• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.

Deleted member 8118

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
3,639
Some of this stuff, like smartphone screens, seem kind of goofy, though the complaints about police vests seem a lot more valid.

I'm pretty sure there's a lot of men that can't properly hold an iPhone Xr without having to use one of those rear ring holder things. I have gigantic hands and I know I can't.

Just bought an SE and I'm more than happy.
 
Oct 27, 2017
4,104
as a younger man, i used to work at a Domino's Pizza that was notorious for miscarriages among the inside female staff. it happened twice the few years i was there. women's biology needs to be considered in the workplace.
 

skipgo

Member
Dec 28, 2018
2,568
It is absurd and irresponsible to not consider women for things like automotive security and security gear in law enforcement.

But this happens in almost everything, down to the quality of clothes which is a lot higher and less expensive on average for "male" clothing than "female" clothing in my experience.
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
2Blackcats

2Blackcats

Member
Oct 26, 2017
16,051
Some of this stuff, like smartphone screens, seem kind of goofy, though the complaints about police vests seem a lot more valid.

I'm pretty sure there's a lot of men that can't properly hold an iPhone Xr without having to use one of those rear ring holder things. I have gigantic hands and I know I can't.

Just bought an SE and I'm more than happy.

Yeah, when she brought up the screen size thing i rubbished it. But then read the article. Some interesting points. The crash test dummy part seems particularly bizarre. Must do some research later.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,846
I feel like there's some interesting food for thought here, but it's wrapped up in unsupported or unexamined assertions. Why bags of cement are the size they are didn't just occur in a vacuum, the same with bricks. "Just make these things smaller for the minority of the workforce" is, to use her comments earlier about productivity, not an efficient strategy. You can't do rigorous testing on every single possible chemical interaction because that's expensive and hard to do (and she suggests no actual evidence that suggests these interactions actually exist.) The bit about smartphones and unsupported assertion bigger screen sizes are driven by an appeal to men is likewise not supported by the fact that phablets are broadly popular especially in places with smaller-handed people.

There's plenty in there that does speak to actual problems—the stuff about male bias in tech that follows right after is well-documented, for example. You don't have to reach into wild speculation to make the point that women are often not well-accommodated in various aspects.

(I'd also love to know how they think fitness trackers work. If you aren't moving your hand with the tracker on it, it's just not going to give you good data.)
 
Dec 31, 2017
1,724
as a younger man, i used to work at a Domino's Pizza that was notorious for miscarriages among the inside female staff. it happened twice the few years i was there. women's biology needs to be considered in the workplace.
What was Dominos having people do that enduced miscarriages?

Unless this is a joke on the Username in which case never mind.
 

Apathy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,992
Why the fuck wouldn't it be a government mandate to test using the pregnant test dummy. Hell, even from a companies perspective, taking the initiative and good pr, they've done so in the past for so much less good.
 

mikeys_legendary

The Fallen
Sep 26, 2018
3,008
A lot of this makes sense. Especially police uniforms. We've had female officers for decades, why does proper equipment not broadly exist? Things like this need to be proactive rather than reactive when people's lives are at stake.

The restoom issue is rather silly though. I get that women need cubicles for more than men do but I still fail to see a proper reason for increasing the size of the ladies room while leaving the men's room the same size? Any guy who's been to the movie theater or any stadium knows that there's often a line for us too. Even that silly rule of "every other urinal" goes out the window in these cases. Could the issue not be fixed by simply making all washrooms larger?

Perhaps decrease the size of restroom cubicles across the board and make the space between urinals smaller? There's usually a ton of room between me and the next guy, and I'm a pretty big dude. Often times there's enough room in a non-handicapped cubicle for me to extend both of my arms at least 3/4 of the way too. I'm 6ft flat.
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
20,660
I relate to the bit about smartphones. I can't do actions one-handed on pretty much any of them. My female friend also has trouble getting Android Auto to work with consistency. I chalked it up to it being trash, but my brother will insist it's an amazing feature.
 

HeySeuss

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
8,844
Ohio
They do make female police vests but I've been told they aren't all that much better. That technology has come quite a long way but no matter what they do the vests are going to be rigid an uncomfortable.
 

dreams

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,792
This is a really great article. The part about not having basically any information about the impact of the exposure to so many chemicals for nail techs and other "women's work" jobs is really interesting. Testing needs to be done for this ASAP.

Somewhat side-eyeing the posters in here about how stuff in this article is "so silly" even though everything mentioned is related to being designed by and for men, with women as an afterthought (since that is... the whole point of the article). Some things are more dire than others.
 

Deleted member 19003

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,809
Wow, great article, I can personally relate to a few things she brought up. Misfiting work uniforms are almost always just smaller men's sizes, and not designed for women's bodies. And I had the same problem with voice recognition in the car. I'm really shocked about the car test dummies and women causalties, that's infuriating that such awful stats for women have been ignored in safety design. And I had a good laugh over what happened with the 'gender neutral' bathrooms. This is a man's world and women are secondary thoughts to its design. Sigh. I hope this article is insightful for some here, even the more silly parts, like iPhone design, do ring true.



Their advertising clearly showing it was designed for a man's hand, with a male voice over to boot.
 
Last edited:

nel e nel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,134
as a younger man, i used to work at a Domino's Pizza that was notorious for miscarriages among the inside female staff. it happened twice the few years i was there. women's biology needs to be considered in the workplace.

Miscarriages are incredibly more frequent than most people realize. Trying to tie it to a pizza parlor's working conditions is almost laughable.

If anything, the general ignorance of how common miscarriages are would be a better argument in this topic.
 

Sub Boss

Banned
Nov 14, 2017
13,441
Miscarriages are incredibly more frequent than most people realize. Trying to tie it to a pizza parlor's working conditions is almost laughable.

If anything, the general ignorance of how common miscarriages are would be a better argument in this topic.
Wow i thought it could be the kitchen, i didn't know they were so common :^(
having a miscarriage for working in a pizzeria sounds pretty scary
 

Dead Guy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,597
Saskatchewan, Canada
Let's just do away with urinals and make all bathrooms gender neutral.

Fuck that. Urinals are a godsend. I don't want to be standing in line for 30 minutes every time I want to use the bathroom at a sporting event or concert.

I realize how much it sucks for women to have to stand there, but the solution isn't taking out something incredibly convenient for no reason and pissing off half of the population.
 

nel e nel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,134
Wow i thought it could be the kitchen, i didn't know they were so common :^(
having a miscarriage for working in a pizzeria sounds pretty scary

I think it's something like 30% of pregnancies end in miscarriages. The data isn't entirely precise because a lot of them occur when the person doesn't even know they are pregnant.
 

Sub Boss

Banned
Nov 14, 2017
13,441
This is a really great article. The part about not having basically any information about the impact of the exposure to so many chemicals for nail techs and other "women's work" jobs is really interesting. Testing needs to be done for this ASAP.

Somewhat side-eyeing the posters in here about how stuff in this article is "so silly" even though everything mentioned is related to being designed by and for men, with women as an afterthought (since that is... the whole point of the article). Some things are more dire than others.
I suppose first we need more women in the tech industry , problem is that seems a very toxic, nasty and unwelcome environment...that PIXAR article a few months back opened my eyes.
I think it's something like 30% of pregnancies end in miscarriages. The data isn't entirely precise because a lot of them occur when the person doesn't even know they are pregnant.
30% is pretty high :^O and something like that is very personal so i guess there is not much info on the subject
 
Last edited:

Sonicbug

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,409
The Void, MA
The phone size thing kills me for a completely unrelated reason not mentioned in that article.

Fitting one in the back pocket of women's jeans. I still have a 6s and the fact phones kept getting larger upset me nearly as much as removing the headphone jack.

30% is pretty high :^O and something like that is very personal so i guess there is not much info on the subject

It could be as high as 50% for unrecognized, the 30% is actually once someone realizes they're pregnant. That's another thing that drives me nuts about society, there shouldn't be a stigma around miscarriages. It's natural, it happens, it's a biological process. Education on that is severely lacking.
 

FeistyBoots

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,506
Southern California
The deadly truth about a world built for men – from stab vests to car crashes

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/feb/23/truth-world-built-for-men-car-crashes

My wife is always talking about this stuff and just shared this article. Found it pretty interesting.

(heading to work now but will reply later)

This is a fantastic and extremely important article. It's infuriating how little thought is given to the little things like, oh, women's survival.

Edit: and the FIRST reply is a fucking "not all men"-style post. JFC.
 

TSM

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,821
Let's just do away with urinals and make all bathrooms gender neutral.

Every urinal that is available frees up a stall for the time a man would spend occupying it. Urinals are space efficient and should actually open up more time in stalls for women in a gender neutral bathroom. If there were no urinals in a gender neutral bathroom then women would actually have to wait longer as men would be occupying much more of the available stall time. The only case I can see to be made for eliminating urinals if is your goal is purely to make the men experience the same uncomfortable waiting time as women instead of actually trying to help women get into a stall as quickly as possible.
 
OP
OP
2Blackcats

2Blackcats

Member
Oct 26, 2017
16,051
This is a fantastic and extremely important article. It's infuriating how little thought is given to the little things like, oh, women's survival.

Edit: and the FIRST reply is a fucking "not all men"-style post. JFC.

It's a great article alright though i do agree that a little editing could have made the point in an even more powerful way.

Might be cool to try to think of examples that aren't covered in the article.

The Duke, the pad that came with the original xbox definitely didn't have women in mind.

Got to be loads of examples. Power tools?
 

rras1994

Member
Nov 4, 2017
5,742
Let's just do away with urinals and make all bathrooms gender neutral.
Let's not. The women's toilets is one of the few places I can go if a guy is creeping me out and not leaving me alone that I can go and lie and say I need the bathroom (thus avoiding a potentially dangerous confrontation of him handling rejection badly), he can't follow in there, and I can wait til the guy leaves or attempt to sneak out. Making all bathrooms gender neutral would be much worse for me.
 

Deleted member 8468

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
9,109
as a younger man, i used to work at a Domino's Pizza that was notorious for miscarriages among the inside female staff. it happened twice the few years i was there. women's biology needs to be considered in the workplace.
I genuinely don't understand what you're getting at. I worked in restaurants for years with women in the front and back of the house who had children. What specifically are you inferring causes the miscarriages?
 
Oct 27, 2017
4,104
Miscarriages are incredibly more frequent than most people realize. Trying to tie it to a pizza parlor's working conditions is almost laughable.

If anything, the general ignorance of how common miscarriages are would be a better argument in this topic.

i apologize if i came across as making light of the issue or that i might have some special insight on the subject. I'm not a medical professional. i can only say what the other staff relayed to me. there are more personal stories i could mention but they're not mine to talk about.

i will say that these conditions were not typical, however. we were one of the busiest stores in the country, in the deep south, in a building in poor repair with an oven that probably wasn't ventilated correctly, with tight quarters.

we did so much business, towers of pizza boxes were stacked wherever there was space, so you had to walk through a maze of them to get anywhere -- no one had time to fold anymore when the rushes hit. deliveries were often late and stress levels were often high. it was hot, loud, and cramped all the time and behind it all, the ringing of phones. i still have nightmares about that ringing.

honestly, the store was probably just detrimental to human life in general, but the majority of the inside staff were women, so they suffered the brunt of it.

they did remodel a few years after i left. hopefully it's gotten better.
 
Last edited:

Deleted member 19003

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,809
Let's just do away with urinals and make all bathrooms gender neutral.

The solutions to bathrooms is not to make them all gender neutral or make men's bathrooms more inconvenient by ripping out their urinals. The solution is simple, just accept that anyone can use the one bathroom they deem is necessary for their gender and not to make up lies to scare people into believing that transpeople are out to get them in the bathrooms. And giving women's bathroom a bit more sqft for more stalls to compensate for their unique needs would be a step forward.
 

Dead Guy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,597
Saskatchewan, Canada
It's a great article alright though i do agree that a little editing could have made the point in an even more powerful way.

Might be cool to try to think of examples that aren't covered in the article.

The Duke, the pad that came with the original xbox definitely didn't have women in mind.

Got to be loads of examples. Power tools?

The Duke wasn't built with human beings in mind. That thing is a monstrosity that everyone universally hated. I'm pretty sure you could kill someone with that thing and it wouldn't have a scratch on it.
 

Deleted member 19003

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,809
Design urinals for women.
Something quick without doors.
Not sure how that would work at all since our equipment is not designed for standing and peeing XD
Also women have more needs for an enclosed areas besides just having to urinate. Tampon and pad changes are a big one, and needs a dedicated trash can as well.
 

Owarifin

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
1,741
Not sure how that would work at all since our equipment is not designed for standing and peeing XD
Also women have more needs for an enclosed areas besides just having to urinate. Tampon and pad changes are a big one, and needs a dedicated trash can as well.
It's just for urinating.

Also, it won't be easy to design,
if it was, it would already be out there.

Whoever designs it will become rich.
 

Fiction

Fanthropologist
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,727
Elf Tower, New Mexico
Yeah the 'silly' things like phone screen size are only a constant annoyance for us, not deadly like seatbelts and stab vest, so it can be brushed off. I guess.
 

Rampage

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,134
Metro Detriot
It's just for urinating.

Also, it won't be easy to design,
if it was, it would already be out there.

Whoever designs it will become rich.

They already exist. They are called squat toilets. I found them mush faster to use that regular ones when I just wanted to pee. But that is not the problem with women's bathrooms, like the article said. It the amount of time women have to dedicate in bathrooms due to period and attending to children, elderly, and the handicapped compared to men's bathrooms. We need more stalls. Guys can keep their urinals.
 
Oct 26, 2017
6,571
The toilet situation really depends on the type of event you go to. Been to plenty of concerts or parties where the women toilets are basically empty.
Then again, we all recognized that being an anomaly.