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Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker |OT| Revenge of a Sith (SPOILERS NOW OPEN)
- Thread starter MMarston
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Yes, a jar of Snoke clones. The Snoke we saw in the previous films was a clone of other Snokes. Not a clone of Palpatine or anyone famous.
The writing process for Star Wars films is complicated. I believe Lucas intended for each episode to be able to work on its own but also be part of a larger story and I feel that is what Disney was trying to re-create with the sequel trilogy with TFA acting as a reboot/sequel to establish the new characters and passing the torch from the original cast and then the stories for TLJ and RoS were being worked on based on what TFA set up. RoS had its first story treatments going way back to 2015 before TLJ even started shooting principle photography.
There has always been some level of planning to interconnect the movies, but there are always changes going on in preproduction of the next episode. Lucas himself was going back and forth on how many episodes there were going to be and eventually deciding on moving elements from the original episode IX into VI after V was completed and decided to just have 6 episodes. I think the biggest impact on the story for RoS was that it seems Leia was going to have a bigger role so the script had to be rewritten quickly around Carrie's unfortunate death. I get the sense Leia was going to be more of a mentor to Rey and a mother figure so that she could take on the Skywalker name by the end.
I do like how a lot of George's ideas ended up in TLJ, like the depiction of Luke in a self-imposed exile, based on the leaked 2013 story conference. And they brought on George to consult with RoS to connect it with the rest of the saga. I get the feeling Palpatine was part of the plan going back as far as 2016... but who knows when they decided to make a Rey a Palpatine by blood.. maybe later down the line during the rewrites. I feel like all of the decisions they made about major characters and plot lines though seem to make sense to me. I don't really see any plot wholes or throwing away things established in prior films except maybe a few minor characters.
There has always been some level of planning to interconnect the movies, but there are always changes going on in preproduction of the next episode. Lucas himself was going back and forth on how many episodes there were going to be and eventually deciding on moving elements from the original episode IX into VI after V was completed and decided to just have 6 episodes. I think the biggest impact on the story for RoS was that it seems Leia was going to have a bigger role so the script had to be rewritten quickly around Carrie's unfortunate death. I get the sense Leia was going to be more of a mentor to Rey and a mother figure so that she could take on the Skywalker name by the end.
I do like how a lot of George's ideas ended up in TLJ, like the depiction of Luke in a self-imposed exile, based on the leaked 2013 story conference. And they brought on George to consult with RoS to connect it with the rest of the saga. I get the feeling Palpatine was part of the plan going back as far as 2016... but who knows when they decided to make a Rey a Palpatine by blood.. maybe later down the line during the rewrites. I feel like all of the decisions they made about major characters and plot lines though seem to make sense to me. I don't really see any plot wholes or throwing away things established in prior films except maybe a few minor characters.
A friend of mine mentioned this but does the timeline for Palpatine even having kids check out?
Did he just bang a random Sith loyalist and have a son right before Return of the Jedi took place?
Rey's dad looked to be in his twenties when he dropped her off on Jaku then died. There are thirty years between RotJ and TFA so gonna assume Rey's parents Have to be in their 30's unless Palpatine birthed his son in a tank later too?
Did he just bang a random Sith loyalist and have a son right before Return of the Jedi took place?
Rey's dad looked to be in his twenties when he dropped her off on Jaku then died. There are thirty years between RotJ and TFA so gonna assume Rey's parents Have to be in their 30's unless Palpatine birthed his son in a tank later too?
The only episode I'd say this even remotely works with is A New Hope. Empire ends on a cliffhanger, and Return of the Jedi expects that you know who these characters are by this point.
I don't think any other Star Wars film works as a completely stand-alone thing.
This is almost exactly how I feel about the ST. Most sane post in here.
They have 10,000 ships! Who gives a fuck if there is some friendly fire? They just sat there and let the Rebels win.
I mean, same difference. The point is, Snokes are just bodies that Palpatine controls. They could be his clones and just made to look differently so that he's not recognized. After all, Snoke looks more like an elongated and distorted human than actual alien, so he might be. But even if he is just a different being that Palpatine is using, it's the same thing, just a body for him to control. So it's HIS clone, whether or not it's his genes.
So I had seen it late last night and was too tired to voice to many thoughts, but here are some
- The first scene has Kylo randomly killing hooded people. I don't get why his lightsaber seemed to dismember at times, but couldn't cut through a torso
- The first, maybe half, of the movie seems like a disjointed mess. They just seem to be hopping from location to location and, maybe it's just me, but a lot of scenes seemed unusually terse. Like they were always in mid conversation or cut off slightly before they should have been. Just really bizarre editing
- Poe is always made out to be a star pilot, but there seems to be the implication Rey is better at piloting the Falcon than him? I guess she's more familiar with it
- It was too little too late in trying to get the whole group to go on adventures together. There was a lot of implied chemistry that unfortunately wasn't shown in the previous 2 movies, aside from Finn and Rey (because she continues to be the only person he truly cares about)
- The scene with Rose was so disrespectful. It almost seemed like they were going in for a kiss and then nope. And then Finn is like "Hey, wanna go on an adventure with us?" and she's like "Nah, the director says I can for plot reasons". Okay...a pathetic acquiescence to trolls/racists
- I joked with a friend they seemed to be trying to pass some "Black Bechdel" test because the black characters kind of only talked to one another and then the ex-Stormtrooper girl randomly talking to Lando at the end because...🤷🏽♂️
- I appreciate them trying to incorporate Carrie Fisher into the movie, but it was so jarring. You could tell she wasn't there and that it was just random clips of her saying mysterious things and characters responding. I wish they had done something better. Maybe implied that her "space walk" in TLJ had secretly done more damage to her body than they thought and that she was slowly dying and had that done earlier in the movie
- The Knights of Ren were fucking trash. Kylo dispatched them easier than Snoke's random guards. I don't even know what they were doing skulking around the whole movie. I think their one accomplishment was capturing Chewie off screen? I get Palp wanted Rey to be brought in alive, but why weren't the Knights killing other Resistance members?
- Finn being force sensitive, holding a lightsaber for a few minutes, and then doing nothing again? Fuck you, JJ
- OGs knife was probably the worst mcguffin I've seen in a recent movie. Also did anyone think it was dumb that it's use, aside from the translation, ended up requiring it to be seemingly arbitrarily lined up with the ruins of the Death Star? I could get it having sith writing, but what if the Death Star had randomly degraded from, you know, constantly being buffeted by crazy waves for decades? The knife would've become useless
- I actually didn't mind Rey having all these crazy force powers. She had the books, she was doing training. I think they made way more sense than her being a better lightsaber fighter than Kylo ever did. I wish they had done more with her accidentally using dark side powers when super emotional. I think that should have been something that had been recurring throughout the trilogy, not just tossed in her because she was Sheev's granddaughter
- I also loved the force bond between Kylo and Rey. I wish it was better..."realized", but I thought it was cool when it was particularly strong they could physically exchange things. I joked JJ must've watched FLCL because it was like NO
- I called Kylo dying saving Rey by giving his life force. It was so obvious it was going to happen when she was "dead" after Palpatine had drained her and Kylo was knocked off screen. Plus it gave him his redemption. I guess it was better than him full on turning good. He always did have a draw to Rey so I feel like him doing something good for her wasn't out of character
- Them kissing at the end was ewww
- I have to hand it to JJ. After Starkiller base I thought "How will you top the deathstar 3? How much more star deathy can you get?" and him attaching their lasers to Star Destroyers? Bravo JJ. You proved the unimaginative hack I knew you could be
- Luke's force ghost seemed to have a completely different character from his TLJ character. It was jarring
- I didn't get the Final Order. Like who was piloting all those Star Destroyers? I always thought it was weird the FO was seemingly more powerful than the Empire despite not being as large, but not it seems they secretly were? Also I don't get why they didn't just attack if they had all those resources just there laying in wait. Why did Snoke need Kylo or Rey? Just to carry on the sith?
- Was Snoke just a puppet? We saw vats of other bodies. I thought it was implied his face was damaged fighting Luke (in a comic or something), but it seemed like they were all fucked up
- Also, Luke dying to "inspire" people did nothing, but Lando taking a weekend flying the Millennium Falcon around asking people somehow did? They did Luke dirty. I could tell Mark Hammill thought so too
I mean, to be fair
The Extended Universe was also mostly a pile of steaming shit, with a few exceptions.
A popular Nabooian delicacy. Palpatine used Sith magic to bring one to life as a joke, and the rest is history.
Wasnt't that Always going to gutted since Lucas started work on the ST about the grandkids that were incompatible as well
This is a popular thing to say but I don't really have an issue with this.
I saw it as Lando was going to be the rally point and lead everyone there. And Luke's sacrifice plus the knowledge of what the Galaxy needs to come together to do is what caused everyone to show up. "Hey everyone we need everyone's firepower to sabotage a fleet of Planet Killing Star Destroyers Before they can take off. Here's the plan to end this war."
I had a lot of issues with the script but this isn't really one of them
The EU was never canon anyway and if Lucas had made these movies it would all have been tossed anyway.
What I was stuck contemplating was why Palpy would hang everything on only one granddaughter? Wouldn't a guy like him potentially have had dozens or hundreds of concubines (and sired his own little clone army)? Shouldn't there be hundreds of other super-force-sensitive grandchildren children all over the galaxy?
JJ, seemed too occupied with trying to fix the perceived wrongs of TLJ and making vocal fans happy. Scenes just seemed like something checked off a list of things he needed to do.
Pacing was weird and chunks of it felt random. Having the group together was great and the highlight of the film.
I think your rating is fair. It's not great and not completely awful (my same feelings on TLJ). It could have been so much more.
This was literally the plot of the first two movies. Just completely discarded in this.
Remember how the film introduces lightspeed skipping at the start and then never brings it up again. Yeah, that TROS in a nutshell.
Setups with zero payoff.
Setups with zero payoff.
Apparently, according to the Star Wars visual dictionary for this, Lando is her father. :/
BossAttack I'm trying to find all the thread highlights for you, but I'm gonna be honest, it's been a haze of hilarity and shitposting interspersed with incredulity, disappointment and tears.
But here's probably the most substantial thing I've said about the film:
Here's possibly the funnest summary of a specific plot point I've seen:
Link to Essay: https://www.patreon.com/posts/32504876
But here's probably the most substantial thing I've said about the film:
Here's possibly the funnest summary of a specific plot point I've seen:
Link to Essay: https://www.patreon.com/posts/32504876
I still remember the days when jumping in/out of lightspeed actually required some prep so as not to jump out in the middle of something
It was revealed in a cut scene from the leaks. Black people are more rare than Jedi
This is actually inaccurate. A podcast would be a step up from what happened. What actually happened is....
You mean like 4 years ago in TFA? A movie that JJ also made?
I also dont understand how Poe turns to Rey and says: "We need you up there, you are the best pilot we have!" like... what the fuck? I imagine Rey never flew a ship while in Jakku, then she flies the Millenium Falcon a bit and now she is better than Poe, a guy that destroyed 14 tie fighters in like one minute during TFA?
Sure but why couldn't they have adapted the good stuff? People would've been far more impressed with an adaptation of the Heir to the Empire trilogy than what we ended up getting. Would've been no different to Marvel adapting the Infinity Saga and they could've even gotten Zahn to write the screenplays or something.
They did send out a bunch of tie fighters. Just wasn't enough.
Also, I read somewhere here that the Star Destoyers were built in a shipyard? The same shipyard that built the OG Star Destroyers?
I actually don't think that's the case here. The fact that all of them were sitting in atmosphere combined with then fact that Palps specifically said they were "conjured" leads me to believe they were created by some sort of magic right there on the Sith homeworld. The specific choice of word "conjured" and not "constructed" leads me to that theory. Have they confirmed either way?
Amazing.
Also, something my brother brought up. Why can't Threepio read Sith text. He says it's against his programming as if he came off a factory line imprinted with old Republic standardized programming. But he wasn't, ANAKIN BUILT HIM BY HAND. Did child Anakin program that into him for no reason?
I think he says you're the best fighter we have, implying she needs to stop training and get her saber into gear
I thought of that too. It made me wonder if he wasn't just a random droid that Anakin fixed or if he was a custom build one. This movie made me think the former, while I always assumed it was the latter
Yeah, but that was story starter JJ, not story ender JJ. They aren't the same people
He said it was something passed by the Senate. No idea which Senate though - it's possible it was something the New Republic decreed.
So you hope they get more movies just to make people mad? Why? This is so petty for no reason
Also, if the Sith were suppose to be nearly dead/long forgotten in the PT, who the hell programmed in a Sith language translation into C3PO?!
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