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darkwing

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,969
They would only need 51 votes to overturn the filibuster. Not that they necessarily would. But if Dems did first, then the lower bar would be there for them to clear.

(This is not an argument in favor of the filibuster btw, just saying that is the downside of getting rid of it)

but won't the GOP get rid of it when they have the chance
 

Newlib

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,822
Ugh. Unreal.

Now Im hearing from many on the radio while driving that a Federal Nationwide Ban is next up…I'm admittedly pretty ignorant on the logistics of what that would require..is that something that could actually realistically happen?

It's something that will happen. Republicans are assured to win the House this November and will select the President in 2024 regardless of votes. DeSantis would pass a national abortion ban in a second.
 
This is a different topic. I'm talking about a hypothetical situation where Mitch was the President and Obama was the senate majority leader who refused to give President Mitch's SC nominee a hearing. There is no universe where Mitch rolls over and goes away. He would have used every arcane rule to seat his nominee.
Obama didn't go away, he and the party campaigned on it, the only actual remedy in the system.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,728
It's truly amazing the damage a reality show host and failed casino owner has done and continues to do to this country. If anyone thought this could happen even twenty years ago, it would have been laughed off as the bad comedy it should be, instead of the real nightmare it actually is.
 

jdmc13

Member
Mar 14, 2019
2,893
"before they take more rights away from people less privileged than myself, we should burn down the entire system that protects those marginalized folks and leave them completely alone out in the cold"
I get what you're saying, but those protections are at risk as well. I just don't know anymore, man. It feels like political violence becomes more inevitable everyday, and I would by lying if some dark place deep inside didn't think it would be called for it.
 

Fisty

Member
Oct 25, 2017
20,224
This!!

Would Biden maybe have the "right" to do so now? Like on the national stage, would that hurt him or help him now if he said it?

This is bullshit and I feel he should have done it before but he was peddling the "reaching across the isles, I can work with them" bullshit. We know it hasn't worked. Time for plan b?

There's no better excuse, and yeah the only option at this point is the nuclear option. Republicans did this to themselves, this is NOT what the SC is for
 

bruhaha

Banned
Jun 13, 2018
4,122
This is a different topic. I'm talking about a hypothetical situation where Mitch was the President and Obama was the senate majority leader who refused to give President Mitch's SC nominee a hearing. There is no universe where Mitch rolls over and goes away. He would have used every arcane rule to seat his nominee.

Legal scholars looked at all the arcane rules and the most liberal of them (both in legal interpretation and political leaning) could come up only with a result of 1 year of Garland. 1 year of Garland doesn't get you anything so Obama didn't do it.

Overturning the part of Obamacare that you could get McCain and Susan Collins to agree with doesn't get you much so Mitch didn't eliminate the filibuster.
 

melodiousmowl

Member
Jan 14, 2018
3,774
CT
Yea, GOP are fucked.

The blowback will be immense.

I 100% don't think this is the case. And worse, I think dems didn't do anything to stop this as a strategy, basically what you are alluding to. Well, I am old enough to know that will never, ever, ever work.

It will galvanize the right, and the left will come out just as limp as ever.

Talk to people who are not into politics. They hate this, but still feel like they have no one to vote for. It's not like dems stopped it form happening, and THEN campaigned on "if you let Rs win they will repeal this".

It's the same on every issue, they ALWAYS do nothing then fund-raise off the tragedy. They, we, are totally boned come the midterms, and at that point theres no way to climb back after everything Rs are already doing which dems refuse to stop.
 

Deleted member 1594

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,762
Yea, GOP are fucked.

The blowback will be immense.
I wish I had your optimism but all this shows me is that they have all the momentum in the world. Republicans are getting what they want while democrats have a sitting democratic president that can't get anything done for them. It's emboldening republicans and demoralizing democrats.

I mean if anything this screams "GET OUT THERE AND VOTE" but it's proven to be very ineffective. And there's absolutely nothing we can do about the supreme court. That's going to stay a republican majority for quite a while. Biden has already shown reluctance to pack the courts, which in my opinion would be an appropriate reaction to Trump appointing absolute garbage during his 1 term.

I dunno... I'm just super depressed and pessimistic right now. I have such little hope for this country anymore.
 

geardo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,338
User threadbanned: derail
All of this is happening because RBG thought she was going to get "The Year of Ruth" during the first year of Hillary's administration with movies, TV specials, books, interviews, and parades culminating in a big retirement ceremony where she handed the baton to her hand picked successor.

That dumb mother fucker should have her coffin dug up and shot into the sun.

Fuck the Republicans. Fuck the Democrats. Fuck religious zealots. Fuck this country.
 

PiranhaMan

Member
Apr 26, 2020
977
"Violence is not the answer" - Biden

No, Violence is the response. It is inevitable that things will get violent in many places across the country.
 
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YolkFolk

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,212
The North, England
As an outsider this is genuinely insane. Like you couldn't even imagine something like this happened even 10 years ago.

This is the result of social media, the media in general and years of bombardment from the alt right.

America is a radicalised state and we're probably not far behind (Britain). Not even sure we'd go this far though.
 
Oct 26, 2017
8,206
No way this would fly in anti abortion states. They would harass the doctors and make it impossible to work.
Armed security
Hyde Amendment... Can't spend federal money on abortions

Even if they could the doctors would just be arrested and jailed by the states as soon as they left federal property. You'd have to fly them in and out by helicopter and even then the doctors would have to never step foot in any red state for the rest of their life.
His response to that:


I would actually recommend reading his article that I posted earlier. Though I know many here won't like or accept anything that breaks decorum and norms.
 

GK86

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,768


I hope hell is real and there is a special place in it reserved for all these fucking assholes.
 
Oct 27, 2017
7,694
Dems vote, but you need the filibuster ended and many Senators won't do it.

Also remember, the GOP played the long game. This was decades in the making. Dems get demoralized one election cycle.

This is what pisses me off most about how defeatist Dem voters are. You got to play the long game. This system is not about the character of the individuals you vote in. It's about the platform they push for. You got to put aside your pride if we all want to survive this in the long run.

The bare minimum floor is that you vote fully up and down ticket for all Dems.... Every. Single. Election.

That's what your opponents do for Republicans. And they will fully destroy the country if we don't start countering them now.

The time to assert your preferences is in the primaries... Never the general election.

This shit should be stickied as a primer for succeeding in U.S. politics.
 

Desi

Member
Oct 30, 2017
4,210
Couple of dark decades ahead for the US. :(

I know it's no solace for those currently hurting from these ass-backward SCOTUS decisions but the tide will turn eventually.
honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if people post those pics of Iran in the 70's with women in "western fashions" then Iran now but just be Americans instead.
 

Booshka

Banned
May 8, 2018
3,957
Colton, CA
Violence is sometimes the answer when the state is committing violence against you, it's no longer violence, it's self-defense. Over half the country are now second class citizens and considered subhuman, violence is self-defense in this case.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,110
I 100% don't think this is the case. And worse, I think dems didn't do anything to stop this as a strategy, basically what you are alluding to. Well, I am old enough to know that will never, ever, ever work.

It will galvanize the right, and the left will come out just as limp as ever.

Talk to people who are not into politics. They hate this, but still feel like they have no one to vote for. It's not like dems stopped it form happening, and THEN campaigned on "if you let Rs win they will repeal this".

It's the same on every issue, they ALWAYS do nothing then fund-raise off the tragedy. They, we, are totally boned come the midterms, and at that point theres no way to climb back after everything Rs are already doing which dems refuse to stop.
Exactly, republicans have all the power and their base is just getting more and more energized with every victory. I think there are ton of people who care about abortion rights, but for how many of them is the #1 issue? I'm sure plenty of people are upset about this but gas prices and inflation will trump that every time. This is how "normal" well meaning people sit back and let Fascism take hold.
 

Proxy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
213
You keep moving the goal posts to try to force me to say the Dems are great, or something? The Dems are shitty and ineffective. But we should absolutely be voting for them at every possible chance we have to reduce harm to vulnerable people. I can't see any logical or moral reason for not doing so. Feel free to lay one out for me if you have it.


I don't know or care? I'm responding to ignorant, braindead, thoughtless political discussion, not opining on every other posters' ideology. I think ideological differences and discussions are healthy and necessary. Braindead Twitter-tier political musings, on the other hand, are a big part of the reason our politics are so broken right now, IMO, so I push back against it.

It doesn't matter whether I "agree" with their opinion or not -- people reducing issues into tweet-level black and white and yelling dumb, brainless nonsense into the void of the internet is actively harming our politics, our discource, and our world. I include most US mainstream media in that "harmful" zone -- even the ones i "agree" with. Everyone is turning off their brains and just wants to score points and WIN and it drives me nuts.

You're arguing against something I've never said. I never once said not to vote. I've never once said not to vote for Democrats. I want the Democrats to work for the majority of Americans in this country instead of being corporate lap dogs they presently are. That does not happen by being uncritical of their actions. You seem to me to be bent on tying leftist critiques of the Democrats to imaginary calls to not vote.
 

Kaelan

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
2,641
Maryland
But privately, Mr. Trump has told people repeatedly that he believes it will be "bad for Republicans."

The decision, Mr. Trump has told friends and advisers, will anger suburban women, a group who helped tilt the 2020 presidential race to Joseph R. Biden Jr., and will lead to a backlash against Republicans in the November midterm elections.

Per the NYT. Very interesting
 

RoKKeR

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,385
It's something that will happen. Republicans are assured to win the House this November and will select the President in 2024 regardless of votes. DeSantis would pass a national abortion ban in a second.
This is all extremely plausible and the fact that's even true is so fucking dystopian ffs.
 

Fhtagn

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,615
This is what pisses me off most about how defeatist Dem voters are. You got to play the long game. This system is not about the character of the individuals you vote in. It's about the platform they push for. You got to put aside your pride if we all want to survive this in the long run.

The bare minimum floor is that you vote fully up and down ticket for all Dems.... Every. Single. Election.

That's what your opponents do. And they will fully destroy the country if we don't start countering them now.

The time to assert your preferences is in the primaries... Never the general election.

There's two sides to this and the Dems have to start having better messaging and stop being an embarrassment.

It is absolutely clear that some large percentage of Americans will not show up to vote just to stop the GOP. I wish that wasn't the case, but if they want more votes, they're gonna have to do something to engage those voters. Instead they obsess about swing voters who barely exist; they need to focus on the sometimes-voters-who-always-vote-dem-when-they-show-up, a MUCH larger number of people.

(I always vote in primaries, etc, I do phone banks, I get signatures to get people on ballot, do not confuse me for a not-voting person.)
 

Deleted member 8257

Oct 26, 2017
24,586
Legal scholars looked at all the arcane rules and the most liberal of them (both in legal interpretation and political leaning) could come up only with a result of 1 year of Garland. 1 year of Garland doesn't get you anything so Obama didn't do it.

Overturning the part of Obamacare that you could get McCain and Susan Collins to agree with doesn't get you much so Mitch didn't eliminate the filibuster.
And this is where we differ I guess. Even if it was for a year, and Obama did it, I would have had lot more respect for him to speak on this issue than I do currently. I want Democrats to go scorch earth and get shit done. Even if it was for one year. Let it play out. We don't know the reality and even if there was a 1% chance that Garland can stake it out for more than a year then take the shot. Really, what did Obama had to lose? In fact, he could have energized his own voters.