down the code to its simplest form: "A Jedi uses The Force for knowledge and defense, never to attack."
Something he did after the jedi order was in ruins and mostly dead. When people like Ahsoke think of Jedi, they think of the order that was established and a running power on corusant. not the nebulous ideals that have changed with them over millenia
 

Hella

Member
Oct 27, 2017
23,409
Grey Jedi is nonsense that Lucas never accepted and I doubt Filoni would ever let happen. A Grey Jedi is, by definition, in between Light and Dark. They will actually turn to the Dark Side when necessary. Ahsoka does not and would never do that. She's a Jedi in everything but name, and we aren't even sure she doesn't consider herself a Jedi again.

Yoda boiled down the code to its simplest form: "A Jedi uses The Force for knowledge and defense, never to attack."
A grey Jedi could just be a Jedi that follows the Light, but is not bound to an Order. There's plenty of directions to take it without diluting the danger of the Dark Side.
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
43,028
Saving the citizens over getting information is a normal "not being an asshole" thing. It has nothing to do with a code. Superman and Batman do it all the time. She was trained as a Jedi so she can still teach Grogu how to use the Force, regardless of whether she considers herself a Jedi or not. If I recall Luke taught Rey while insisting he was no longer a Jedi.

Luke was a Jedi. He didn't say he wasn't a Jedi. He said he'd never train another Jedi, he would be the last and the Order would then fade. Also, his lessons to Rey were designed to teach her to not become a Jedi.

So, why would Ahsoka, someone not a Jedi, train another in the Ways of The Force when she has no intention of teaching them to become Jedi. Would she just start her own order between the two of them?


Something he did after the jedi order was in ruins and mostly dead. When people like Ahsoke think of Jedi, they think of the order that was established and a running power on corusant. not the nebulous ideals that have changed with them over millenia


A grey Jedi could just be a Jedi that follows the Light, but is not bound to an Order. There's plenty of directions to take it without diluting the danger of the Dark Side.

So a Jedi? Remember, there is no Order at this time. Does that mean Luke was a Grey Jedi?
 

Fj0823

Legendary Duelist
Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,664
Costa Rica
If she was truly no longer a Jedi then I don't see why she would consider training Grogu. Also, nothing we see suggests she abandoned the Jedi Code even if she left the Order in CW. She never becomes some dumb Grey Jedi. In this very episode she prioritizes saving the civilians over getting information, you know the Jedi way. Even if she doesn't call herself a Jedi, she follows everything about them.

As for The Force, it's not a "talent" thought, it's innate. It is literally like breathing to someone sensitive to it. You don't forget how to breathe. So, Grogu just "forgetting" he can feel The Force all around him doesn't seem right. It seems to make more sense that sensitivity can fade under a set of circumstances.



Saber Forms don't mean much, they are just different expressions of The Force. You can learn to control your breathing and even extend the time you can hold your breath, but you don't forget how to breathe.

tumblr_inline_pakhmaGXJV1qkfcf5_1280.gifv


DaringFavorableHorsechestnutleafminer-size_restricted.gif

So it's all about breathing? When are we getting this?
 

Starphanluke

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Nov 15, 2017
7,337
I'm extremely certain a lot of this was setup for the Ahsoka spinoff/Rebels sequel and not necessarily indicative that Ezra/Thrawn will be in Rebels.
 

Deleted member 7051

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,254
1. The Rebellion didn't start until Rogue One. This is stated in the title crawl of ANH. What we see in Rebels and all media prior to that are disparate rebel attempts, uncoordinated. The Galactic Civil War didn't officially start until the Battle over Scarif. That's when the disparate, uncoordinated rebel cells formed the Rebel Alliance. So, Ahsoka, as far as we know, did not fight in the Galactic Civil War.

This is completely wrong. Rebels takes place years before Rogue One and The Ghost had been part of the Rebellion for many years before Ezra showed up. In fact Bail Organa had founded the Rebellion in the years immediately after the Empire rose to power, Hera even being one of the first people to join him, and the Rebellion grew steadily in size over the years as planets grew increasingly angry and disillusioned with the Empire.

As I said before, the Rebellion was split into cells so that nobody would know anything that might endanger other rebels while they worked to undermine the Empire and the battle over Scarif - which you're referring to - was the first time the Rebellion actually mobilised as an army on a large scale.

2. Thrawn was out of the picture before the start of the war, so who cares where he is? He was gone. Now, we can apparently now see that he managed to escape from Ezra and possibly helped reform the defeated Imperial Army. But, that's all post-Civil War. As far as we can tell, Thrawn was out of the picture the entire war. So, what exactly was Ahsoka accomplishing if she was searching for him the entire war and after?

Again you seem to completely misunderstand just how long the Empire had been fighting the Rebellion. Thrawn was the major antagonist of the third season of Rebels, set many years before the original trilogy, and he had to work especially hard to get where he was because of the colour of his skin.

We don't know what happened after the Rebels finale or where Ezra and Thrawn ended up, but the fact that he has returned to the galaxy and is seemingly rebuilding the Imperial Navy under his command strongly implies everyone is falling in line.

I don't need her on the frontlines. I do need her to have at least spoken to Luke fucking Skywalker about his FATHER and what it means to be a Jedi.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, or did you really expect The Mandalorian to bring in a de-aged Mark Hamill so we can see Luke and Ahsoka talk about how cool Anakin was? Would be a bit jarring, don't you think?
 

Superbagman

Member
Nov 3, 2017
347
Some folks: if this show tells me everything explicitly it's bad storytelling
Same folks: you told me stuff and not everything so it's bad storytelling.
 

Hella

Member
Oct 27, 2017
23,409
So a Jedi? Remember, there is no Order at this time. Does that mean Luke was a Grey Jedi?
Sure.

It's just a term for a devotee of the Light Side of the Force. One working within the Jedi Order, and one without. Luke wouldn't have even been trained under the Jedi Order--he was too old, to begin with. But this is all getting into my personal speculation; I don't think anything about grey jedi has been confirmed in canon yet, AFAIK.
 

egg

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
6,604
Citation needed.

She left the Jedi Order in CW, but then they blew up. So, her whole "I'm no Jedi" schtick no longer had any relevance. In this episode, Mando calls her a Jedi and she doesn't deny it and she seemed perfectly willing to train Grogu had he not failed the test. So, it seems she's back to being a Jedi. Shit, Ventress became a bounty hunter.

Regardless, Jedi or not the entire galaxy was fighting a war against the evil Empire and she just decided to...sit it out?

Ahsoka is NOT a Jedi. Just like Ventress was NOT a Jedi or a Sith. There is no Gray Jedi. Alignment isn't needed to be who you are lol.

Also why are you making a big deal about Ahsoka not being more involved in the war. She left the order and moved on. Obi Wan and Yoda also didn't do anything for 20 years roughly and they ARE Jedi.
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
43,028
The ambiguous nature of whether Ahsoka is a Jedi or not cuts into why this is another average episode. Again, it's more focused on plot and expanding the world than meaningful character exploration or thematic depth. And please do not throw the whole "it's a throwback to old Westerns" excuse as it's been dismissed time and again how those Westerns had depth. I was going to wait until a bit later once more people had time to see the episode, like Veelk. But, I'll just tear it
down now.

To preface, I enjoyed the episode as a pure fan. We get to see Ahsoka in action, fucking live action. We get to see lightsabers. We get a deul. HK-47 droids are name dropped. The old Jedi Temple on Tython is name dropped. And, we get some backstory on "The Child" who we now know is Grogu. Still, I will now put aside the fan to, once again, explain why it is thoroughly lacking.

The title of the episode is "The Jedi," and is seemingly focused on Ahsoka Tano. Yet, the episode does nothing to explore or challenge her character. She is purely a plot and lore delivery device. She's not a character. Again, we leave the episode as an audience member unsure if she is a Jedi. Now, Mando episodes always start off promising with a hook that could evolve into meaningful storytelling that has both character and thematic depth, but they always discard that in favor of plot. This episode starts with Ahsoka attempting to extract information from the Magistrate only to be confronted with the problem that the Magistrate is willing to execute every innocent villager in the town if Ahsoka attempts to assault it.

This is an interesting problem as it can help us explore who Ahsoka has become since the Clone Wars and Rebels. Is she willing to risk the lives of all the villagers in her quest for information? Or does she still adhere to the Jedi Code where protecting innocent life is paramount? This is a conundrum with no easy solution, especially if we are to accept the information she seeks will serve the greater good. Thus, surely the episode would explore this conflict, yes? We would watch Ahsoka debate the ethics of the assault with someone like Mando, we'd learn her feelings towards the rigid nature of what the Code would dictate in such a circumstance. She would then possibly be confronted with a situation near the end that would require her to choose between getting the information or saving the villagers. And this choice would reflect her growth and new character. Likely, she would choose the villagers but through the aid of Mando is also able to stop the Magistrate from escaping and get the information thus re-kindling her faith in some part of the Jedi Code and that the "greater good" can never be an excuse to turn a blind eye to the immediate suffering in front of you.

You know, basic storytelling character shit.

The Child showing up with Mando should also stir up her feelings about the Order and Anakin Skywalker. We should see more of that than her terse and vague denial for training the child. Hell, you could even tie these feelings all back into the main plot regarding the villagers as it deals with attachment. A Jedi, as she was taught, should retain a certain level of detachment from everyone; to not form strong personal bonds. Yet, such a detachment is what can easily lead a Jedi to believe the "greater good" is more important so going after the information is more important than trying to possibly save the lives of innocent villagers. By witnessing Mando's attachment to Grogu she can reaffirm that personal attachments are necessary in order to do good in the Galaxy.

Yet, instead of getting any of this we just got some lore dumps and cryptic dialog from Ahsoka who also maintains a stoic, "I don't reveal my true feelings" expression alongside the faceless Mandalorian who does the same thing. They both then team up and proceed to face zero actual challenge as they mop up Michael Biehn and the rest of jobbers. Those villagers were never at any risk once Mando joined the squad. Riveting.

This episode proves that the show will always remain what it is and not seek to rise any higher. To have an episode where a fucking Jedi appears and doesn't proceed to drop any actual wisdom or knowledge or greater depth to anything is just criminal.

Ahsoka is NOT a Jedi. Just like Ventress was NOT a Jedi or a Sith. There is no Gray Jedi. Alignment isn't needed to be who you are lol.

Also why are you making a big deal about Ahsoka not being more involved in the war. She left the order and moved on. Obi Wan and Yoda also didn't do anything for 20 years roughly and they ARE Jedi.

They were watching over Luke! That was the plan they all agreed to. And Obi-Wan is getting a whole series about what he was up to as well.

And again, you're assuming Ahsoka isn't a Jedi when nothing proves it either way besides her last statement YEARS ago in Rebels.
 

Fj0823

Legendary Duelist
Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,664
Costa Rica
Ahsoka's alignment isn't that hard to understand.

If you've ever distanced yourself from a religion's crazier beliefs, you know what she's about
 

Lifejumper

Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,335
One of the highlights of this thread is Bossattack initial positive impressions of a chapter but then slowly convincing himself he actually didn't like it that much :p