I'd say it's more like the Brendan Fraser Mummy. Which is a fun (and stupid) movie, in 1999 I wished The Phantom Menace was as fun as The Mummy.
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Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker |OT| Revenge of a Sith (SPOILERS NOW OPEN)
- Thread starter MMarston
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I'd say it's more like the Brendan Fraser Mummy. Which is a fun (and stupid) movie, in 1999 I wished The Phantom Menace was as fun as The Mummy.
The second half has the best moments
-Lando's pep talk to Poe
-Han and Kylo scene
-Chewie reacting to Leia's death
-Palpatine and Rey meeting face to face, and the creepy sith cult chanting
-Kylo and Rey duel on death star ruins
-The ending with the trio hugging (only moment with them that genuinely worked for me).
-The EU fan in me loved Palps's force storm
- Ben Solo being a good guy
I have to be honest, I even liked the kiss, though I fully get the problems with it.
Me too. I didn't get swept up in the "mystique" of Snoke. He just felt like Palpatine 2.0, and I correctly assessed that Kylo would kill him in episode 8, because it felt like his journey was going to be the inverse of Luke's, and Snoke was an impediment to his path down the Dark Side, not a boost.
The only thing I cared about was who Rey's parents were. I didn't think she could be an Organa, Solo, Skywalker, or Palpatine (hah!). I thought maybe, if she just had to have a special lineage, it'd maybe be Kenobi, or one of the other families in the expanded universe. It wasn't until The Last Jedi made her a nobody that I saw how beautiful that was.
In the same way I think that her taking on the name Skywalker is beautiful, especially when I think of it as a nod to George Lucas' own adopted daughter. Blood isn't the only thing that makes people family, and the sins of the father/mother don't always dictate the type of person you'll choose to become.
I'm still not a fan of Rey Palpatine, but I'm all in on Rey Skywalker (that was another prediction I had on NeoGAF way back when as well; that she'd take on the Skywalker name by the end of the trilogy, even if she wasn't related to them by blood).
I was satisfied with this trilogy, but I'm also very much intrigued by the new EU period after this film. I may start reading Star Wars novels again.
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Just got back from it. Enjoyed it. I don't know what people expect from these films but it was full of Lucas/Spielberg twinkles for me. I'm not going to say I loved it like I did the original trilogy when I was a kid in the eighties but it was entertaining. The cinematography was excellent again as it has been in all three movies.
My biggest gripe remains the casting of Adam Driver. He's just so weak and ungainly.
My biggest gripe remains the casting of Adam Driver. He's just so weak and ungainly.
The mummy is not a stupid movie, it achieved exactly what it was going for.
... which was to be a "stupid fun popcorn movie". It's not attempting to be high brow, lol.
It wasn't attempting to be stupid. It was supposed to be a light hearted and fun movie and that's what it was. I didn't say it was high brow but it wasn't stupid either.
We're talking about a movie where the second lead of the film wakes up the Mummy and gets multiple people killed as a result by accident. That is pretty stupid.
It's really not. Though this is getting pretty off topic and it's clear we don't agree on this at all so I think I'll end our conversation here.
So you liked the nonsensical Sith assassin Ochi adventures mystery part?
The part where Ochi took Palpatine's daughter in law's word for "Rey is definitely not on Jakku - I swear", all the while little Rey was right outside and saw the ship leaving right next to her?
Then Ochi murdered Palpatine's kids as they would be of no use anymore trying to find their kid or get further info from them.
To top it all of, he inscribes the murder weapon with the coordinates of the DS2 wreck and as icing on his artistic masterpiece, he puts a retractable scale on it that shows where the Emperor's throne tower is located in all of this giant wavey ocean when standing on a specific piece of shore looking in a specific direction.
Then he flies to Tatooine v3.0 desert festival planet, parks his ship on a steep rock formation, exits and falls down into pit of black jar and gets eaten by a giant snake.
Meanwhile Luke Skywalker + Lando can NOT figure out where that darn wayfinder is even though Luke was right there when DS2 blew up and must have known its location. Both Luke and Lando also apparently never witnessed anyone fall into a sand vagina to be eaten alive so they are too dumb to realize where Ochi could have gone and it is for Rey to figure that sweet, sweet mystery out.
That part?
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There's a difference between thinking about messages and themes and how people in X-Wings would poop.
It's a mess of a movie but it sure is packed with neat stuff too.
People are talking crap about The Mummy? That's a great film. Comedy that hits the mark, good scares, good action, charismatic leads, good pacing.
TROS was reaching so hard to capture the "rollicking adventure" spirit and never really did.
TROS was reaching so hard to capture the "rollicking adventure" spirit and never really did.
oh im sure there's a Disney+ cartoon series coming with these characters that will explain all this nicely!
I didn't say anything about the story. Ochi is stupid as fuck. The movie has a ton of problems. The pacing in the middle of the movie is fine. It's too fast in the beginning and the end.
They need to go full in on Palpatine's son.
Son of Palpatine - A Star Wars Story
Heck lets do two sons, one evil, one good.
Sons of Palpatine - Two Star Wars Stories
Please someone someday in official licensed media please explain to me what in the living fuck was going on with Ochi and his clue dagger because I really dont fuckin know
I actually would quite enjoy the Adventures of Ochi the Incompetent Jedi Assassin
A writer desperately overloading too many convenient plot pointers + mystery origin stories all onto one flimsy MacGuffin, that is what happened.
It is like someone watched RAIDERS and thought having the Staff of Ra not just pointing to a (crumbling) Well of Souls (surrounded by giant waves), but also being the murder weapon of Indy's mother + a famous artifact of one of Hitler's top men all in one package would be a good idea.
Ochi should have spent less time carving stuff into his Sith dagger and more time to just retrieve the damn wayfinder device before the ocean waves would consume the wreckage.
I already own it and I gotta say, while it may talk about Ochi more, it does not make the situation make any more sense. It just says more words about it.
Oh if we're gonna go full Chris Terrio then let's just say...
After Ochi killed Rey's parents, something Sheeven P. Sidious Jr. had said really stuck with him. Before he died he had said the name...Martha. Why would he say that name? Was that the name of his mother? Did Sheev fuck a Martha? It made Ochi think of his own mother, Martha of Bestoon, champion...dagger....maker?
The horrible truth dawned on him that they could be half brothers. Deadbeat Dad Sidious could have a lust for Marthas with kids all over this galaxy. Ochi didn't dare betray Sidious openly, but he was overcome with guilt for his actions. And so he decided to rebel under the radar in his own way. Instead of taking the wayfinder for himself, he carves a dagger with clues that lead to the wayfinder that leads to Sidious' secret treehouse. Hopefully someday, a force wielder that loves treasure hunting will find the dagger and defeat Sidious.
Just as he finishes the dagger, he has a force vision of the future. He can see a girl, seemingly a jedi, in a lightsaber duel at the location of the wayfinder. He fears this might be a vision of failure, but at the last moment...an echo in the force. A woman's voice saying Ben. Why would she say that name? But it seems to do the trick, the jedi wins and the cloaked malcontent rejects the dark side.
The vision ends and he sighs to himself, "It's like poetry, it rhymes." Content, Ochi leaps ass first into a random nearby pit of quicksand knowing that his character is no longer needed in the script.
Lucasfilm please compensate me in the amount of $3.50.
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Someone literally made a dagger 20 years ago to point to the location of another gps device in wreckage that might not even be in the same condition after a few decades
...for the sole purpose of giving his own boss the middle finger because why else would you go out of your way to tell on him like that?
Did Sheev cut his benefits or something?
That's good.
My parents went to watch it and their review was:
"It was pretty good, but I wasn't sure what was going on because we missed a lot of the movies in between"
"It was pretty good, but I wasn't sure what was going on because we missed a lot of the movies in between"
they saw TLJ in theaters
Guys, stop trying to make sense of the movie
Like even if you get Chris Terrio to respond, what answer would possibly satisfy you?
The Ochi knife was written as a plot device to give the group a thing to do that would use up screentime and while not having to do any character stuff, so that Rey could end up on the death star fighting Kylo Ren. That's all this is.
Like even if you get Chris Terrio to respond, what answer would possibly satisfy you?
The Ochi knife was written as a plot device to give the group a thing to do that would use up screentime and while not having to do any character stuff, so that Rey could end up on the death star fighting Kylo Ren. That's all this is.
ouch lol
Yeah the quicker we let this movie die the better.
I want Terrio to respond because every "explanation" he gives just raises 100 more questions. Its like watching a proven liar testify at court and seeing him come up with a dozen new lies to cover up the first one.
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This is probably the thread that had made me laught the most in the last year.
Not out of spite or anything, it's just gotten so absurd I just can't help myself.
I have clients near me, and here is my dumb ass loudly laughing at #ReyleasetheSnyderCut
We laugh but you know Filoni is going to save this movie and it's weird plot devices
I realized watching this that having the gang together actually seems to limit or constrain opportunities for developing the characters or giving them decent arcs. Same thing happens with Return of the Jedi. None of the main heroes has an arc or meaningful character development in that movie except Luke. This is probably one of the reasons why RJ chose to split them all up.
On the Rey Palpatine reveal:
As much as I enjoyed TFA, the mystery surrounding Rey's lineage was always the least enticing and potentially derailing plot thread going forward. Even at the time, I couldn't help but think that there's simply no way to make for an interesting reveal, just on a dramatic level. Seriously, just forget themes for a second, JJ must have understood there's no way to deliver a satisfying answer to that question, 1) because we've already done the big family twist in the OT - one of the most iconic twists of all time that anything in the ballpark will just feel like blatant rehashing. There's just no need to draw those kinds of comparisons. 2) because between TFA and TLJ, the entire internet would already come up with every possible explanation for who Rey's parents would be, so no answer would actually be surprising in any way. It's a twist without any actual oomph right out the gate. 3) Because it's not a particularly interesting question.
I have my reservations about TLJ, but based on the above issues with the setup, RJ managed to find the only dramatically satisfying answer to that question. Coming up with something that is truly fresh, that truly wasn't prominently and relentlessly discussed online prior, and truly thrust the central character into a place we hadn't seen before in the series is great fucking writing. Star Wars was immediately novel again. What many people misconstrue as a deflection for the question JJ setup is in fact a novel and dramatically charged answer. He thread the needle on what I don't think JJ realised was such an extremely difficult question to answer. Without even really consolidating the thematic work of the reveal, in the cinema at the time, I remember just thinking "of course!" It's such a clear and obvious decision in hindsight. The twist is also, despite endless internet discussion at the time to the contrary, not played for ambiguity. On a literal and technical level, yes, the information is coming from a manipulative Kylo Ren, but it's so clearly designed as concrete sobering story information. This is Rey's reality. She comes from nothing and that's all there is to it.
With all that in mind, the decision in TROS to make Rey a Palpatine is outright baffling, tragic and so disappointing it's fortunate I'm not more invested in these films. It fails to respond to either TLJ or TFA. Unlike the question posed in TFA, TLJ's reveal is not up for debate - it's not a handover for the next writer to decide, even if you didn't like it. It's a decisive statement and the following film should be wrestling with its ramifications. To do anything else just goes against the language of cinema. It's no less shameful than if ROTJ revealed that Vader was lying and manipulating Luke, and that he had indeed murdered Anakin Skywalker. Once the cat's out of the bag, you can't rescind that reveal, especially one that so skillfully landed on one of the only actual novel directions to go with a question like that. And on top of all this, we've still got all the original TFA reasons why this kind of reveal is so ill-fitting: We've already had the big family twist in the OT and, to no one's surprise, this reveal pales in comparison to that one. Why draw comparisons to something so unobtainably iconic? We've already had endless discussion about the potential for Rey to be a Palpatine, so there's just absolutely nothing surprising about something that's so clearly meant to surprise. And finally, it's just not interesting to hear this. Rey is not a more interesting character as a result.
This is all just looking at the dramatic reasons why this kind of thing fails spectacularly. Doesn't even touch on the more tread ground of why it's thematically limp too. Really disappointing.
As much as I enjoyed TFA, the mystery surrounding Rey's lineage was always the least enticing and potentially derailing plot thread going forward. Even at the time, I couldn't help but think that there's simply no way to make for an interesting reveal, just on a dramatic level. Seriously, just forget themes for a second, JJ must have understood there's no way to deliver a satisfying answer to that question, 1) because we've already done the big family twist in the OT - one of the most iconic twists of all time that anything in the ballpark will just feel like blatant rehashing. There's just no need to draw those kinds of comparisons. 2) because between TFA and TLJ, the entire internet would already come up with every possible explanation for who Rey's parents would be, so no answer would actually be surprising in any way. It's a twist without any actual oomph right out the gate. 3) Because it's not a particularly interesting question.
I have my reservations about TLJ, but based on the above issues with the setup, RJ managed to find the only dramatically satisfying answer to that question. Coming up with something that is truly fresh, that truly wasn't prominently and relentlessly discussed online prior, and truly thrust the central character into a place we hadn't seen before in the series is great fucking writing. Star Wars was immediately novel again. What many people misconstrue as a deflection for the question JJ setup is in fact a novel and dramatically charged answer. He thread the needle on what I don't think JJ realised was such an extremely difficult question to answer. Without even really consolidating the thematic work of the reveal, in the cinema at the time, I remember just thinking "of course!" It's such a clear and obvious decision in hindsight. The twist is also, despite endless internet discussion at the time to the contrary, not played for ambiguity. On a literal and technical level, yes, the information is coming from a manipulative Kylo Ren, but it's so clearly designed as concrete sobering story information. This is Rey's reality. She comes from nothing and that's all there is to it.
With all that in mind, the decision in TROS to make Rey a Palpatine is outright baffling, tragic and so disappointing it's fortunate I'm not more invested in these films. It fails to respond to either TLJ or TFA. Unlike the question posed in TFA, TLJ's reveal is not up for debate - it's not a handover for the next writer to decide, even if you didn't like it. It's a decisive statement and the following film should be wrestling with its ramifications. To do anything else just goes against the language of cinema. It's no less shameful than if ROTJ revealed that Vader was lying and manipulating Luke, and that he had indeed murdered Anakin Skywalker. Once the cat's out of the bag, you can't rescind that reveal, especially one that so skillfully landed on one of the only actual novel directions to go with a question like that. And on top of all this, we've still got all the original TFA reasons why this kind of reveal is so ill-fitting: We've already had the big family twist in the OT and, to no one's surprise, this reveal pales in comparison to that one. Why draw comparisons to something so unobtainably iconic? We've already had endless discussion about the potential for Rey to be a Palpatine, so there's just absolutely nothing surprising about something that's so clearly meant to surprise. And finally, it's just not interesting to hear this. Rey is not a more interesting character as a result.
This is all just looking at the dramatic reasons why this kind of thing fails spectacularly. Doesn't even touch on the more tread ground of why it's thematically limp too. Really disappointing.
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The idea that having a long cut of the movie would hurt BO sales is funny. They must of known going into it that it was going to stink, so even though the edited sequences that would have added more to character were cut, still the BO is trending for the lowest of the new 3.
Though it is smart to release the longer cut to make more money, but it really feels like the artistic nature of film making is really being trivialized here with "This extended theater cut... this extended blu ray release.... this even MORE extended Disney Plus release".
Really just makes me sad that they didn't put more efforting in planning a STORY instead of milking money from a bad narrative.
Though it is smart to release the longer cut to make more money, but it really feels like the artistic nature of film making is really being trivialized here with "This extended theater cut... this extended blu ray release.... this even MORE extended Disney Plus release".
Really just makes me sad that they didn't put more efforting in planning a STORY instead of milking money from a bad narrative.
I dont understand
Could you please rephrase this response in the form of exasperated sonic fan who believes the frickin fricks will never be satiated
Yep.
Remember when we all thought TLJ reveal fit since it lined up with so much of Rey's character decision in TFA. For instance, not selling BB-8 because she was once carelessly sold by her parents.
Yeah, screw all that. She's a Palpatine. The reveal makes TFA so much worse.
I thought about this exact scene on my drive home from work tonight (yea I know that's weird!) and how perfectly it aligns with Rey Nobody and her trash parents in TLJ.Yep.
Remember when we all thought TLJ reveal fit since it lined up with so much of Rey's character decision in TFA. For instance, not selling BB-8 because she was once carelessly sold by her parents.
Yeah, screw all that. She's a Palpatine. The reveal makes TFA so much worse.
I still can't believe they really made this movie. If they had just stuck the landing and made a film half as good as The Last Jedi, I think this would have actually been my favourite of all the Star Wars trilogies. Now I just feel completely indifferent to it.
I will forever resent the part of the Internet that led to this reactionary, artless dreck.
I will forever resent the part of the Internet that led to this reactionary, artless dreck.
Because hey, he's a handsome rogue and a smuggler, you know who that reminds me of? Doesn't it kinda make you think about watching another movie you love? Just turn off your brain and don't think about it!
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I saw a tweet that said The Rise of Skywalker can't withstand a single "Why?" and that is exactly where I'm at. A movie with things that happen because they're supposed to that was created because it had to be.
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