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Deleted member 8257

Oct 26, 2017
24,586
Serkis is fine in his 5 mins of screen time, lol. He is simply not present enough to even complain about. Miscast? What choices did he make in his whopping THREE SCENES that were so off putting? Leave gollum alone 🤣

I look forward to his expansion in the next film. He certainly seems like he's got an interesting past.

Pattinson
Farrell
Kravitz
Wright
Tuturro
Dano

are my performance rankings
I'm not sure! He just seemed out of place as Butler of Wayne Manor and yeah he had very small screen time. I did like the fact that he is more actively involved in the investigations.

I would put Colin Farrell as #1. Dude deserves an Oscar nom for that performance.
 

OSHAN

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,931
Why would it be after that? Usually Europe gets releases after US.

I was thinking about Dune, which came out Dec 9th in Italy, and January 11th in NA. Suicide Squad was a week earlier in Italy. MK was a week earlier in Italy. But, Conjuring and Matrix were separated by just two days. I would expect the US release to be between June 30th and mid-July.
 

Speevy

Member
Oct 26, 2017
19,327
Dano's problem isn't how he acts, but how they buried his performance with that mask. His psychotic manchild persona such as you see in 12 Years A Slave is actually perfect for a serial killer.
 

UltraMagnus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,670
It's more effective in THE BATMAN because it's the central focus of the narrative. Bruce has this epiphany early in BATMAN BEGINS (first 30 mins) and does most of the work off screen. By the time he links up with Alfred he's already come to where Battinson is at the end of THE BATMAN. This is solely a difference in narrative and thematic focuses.

Debatable if it's more effective. In The Batman it just feels sorta ... tacked on at the end by voice narration once the action scene is over (albiet it's a nice overhead visual).

In BB, he learns not only that vengance can't be the sole purpose of the Batman but on top of that he grows into the legacy of the Wayne family (we are told earlier generation Waynes smuggled slaves out to Canada I presume? His father built an affordable public transport system among other civic responsibilities). So it's kinda more emotional when Bruce finally grows into the legacy his family has left him.
 

Tuorom

Member
Oct 30, 2017
10,907
I felt like Batman Begins already did all this in 2005 though. Bruce wants revenge on Joe Chill and Maroni, but Rachel slaps him upside the head (literally) and shows him the uglier side of Gotham where society has been left to rot. Rhas Al Ghul tries to immerse Bruce into becoming a ruthless, vengance driven acolyte but eventually Bruce sees the error in this too. And by the end he understands being Batman is about more than just avenging his parents death, it's about giving oneself to Gotham in service and the fulfillment of the Wayne family name being a hopeful beacon for the community.
Yea they did focus the movie around that ideal of Batman in Begins but I don't think it as effectively explores this idea of masculine purpose being false but rather reinforces it. Nolan's movies are all about the purpose of Batman being a lone fighter for some grand ambition, the essence of hollywood heroism. I don't recall at any point Batman really interacts with people, like the citizens? He saves Joffrey, he gives a kid a tool, uhhh...I think that's it lol. He is completely isolated, his goal is to die for the city in dramatic fashion to create a legend, and yet you don't really get a sense he is really a part of the city like in The Batman. Nolan is much more focused on heroic ideals, a broader scope which is why his villains get a lot of screen time to help explore Batman and the ideals that drive him.

What The Batman does is juxtapose his reputation with the citizenry in a way to show that this grand ambition cannot be reached without being an active part of the community he serves and we see that in a few ways whether he is Bruce or Batman. I think more to the videos point, you can't just beat up on bad guys toward a goal like removing all crime and spout a line of philosophy to define your purpose. The heroic masculine purpose should be to become a readily available resource, accountable to all, and where every service no matter how small is treated as virtuous, rather it is in fact in those small acts that show your virtue. And we get that arc from him being an isolated beacon of terror to all, to him choosing to be accountable and in service to all (as Bruce and Batman). He (presumably) chooses to be the Prince of Gotham to be of service where before he was negligent and favoured his grander and selfish purpose (of using his mask to hide his pain, hello watchmen). And this villain is directly related to Batman's relationship with the citizens whereas Nolan used his villains as a relation to Batman's ideals. You can see how the framing is much different in The Batman.
 

UltraMagnus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,670
Yea they did focus the movie around that ideal of Batman in Begins but I don't think it as effectively explores this idea of masculine purpose being false but rather reinforces it. Nolan's movies are all about the purpose of Batman being a lone fighter for some grand ambition, the essence of hollywood heroism. I don't recall at any point Batman really interacts with people, like the citizens? He saves Joffrey, he gives a kid a tool, uhhh...I think that's it lol. He is completely isolated, his goal is to die for the city in dramatic fashion to create a legend, and yet you don't really get a sense he is really a part of the city like in The Batman. Nolan is much more focused on heroic ideals, a broader scope which is why his villains get a lot of screen time to help explore Batman and the ideals that drive him.

What The Batman does is juxtapose his reputation with the citizenry in a way to show that this grand ambition cannot be reached without being an active part of the community he serves and we see that in a few ways whether he is Bruce or Batman. I think more to the videos point, you can't just beat up on bad guys toward a goal like removing all crime and spout a line of philosophy to define your purpose. The heroic masculine purpose should be to become a readily available resource, accountable to all, and where every service no matter how small is treated as virtuous, rather it is in fact in those small acts that show your virtue. And we get that arc from him being an isolated beacon of terror to all, to him choosing to be accountable and in service to all (as Bruce and Batman). He (presumably) chooses to be the Prince of Gotham to be of service where before he was negligent and favoured his grander and selfish purpose (of using his mask to hide his pain, hello watchmen). And this villain is directly related to Batman's relationship with the citizens whereas Nolan used his villains as a relation to Batman's ideals. You can see how the framing is much different in The Batman.

Batman doesn't really interface with regular citizens much at all in either film to be honest, in the Batman it's kinda added to the end but obviously any version of Batman would go over and help the mayor and trapped people out, lol, you'd have to be a total asshole Batman to just leave them there heh.

I don't think Adam West or Michael Keaton or Val Kilmer's Batman would just leave those people so I don't know if it's really remarkable that this version of Batman does that, it's kind of implied in his overall mandate that helping Gotham has to involve helping people. It's maybe different in this movie because this version of Batman is probably the only version of Batman that needs to learn to understand this, all the other versions of Batman kind of already all know this already or very early on.
 

Tuorom

Member
Oct 30, 2017
10,907
Batman doesn't really interface with regular citizens much at all in either film to be honest, in the Batman it's kinda added to end but obviously any version of Batman would go over and help the mayor and trapped people out, lol, you'd have to be a total asshole Batman to just leave them there heh.
Qxhr.gif
 

Lifejumper

Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,277
Batman doesn't really interface with regular citizens much at all in either film to be honest, in the Batman it's kinda added to the end but obviously any version of Batman would go over and help the mayor and trapped people out, lol, you'd have to be a total asshole Batman to just leave them there heh.

I don't think Adam West or Michael Keaton or Val Kilmer's Batman would just leave those people so I don't know if it's really remarkable that this version of Batman does that, it's kind of implied in his overall mandate that helping Gotham has to involve helping people. It's maybe different in this movie because this version of Batman is probably the only version of Batman that needs to learn to understand this, all the other versions of Batman kind of already all know this already or very early on.

I mean the focus of that scene in the third act is to show regular Gotham citizens trusting Batman after being scared shitless. He literally steps into the light and monologues that vengeance is not the answer.

I doubt the intention of that scene is to make you doubt or be surprised that bats would save those peeps.
 
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ShutterMunster

Art Manager
Verified
Oct 27, 2017
2,450
Debatable if it's more effective. In The Batman it just feels sorta ... tacked on at the end by voice narration once the action scene is over (albiet it's a nice overhead visual).

In BB, he learns not only that vengance can't be the sole purpose of the Batman but on top of that he grows into the legacy of the Wayne family (we are told earlier generation Waynes smuggled slaves out to Canada I presume? His father built an affordable public transport system among other civic responsibilities). So it's kinda more emotional when Bruce finally grows into the legacy his family has left him.

It's not tacked on at the end, he's coming to this conclusion throughout the entire film. He's emotionally stunted and his bloodlust causes him to miss clues, misjudge people, and ultimately fail to save countless lives. He starts the movie suicidal and ends with a new focus and approach for making positive change with his life. Batman/Bruce growth is the core focus of the movie and Bruce's evolution is more drastic than it is in Begins.

Bruce ultimately never grows into some star philanthropist in the Nolan movies. As Bruce Wayne he's almost always billionaire bozo. His charity efforts play a bigger role in TDKR because they're meant to showcase how reclusive he's become.
 

Solo

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
15,744
If this movie can do a 40% drop this weekend it'll sail past $300M domestically. I think $400M is an absolute lock.
 

Smokey_Run

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
4,630
This is a trip... I've seen it twice but getting an itch to see it again lol
Same boat. Last weekend I got a friend to go, but I kinda wanna see it again. I wish I had a good theater, projection wise, around me. I will say I went to the same theater the second time, but a different theater number and the projection was noticeably better but still not great.
 

Geido

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,097
Just saw it and was blown away. The movie falters a bit at the end imo, but the road there was great.

Also I want to go clubbing at the Iceberg Lounge.
 
Oct 25, 2017
29,446
I'm not sure! He just seemed out of place as Butler of Wayne Manor and yeah he had very small screen time. I did like the fact that he is more actively involved in the investigations.

I would put Colin Farrell as #1. Dude deserves an Oscar nom for that performance.
Alfred isn't really a true butler these days, he's more like a bodyguard/driver/assistant to the Wayne's thats legitimately former SAS
he's like Earth One and the Gotham version


 
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Jroc

Banned
Jun 9, 2018
6,145
The only thing I didn't really like was the soundtrack. The main melody sounded like a 1940s funeral song or something. I get that they were going for a dark noir style mood, but part of me missed the "hype" factor of the Hanz Zimmer music when the action was picking up.

Great movie that could have been a bit shorter.
 

HommePomme

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,052
Thought the movie was all around great, definitely a stunner but maybe a tad long and had a couple dumb parts like
did anyone else find the first "Drive" cypher stupid as hell? Like it was supposed to be clever that it's actually only using the given letters when that's exactly what you'd do at the very start when trying to solve it? How did Alfred not write in those letters and immediately see the solution before going off and trying to guess the double vowels etc? And then the riddle just pointed to his garage that the cops definitely should have swept and found the punctured tire… somehow that soured me for a few minutes while watching
 

Hoggle

Member
Mar 25, 2021
6,109
I need that HDR copy asap.

Movie was clearly made to be an HDR show piece. Like, it might be the best to date if they do the HDR correctly. So many dark scenes with single sources of light. Flash lights, cop car lights, street lights, and so on. It really is positioned to be a perfect purchase for anyone looking to show off or really enjoy their new HDR TV or monitor.

I do hope they're careful with HDR though. I love blinding HDR and a single light source on a black background, but I've watched a few dark films lately with single HDR light sources that do nothing but draws my attention away from the scene.

For example, watching The Matrix Resurrections the other night you have a black actor talking at camera with a very dark background…and a 1000nit light bulb in the very top left of the scene. All that lightbulb did was blind me to Morpheus' actor and his performance.

So hopefully plenty of contrast and bright lights without taking away from the scene.
 

effzee

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,172
NJ
Debatable if it's more effective. In The Batman it just feels sorta ... tacked on at the end by voice narration once the action scene is over (albiet it's a nice overhead visual).

In BB, he learns not only that vengance can't be the sole purpose of the Batman but on top of that he grows into the legacy of the Wayne family (we are told earlier generation Waynes smuggled slaves out to Canada I presume? His father built an affordable public transport system among other civic responsibilities). So it's kinda more emotional when Bruce finally grows into the legacy his family has left him.

Yeah same here. I think both movies achieve the same goal/arc but in a different way. Up to the audience to decide which method they prefer.

He's also suicidal hell bent on revenge emo Bruce at the start the movie, or rather in the flashbacks. He learns that's not the right way with the help of Rachael and then his time away while training. The one point that always jumps out to me is when he is talking to Ras and mentions that he learns the difference between a petty thief and criminals. Or how or why someone steals.

The same thing this new Bruce learns AFTER he has already become Batman, is what Bale's Bruce learns while training to ultimately become Batman. I think both movies do it super effectively, but I give the edge to Begins. The first 50-60 minutes of that is still untouched.
 

Tavernade

Tavernade
Moderator
Sep 18, 2018
8,623
Thought the movie was all around great, definitely a stunner but maybe a tad long and had a couple dumb parts like
did anyone else find the first "Drive" cypher stupid as hell? Like it was supposed to be clever that it's actually only using the given letters when that's exactly what you'd do at the very start when trying to solve it? How did Alfred not write in those letters and immediately see the solution before going off and trying to guess the double vowels etc? And then the riddle just pointed to his garage that the cops definitely should have swept and found the punctured tire… somehow that soured me for a few minutes while watching

I found the riddles to be the weakest part of the film, to be honest. They were all either too vague or too obvious. The carpet tool one was fun, though.
 

Jroc

Banned
Jun 9, 2018
6,145
Just got out of my viewing and I can't shake this feeling of...indifference? I just had this overwhelming feeling of "yup, that was a Batman film". But it never really jumped above that; like I'd already seen it before? That and I found Pattinsons performance a little safe? I dunno, I think it's just not vibing with me. Will rewatch when it hits streaming services.

I appreciated the more detective-forward approach to the story though. Very Seven/Saw-esque in some of it's execution.

To me it felt like what I'd expect from a Batman TV show. Lots of plot, lots of detective work, not as much action, slower pace. Nolan Batman movies felt like these big, epic sagas whereas this one felt like it was just one Batman story in a sea of future Batman stories. Reminds me a bit of a comic book story arch where you know there are going to be dozens of more issues.
 

obeast

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
559
I saw this last weekend without much in the way of expectations, and thought it was shockingly good, probably the best Batman movie ever made. There's nothing in it quite as transcendent as Heath Ledger's joker, but the directing/cinematography/soundtrack/set design are all just dazzling, and fit the grim, twisting narrative perfectly. There's nothing wrong with the Nolan movies in any of those departments, and the Dark Knight is justly revered, but none of them fit the pieces together as well or as with much flair (and the Nolan movies have consistent plotting problems and shoddy dialogue that drive me mad, particularly on repeat viewings). There are some pretty incredible shots in this movie.

Pattinson's Bruce Wayne is pretty bland, but he's barely on screen, and he's more expressive and interesting as Batman than Keaton/Bale. And Zoe Kravitz has this "I'm-a-movie-star" energy that fits the movie perfectly, and saves it from being overly grim.
 
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Astral

Member
Oct 27, 2017
28,055
I recently rewatched the Nolan duology and can confirm to myself that this movie blows Begins out of the water. But I think TDK might still be unmatched.
 

ThatCrazyGuy

Member
Nov 27, 2017
9,848
I re-watched the Nolan trilogy this past week. I have a lot of thoughts. The big thing that annoys me is Bales Batman voice, especially going back from how Pattinson does it. And it gets worse each movie.

And I like The Batman cowl so much better.
 

Darkwing-Buck

Member
Oct 25, 2017
28,353
Los Angeles, CA
Yeah, Begins first half is still kino. Literally perfect pacing especially for a cape movie but it falls off for me now in the second half with how bad the action is and that suit looking goofy.
 

SweetBellic

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,408
The only thing I didn't really like was the soundtrack. The main melody sounded like a 1940s funeral song or something. I get that they were going for a dark noir style mood, but part of me missed the "hype" factor of the Hanz Zimmer music when the action was picking up.

Great movie that could have been a bit shorter.
I could've done without the Nirvana, but I felt the opposite about the OST in that I liked how there was actually an identifiable motif. The Zimmer stuff isn't bad by any stretch, particularly for invoking urgency, but it's a lot more forgettable to me and a lot harder to hum or whistle along to.
 

Theecliff

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,000
it was a bit messy at times (and i wasn't fully convinced on The Riddler) but i really liked it, and definitely appreciated the central arc of Batman realising that his 'vengeance' brooding was actually harming the city more than helping it.

also, i am very, very excited for the 4K release. all the way through this i was thinking to myself holy shit this is going to look gorgeous on an OLED.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
29,446
I re-watched the Nolan trilogy this past week. I have a lot of thoughts. The big thing that annoys me is Bales Batman voice, especially going back from how Pattinson does it. And it gets worse each movie.

And I like The Batman cowl so much better.
The Nolan cowls are just awful
6s436qw9xow41.jpg

Almost feel had the opening been a significantly bigger cut and a different shape it could save them though
 

Tuorom

Member
Oct 30, 2017
10,907
the batmobil destroyed me

whole cinema shook like crazy when batman started the engine



youtu.be

Why THE BATMAN is so beautiful. | A Cinematography Video Essay

#thebatman #film #videoessayDirector Matt Reeves and cinematographer Greig Fraser have created an immersive world draped in darkness and mystery that makes m...
so_good.jpg


The only thing I didn't really like was the soundtrack. The main melody sounded like a 1940s funeral song or something. I get that they were going for a dark noir style mood, but part of me missed the "hype" factor of the Hanz Zimmer music when the action was picking up.
Listen to both Batman and Catwoman themes, they are tremendous on their own.

www.youtube.com

The Batman | Michael Giacchino | WaterTower

The Batman - by Michael Giacchino | From The Batman SoundtrackAvailable now: https://lnk.to/TheBatmanIDListen to more from The Batman:https://www.youtube.co...

www.youtube.com

The Batman Official Soundtrack | Catwoman - Michael Giacchino | WaterTower

Catwoman - by Michael Giacchino | From The Batman SoundtrackAvailable now: https://lnk.to/TheBatmanIDListen to more from The Batman:https://www.youtube.com/p...
 

Solo

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
15,744
The score is awesome but sneakily so. I didn't like it at all the first time I saw the movie nor on my first isolated listen. Now after several viewings and listens, it's the bomb.