• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.

Eoin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,103
I mean, even if every manufacturer agreed to go USB C on everything, Android, Apple, high end, flip phones, whatever... it's not like everyone's going to throw their existing phones in the trash because now there's a "standard" for cables. Those phones are going to be around for a while, also in the used/refurb market. And how many years until USB C gets replaced with something newer. No standard lasts forever.
I don't get your point here. None of the things you mentioned prevent standardisation, or stop it from being a good thing.

Politicians controlling innovation sounds like a solid plan.
It was pretty good when those same politicians got companies to stop making their idiotic panoply of cables that were functionally identical but physically and electronically totally incompatible purely for the sake of raking on money.

So yeah, seems like a solid plan to me, especially since the industry is pretty close to standardising on USB C anyway.
 

Wraith

Member
Jun 28, 2018
8,892
I don't get your point here. None of the things you mentioned prevent standardisation, or stop it from being a good thing.
It's not that standardization would be bad, it would improve some things. It's just that the "my friend has the wrong cable" scenario in that quote will still happen for some folks, even if there isn't an android/apple divide anymore. "You've got USB D? Aw man, I'm still on USB C."
 

Absolute

Banned
Nov 6, 2017
2,090
This absurdly heavy handed and shortsighted.

Why? It will not hold back wireless charging and it will be better for consumers. It's not like charging cables are progressing at breakneck pace. Apples fast charge on it's new phone comes from the plug adaptor not the cable unless I am mistaken.
 

Vilix

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,055
Texas
If Apple moves to USB-C I'll eat my hat. I'm sure iPhones and iPads in the future will move to wireless charging. 😒
 

Eoin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,103
It's not that standardization would be bad, it would improve some things. It's just that the "my friend has the wrong cable" scenario in that quote will still happen for some folks, even if there isn't an android/apple divide anymore. "You've got USB D? Aw man, I'm still on USB C."
Allowing for people to share cables is just one purpose of this, and only a small one. The main purpose is to avoid electronic waste.
 

Gouty

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,658
Why? It will not hold back wireless charging and it will be better for consumers. It's not like charging cables are progressing at breakneck pace. Apples fast charge on it's new phone comes from the plug adaptor not the cable unless I am mistaken.

Whatever problem this is supposedly fixing (Why adults can't manage their own cables and batteries I don't know) isn't worth dictating to device makers how they should design their products. USB C is a fine standard in 2020, but for how long? What if they discover in 2021 that wireless charging kills birds and shrinks dicks? The point is we have no idea what the future holds or what our needs will be so trying to freeze time like this a terrible idea.
 

EloKa

GSP
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
1,905
Having one standardized USB port for all* Phones in the EU has been a blessing. You can charge any phone anywhere with any cable.
*If you own an iPhone and run out of battery then you better bring your own cable. Also fine Apple if they keep refusing to agree to a standard.

Edit: the EU already wants to have standard Port for all phones since 2009 and it is known that Apple spends millions to lobby against that law. Punish them.
 
Last edited:

enzo_gt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,299
This sounds like a horrible idea that will stifle innovation through the bureaucracy of the EU.

What a shortsighted idea, jesus. No amount of frustration with Apple's lightning ports would make this worth it.

Politicians controlling innovation sounds like a solid plan.
Basically, this. Giving legislative bodies this power who are almost always uninformed about this stuff (I mean, looking even beyond this move) is a teeeeeeeeeeeerrible idea and precedent.

Outside of Apple, the industry basically self-regulates well enough so, uh, why are we giving power to these bodies to do this again?
 

Absolute

Banned
Nov 6, 2017
2,090
Whatever problem this is supposedly fixing (Why adults can't manage their own cables and batteries I don't know) isn't worth dictating to device makers how they should design their products. USB C is a fine standard in 2020, but for how long? What if they discover in 2021 that wireless charging kills birds and shrinks dicks? The point is we have no idea what the future holds or what our needs will be so trying to freeze time like this a terrible idea.

Well it protects against unnecessary waste and as long as the manufacturers can keep agreeing on new standards I really don't see the problem. It's not like this will be an unadabtable law that will hold back progress. It's a good decision for customers and the environment imo.
 

Castamere

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,517
Wireless charging gets cheaper by the day. Ban charging ports. They're outdated, Bluetooth/wireless for connections, wireless for charging.
 

Deleted member 4783

Oct 25, 2017
4,531
Why am I not surprised by the puchback here? Stop Innovation? What the fuck are you talking about? Open standards are always improving and getting better.

Shut up.
 

ChrisR

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,794
incoming iPhone with no ports that only charges wirelessly via some new standard
 

Chiaroscuro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,688
Apple to EU: first standardize your sockets.

I agree on the electronic waste thing, so different adapters and sockets should also be banished.
 

Eoin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,103
USB C is a fine standard in 2020, but for how long?
For, say, a decade?

I mean, micro-USB was fine as a near-standard for quite a while, and that has tons of problems and limitations that USB C just doesn't have.

However, this question misunderstands the proposal, because the proposal isn't to try to freeze one standard in place forever. This new call for standardisation is happening now because the last MoU that the industry signed up to, created in 2014, expired. The expected result here is a time-limited standardisation agreement.

This sounds like a horrible idea that will stifle innovation through the bureaucracy of the EU.
Do you feel like companies are being innovative with charging cable technology right now?

Outside of Apple, the industry basically self-regulates well enough so, uh, why are we giving power to these bodies to do this again?
The industry self-regulates right now because of the EU. Before the EU got involved, mobile phone charging cables were a tangled web of incompatibilities, not just between manufacturers but between different phone models from the same manufacturer. Mobile phone companies had plenty of time to fix that and instead they chose to utterly ream their consumers for every last cent they could squeeze out of every new cable. Nokia even had different cables for charging and for data transfer. That was a problem, and the EU scared companies into fixing it.
 

funky

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,527
Did Apple ever say why they went with USB-C in the ipad pro and nothing else?
 

Deleted member 4783

Oct 25, 2017
4,531
This sounds like a horrible idea that will stifle innovation through the bureaucracy of the EU.

What a shortsighted idea, jesus. No amount of frustration with Apple's lightning ports would make this worth it.


Basically, this. Giving legislative bodies this power who are almost always uninformed about this stuff (I mean, looking even beyond this move) is a teeeeeeeeeeeerrible idea and precedent.

Outside of Apple, the industry basically self-regulates well enough so, uh, why are we giving power to these bodies to do this again?
Lmao. You still believe in the fairy tale about auto regulation?

Stiffle innovation? Haha

I'll tell you this, thanks to the E.U we have been able to reach here.
 

Quiksaver

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,022
Good. Apple's shitty ass lightning already made me retire one phone and now it's heading for a second one.
Make them pay
 

enzo_gt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,299
Do you feel like companies are being innovative with charging cable technology right now?

The industry self-regulates right now because of the EU. Before the EU got involved, mobile phone charging cables were a tangled web of incompatibilities, not just between manufacturers but between different phone models from the same manufacturer. Mobile phone companies had plenty of time to fix that and instead they chose to utterly ream their consumers for every last cent they could squeeze out of every new cable. Nokia even had different cables for charging and for data transfer. That was a problem, and the EU scared companies into fixing it.
Without question. SInce battery technology itself has plateaued and sizes aren't increasing at the same rate they used to, the arms race for charging speeds has been in full gear these past few years between major stakeholders.

If you say that the EU has gotten us to a place of self-regulation, what is the impetus for more regulation now, then, exactly?

In a time when phone form factors are changing rapidly as well, it's hard for this not to come off like a well-intentioned but insufficiently thought out proposition like GDPR was. And believe me, I'm pining to put lighting cables away for good the first chance I get.
 

EloKa

GSP
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
1,905
Apple to EU: first standardize your sockets.
These are the different sockets in the EU but note that Red, Green and Teal are compatible to the blue standard.
Swiss uses different variations, but the newer "Eurosocket" form factor is also compatible to the blue standard.

That leaves the UK with the only non-compatible sockets in the EU. On the other hand "leave", "UK" and "EU" are interesting keywords.
main-qimg-760e16095ddb4bdd0c75a2fc98878070.webp
 

Kthulhu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,670

Eoin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,103
Without question. SInce battery technology itself has plateaued and sizes aren't increasing at the same rate they used to, the arms race for charging speeds has been in full gear these past few years between major stakeholders.
Okay, so charger technology has been progressing "in full gear".

That's under the auspices of an existing EU-mandated standardisation MoU.

So it turns out you have nothing to worry about, because the innovation that you wrongly believe will be stifled by this has already been happening, according to you, under an existing version of this.

If you say that the EU has gotten us to a place of self-regulation, what is the impetus for more regulation now, then, exactly?
As I wrote in my previous post, the 2014 MoU has expired.

In a time when phone form factors are changing rapidly as well, it's hard for this not to come off like a well-intentioned but insufficiently thought out proposition like GDPR was.
Okay, so what specific bits don't you like?
 

Gouty

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,658
How much waste do phone protectors create? You'd only need one if the screens were all the same size.
 
Apr 4, 2019
2,915
Greater Toronto Area
The ironic thing is Apple has already embraced USB-C for their Macbooks and iPads. I guess the market incentive is too much for them to give up Lighting on iPhones. Doesn't change the fact that having one cable standard would be better for the environment and consumers.

Did Apple ever say why they went with USB-C in the ipad pro and nothing else?

With their laptops and tablets Apple is also competing with other high end PC/tablets, which have all embraced USB-C. Which means most PC/tablet accessories have switched to USB-C.
 
Last edited:
Feb 1, 2018
5,083
USB-C is superior to micro-USB, and Apple needs to hurry up and put it in iPhones (iPads already have it).

Lightning is ideal for smaller accessories and devices (airpod cases, remotes, keyboards, mice, etc)

But let's be real they're just gonna make the next iPhones fully portless lol
 
Oct 26, 2017
8,734
People using the "innovation" argument don't realize that Apple has been using Lightning for 10 years (so really, what innovation are you getting from consistent Lightning usage? Having USB-C doesn't prevent you from doing Qi wireless charging, so it's entirely motivated by cost). Not to mention, by most if not all objective measures, USB-C is significantly better in performance than Lightning.
 

TheMilkman

Banned
Aug 30, 2019
473
How would this significantly reduce e-waste? There's only one major company that's not on board with the standard as is. Would this increase the quality of cables across the board? Most of the ones I throw away were shitty ones that were on a usb variant, the "standard", already.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,956
God DAMN I love the EU.

Seriously get fked Apple, you greedy greedy fksssssss.

This sounds like a horrible idea that will stifle innovation through the bureaucracy of the EU.

What a shortsighted idea, jesus. No amount of frustration with Apple's lightning ports would make this worth it.


Basically, this. Giving legislative bodies this power who are almost always uninformed about this stuff (I mean, looking even beyond this move) is a teeeeeeeeeeeerrible idea and precedent.

Outside of Apple, the industry basically self-regulates well enough so, uh, why are we giving power to these bodies to do this again?

Lol, cause yeah, corporations have proven themselves SOOOOO good at self-regulation.

That's why we're living in late-stage Capitalist heaven right now amirite?

AMIRIIIIIITE?!?
 
Last edited:

KarmaCow

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,151
Why pay (a few pennies) for USB-C license when you can actually make money selling your own proprietary port license? (and annoy everyone in the process)

Then why buckle for the iPad Pro? It's not like people wont buy Apple branded USB-C cables if they moved over and I can't imagine the margins are that high.

Though as Polymerization said, they'll go wireless soon enough.
 
Apr 4, 2019
2,915
Greater Toronto Area
Then why buckle for the iPad Pro? It's not like people wont buy Apple branded USB-C cables if they moved over and I can't imagine the margins are that high.

Though as Polymerization said, they'll go wireless soon enough.

Because professionals have been leaving iPads/Macbooks for competitors, which all use USB-C. Apple no longer has a quasi-monopoly on high-end laptops/tablets. They're forced to compete now.

With iPhones they have a captive audience of folks who will stick with iPhones no matter what. So Apple is exploiting them for profit as much as they can.