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Should there be a new OT for From the Ashes Era

  • Yes, and I will participate.

    Votes: 18 58.1%
  • Yes, but I probably won't participate.

    Votes: 7 22.6%
  • No. Keep the conversation here.

    Votes: 3 9.7%
  • No. I have no interest in From the Ashes.

    Votes: 2 6.5%
  • Let's just talk about it on the Comics Era OT.

    Votes: 1 3.2%

  • Total voters
    31
  • This poll will close: .

Mancha

alt account
Banned
Oct 23, 2021
2,520
We live in 2022. If having superpowers would be something that causes humans to hate someone, they'd hate all of them, except the dude who very clearly just built himself a iron suit.

Cap. America is a science experiment? That's what they want you to think, only reason you don't have 300 young kids with his genes is because we lucked out, and the dude is American Jesus from the 40's or something, and is gonna die a virgin.

Same logic for every other superhero, especially any of those from outer space kinds. Space Vikings are coming for our stuff, that's the whole point of being a Viking.

Also, if anyone can have a mutant kid, you're not a lowly homo sapiens, you're a temporarily inconvenienced parent of a Omega Class mutant, keep living that dream (isn't that how it works with millionaires?).

And it got boring, quite frankly. I like the current setting, where it makes sense for humans to be very distrustful of mutants, because they're their own nation, they're not your family, they're the dudes that are going to come and take your kids away.

I get that they were useful to tell stories of discrimination, but for me, making Cap. America black, and show what that would mean, is much better. IMO.
I avoid this thread like the plague because I'm still way behind on X-Men stuff but I just want to chime in to say that I absolutely love the line of thought that DarthMasta has here for how I would like to see mutants and haters of mutants both in comics and in the MCU currently.

The whole aspect of racists seeing Rogers sometimes as an Übermensch and "one of them" by some and just another mutie by the sect of racists that are also Q Anon nut jobs analogues is particularly brilliant.

Also, very excited for the return of Chris Claremont and Salvador Larroca, even if it's just for a limited series.
 

BebopCola

Member
Jul 17, 2019
2,060
Something tells me Wanda's little fantasy land is where there's going to be an intervention with Magneto.

And damn I hope Pog makes it!
 

deimosmasque

Ugly, Queer, Gender-Fluid, Drive-In Mutant, yes?
Moderator
Apr 22, 2018
14,215
Tampa, Fl
I don't know much about Eternals so I have to ask, what are the odds for the X-men ? Seeing that as always Avengers are going to f*** it up badly. >.>
They boned!

The Eternals actually all have the same powers. Cosmic Energy Manipulation.

They all use it different ways in general, but all of them can use it the same way to create energy blasts, fly, move faster than humans, teleport, etc to various degrees of ability.

They are all basically demi-gods at the least powerful.

And then there is the Uni-Mind, which we saw how devastating that was.
 

caliph95

Member
Oct 25, 2017
35,187
They boned!

The Eternals actually all have the same powers. Cosmic Energy Manipulation.

They all use it different ways in general, but all of them can use it the same way to create energy blasts, fly, move faster than humans, teleport, etc to various degrees of ability.

They are all basically demi-gods at the least powerful.

And then there is the Uni-Mind, which we saw how devastating that was.
Some are stronger than others
With some like Gilgamesh putting all his points into Strength to make him on par with Hercules and Thor
Sersi puts her points in psychic and matter manipulation
Ikaris in like the flying brick superman stuff

Zuras is supposed to be powerful but he hasn't done much

Uranos is supposed to be strong but he's also using weapons i guess are in his body or suit

Thanos is only strong because he fucked with his genetics plus Death
 

deimosmasque

Ugly, Queer, Gender-Fluid, Drive-In Mutant, yes?
Moderator
Apr 22, 2018
14,215
Tampa, Fl
Some are stronger than others
With some like Gilgamesh putting all his points into Strength to make him on par with Hercules and Thor
Sersi puts her points in psychic and matter manipulation
Ikaris in like the flying brick superman stuff

Zuras is supposed to be powerful but he hasn't done much

Uranos is supposed to be strong but he's also using weapons i guess are in his body or suit

Thanos is only strong because he fucked with his genetics plus Death
The point is they have a ton of versatility. Mutants get one or two powers. The Eternals have all the powers.
 

Manmademan

Election Thread Watcher
Member
Aug 6, 2018
16,019
The point is they have a ton of versatility. Mutants get one or two powers. The Eternals have all the powers.

Not *really*.

The eternals innately can channel cosmic energy, but this ability is actually pretty limited. Roughly its:

Strength and Durability: (Forgotten One is best at this)
Matter Manipulation: (Sersi)
Speed: (Makkari)
Psychic power: (Druig? Not sure)
Energy Blasts: (Zuras)

Plus some generic stuff like flight that basically everyone has. The drawback is that to be particularly GOOD in any one area the Eternal has to sacrifice any real skill in the others. Sersi, Makkari, Druig, etc aren't significant threats outside of their specialized areas.

Ikaris is a notable anomaly for being "pretty good" in 3 out of 5 of these areas while not being a master at anything. Kingo on the other hand is notable for not having ANY apparent skill in the above and just being a good martial artist.

Mutants though are truly random. They have lower lows- (there's no eternal equivalent of Toad or Angel) but also WAY higher highs. Druig says this straight out- the minds on Krakoa are easily the best on the planet. Yeah, the eternals merged into the uni-mind and fought them head on- but the uni mind was literally half their forces and it got held off by just Xavier, Emma, Exodus, and Jean- with Hope presumably mimicking one of those four.

Quire, Betsy Braddock, Sinister, Legion, and Rachel were dead, missing, or off world. Had that not been the case OR the Xmen don't get surprise attacked that fight plays out differently. Mutant telepaths can ALSO link minds to amp themselves (the stepfords literally always exist this way) but that takes some prep time which they didn't have.

Mutants also have a much wider spectrum of abilities to work with. There's no Eternal equivalent to Elixir, Storm, Synch, Iceman, Madrox, Destiny, Darwin, Domino, Eva Bell or Xorn. Eternal powers just don't work that way and in most cases *can't* counter powers like these.

Mutants also don't necessarily need to be weak in one area to have a strength in another. Legion's whole thing is having "every" power, but this also happens to a lesser extent with Apocalypse, Monet St. Croix, Sunspot, Vulcan, Selene and a few others- and in a head to head match between the two Ikaris got beaten so badly by Apocalypse it made the thrashing he got from Thanos look like a vacation.
 
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Miamiwesker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,670
Miami
Finished everything up to inferno. I jumped on cause I am a casual xmen fan and I kept hearing how amazing Hickman is. Loved the ideas, sad at how he left, but still excited as the Krakoa era is really interesting. As for Inferno it was a great 4 part issue, seeing Charles and Mags go at it with Nimrod and Omega was great, the two leader groups head to head. I enjoyed the twists and turns of the story but still in the end the finale for Hickman's run on X-men didn't have the X-Men.

I am surprised at how few people cared or every talked about X lives/deaths of Wolverine. I decided to read that after cause it's all on MU and Wolverine is my favorite comic character. Yeah I get it was kind of crazy, Moira's character is out of character, it can be sloppy. But it's a comic where Wolverine has to travel through his past to fight a ton of time traveling people possessing Omega Red and prevent him from killing Xavier and his ancestors. That's awesome! Imagine that set up for a movie how freaking cool would that be.

At the same time you get a fugitive style hunt with Mystique acting like a Terminator chasing Moira around and then you get a time traveling death machine in Wolverine joining the hunt, again another fun exciting premise. As a wolverine fan I found it to be action packed and had so many great moments for him. It reinforces just how loyal and heroic he his, if there is pain to be had Logan will be the one to jump in and take it all for his friends and family. Just love the character and I really enjoyed the craziness of it all.
 
The strength of the Eternals has always been, well, they're eternal. You can beat one to death relatively easily if you rate on the strength chart. However, they always come back and have forever to strategize, coordinate, and plan.

Outside of one or two allfather-level nukes in their arsenal, they can't really muster an army capable of overcoming a few dozen omega-level mutants.

Plus, I have to wonder if THIS degree of threat to Krakoa and Arrako both would be the thing to pull Apocalypse back from his summer home in hell - Apoc, his SO, and his true Horsemen? Particularly Death? Uranos might pause a moment to think.

The real danger for mutants would be if Druig remains Prime, and settles into a genuine grudge against them. The eternals would be a forever enemy and eventually they'd devise a winning strategy.
 

Coiote

Member
Oct 25, 2017
234
The problem of "killing" eternals is that you are indirectly killing humans and going against Krakoa's laws.
 

Manmademan

Election Thread Watcher
Member
Aug 6, 2018
16,019
The strength of the Eternals has always been, well, they're eternal. You can beat one to death relatively easily if you rate on the strength chart. However, they always come back and have forever to strategize, coordinate, and plan.

Outside of one or two allfather-level nukes in their arsenal, they can't really muster an army capable of overcoming a few dozen omega-level mutants.

Plus, I have to wonder if THIS degree of threat to Krakoa and Arrako both would be the thing to pull Apocalypse back from his summer home in hell - Apoc, his SO, and his true Horsemen? Particularly Death? Uranos might pause a moment to think.

The real danger for mutants would be if Druig remains Prime, and settles into a genuine grudge against them. The eternals would be a forever enemy and eventually they'd devise a winning strategy.

Good question about Apocalypse. He isn't "technically" an Omega Mutant but offensively he's one of the most powerful individuals on the island.

Honestly though the Eternals being a "forever" problem is a bit overrated. If you can't "kill" them, just neutralize them. Brain dead is technically still alive and Krakoa has quite a few powerful telepaths on it.

Alternatively Is the cancerverse still a thing? Throw them all in there and walk away.
 

PhoenixAKG

Member
Aug 14, 2019
7,814
Magik is becoming a Gold Saint:

FYhdXjGVUAAuj_r



For all you uncutured noobs who don't know what I mean, this is a Gold Saint:

The-12-Gold-Saints-silentforce-40149020-1916-799.jpg
 
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Mancha

alt account
Banned
Oct 23, 2021
2,520
I went to the Marvel Unlimited home page because I want to gift a friend with an one year subscription.

Now I'm seriously tempted to upgrade my account because of this:

mu2021_kit-2360x1544_03.jpg
 

nitekrawler

Member
Oct 28, 2017
312
Damn. All the issues were just ridiculously good this week. I never thought i would praise a cross over event and yet here we are.

I see why we we've been learning about the Arakki culture around Gods in Legion of X. But more importantly we're getting to heart of faith and belief.

Immortal X-men does so much to bring understanding to Exodus and his faith in a way that I just didn't think was possible. Consider me a convert and a true believer.

X-men Red is just continuing to be fire. My only fear is that it should burn too bright and extinguish too soon.
 

lone_stranger

Member
Aug 24, 2018
289
Magneto has had some ridiculous feats and X-Men Red's latest development is up there with the best of them. Loved it and looking forward to the next "hour".
 

Sagroth

Member
Oct 28, 2017
6,839
All of the X-books were great today, but man did Red knock it out of the park. I cannot wait for the Hour of Magneto.
 

lone_stranger

Member
Aug 24, 2018
289
Is the implication Mags is manually pumping his blood round his body by manipulating the iron in it? That's the sort of comic book ridiculous I love.
That's my read on it. That you can rip out Magneto's heart and it doesn't matter because he can pump his own blood with the iron in his body. That's bananas but I don't know what else could be happening here. Maybe Uranos barely missed his heart, but even so...

Real talk, I hope the next issue is some legendary payback by Magneto. Nobody should be able to leave that character for dead surrounded by the bodies of his allies given his history. Consequences for that should be severe.
 

Caspel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,343
SoCal
Loved this week's mutant books.
I hope Legion getting taken off the chessboard so quickly is explained in Legion of X. Also a little too convenient in plot armor that Ora Serrata's power dont work on Uranos.

Also, question on a few other omegas or "top-tier power" mutants, is anyone expecting any of these characters to have involvement with the fights against the Eternals?

Proteus: basically immortal, so... should be able to outlast most of the Eternals

Scarlet Witch: Doesnt she now have all of the power of the Dark Hold? I don't see anyone really contesting her

Mister M: he's been inactive and staying away from mutants beyond a few interactions. Is his time coming soon or is he just too powerful that it's best to keep him off the chessboard

X-Man: Will he ever leave his own bubble world he made? I know it's unlikely, but curious to hear other thoughts.

Jamie Braddock: Reality manipulator that helped terraform Mars... he's been mostly in Otherworld so perhaps he wont leave it anytime soon.
 
Kurt's immediate reaction to just get rid of Isca seems to be her real weakness. Take her far away from the battle and let her win against an isolated opponent / circumstance that has nothing to do with the conflict that demands she switch sides.

Is the implication Mags is manually pumping his blood round his body by manipulating the iron in it? That's the sort of comic book ridiculous I love.
RgzwOx0.jpg
 
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Dalek

Dalek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,962
I'm not a fan of the art in a legion of X and it's hampering my ability to enjoy the book. Same with Marauders.
 

Glio

Member
Oct 27, 2017
24,528
Spain
Kurt's immediate reaction to just get rid of Isca seems to be her real weakness. Take her far away from the battle and let her win against an isolated opponent / circumstance that has nothing to do with the conflict that demands she switch sides.


RgzwOx0.jpg
Yeah, she is absurdly good in a fight, but she can't fly and doesn't have super speed or something like that. If someone always wins playing chess, you just throw her off the board
 

Manmademan

Election Thread Watcher
Member
Aug 6, 2018
16,019
Loved this week's mutant books.
I hope Legion getting taken off the chessboard so quickly is explained in Legion of X. Also a little too convenient in plot armor that Ora Serrata's power dont work on Uranos.

Also, question on a few other omegas or "top-tier power" mutants, is anyone expecting any of these characters to have involvement with the fights against the Eternals?

Proteus: basically immortal, so... should be able to outlast most of the Eternals

Proteus is part of "The Five." He's too valuable to risk getting killed or incapacitated (he's not immortal by any means) so they're going to keep him as far away from combat as possible.

Scarlet Witch: Doesnt she now have all of the power of the Dark Hold? I don't see anyone really contesting her

...are you confusing 616 Wanda with the theatrical film? The Scarlet Witch is not a mutant and not on Krakoa. At best she's an Avenger and will be neutral in AXE.

Mister M: he's been inactive and staying away from mutants beyond a few interactions. Is his time coming soon or is he just too powerful that it's best to keep him off the chessboard

He's in Knights of X and his absence is explained. Basically his entire territory is the seige perilous and he is busy keeping people out of there. Probably not getting involved in the AXE business.

X-Man: Will he ever leave his own bubble world he made? I know it's unlikely, but curious to hear other thoughts.

X-man was rapidly aging throughout that event as his powers were burning out his body again. Even the Life Seed couldn't stop it. He wasn't dead at the conclusion of Age of X-man but it was clearly coming.

Jamie Braddock: Reality manipulator that helped terraform Mars... he's been mostly in Otherworld so perhaps he wont leave it anytime soon.

Jamie's instability makes him more liability than asset in cases like this. Otherworld is currently inaccessible but I'm not sure where he is precisely.

The better question than any of these are where Apocalyse, Genesis, and (most of) the original horsemen are. Now is not the best time for a vacation.
 

BebopCola

Member
Jul 17, 2019
2,060
The arrogance of that one CEO that Emma mentioned at the Gala is so sadly familiar. I mean, sure, Apocalypse and Magneto are off of Krakoa. But for them to think that shows the island is weakening is lunacy.

Hell, Xavier held off the Uni-Mind solo after getting ambushed. Granted he couldn't fight back, but his presence alone should still give humanity pause. And that's not taking into account, you know, everyone else.

616 Humans are the worst.

EDIT: and that mutant carpenter Hope mentioned had better be THE NAZARENE lol
 
OP
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Dalek

Dalek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,962
That might be the coolest thing I've ever seen Magneto. THE MUTANT TOO ANGRY TO DIE!!
 
The moment I saw Ora Serrata, their power seemed overdone if that's all there was too it. Death levels of simply disintegrating living beings - even gods?

Yeah, plot armor for Uranos but I wonder if the secret behind Ultra Penance Stare is the target must believe they have violated a law or are otherwise in a position to be judged.

That might be the coolest thing I've ever seen Magneto. THE MUTANT TOO ANGRY TO DIE!!
If nothing else it will really fill out his "Become a Real Arakkoan" punchcard.

I mean these people have a cop who hunts you down if you back away from a challenge.
 

Caspel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,343
SoCal
Proteus is part of "The Five." He's too valuable to risk getting killed or incapacitated (he's not immortal by any means) so they're going to keep him as far away from combat as possible.

Did Proteus get nerfed recently or by Hickman? Proteus in the past was always said to never be truly dead when defeats led to his death. His energy is just dispersed and it would take time for him to recover. Correct me if I am wrong on this because anytime the mutants or any form of X-men have thought he was dead, he would come back years later when his energy was gathered again. Definitely understand him needing to be away from combat, just curious to know if there people expect the story to lead to him finally being involved.
...are you confusing 616 Wanda with the theatrical film? The Scarlet Witch is not a mutant and not on Krakoa. At best she's an Avenger and will be neutral in AXE.
Nah, definitely not confusing the two. 616 Wanda was featured in the mini-series Darkhold before Trial of Magneto. Give it a read, I think it came out in late 2021, so it's not even a year old yet. Written by Steve Orlando. I read it and figured someday they will need to talk about how she basically has all of the powers of the Darkhold and actually beat Chthon in his own realm, whom is said to be among the most powerful beings in Marvel when in his own realm/universe or whatever. Chthon should be lightyears ahead of Uranos and any eternal.

Synopsis of how she fuses with the Darkhold to finally overcome and defeat Chthon from Fandom:

"The Scarlet Witch then entered Chthon's domain with Doctor Doom to confront the demon directly. She betrayed Doctor Doom and took the Darkhold in order defeat Chthon herself. Fused with the book, she was able to defeat and possess Chthon entirely. Empowered by the Darkhold and Chthon, she undid the corruption. Afterwards, the Scarlet Witch taunted Doom for his past abusive schemes against her and proclaimed her freedom.[SUP]"[/SUP]

Also, not sure why you think she will be neutral. Kind of confused about how much you are reading Scarlet's stories since she is now labeled the "mutant redeemer" after the Magneto Trials. Can you explain further? Did something else happen to Scarlet for her to go back to removing herself from involving herself with mutants after Marvel clearly was trying to clean up her story and put M-Day behind her? Maybe I missed what she is up to post Magneto leaving Krakoa.

He's in Knights of X and his absence is explained. Basically his entire territory is the seige perilous and he is busy keeping people out of there. Probably not getting involved in the AXE business.

Yeah, that's what I briefly mentioned. Apocalypse told him to stay there and he would know when it is time to open up his territory. Guessing you think it isn't time for him to open it up even with the mutant genocide going on.

X-man was rapidly aging throughout that event as his powers were burning out his body again. Even the Life Seed couldn't stop it. He wasn't dead at the conclusion of Age of X-man but it was clearly coming.
Ahh, kind of expected him to recover. He's one of my favs, so maybe he will get another shot with mutants several years from now.

Jamie's instability makes him more liability than asset in cases like this. Otherworld is currently inaccessible but I'm not sure where he is precisely.
Last I saw, I think Jamie was abducted by Merlin and was saved by his sister? I forget since Otherworld stuff is always confusing to me when it is happening on the timeline with other mutant comics.

The better question than any of these are where Apocalyse, Genesis, and (most of) the original horsemen are. Now is not the best time for a vacation.
Yeah, I brought that up earlier in the thread last week prior to X-Men Red #5 so didn't ask about it again haha. I guess could also go running back to Selene and resurrect her again or ask any of the Externals (all said to be immortal, too) to help against the Eternals. Gideon with the power to mimic other powers, Selene can life absorb any Eternal if she wanted, Burke is a precog so he wouldnt be of much help, Absalom more of a melee fighter due to bone manipulation, or White Sword with his healing powers -- guessing he would come along with Apoc if they were to return.

Also another two quick questions :
1 - chances of Mad Jim Jaspers getting involved in any of the current stories? He's another reality manipulator that has been on the sidelines for awhile and just makes quick appearances in Otherworld like Mister M and then disappears.

2 - Vulcan died a couple of months ago but it doesnt seem he will have resurrection protocols for him after his defeat to Tarn. Any reason why they are keeping one of their most powerful mutants and relative to Cyclops dead?

3 - Have we seen Gabriel Shepard return since Hickman's new Krakoa? I know he's a Proto-mutant, so technically not too involved with Krakoa mutants but he's another energy being that likely cannot die and has been able to manipulate time among other powers and hasn't been seen in years.
 

Manmademan

Election Thread Watcher
Member
Aug 6, 2018
16,019
The arrogance of that one CEO that Emma mentioned at the Gala is so sadly familiar. I mean, sure, Apocalypse and Magneto are off of Krakoa. But for them to think that shows the island is weakening is lunacy.

Hell, Xavier held off the Uni-Mind solo after getting ambushed. Granted he couldn't fight back, but his presence alone should still give humanity pause. And that's not taking into account, you know, everyone else.

616 Humans are the worst.

EDIT: and that mutant carpenter Hope mentioned had better be THE NAZARENE lol


Moira mentioned that the average level of power for most mutants on the island was roughly on the level of a fart in the wind. Previously there were numbers from Bishop that said only 2% or so were combat ready. With numbers THAT low losing one confirmed Omega Mutant and one that's damned close to it definitely would make it appear that the island is vulnerable. Especially since to 99% of the world, "powerful, evil mutant" means Apocalypse or Magneto.
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,339
Moira mentioned that the average level of power for most mutants on the island was roughly on the level of a fart in the wind. Previously there were numbers from Bishop that said only 2% or so were combat ready. With numbers THAT low losing one confirmed Omega Mutant and one that's damned close to it definitely would make it appear that the island is vulnerable. Especially since to 99% of the world, "powerful, evil mutant" means Apocalypse or Magneto.

This is particularly important I think, there's a LOT of political cachet and threat in those two names in particular. In the Marvel universe, Magneto is very likely the first mutant most people ever saw. Replacing them with Hope and Destiny (wow, I never really thought about what message that sends before lol) is going to look like a step back.
 

BebopCola

Member
Jul 17, 2019
2,060
Moira mentioned that the average level of power for most mutants on the island was roughly on the level of a fart in the wind. Previously there were numbers from Bishop that said only 2% or so were combat ready. With numbers THAT low losing one confirmed Omega Mutant and one that's damned close to it definitely would make it appear that the island is vulnerable. Especially since to 99% of the world, "powerful, evil mutant" means Apocalypse or Magneto.

Okay, good point. I dismissed Moira's comment as angry arrogance but coupled with Bishop I get it.

But that makes me wonder: is there an "average" mutant power? Has there been some kind of quantifiable baseline for mutants stated other than simply possession of the X-Gene?
 

Kanhir

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,891
this Gillen / Ewing era seems better than the actual Hickman era

giphy.gif
I've been saying this for a while, it's nice to see I'm not alone! Immortal and Red have been incredible, Legion and Knights have been great upgrades to their previous series, New Mutants is still stellar, and the rest are...also there.

I'm just hesitant about AXE, since so far it seems to be falling into the old "mutant genocide" trope, but we'll see.
 

-Tetsuo-

Unlimited Capacity
Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,587
I am finally catching up on this after reading House/Powers a while back. I am about to start X of Swords. I am prepared for the fuckery.
 

Manmademan

Election Thread Watcher
Member
Aug 6, 2018
16,019
I've been saying this for a while, it's nice to see I'm not alone! Immortal and Red have been incredible, Legion and Knights have been great upgrades to their previous series, New Mutants is still stellar, and the rest are...also there.

I'm just hesitant about AXE, since so far it seems to be falling into the old "mutant genocide" trope, but we'll see.

AXE is pretty good. The X-men have an established, credible threat as an opponent and neither side is capable of backing down.

I would disagree a bit that this is falling into the mutant genocide trope- AXE is clear that the only result from this is mutually assured destruction for the rest of the planet as neither side can be permanently put down. The Eternals just blew their one shot at that by failing to kill the Five outright- but even that wouldn't have worked because there are other mutants identified to work as backups in case the Five ever become indisposed or compromised.

Where the story is going seems obvious if you're a fan of obscure marvel crossovers from the 1980s but that's not most people.
 

ajido

Unshakable Resolve
Member
Dec 7, 2018
1,196
Nah, definitely not confusing the two. 616 Wanda was featured in the mini-series Darkhold before Trial of Magneto. Give it a read, I think it came out in late 2021, so it's not even a year old yet. Written by Steve Orlando. I read it and figured someday they will need to talk about how she basically has all of the powers of the Darkhold and actually beat Chthon in his own realm, whom is said to be among the most powerful beings in Marvel when in his own realm/universe or whatever. Chthon should be lightyears ahead of Uranos and any eternal.

Synopsis of how she fuses with the Darkhold to finally overcome and defeat Chthon from Fandom:

"The Scarlet Witch then entered Chthon's domain with Doctor Doom to confront the demon directly. She betrayed Doctor Doom and took the Darkhold in order defeat Chthon herself. Fused with the book, she was able to defeat and possess Chthon entirely. Empowered by the Darkhold and Chthon, she undid the corruption. Afterwards, the Scarlet Witch taunted Doom for his past abusive schemes against her and proclaimed her freedom.[SUP]"[/SUP]

Also, not sure why you think she will be neutral. Kind of confused about how much you are reading Scarlet's stories since she is now labeled the "mutant redeemer" after the Magneto Trials. Can you explain further? Did something else happen to Scarlet for her to go back to removing herself from involving herself with mutants after Marvel clearly was trying to clean up her story and put M-Day behind her? Maybe I missed what she is up to post Magneto leaving Krakoa.

Oh my god how did I miss an entire Scarlet Witch focused event?!? Thank you for this! Just picked up the series on digital.
 

Caspel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,343
SoCal
Oh my god how did I miss an entire Scarlet Witch focused event?!? Thank you for this! Just picked up the series on digital.
Haha no worries -- it was mostly one-shots for each character which led up to the finale with Scarlet. I read most of due to my general interest in Chthon and how powerful he is supposed to be but never gets any real comic time beyond mentions of how dangerous he could be. Will be interesting to see if Marvel ever mentions it again and how Scarlet has the Darkhold powers now or just handwaves it away.
 

PhoenixAKG

Member
Aug 14, 2019
7,814
Did Proteus get nerfed recently or by Hickman? Proteus in the past was always said to never be truly dead when defeats led to his death. His energy is just dispersed and it would take time for him to recover. Correct me if I am wrong on this because anytime the mutants or any form of X-men have thought he was dead, he would come back years later when his energy was gathered again. Definitely understand him needing to be away from combat, just curious to know if there people expect the story to lead to him finally being involved.

Nah, definitely not confusing the two. 616 Wanda was featured in the mini-series Darkhold before Trial of Magneto. Give it a read, I think it came out in late 2021, so it's not even a year old yet. Written by Steve Orlando. I read it and figured someday they will need to talk about how she basically has all of the powers of the Darkhold and actually beat Chthon in his own realm, whom is said to be among the most powerful beings in Marvel when in his own realm/universe or whatever. Chthon should be lightyears ahead of Uranos and any eternal.

Synopsis of how she fuses with the Darkhold to finally overcome and defeat Chthon from Fandom:

"The Scarlet Witch then entered Chthon's domain with Doctor Doom to confront the demon directly. She betrayed Doctor Doom and took the Darkhold in order defeat Chthon herself. Fused with the book, she was able to defeat and possess Chthon entirely. Empowered by the Darkhold and Chthon, she undid the corruption. Afterwards, the Scarlet Witch taunted Doom for his past abusive schemes against her and proclaimed her freedom.[SUP]"[/SUP]

Also, not sure why you think she will be neutral. Kind of confused about how much you are reading Scarlet's stories since she is now labeled the "mutant redeemer" after the Magneto Trials. Can you explain further? Did something else happen to Scarlet for her to go back to removing herself from involving herself with mutants after Marvel clearly was trying to clean up her story and put M-Day behind her? Maybe I missed what she is up to post Magneto leaving Krakoa.



Yeah, that's what I briefly mentioned. Apocalypse told him to stay there and he would know when it is time to open up his territory. Guessing you think it isn't time for him to open it up even with the mutant genocide going on.


Ahh, kind of expected him to recover. He's one of my favs, so maybe he will get another shot with mutants several years from now.


Last I saw, I think Jamie was abducted by Merlin and was saved by his sister? I forget since Otherworld stuff is always confusing to me when it is happening on the timeline with other mutant comics.


Yeah, I brought that up earlier in the thread last week prior to X-Men Red #5 so didn't ask about it again haha. I guess could also go running back to Selene and resurrect her again or ask any of the Externals (all said to be immortal, too) to help against the Eternals. Gideon with the power to mimic other powers, Selene can life absorb any Eternal if she wanted, Burke is a precog so he wouldnt be of much help, Absalom more of a melee fighter due to bone manipulation, or White Sword with his healing powers -- guessing he would come along with Apoc if they were to return.

Also another two quick questions :
1 - chances of Mad Jim Jaspers getting involved in any of the current stories? He's another reality manipulator that has been on the sidelines for awhile and just makes quick appearances in Otherworld like Mister M and then disappears.

2 - Vulcan died a couple of months ago but it doesnt seem he will have resurrection protocols for him after his defeat to Tarn. Any reason why they are keeping one of their most powerful mutants and relative to Cyclops dead?

3 - Have we seen Gabriel Shepard return since Hickman's new Krakoa? I know he's a Proto-mutant, so technically not too involved with Krakoa mutants but he's another energy being that likely cannot die and has been able to manipulate time among other powers and hasn't been seen in years.

Isn't Wanda currently staying on Krakoa for a bit?
 

Caspel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,343
SoCal
Isn't Wanda currently staying on Krakoa for a bit?

I think so? Last I knew she helped out with improving the resurrection protocols. She has to be involved in the conflict with the Eternals sooner or later. If they handwave Chthon being tied to her soul (if she dies, Chthon will come back and potentially on Earth) and having the powers of the Darkhold, I will be disappointed.