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The Big House Online C&D'd by Nintendo; Event Cancelled
- Thread starter Soulflarz
- Start date
To the first: Because their IPs are what make them money, not investing in tournament scenes. The vast majority of the 23 million + people who have purchased Smash Bros Ultimate have never once set eyes on a Smash tourney, let alone a melee tourney specifically. It's not like with Capcom or NRS where a strong minority of the consumer base for their fighting games are tourney players or viewers and, thus, it behooves them to invest in the scene. The fact that they're playing a 20 year old game is even more reason for then to not care about the scene, but the IP. They don't make a thin red cent off of copies of Melee anymore, but playing it with Slippi means it's not the game disk but a copy of an ISO and that's gonna draw attention eventually.
To the second: To begin with, they're a corporation. There's no such thing as the "good guys". People need to stop expecting them to be their friends. The majority of consumers aren't affected by this. Pointing back to the ISO thing for a moment, the people playing in the Melee tournament are, by definition, not consumers of that Nintendo product. But in terms of actual anti-consumer practices like predatory loot boxes or and such? Yeah, they're a shitton better than a lot of their competitors.
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User Warned: Drive-By Posting
edit: made a bad hot take. Going to leave before I embarrass myself any further. Sorry for the discourse.
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No one actually calls them pro-consumer.
they've always been labeled on the other side more often
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ok my facebook ad after talking about slippi and the legalities of emulation for the past hour definitely made me laugh
Hbox is pretty hated within the actual tournament community, for what it's worth. Not really a nice guy and has done a LOT of bad things. Doesn't make the crab right, but giving some context at least.
edit: can people stop coming into here to go fuck smash with no actual context to the situation? It's obnoxious as hell to just go "lol well smashers ARE shit people as a whole so they deserve this!"
Hbox is pretty hated within the actual tournament community, for what it's worth. Not really a nice guy and has done a LOT of bad things. Doesn't make the crab right, but giving some context at least.
edit: can people stop coming into here to go fuck smash with no actual context to the situation? It's obnoxious as hell to just go "lol well smashers ARE shit people as a whole so they deserve this!"
Yeah not very bright. Nintendo brought the hammer down, but the organizers refused to move despite the warning. They could have had Ultimate...
Big House is a Melee tournament since it's inception. No way they would have dropped Melee and ran Ultimate only.
Interesting how you say "fans' when one person threw a crab at Hbox at an event. They were promptly banned from all smash tournaments. Hbox is now campaigning along with the community for Nintendo to reverse their decision.
fuck outta here with your trolling
No one actually calls them pro-consumer.
they've always been labeled on the other side more often
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Yup, Nintendo is definitely the most anti-consumer™ of the big three... I don't know how would anyone call them even slightly pro-consumer.
they've always been labeled on the other side more often
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Yup, Nintendo is definitely the most anti-consumer™ of the big three... I don't know how would anyone call them even slightly pro-consumer.
Nobody is stopping them. If they are serious they should stand their ground. Broadcast anyway. If they get sued, face legal action, and have to deplete their savings in a court case so be it. Sometimes you should stand up for your rights.
If they end up doing jail time we will all applaud them as heroes.
If they end up doing jail time we will all applaud them as heroes.
That's the dumbest idea I've seen regarding this issue. Have the TOs bankrupt themselves all for some internet clout.
Nintendo would just go after them on copyright grounds and probably win unless they manage to set a fair use precedent that affects the entire industry. The Slippi/Anther's Ladder devs are the ones that should be willing to fight, but I think Nintendo is smart enough to not do that.
Easy for people to say dumb shit like "other people should stop being cowards and sacrifice and lose everything."
I don't think ANYONE would accept losing everything and going to jail so some internet randos can think they're cool, wtf
How is it not bright of them to take a stand for a game they believe in?
I'm not saying for internet clout. If they truly believe they are in the right. They should stand up for themselves and fight it even if the repercussions are severe.
All I am saying is they feel they are in the right. If they do, they should stand up for their rights and fight it. Even if they lose everything, you can't put a price on your or principles is all I am saying.
These people would literally be in financial ruin that they likely could not recover from for this. Right or wrong doesn't matter here, the financial resources to prove it do.
I think they should take it as far as they can until they can no longer afford to fight it. Setup a patreon and ask for help. People have lost their lives for their principles. I think they should proceed and if ruin comes, so be it.
Pretty sure most of the time they are called that because people misuse the term and believe it means "they did something i don't like"
The right to host a video game event is not worth the ruination of one's life and the loss of one's rights. Which is what happens when you go to jail, and even after you are released. You lose your rights.
This isn't Nintendo taking away someone's citizenship, or family, or right to vote. It's a fucking video game event.
Financial ruin isn't something you can just shrug off and move on from, lmao. Can't believe people expect others to ruin their lives as if it's nothing from the safety of your room, lmao. You can't say "I think they should sacrifice everything, if they lose everything so be it." How about YOU sacrifice everything?
People all over twitch are also getting banned for streaming Age of Calamity right now.
Even for it being out in Japan and Australia. Heck, even an japanese Streamer got banned.
The fuck is going on Nintendo?
Even for it being out in Japan and Australia. Heck, even an japanese Streamer got banned.
The fuck is going on Nintendo?
"Nintendo has every right to defend their IPs and properties, and to make decisions relevant to their business"
"WHY IS COMPANY XYZ SO ANTI-CONSUMER?"
Again, just because Nintendo has right legally doesn't mean it's the right decision to make, but who am I kidding, people will continue to side with Nintendo on this one regardless of their opinions on the subject in any other case.
"WHY IS COMPANY XYZ SO ANTI-CONSUMER?"
Again, just because Nintendo has right legally doesn't mean it's the right decision to make, but who am I kidding, people will continue to side with Nintendo on this one regardless of their opinions on the subject in any other case.
Ah Nintendo made a statement. And it makes sense. This was never about slippi being a mod or whatever. It was always about emulation which is a thorn in Nintendo's side. Sure, you technically can make completely legal copies of games and play them on emulators but realistically, how many people are gonna do that? So I can totally understand why Nintendo is not okay with this.
Sucks but they didn't take Slippi down or anything, so online play is gonna continue just fine.
Sucks but they didn't take Slippi down or anything, so online play is gonna continue just fine.
I mean, there is legal precedent that allows consumers to backup games they've purchased. They just released a statement saying that emulators require use of illegally copied games. To me, that's pretty clearly "anti-consumer".
Potential workaround idea: Run the tournament offline and just put out the replay files + audio commentary. Someone could build a better replay viewer into Slippi that syncs the audio and everyone can watch at their leisure.
No one thinks the TOs are ultimately in the right. They are in their rights to use the emulator, but at the end of the day Nintendo can treat them like any other streamer.
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Because courts have pretty much said they're in the wrong for 20yr so they have no place calling it criminal activity other than to put stigma on it.
Selling a product with a latent defect for 4 years do seem very anti-consumer to me and not a case of "they did something I don't like".
I genuinely don't get how someone can defend Nintendo in this situation. Not only is it stupid to do this in the first place, getring mad at people playing a game online in the middle of a pandemic is genuinely scummy lmao
I know emulation itself is legal. I'm saying that most people don't use emulation in the legal way and thus it makes sense that Nintendo takes issue with it.
Anyone who's been around for a while has known that Nintendo's never wanted Melee around for the past decade. Nor do they want any modifications to their software, period. Same thing happened with Project M. This is nothing new nor surprising.
They sponsor GDQ and GDQ doesn't profit off of their software so most likely not.
They sponsor GDQ and GDQ doesn't profit off of their software so most likely not.
That is why i said most of the time, most people here call anti-consumer anything they dislike when a company does it
But Slippi is not a modification to their software, as is stated in the OP and many times in this thread. They just released a statement that effectively said emulation is illegal, which has frustrated many as there is legal precedent to support the contrary.
You gonna fight them in court? Be my guest.
It's shitty. But ultimately no one's going to do anything. There'll be some complaining and hashtags for a few weeks then everyone's still gonna buy a Switch and whatever big new game drops.
Edit: Copyright lawyer and FGC commentator Ultradavid claims it's within Nintendo's rights to do this, despite being shitty.
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I get what you're saying but unless as a company you want to die on the hill everyone using slippis a pirate, thats a trash corporate stance >_>
No - I'm confused as to where you got the idea that I was interested in that. I'm simply pointing out that this is different, and more anti-consumer, than something like disallowing a mod like Project M.
As for the UltraDavid thing, he's 100% right about shutting down the tournament. They could have just said "We don't like this" and as the IP holder that would be legal haha (I think?).
They used to sponsor TBH, the only reason that tourney was going to be online is covid.
Melee community doesn't really profit either, it's break even at best.
I could see GDQ getting grandfathered in, *maybe*, but that's entirely inconsistent with their public arguments. Slippi is an emulator mod, not a rom hack. When they go after melee+slippi the "legal" argument is that emulation is what they have a problem with.
As noted elsewhere, the legal basis for streaming games is so shaky (and so poorly defended -- nobody has stepped up) that it's probably within their legal right to shut down any stream for literally any reason, frivolous or no
I can sort of see how it's connected like spider webs. It's not even a hard reach with anything emulation related, even if it's emulating the network functionality using Nintendo assets.
Probably better as a new thread, since it's unrelated to the Big House.
