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Tell Me Why announced, developed by DONTNOD and releasing Summer 2020 for Xbox & PC (published by Xbox Game Studios)

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Garlador

Garlador

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
14,131
xeecee said:
"major" is a pretty narrow goalpost here. There are oodles of indie games starring trans characters made by trans people.
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I think that's the difference though (not to besmirch indie games).

This is a major title published by Microsoft as an exclusive with a lot of money and lots of development talent behind it.

It's kind of the same reason Black Panther was a big deal for the MCU. Did black superheroes exist on the big screen before? Yeah, of course. But there was always caveats before - usually not in a leading role (Falcon, Rhodey, Cyborg, etc.), or they were R-rated (Blade) or they were... whatever Blank Man and Meteor Man were, etc.

This is a HUGE deal for the entire gaming industry because people do look to companies like Microsoft and what they invest in and promote, so having Microsoft and Dontnod do this game and have a major trans hero right there on the front of the box is a massive thing.
 
dodo

dodo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,997
Garlador said:
I think that's the difference though (not to besmirch indie games).

This is a major title published by Microsoft as an exclusive with a lot of money and lots of development talent behind it.

It's kind of the same reason Black Panther was a big deal for the MCU. Did black superheroes exist on the big screen before? Yeah, of course. But there was always caveats before - usually not in a leading role (Falcon, Rhodey, Cyborg, etc.), or they were R-rated (Blade) or they were... whatever Blank Man and Meteor Man were, etc.

This is a HUGE deal for the entire gaming industry because people do look to companies like Microsoft and what they invest in and promote, so having Microsoft and Dontnod do this game and have a major trans hero right there on the front of the box is a massive thing.
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Black Panther was written and directed by black filmmakers. Tell Me Why is checking in with GLAAD to make sure they're being sensitive. Big difference, imo, and an important one. I hope you can understand why I'm skeptical at best about this game, and its use of "representation" as marketing leverage.
 
residentgrigo

residentgrigo

Banned
Oct 30, 2019
3,726
Germany
They peaked with LiS 1 and are on a clear decline game by game but I wish them luck. I like adventure games and the topic is good but only 1 of their 4 games is actually well written. Fingers crossed. I have an Xbone and a PC but I don´t know if the Xbox environment is that welcoming to TT style games anymore.
 

Deleted member 17184

User-requested account closure
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Oct 27, 2017
5,240
xeecee said:
Black Panther was written and directed by black filmmakers. Tell Me Why is checking in with GLAAD to make sure they're being sensitive. Big difference, imo, and an important one. I hope you can understand why I'm skeptical at best about this game, and it's use of "representation" as marketing leverage.
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I totally understand your position, but please give them the benefit of the doubt. I'm Latino, and their characterization in Life is Strange 2 is amazing. Of course, it'd be better if actual Latine people worked on LiS 2 and trans people worked on Tell Me Why, but I trust them.
 
Garlador

Garlador

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
14,131
xeecee said:
Black Panther was written and directed by black filmmakers. Tell Me Why is checking in with GLAAD to make sure they're being sensitive. Big difference, imo, and an important one. I hope you can understand why I'm skeptical at best about this game, and it's use of "representation" as marketing leverage.
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It was a predominately black cast and director, yes, but that still doesn't mean the major appeal was him even getting his own movie in the FIRST place. The decision was welcomed at the time before any further casting or crew decisions were made. They did happen to make some good ones, of course.

But I don't think it's entirely fair to say that something loses value if team making it doesn't always reflect the protagonists they make. As a Native American man, it'll be a cold day in hell before I ever see a Native American director make a movie starring a Native American superhero. Those stars aren't going to align, but that doesn't mean I'm not thrilled when I see Native American representation in movies, comics, and games. How many developers on Turok were Native American? Or Prey? Or Killer Instinct? Or Mortal Kombat? I don't know, but every time we get even one in any sort of playable role it's a massive joy for me to experience, and I say that even as countless times they've mishandled Native American culture (Johnny Depp's Tonto springs to mind as particularly egregious).

I'm not a trans man so I cannot comment on a trans experience, but I LIVE with a trans man who I've trusted to help raise my daughter as our caretaker. So far, his views have been giddy with glee at the announcement.

Can things always improve? Of course. But that doesn't diminish the joy he's feeling currently or the excitement he has texting with me now.
 

Deleted member 17403

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Don't own an Xbox, or a gaming PC but I appreciate DontNod making this game, and sharing stories like these about people who are generally underrepresented in this industry.
 
Hadok

Hadok

Member
Feb 14, 2018
5,797
"Set in the fictional town of Delos Crossing, Alaska, Tell Me Why features a cast of intriguing, true to life characters and mature themes. As you interact with memories of the past, you will make choices that determine the strength of the unique bond that Tyler and Alyson share—and shape the future course of the twins' lives. "
 
MadLaughter

MadLaughter

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
13,097
EJXjpMDWkAA_Ocp
 
dodo

dodo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,997
Garlador said:
It was a predominately black cast and director, yes, but that still doesn't mean the major appeal was him even getting his own movie in the FIRST place. The decision was welcomed at the time before any further casting or crew decisions were made. They did happen to make some good ones, of course.

But I don't think it's entirely fair to say that something loses value if team making it doesn't always reflect the protagonists they make. As a Native American man, it'll be a cold day in hell before I ever see a Native American director make a movie starring a Native American superhero. Those stars aren't going to align, but that doesn't mean I'm not thrilled when I see Native American representation in movies, comics, and games. How many developers on Turok were Native American? Or Prey? Or Killer Instinct? Or Mortal Kombat? I don't know, but every time we get even one in any sort of playable role it's a massive joy for me to experience, and I say that even as countless times they've mishandled Native American culture (Johnny Depp's Tonto springs to mind as particularly egregious).

I'm not a trans man so I cannot comment on a trans experience, but I LIVE with a trans man who I've trusted to help raise my daughter as our caretaker. So far, his views have been giddy with glee at the announcement.

Can things always improve? Of course. But that doesn't diminish the joy he's feeling currently or the excitement he has texting with me now.
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Fair enough. Neither of these reactions are invalid. It's cool that this announcement means a lot to him. I just personally find it very hard to get excited about cis men collecting the inevitable accolades for "the first trans main character in games!" when I personally know trans people who are struggling to survive making their own art. I dislike "representation" as a metric for progress for this reason; it's always nice to see yourself in something, but it hurts seeing things mishandled, and stings worse, in my opinion, feeling used like a stepping stone for someone else's success.

EDIT: also, just to be perfectly clear, I'm not saying nobody should ever include characters outside of their own experience in stories; it's more that I get immediately cynical when they get out ahead of it and make a point of highlighting it as a selling point for the product.
 
Splader

Splader

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Feb 12, 2018
5,063
trashtabby said:
So no trans creatives were involved then, just cis creatives who consulted with trans people. Which, hrmm.

It's better than nothing I guess, and I imagine that they'll sincerely try to get this right at least, but this is still disappointing.
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It's a whole lot better than nothing. Not sure why you're seeing this in a negative light. I can understand being skeptical (but even then nothing to do but wait for the release of the game and judge it then), but what else did you want Dontnot to do?
 

Deleted member 3294

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Splader said:
It's a whole lot better than nothing. Not sure why you're seeing this in a negative light. I can understand being skeptical (but even then nothing to do but wait for the release of the game and judge it then), but what else did you want Dontnot to do?
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Hire trans people to work on the game. I'm glad to see a game about a trans man but it being written by cis people means I'm much more worried about how they'll handle his portrayal than if they hired trans writers.
 
Splader

Splader

Member
Feb 12, 2018
5,063
trashtabby said:
Hire trans people to work on the game. I'm glad to see a game about a trans man but it being written by cis people means I'm much more worried about how they'll handle his portrayal than if they hired trans writers.
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Fair enough. They could have always contracted trans writers or whatnot to help make the game.
 
Iwao

Iwao

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Oct 25, 2017
11,799
I've been following this studio since the beginning where they were planning 'Adrift' but Sony bailed as publisher, and it was picked up by Capcom and released as Remember Me. Loved LiS 1 but it's clear that is where they peaked and nothing they've release since then has been as good. With their team spread across 3 games, struggling to release LiS 2 episodes at a reasonable pace, I'm hoping they're not spreading themselves too thin if this is truly coming out in 2020, along with Twin Mirror.
 
Van Bur3n

Van Bur3n

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
26,089
Why what.

Looks great, though. I liked LiS well enough that I can see myself playing this. Hopefully consulting with the GAAP is enough for something good to come out of this.
 
crazillo

crazillo

Member
Apr 5, 2018
8,185
Dontnod games are instant buys for me. I'm glad video games these days tackle difficult topics. Kudos to Dontnod! I'm also glad they're releasing episodic content at once. A week apart would also do, but waiting for a new episode for several months just isn't working very well.
 
Osu 16 Bit

Osu 16 Bit

QA Lead at NetherRealm Studios
Verified
Oct 27, 2017
2,924
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The MISSING is wonderful and represents the trans experience well IMO and that was written by a cis man who just consulted with trans people. I have faith they'll do good.
 
Hadok

Hadok

Member
Feb 14, 2018
5,797
Breathless_Wallpaper-Preview_960x540.jpg

Breathless_Image_27-1920x1080.png


Breathless_Image_13-1920x1080.png



A little fun fact: the name of the official screenshot is "breathless.imagex_xxx.png".

And...
"The studio received back in September 2016 a 200 K€ help for pre-production from the CNC for a game named Breathless. "

:)
 

Deleted member 2254

user requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
21,467
Wow, all chapters together too. Looks really fascinating. Microsoft may have a huge hit on their hands here.
 
wildbite

wildbite

Member
Oct 26, 2017
241
Wow! I wish one of their future games would be open world. The towns they create look so magical to walk around, I want more than being restricted in an area even though I understand the story telling reasons.
 
Combichristoffersen

Combichristoffersen

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Oct 27, 2017
12,756
User warned: System wars.
Microsoft nabs this while Sony pissed away fuck know how much money on Kojima's middling postal delivery simulator. Great job, Sony. Much appreciated.
 
Combichristoffersen

Combichristoffersen

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
12,756
Hadok said:
Tss Tss Tsss
Death Stranding is amazing,and my GOTY probably so... ;)
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I wouldn't play DS even if I got it for free. Looks like the worst pile of shit Sony's wasted money on since The Order: 1886.

Anyway, this looks like a really nice get for MS. Too bad my PC can't run it, so I won't get to play it. YouTube it is then, I guess.
 
Kolibri

Kolibri

Member
Nov 6, 2017
1,997
Tell me why I need another pet rock
Tell me why I got that ALF alarm clock
Tell me why I bid on Shatner's old toupée
 
Princess Bubblegum

Princess Bubblegum

I'll be the one who puts you in the ground.
On Break
Oct 25, 2017
10,304
A Cavern Shaped Like Home
xeecee said:
Fair enough. Neither of these reactions are invalid. It's cool that this announcement means a lot to him. I just personally find it very hard to get excited about cis men collecting the inevitable accolades for "the first trans main character in games!" when I personally know trans people who are struggling to survive making their own art. I dislike "representation" as a metric for progress for this reason; it's always nice to see yourself in something, but it hurts seeing things mishandled, and stings worse, in my opinion, feeling used like a stepping stone for someone else's success.

EDIT: also, just to be perfectly clear, I'm not saying nobody should ever include characters outside of their own experience in stories; it's more that I get immediately cynical when they get out ahead of it and make a point of highlighting it as a selling point for the product.
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As a LiS fan this very much rings true to me. Also to a lesser (for now) extent The Last of Us.

Totally agree with you about trans developers and artists not getting the spotlight they need. Some of my favorite indie games are made by trans women.

On another note. Not to be too much of a downer but GLAAD fucking sucks, their consultation with Ubisoft didn't fix the shit pulled in Assassin's Creed Odyssey. https://www.kotaku.co.uk/2019/02/28...ed-dlc-doesnt-really-fix-that-romance-problem (GLAAD still kept the game nominated for their awards.)
 
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dragonbane

dragonbane

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Oct 26, 2017
4,585
Germany
Having no trans creatives on it is a bummer, but expected for Dontnod. Hopefully they can pull it off, they are taking a risk here at least.
 
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