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Who was the better Catwoman?

  • Halle Berry's Catwoman

    Votes: 74 13.1%
  • Anne Hathaway's Catwoman

    Votes: 492 86.9%

  • Total voters
    566

akilshohen

Member
Dec 8, 2017
1,308
I mean, let's see what rigorously conducted surveys say:
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www.hollywoodreporter.com

Robert Pattinson's Batman Selection Wins Over Younger Fans, Poll Finds

Americans ages 18-29 prefer Warner Bros.’ choice of the 'Twilight' star over the also-ran, Nicholas Hoult, a new Hollywood Reporter/Morning Consult poll finds.
*mindblown*

I will say that I would like to see Michelle or Halle's versions return in a ensemble movie.
 

FaceHugger

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
13,949
USA
I thought Anne opened up very strongly, playing the confused thief Bruce catches then quickly switches into Catwoman mode. Even how she makes her escape. The rest of the movie, well, she wasn't that great.

Berry's Catwoman was just weird. I mean that entire movie was weird. And why an actress of her caliber even agreed to it I'll never understand.
 
Oct 27, 2017
12,374
Well, Halle Berry is definitely mesmerizing in a train wreck way.

Catwoman 2004 sucks. Her performance is awful. I don't even see how it's awful in a fun way.

Hathaway was fucking awesome with the nothing part she was given. At least I agree with you on that, her role wasn't much in a movie that wasn't much.
 
Oct 27, 2017
12,374
I think people are mistaking which is a better film and not which actress better portrayed the character of CATWOMAN not Selina Kyle. Nolan's fixation on a realistic world absolutely neuters the character of Catwoman and the character lacks any camp or fun. There's nothing really catlike to Hathaways performance.OP is right on.

Catwoman wasn't bitten by a radioactive cat, so why does Halle Berry lick herself and act like a fucking actual cat?

She's a cat burglar, hence the motif, and why Hathaway was way better.
 

thekonamicode

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,726
A pile of oily rags on the ground is better than Nolan's Catwoman. Anne Hathaway has had some great roles, this ain't one of them.

One of the few times I've literally cringed in the theater, granted that entire film is problematic.
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
Hathaway's Catwoman is serviceable and inconsequential.

Berry's Catwoman is a waking nightmare

Julie Newmar is still the best
People have a weird hate boner for DKR in here. I don't know why. Outside of TDK and maybe Winter Soldier, it's one of the top comic book movies ever made.
It's truly a slog and a mess of a film that has some questionable messaging.

here are some other far superior comic book movies (and we're just talking Superheroes here):

Spider-Man: Into The Spider-Verse
Logan
Dredd
The Incredibles (if original IP paying homage counts)

I could name more but i feel like those are particularly agreed to be fantastic by consensus, in addition to TDK (and maaaybe Winter Soldier, Marvel is contentious)

And really, just within the Batman franchise I rate these films higher than DKR easily:

Batman Begins
Batman 89
Barman 66
Batman Mask Of The Phantasm

and just in terms of pure entertainment most Marvel films are a more enjoyable and rewatchable experience, even if they are generally vapid

fuck, I'd rather watch Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles: The Movie (1991)
 
Last edited:

Deleted member 60582

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 12, 2019
2,152
Hathaway's Catwoman is serviceable and inconsequential.

Berry's Catwoman is a waking nightmare

Julie Newmar is still the best

It's truly a slog and a mess of a film that has some questionable messaging.

here are some other far superior comic book movies (and we're just talking Superheroes here):

Spider-Man: Into The Spider-Verse
Logan
Dredd
The Incredibles (if original IP paying homage counts)

I could name more but i feel like those are particularly agreed to be fantastic by consensus, in addition to TDK (and maaaybe Winter Soldier, Marvel is contentious)

And really, just within the Batman franchise I rate these films higher than DKR easily:

Batman Begins
Batman 89
Barman 66
Batman Mask Of The Phantasm

and just in terms of pure entertainment most Marvel films are a more enjoyable and rewatchable experience, even if they are generally vapid

fuck, I'd rather watch Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles: The Movie (1991)

I'm with you for the most part, but for me TDKR opening night/day was still a hell of a good time in the theater because of the hype. The problem is once the hype is over and you start looking at it with a critical eye or even start questioning the basics, it just falls apart immediately. Someone who is generally as detailed as Nolan has no excuse for making such a sloppy film outside of only doing it out of obligation, and that's still no reason for it to be as sloppy as it is.

But to be fair, even TDK falls apart in a lot of respects when you start examining it. If it didn't have such a strong performance from Ledger it wouldn't be nearly as highly regarded as it is in my opinion. I don't think it's even close to being as messy as TDKR but it's pretty messy in its own right. '89 and Begins are light years ahead of both of them.
 

Zaied

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,573
I found Hathaway's Catwoman middling at worst. Definitely could've used more screentime (TDKR's novelization helps a bit), but she still had her moments — the scene where she arrives at the correctional facility and snaps the inmate's hands was amusing:



Halle's Catwoman was Pfeiffer Catwoman levels of stupid, but in a worse movie, without anything redeeming like a Danny Elfman score to make it tolerable.
 

Deleted member 61909

User requested account closure
Banned
Dec 5, 2019
1,161
not even Michelle Phiffer could make that script Halle berry was given to work. The fact that movie stained Hallie Berry so much is infuriating.
 

Pop-O-Matic

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
12,900
This sounds like a good channel idea tbh. "Actually Pretty Good," about taking popularly panned films and finding the good in them.
I mean, that's basically all of film Youtube that isn't dedicated to shitting on popularly loved films or just general alt-right skulduggery. I wouldn't have written that post if the kind of videos I was parodying didn't already exist in abundance.
 

Ogodei

One Winged Slayer
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,256
Coruscant
I mean, that's basically all of film Youtube that isn't dedicated to shitting on popularly loved films or just general alt-right skulduggery. I wouldn't have written that post if the kind of videos I was parodying didn't already exist in abundance.

Interesting, most of the left-tube adjacent film critique channels I look at are generally critical, or talk about why generally-acknowledged good movies are good. Got any channels you can recommend?
 

Dankir

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
2,513
The Batpod was boring? No.... DKR wasn't as good as the Dark Knight but it's just fine.

Halle's Catwoman is garbage.
 

Keldroc

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,987
People have a weird hate boner for DKR in here. I don't know why. Outside of TDK and maybe Winter Soldier, it's one of the top comic book movies ever made.

Because DKR is terrible. None of it makes any damn sense, it's a completely ridiculous way to follow up the ending of TDK, and even forgiving the derailment of losing Heath Ledger and thus not being able to use the Joker, it's a trainwreck for most of its runtime. It could not be more obvious that Jonathan Nolan wrote Begins and TDK, and Goyer wrote TDKR as Nolan transitioned to Person of Interest. TDKR has all the hallmarks of Goyer's sloppy, terrible plotting and inability to make pieces fit together or characters behave as human beings.

Let's just take the basic premise of the story:

1. So the scheme hatched to blame Batman at the end of TDK...worked. Perfectly. So instead of focusing on the hunt for the Dark Knight alluded to in the final moments of the last film, you're just gonna...jump over that? Or it didn't happen at all? Bruce just went home and never went out again? For 8 years, Gotham has had low crime and a civic hero in Harvey Dent. The only person who has a problem with this seems to be Jim Gordon. Why is this a problem? Blame the basically fictional urban legend, get better life for everyone in the city. Sure, Bane shows up but why does Batman have to, you know, dress as Batman? Just put on tactical gear and fight him under a different name, like Deathstroke or something. Who's gonna know?
2. Wait, eight years? Why is there an eight year time jump from TDK to TDKR? Nobody looks almost a decade older. Bruce has crippling knee problems eight years later from being Batman for like 10 months?
3. Why does the orphan kid ask Joseph Gordon Levitt if Batman is coming back? If crime is so much better why would anyone want Batman back? What's he going to solve? For that matter why does an 8 year old kid even know who Batman is or care? The events of TDK took place about the time this kid was born.
4. Whoops, the 8 year time skip was so JGL's character could have seen Batman as a kid and recognized his "orphan eyes" (wtf?) but now be an adult cop who can take up the mantle of the bat at the end. Goyer disrupted the entire flow of the story for this, for some reason. The 8 year skip makes zero sense in any other context.

And that's just the starting point of the plot. That doesn't get into Bane's complete lack of endgame, Talia's non-plan, the notion that Bruce Wayne would abandon his psychosis to go hang out in cafes, healing back injuries with well-placed punches, who painted the flaming batsymbol on the bridge, the clumsy way of getting Alfred out of town (maybe he painted it on his way out), the awful action choreography, Catwoman's inclusion purely as a replacement Rachel to give Bruce an arbitrary "happy" ending, and the general empty-headedness of the entire film in comparison to its predecessors.

In the long history of trilogies blowing it in the third film, TDKR is an all time champion. It's one of the biggest drops in quality from one sequel to the next in the history of film.
 

electricblue

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,991
Hathaway did fine considering she was miscast
Berry was a better fit for the character but the movie was trash
 

Pau

Self-Appointed Godmother of Bruce Wayne's Children
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,850
Considering how badly done Nolan's female characters were at the time, Hathaway's Selina Kyle could have been a lot worse. My expectations were so low that making her slightly forgettable was a more desirable outcome. But Nolan could have really should have pushed the class differences, childhood trauma, and ideologies of the three main costumed characters. Bruce, Selina, and Bane are all incredibly intelligent and talented people. One of the three just happened to be born with enough wealth to not have to worry about his survival. The other two weren't as lucky.

The other film adaptations of Catwoman aren't even an attempt at the same character, so it's hard to compare. But I agree that both actresses could have done a great job playing a character that was more true to the comic interpretation.
 

Naijaboy

The Fallen
Mar 13, 2018
15,309
What? No way that's true. Anne Hathaway's Catwoman had... well...

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Okay this is tougher than I thought. It doesn't help that both depicts are completely different.
 

Nigel Tufnel

Member
Mar 5, 2019
3,153
I like Anne Hathaway so I'd pick hers. Dark Knight Rises is a bad movie but its not nearly as bad as Catwoman.
 

blazenumb1

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
641
Probably in the minority but always preferred Hathaway to Pfeiffer and Berry. Anne at least portrays her closest(not saying a ton) to the comics, not sure what Berry was supposed to be and Pfeiffer "dies" and is pretty much a zombie/cat and doesn't really do anything. Hopefully the next Batman movie does her better justice.

Not a choice in this thread but would pick the Catwoman from Batman TAS for the best version of one so far.
 

Androidsleeps

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,597
I can't really say if Halle's Catwoman was better, but OP makes a good point. Hathaway's Catwoman in TDKR did feel like an afterthought, and I don't particularly remember her in it besides that scene in the beginning where she steals from Bruce. I do think that Hathaway, while the better actress, wasn't really the right fit for the character and was in a mediocre movie, but is being forgettable in a mediocre movie worse than being over-the-top in a notoriously comically bad movie?
 

AniHawk

No Fear, Only Math
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,164
I also don't understand thinking Pfeiffer is better as Catwoman. Is she generally a zombie in the comics, brought back to life by cats??
What does she do in the movie? Talk seductively and.....?

she's more of jekyll/hyde character. that's why it works for me. and oswald cobblepot is a gangster, not some gross sewer man. both work in the context of their movies. comic books have written and rewritten characters so much that alternate interpretations should be fine as long as they fit the world they're in. pfeiffer's take is perfectly fine in batman returns. her presence is the only reason why the retread of bruce's love story is interesting at all too.
 

J_Viper

Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,728
I hate that we never got any more Burton Batman movies.

I know the purists seem to hate them, but goddamn they were weird, fun, and had incredible art direction & music.
'89 is perfect on every way

Returns is a god damn mess, only salvaged by the actors.

I can see why WB gave Burton the boot after that one.
 

gforguava

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,705
I hate that we never got any more Burton Batman movies.

I know the purists seem to hate them, but goddamn they were weird, fun, and had incredible art direction & music.
Seriously, I love Batman and pretty much always have but 'faithfulness' or 'accuracy' or whathaveyou means absolutely nothing. When you get a movie as awesome as Batman Returns you should be thanking the filmic gods for such a bounty.
 

Strider_Blaze

Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,983
Lancaster, CA
Eh didn't feel Hatheway nailed her role as Catwoman but she was okay at best nonetheless. At least much better than what Halle Berry got! Though best Catwoman was definitely Michelle.....

Then again...

 

Cheerilee

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,969
I thought Anne opened up very strongly, playing the confused thief Bruce catches then quickly switches into Catwoman mode. Even how she makes her escape. The rest of the movie, well, she wasn't that great.

Berry's Catwoman was just weird. I mean that entire movie was weird. And why an actress of her caliber even agreed to it I'll never understand.
Actors have a really hard time trying to figure out a good movie just by reading the script. Tons of great movies have script problems, and a great script can't carry a movie by itself. A lot of it comes down to trust in the director. Do you believe the director when they say the movie's gonna be great? If you do, then you take the part. And while making the movie, actors need to do a lot of stupid and embarrassing things, which never make any sense out of context, but you just have to trust the director when he says that you need to do [X], and that he really needs this scene, and that it'll all make sense and be an artistic masterpiece once it's all put together. There's even multiple takes, where you do a scene several different times, in several different ways, and you trust the director to find and use "the good one" out of all the different versions you tried. Trust is everything in acting.

Halle Berry put herself out there, put herself in the hands of her director, and he made her look like the butt of a joke. (I don't think there's any grounds to suggest that a substandard performance on her part was what doomed the movie, because the whole movie was just plain weird. She apparently gave the director exactly what he asked for.)

Also bear in mind, prior to the Catwoman movie, the "Batman" movie franchise was considered a campy playground for Hollywood's elite. Being offered the lead role in it's female spinoff pretty much implied that Halle Berry was one of the greatest female actresses of the 2000's. Acting alongside Sharon Stone, one of the greatest female actresses of the 1990's. That looks really good, on paper. And if the script seems a little campy, and the director seems a little weird... well, that's perfectly normal for this franchise, right? Like, the most "ordinary" modern Batman movie was made by Tim Burton. Weird is what they were asking for, so weird is what you deliver.