The Boys Prime Original |OT| are back in town (Renewed for Season 3) | Aired episode spoilers! [Comic Spoilers will be thread-banned]

[dabig2]

The AOC twist is so fucking cynical and so in line with the show's ethos that I saw it coming a couple of episodes ago and hoped the show would surprise me by rising above that. They didn't.

Good finale overall with how they handled a soft reset, but this show just ain't for me.

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I'm almost here. On its own, the season was mostly a miss. Soft reboot is OK and gives them more freedom in the future, but they've got some kinks to iron out here in terms of writing and plots. Didn't enjoy the storylines nor the characters and some things got old way too fast (like the damn blackmail and CNN/MSNBC info dumps). The world itself just feels small, way too small for what this show could offer.

And yeah, discount AOC the parallel is a bit on the nose. They straight up reference a viral dancing video of the congresswoman, from Queens, and her entire message and public demeanor was run through an online AOC generator right into the script.

Kinda weird too considering all the other bad characters in the show are some sort of amalgam of a concept or a group. At best with individuals we get some 1 liners that clearly reference real world and real people, just like Supernatural and True Blood did their entire runs. Like Gus Fring here is just an image of a corporate sellout, but not clearly based on someone else - more just the idea and concept. Same goes for Nazi bitch.

But they changed it up here with the congresswoman for some reason.

Don't want to get too much into conspiracy here, but I'm happy that the fact that this is an Amazon show is not escaping some. Just saying. And considering the nonchalant cynical nature of this show, I think fans of it would appreciate a bit of (most likely and definitely true) conspiracy here.

 

[FaceHugger]

Yes, in a vacuum.

You fail to realize that for the most part she is the one politician singled out by this show as given any kind of meaningful copy and she turns out to be a terrorist killing other politicians who may work for the world's most powerful corporation.

Like, you even have to ask... why her? And the answer may be so benign from a writing POV but its optics aren't good. Like, with all the fodder of politicians out there it's her, and only her, and she's a terrorist.

There's nothing wrong with just going, "Yeah, that's a bad look". It's not like we're condemning the show to the point of boycott.

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Well the writers can't cover everyone but like Ennis did back in 2006 - 2012, he referenced what was in the mainstream back then.

Aside from doing some boring Trump or Biden allegory, AOC is going to resonate. So they created a character based on her image. Again, I don't think it goes any deeper than that. I mean we're talking about a super villain that pops heads. Obviously the departure beyond her looks and stature left a long time ago.

 

[samoyed]

I assume they wanted to try to capture the essence of the upstart young progressive politician but leaned into it a bit too hard so they would up with an expy instead of an amalgam.

 

[Lump]

It's a little weird how at least two shows this year have come out with their own discount AOCs (Space Force being the other one), just to then put the discount AOC in a bad light.

 

[Fleck0]

I need to watch this but I seriously don't remember anything from season 1 except i remember liking it. Should i rewatch it? before going with season 2

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I think a short recap, or even the one at the top of S2E1 would be enough. Like you I forget a lot besides the biggest moments from season one but I never felt out of the loop.

It's a little weird how at least two shows this year have come out with their own discount AOCs (Space Force being the other one), just to then put the discount AOC in a bad light.

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I think some of us are reading way too deep into the character being based on AOC, she's still a popular politician in the show, she a progressive icon, and she pops heads. I don't really think it's some insult, I'd be curious if she comments on it herself someday.

She's still a cool character, and I don't think we're meant to hate her in the show. Not yet at least, we don't really know her motivations, long term plans, or origin.

 

[subpar spatula]

Well the writers can't cover everyone but like Ennis did back in 2006 - 2012, he referenced what was in the mainstream back then.

Aside from doing some boring Trump or Biden allegory, AOC is going to resonate. So they created a character based on her image. Again, I don't think it goes any deeper than that. I mean we're talking about a super villain that pops heads. Obviously the departure beyond her looks and stature left a long time ago.

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It doesn't matter if their intentions were to be shallow. it's the optics. The optics. You don't seem to understand this.

Like, think of it this way: Obama didn't like Fox News. Fox News didn't like Obama. Let's say the Fox Network green lights a show where there was a stand in for Obama. He's charismatic, helpful, and genuinely good then... they make him into a behind the scenes terrorist villain. Regardless of how the creator intended it to be... it's still really weird.

 

[dabig2]

It doesn't matter if their intentions were to be shallow. it's the optics. The optics. You don't seem to understand this.

Like, think of it this way: Obama didn't like Fox News. Fox News didn't like Obama. Let's say the Fox Network green lights a show where there was a stand in for Obama. He's charismatic, helpful, and genuinely good then... they make him into a behind the scenes terrorist villain. Regardless of how the creator intended it to be... it's still really weird.

Click to shrink...

 

[FaceHugger]

It doesn't matter if their intentions were to be shallow. it's the optics. The optics. You don't seem to understand this.

Like, think of it this way: Obama didn't like Fox News. Fox News didn't like Obama. Let's say the Fox Network made a show where there was a stand in for Obama. He's charismatic, helpful, and genuinely good then... they make him into a behind the scenes terrorist villain. Regardless of how the creator intended it to be... it's still really weird.

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The optics of a satire shouldn't be taken too seriously. I get it, honestly. But again, satire. These writers are on Twitter and what not. You can ask them directly but what I am sure of is that they don't think AOC of all people is someone to be villainized.

 

[Fleck0]

It doesn't matter if their intentions were to be shallow. it's the optics. The optics. You don't seem to understand this.

Like, think of it this way: Obama didn't like Fox News. Fox News didn't like Obama. Let's say the Fox Network green lights a show where there was a stand in for Obama. He's charismatic, helpful, and genuinely good then... they make him into a behind the scenes terrorist villain. Regardless of how the creator intended it to be... it's still really weird.

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I remember when they literally made that show on Fox News. It was called Fox News anytime from 2008 to 2016.

 

[subpar spatula]

The optics of a satire shouldn't be taken too seriously. I get it, honestly. But again, satire. These writers are on Twitter and what not. You can ask them directly but what I am sure of is that they don't think AOC of all people is someone to be villainized.

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it really doesn't matter what they think. You aren't understanding this. You keep saying you are but you don't seem to be. You can make a piece and it be construed differently and accurately from what you intended.

 

[FaceHugger]

it really doesn't matter what they think. You aren't understanding this. You keep saying you are but you don't seem to be. You can make a piece and it be construed differently and accurately from what you intended.

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Please stop being so hostile about something as funny as The Boys TV show of all things.

Aside from that, as I mentioned, go ahead and ask the writers what their intentions are. It's clear to me and most viewers but if you have an issue with it ask them. I'm just some guy on a discussion forum sharing an opinion. I'm sorry we disagree but geez.

 

[Fleck0]

it really doesn't matter what they think. You aren't understanding this. You keep saying you are but you don't seem to be. You can make a piece and it be construed differently and accurately from what you intended.

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Sounds like you are worried about Trump's base taking this and running with it? Get with the times those people are too far gone and aren't really relevant outside their own bubble. Yes there are a lot of them in the US, but not even close enough to win any election on their own (save the really crazy counties, which again, are too far gone).

Just write em off, they are already angry at everything, this won't matter.

edit: This isn't the thread for this because it's becoming topical politics more than The Boys. If you're feeling real outrage then you should definitely make a new thread about this.

 

[wenis]

That was cool

 

[subpar spatula]

Please stop being so hostile about something as funny as The Boys TV show of all things.

Aside from that, as I mentioned, go ahead and ask the writers what their intentions are. It's clear to me and most viewers but if you have an issue with it ask them. I'm just some guy on a discussion forum sharing an opinion. I'm sorry we disagree but geez.

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Hostile? wtf. How was that even hostile? If you're going to try and discredit someone's point then at least have something better than that, and yes, you disagree, but if you're going to keep conversating then it's not an opinion you put out there, but one you are defending thus it's allowed to be discussed.

 

[Garble Slew]

Stormfront's power level was significantly lower than I thought. Thought she'd be a step below Homelander but clearly superior to everyone else but even Kimiko was able to draw blood which she couldn't even do to A-Train.

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Spoiler: Spoiler

Kimiko hit him so hard with a crowbar, just once, that she split the bone so hard it almost tore his leg in half. And his legs are his power. A far better example of Stormfront being underpowered is her inability to kill any of the boys despite having every opportunity to do so.

 

[Pall Mall]

The optics of a satire shouldn't be taken too seriously. I get it, honestly. But again, satire. These writers are on Twitter and what not. You can ask them directly but what I am sure of is that they don't think AOC of all people is someone to be villainized.

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I agree that the writers definitely didnt want to paint AOC herself in a bad light, but they should have known how it would look to make her parallel a head popping murderer. They shouldn't have made her an AOC parallel at all given the political nature of the show, everything else is trying to tell us something about the writer's opinions of the real world so why would it be any different with a real life figure's parallel?

Again I know that's not what the writers meant but it doesn't sit right.

 

[Vector]

If you had to guess which politician is secretly evil, AOC would be at the bottom of that list... which is why she's the ideal public facing identity for someone evil.

The whole progressive congresswoman image is the perfect ruse for Vought to secretly control their political opposition.

Maybe the show's trope of "seemingly good guys are actuality murderous assholes" is getting old but I like to be reminded that there are wolves in sheep's clothing every now and then.

 

[Pall Mall]

If you had to guess which politician is secretly evil, AOC would be at the bottom of that list... which is why she's the ideal public facing identity for someone evil.

The whole progressive congresswoman image is the perfect ruse for Vought to secretly control their political opposition.

Maybe the show's trope of "seemingly good guys are actuality murderous assholes" is getting old but I like to be reminded that there are wolves in sheep's clothing every now and then.

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See I would agree with this but then don't make her literally AOC. You can have Vought using a progressive congresswoman as a wolf in sheep's clothing but when you make it a real life person's parallel it looks more like you're saying something about the actual person.

 

[dabig2]

I think some of us are reading way too deep into the character being based on AOC, she's still a popular politician in the show, she a progressive icon, and she pops heads. I don't really think it's some insult, I'd be curious if she comments on it herself someday.

She's still a cool character, and I don't think we're meant to hate her in the show. Not yet at least, we don't really know her motivations, long term plans, or origin.

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Killed off Raynor. Murdered how many innocent people in that hearing? Both events clearly affected The Boys. Hell, after the hearing they were about to go on a supe genocide because "they attacked the country" or whatever.

She's bad, real bad. Doesn't really matter what the motivations are, she was the hidden big baddie of the season, literally popping heads to move the plot along.

And for a character like that, it's just super super weird to create an AOC clone. Damn, they even had a "Send her back" poster in the show directed at her. They basically did a 1:1. Again, the show doesn't go out of its way like that for other individuals, so it really stands out; especially with the lack of minorities as plot movers on the show in general. It stands out right now and for that it's getting called out.

I guess we'll see how far they go with it next season since Hughie landed on her campaign as a starting plot point for that season. This show is pretty self aware, so we'll see. Dangerous ground the writers are treading on though. Dangerous ground.

 

[davepoobond]

Fuck Fresca!

I didn't expect "AOC" to actually be the real head exploder, I thought it was like trolling speculation, and then it happened.

I get why people are saying she's like AOC, but she hasn't really done much in the show itself to make me think "she is AOC" — she's not exactly fighting for green new deal and all those other things. She is Probably more like a different congressman I don't know in that regard.

Everything else about her, yes, I agree, and I have to believe it was in service to throw us off scent. It did for me, at least.

I did NOT expect the leader of the church To die.

 

[Thatonedice1]

This twist with the AOC stand in gets worse and worse the more I think about it. I swear if this show goes from good (though soft gloved) critique of corporations and corporate power to being "Big government bad!" I'm dropping so hard next season. You can't have a show who's when overarching theme is "We should take a more critical look at corporate" switch to "Actually the truth threat all along was Government officials!" I'm willing to see where they take this but I'm not liking what it's hinting at atleast.

Fuck Fresca!

I didn't expect "AOC" to actually be the real head exploder, I thought it was like trolling speculation, and then it happened.

I get why people are saying she's like AOC, but she hasn't really done much in the show itself to make me think "she is AOC" — she's not exactly fighting for green new deal and all those other things. She is Probably more like a different congressman I don't know in that regard.

Everything else about her, yes, I agree, and I have to believe it was in service to throw us off scent. It did for me, at least.

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She is Hispanic, a Congress woman from Queens, is critical of corporations, and was referenced to have a video of her dancing. It seems pretty clear to me she is AOC. Like you can get much more on the nose than this.

 

[TSM]

Fuck Fresca!

I didn't expect "AOC" to actually be the real head exploder, I thought it was like trolling speculation, and then it happened.

I get why people are saying she's like AOC, but she hasn't really done much in the show itself to make me think "she is AOC" — she's not exactly fighting for green new deal and all those other things. She is Probably more like a different congressman I don't know in that regard.

Everything else about her, yes, I agree, and I have to believe it was in service to throw us off scent. It did for me, at least.

Click to shrink...

They made a character superficially like a real living person to set up preconceived ideas about her, and then they revealed her to be nothing like the real person as a plot twist. Obviously people are going to suspect the real AOC is a super powered head popper in real life now.

 

[sredgrin]

Fuck Fresca!

I didn't expect "AOC" to actually be the real head exploder, I thought it was like trolling speculation, and then it happened.

I get why people are saying she's like AOC, but she hasn't really done much in the show itself to make me think "she is AOC" — she's not exactly fighting for green new deal and all those other things. She is Probably more like a different congressman I don't know in that regard.

Everything else about her, yes, I agree, and I have to believe it was in service to throw us off scent. It did for me, at least.

I did NOT expect the leader of the church To die.

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She's not like that because she's barely a character at this point. Almost everything about her characterization we do know is lifted almost wholesale from her obvious real life inspiration, down to even having a viral dancing video Homeland pokes fun at.

 

[Vector]

This twist with the AOC stand in gets worse and worse the more I think about it. I swear if this show goes from good (though soft gloved) critique of corporations and corporate power to being "Big government bad!" I'm dropping so hard next season. You can't have a show who's when overarching theme is "We should take a more critical look at corporate" switch to "Actually the truth threat all along was Government officials!" I'm willing to see where they take this but I'm not liking what it's hinting at atleast.

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I think the message here is "Corporate corruption has gotten so out of hand that Corporations now control Government" which is a fair critique and not far off from what is happening in real life.

The issues of corporate greed/corruption and government greed/corruptiom go hand in hand.

 

[Thatonedice1]

I think the message here is "Corporate corruption has gotten so out of hand that Corporations now control Government" which is a fair critique and not far off from what is happening in real life.

The issues of corporate greed/corruption and government greed/corruptiom go hand in hand.

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No I agree with that critique and think corporate power has gotten way to out of control in real like and needs to be reigned in. What I'm saying is to make that a main theme of your show, then to create a character that is an obvious reference to a real life member of Congress that's actually fighting corporate power, into a superpowered terrorist is a pretty big slap to the face of the theme you were pushing for two seasons there.

 

[Fleck0]

They made a character superficially like a real living person to set up preconceived ideas about her, and then they revealed her to be nothing like the real person as a plot twist. Obviously people are going to suspect the real AOC is a super powered head popper in real life now.

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if Trump's head explodes this weekend Q is going to run with that I know it.

 

[JasonV]

Please stop being so hostile about something as funny as The Boys TV show of all things.

Aside from that, as I mentioned, go ahead and ask the writers what their intentions are. It's clear to me and most viewers but if you have an issue with it ask them. I'm just some guy on a discussion forum sharing an opinion. I'm sorry we disagree but geez.

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Stop being so defensive, no one is hostile here.

And dismissing critique/discussion as "hey its just a funny show" is just anti-intellectualism.

Aside from that, as I mentioned, go ahead and ask the writers what their intentions are. It's clear to me and most viewers but if you have an issue with it ask them. I'm just some guy on a discussion forum sharing an opinion. I'm sorry we disagree but geez.

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Again, your not getting it. No one cares about the creators INTENT. It is IRRELEVANT.

 

[Deleted member 14518]

Quite obviously an AOC stand-in.

I can see this going two ways, they poke fun at the insane right-wing conspiracy about AOC or they go both sides on this and retro-actively fuckup and say well both sides think crazy things about the other.

EDIt: For the record I think it was a mistake to use an AOC-alike character for this. For so many reasons.

 

[FaceHugger]

Stop being so defensive, no one is hostile here.

And dismissing critique/discussion as "hey its just a funny show" is just anti-intellectualism.

Again, your not getting it. No one cares about the creators INTENT. It is IRRELEVANT.

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Please stop with the aggression. This is clearly your alt. You can't even type out "you're" correctly.

 

[JasonV]

You can't even type out "you're" correctly.

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Amazing.

Aggressively ungrammatical.

 

[Pall Mall]

Jeez what is this thread coming to. I don't think anyone is trying to be hostile y'all, there's no need to start jabbing and accusing people of being alts...

 

[BossAttack]

The final shot of the season is good natured Hughie volunteering for a job with Congressman Neuman because he believes in her and what she stands for. As she closes the door on the audience, we pan out to far-left posters advocating for corporate oversight and the takedown of Vought. Meanwhile, other posters reveal she represents Queens, NY as part of her district to real drive the point home.

And, we the audience react with dread as Hughie unknowingly signs up to work for a supervillain whose likely in cahoots with Vought and is responsible for the personal murder of dozens of innocent people, including her own Chief of Staff.

Y'all watch all that and are like, "nah, the optics are fine. Whose AOC? Stop being so sensitive."

Brehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh............

 

[dabig2]

They made a character superficially like a real living person to set up preconceived ideas about her, and then they revealed her to be nothing like the real person as a plot twist. Obviously people are going to suspect the real AOC is a super powered head popper in real life now.

Click to shrink...

It's not as basic as that, because humans aren't as basic as that.

It's more that this young, rising minority woman in politics, who gets some historic undue hate despite being in politics for a whole 2 years, is actually a duplicitous lying bitch of a villain with ulterior motives. AKA what the real AOC has had to fight against for the last 2 years among real death threats and attempts on her life.

So when a very self-conscious and self-aware show with a 1:1 version of the real AOC, at least in terms of her public face which is all we know about AOC anyways, decides to then show her as some Aizen smirking villain - well, it comes off as reinforcement of some toxic beliefs and ideas surrounding the real one. Don't know if intentional or not (and don't really care), but again, that Amazon factor here will always make it extra weird.

Related: the fact that the 2 minorities on the show that represent power - that move the plot with their own motivations and resources - happen to be the baddies is also kinda off in a show dominated by white people.

This thread from last month gets at some of the issues that were apparent, and for me it only got worse as the season went on:

I love The Boys, but what the fuck is up with the Arab portrayal? *spoilers*

This is how your people have been portrayed, so that Americans can be on board and not give much thought when our government oppresses your people overseas and illegally spies on them within our borders. It's a media psyop.

www.resetera.com

 

[Pall Mall]

The final shot of the season is good natured Hughie volunteering for a job with Congressman Neuman because he believes in her and what she stands for. As she closes the door on the audience, we pan out to far-left posters advocating for corporate oversight and the takedown of Vought. Meanwhile, other posters reveal she represents Queens, NY as part of her district to real drive the point home.

And, we the audience react with dread as Hughie unknowingly signs up to work for a supervillain whose likely in cahoots with Vought and is repsonsible for the personal murder of dozens of innocent people, including her own Chief of Staff.

Y'all watch all that and are like, "nah, the optics are fine. Whose AOC? Stop being so sensitive."

Brehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh............

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It's so ridiculous because it would be just fine if they didn't LITERALLY make her AOC. There's a way to pull this off right and I don't think they did it.

 

[Lotus]

It's so ridiculous because it would be just fine if they didn't LITERALLY make her AOC. There's a way to pull this off right and I don't think they did it.

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Agreed

 

[BossAttack]

It's so ridiculous because it would be just fine if they didn't LITERALLY make her AOC. There's a way to pull this off right and I don't think they did it.

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Even if she wasn't an AOC stand-in, I would be side-eyeing such a turn because essentially the show is saying, "hey, you know those far-left liberals that are fighting against crony corporate capitalism? Well, you're a sucker if you think they actually believe that. They're actually in it with the corporations (#S O R O S)." It veers real close to "both-sides" territory. The AOC stand-in just pushes it over the edge.

 

[Fleck0]

The final shot of the season is good natured Hughie volunteering for a job with Congressman Neuman because he believes in her and what she stands for. As she closes the door on the audience, we pan out to far-left posters advocating for corporate oversight and the takedown of Vought. Meanwhile, other posters reveal she represents Queens, NY as part of her district to real drive the point home.

And, we the audience react with dread as Hughie unknowingly signs up to work for a supervillain whose likely in cahoots with Vought and is responsible for the personal murder of dozens of innocent people, including her own Chief of Staff.

Y'all watch all that and are like, "nah, the optics are fine. Whose AOC? Stop being so sensitive."

Brehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh............

Click to shrink...

Will The Boys (a superhero show on Amazon!) take down AOC's entire political career!? It's the most popular progressive house member in the entire congress VS. 2 years of upcoming internet forum speculation!

Tune in Next Season to Find Out!

 

[JDSN]

I just can't grasp the atempts to gaslight folks into thinking this is not a Greg Land-tier copy of AOC while refering to her as "AOC".

If people are only interested in Butcher being alpha as fuck let them be, but if people wanna talk about the implication of an antiestablishment PoC politician having an evil tv doppelganger in a
show produced by a company she went up against, then fucking let them, otherwise you might sound like the people that say all those nazis are just continuosly expressing that they are "ok".

 

[Disco]

Antony Starr always looked a bit unhinged in Banshee but they really flex his psychotic stare in this show. That scene when he walked into the cabin to greet that strike team was terrifying. Dude is a fantastic villain.

 

[Fleck0]

more out of character stuff

 

[Salty Rice]

Has Claudia Doumit and Eric Kripke talking about Neumann and what Season 3 is going to be about.

 

[The Silver]

When I saw Stormie in that fucked up state all I could think of was Strohiem from Jojo. She's gonna return as a cyborg nazi.

Stormie getting the dogshit beat out of her by the girls was great, damn that was good.

 

[Razmos]

I'm still thinking how Queen Maeve was having none of that nazi shit as soon as the news dropped. Damn.

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I like it because Maeve gave up on being a hero, and then she gets given a literal Nazi to punch to convince her

 

[caliph95]

When I saw Stormie in that fucked up state all I could think of was Strohiem from Jojo. She's gonna return as a cyborg nazi.

Stormie getting the dogshit beat out of her by the girls was great, damn that was good.

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Except it's not going to end with Stormfront walking out with Hughie saying she maybe a nazi but she was a good Nazi *American salute* after she saved them from Mega Homelander who was her fault

 

[Mariolee]

I loved that finale. I also cringed though that the reveal was the AOC character, but so far the writing hasn't let me down. I wanna see what they do with this next season before I judge too quickly. I do like them revealing the person you least expect to be the head-popper to be a progressive person but agree with the sentiment that I wish it wasn't someone who was exactly AOC.

 

[Ravelle]

Antony Starr always looked a bit unhinged in Banshee but they really flex his psychotic stare in this show. That scene when he walked into the cabin to greet that strike team was terrifying. Dude is a fantastic villain.

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He's such a damn good actor, he's able to act and express without saying anything and just using his face.

 

[Nooblet]

Why is starlight vulnerable to stormfront when her power relies on draining electricity?

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Stormfront's power is not electricity, it's plasma...which is the highest energy state of matter. So think of it as a tier above what Starlight can control. Or just go with it because writers thought to make it so.

 

[JasonV]

He's such a damn good actor, he's able to act and express without saying anything and just using his face.

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He is absolutely amazing. From being manic to baffled to I don't know what.

Like look at his reaction to seeing the video when he accidently kills that boy, to walking in on Vought security; all with no dialogue. Just crazy.

 

[Idde]

Wow. So many people in here already knowing what sort of character Neuman is (gonna be). We've seen her on the show for a total of what...five minutes altogether? We have no clue what her objectives are, or her motivations. And one of the main things of this show is that it's pretty much impossible to come to completely clear cut ideas of how 'good' or how 'bad' a character is.

I get the frustration, and when theories came up two episodes ago that Neuman was the head popper I also thought: nah, a liberal show like this wouldn't make someone with such a liberal real life analogue into a murderer...And I also think they shouldn't have.

But you know...lets just wait and see where the character goes?

 

[JasonV]

And one of the main things of this show is that it's pretty much impossible to come to completely clear cut ideas of how 'good' or how 'bad' a character is.

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I think we all have a pretty clear cut idea about Stormfront.