Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker |OT| Revenge of a Sith (SPOILERS NOW OPEN)

[Shaun Solo]

While I agree that it was the intent of TLJ, it feels clunkily implemented in TROS. They appear at the 11th hour and only when Lando called in? The galaxy didn't start rising between TLJ and that moment since The First Order still has a solid control? It feels more plot convenience because of how it only matters when the plot demands it matters than is just ignored until that moment.

Click to shrink...

Exactly. This film should have started with all those people already being inspired and having joined the cause. Rey and Kylo are each building up their sides, one through hope and the other through fear. Rey while being a nobody has created a found family of rebels, and Kylo while being a Solo/Skywalker has nobody beside him as he pushed them all away (keep the Hux betrayal to further the point).

And TROS even muddies the interpretation that the Luke scene is why everyone shows up. Finn yells out "Lando you did it!". Lando is the reason people show up. Luke's influence is never mentioned.

 

[Lotus]

Click to shrink...

This makes no sense...

 

[Veelk]

It's hilarious. That's not how human beings behave at all. He clearly wanted to tell her he loves her, that's the kinda shit you say before you think you're going to die. Not "i can feel the force!". There's no reason why he wouldn't have told her that before, but there's a lot of reason why he wouldn't tell her he loves her or has feelings for her.

Click to shrink...

*finn on his deathbed*
"Rey..."
"Yes?"
"There's something I have to tell you...."
"I...think I know. I don't think I feel the same way, but that does not mean you are not dear to me and...."
"No, Rey..... Listen. Let me say it....I need to say it."
"...okay"
"I'm...force sensitive."
"I know you do- wait, what?"
"I can feel the force."
"Um....oh, cool? what does that mean for you? What does this mean for us?"
"Ab...solutely...no....thing."
"wha....did you want me to train you or something?"
"I...honestly don't know...but I'm force sensitive. I need you to know that, rey. I'm....force....sensitive...."
*finn dies*
"NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO..............................."

 

[Infinity Times Two]

Ultimately, TROS, like TFA, was pure unfiltered OT bootlicking, with very little new things to say. But that's what hardcore fans want, I guess.

 

[Aadiboy]

Also why does it seem like everyone knows who the Sith are now? The Sith were gone for a thousand years before Palpatine rose to power, and the only people who knew about him and Vader being Sith lords were the high ranking imperials. But in this movie you have a lot of characters talking about the "Sith this, Sith that" as if they are common knowledge. In general it seems weird how the general public in the ST knows so much minute details about the OT.

 

[mogster7777]

Why didn't Finn and Poe kiss at the end too? Everyone else kissed without any buildup to it or any chemistry?

Joking aside it's funny that they showed two women kissing but never show two men. It's good this was included but Hollywood still NEVER show two men kissing in big budget movies like this. Always has to be two women when showing same sex relationships. Still progress I suppose.

 

[Iceman]

But in this movie you have a lot of characters talking about the "Sith this, Sith that" as if they are common knowledge. In general it seems weird how the general public in the ST knows so much minute details about the OT.

Click to shrink...

They seem to have it both ways, as the new former stormtrooper girl lets Finn know that she doubts the Force is real.

I don't know if that makes it better or worse, honestly.

 

[Raijinto]

Not to detract too much from that dumb thing Abrams said about Finn but can someone please kindly explain to me what this Fortnite tie-in was all about that was apparently referenced in the opening crawl? I've got no idea about any of it so any explanation would be great.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

A movie is more than its script.

And I would absolutely describe the prequels as just as "lazy and slap dash". They were not well thought out in any way, shape, or form, full of nonsense plots(the entirety of AOTC makes no sense), characters that do not work, it is all telling and no showing, and on top of all that nearly every aspect of the film that isn't music or art related is executed terribly.


I can't believe some of you really think Palpatine having a comically unrealistic amount of Superduper Star Destroyers(which, true, is very fucking stupid) is more a detriment to a film than horrendous acting and terrible characters.

Click to shrink...

TROS is riding off the good characterizations of TFA and TLJ and regresses every single character essentially to their base form. That's far more damaging.

Look. The prequels are bad. They started off terrible and only managed to be barely mediocre by the end. ST started off okay with TFA, became great with TLJ, and TROS smashes it all to pieces in one fell swoop. The fuck up here is far more monumental. And the message here is that Star Wars must forever be tied to the past, because fuck trying new things because of money. The cynical corporate fingering here is the worst this series has ever seen. If you wanna argue that the artistic faults of the prequels are greater, sure. But the insult of TROS is far far worse.

There was a misguided vision with the prequel movies. But TROS is corporate cynical vomit on a screen. And it's easily the most forgettable movie in this series.

 

[Midas]

Idk but I got a chuckle when that giant stone chunk took out about a hundred of them lol

Click to shrink...

Haha yeah, it was so strange.

Click to shrink...

Sums it up quite well. "Let's put a bunch of guys here as props only to be killed."

Random sith acolytes, fanboys I guess. I know they're supposed to be bad and therefore we should have no sympathy but I thought the way they showed the crowds just getting brutalized was a bit much lol

Click to shrink...

I guess we could see them as space nazis and just be happy that they're gone? :lol

 

[KadeYuy]

A movie is more than its script.

And I would absolutely describe the prequels as just as "lazy and slap dash". They were not well thought out in any way, shape, or form, full of nonsense plots(the entirety of AOTC makes no sense), characters that do not work, it is all telling and no showing, and on top of all that nearly every aspect of the film that isn't music or art related is executed terribly.


I can't believe some of you really think Palpatine having a comically unrealistic amount of Superduper Star Destroyers(which, true, is very fucking stupid) is more a detriment to a film than horrendous acting and terrible characters.

Click to shrink...

It might be an age thing. I'm only 28 so the PT came out when I was a kid so maybe I'm more lenient towards them. I can watch them and see a ton of flaws but also really enjoy them. The sad part about watching them is I get what they were going for but they messed up the execution. In ROS they nail the execution. The effects, the visuals, the acting for the most part (the dialog in this movie is downright bad in some places even by Rey and Kylo). But I took away from the movie that it had no interest in telling a story at all. It was more interested in putting flashing lights in front of me for 2.5 hours than actually attempting a story. It executed that non-story in a flashy way though.

So I guess I'm grasping at the subjective "the movie has heart" or I feel like the other movies were more earnest.

 

[808s & Villainy]

Also why does it seem like everyone knows who the Sith are now? The Sith were gone for a thousand years before Palpatine rose to power, and the only people who knew about him and Vader being Sith lords were the high ranking imperials. But in this movie you have a lot of characters talking about the "Sith this, Sith that" as if they are common knowledge. In general it seems weird how the general public in the ST knows so much minute details about the OT.

Click to shrink...

They barely knew jedi and the force were real months ago (however long ago TFA took place), which makes it extra hilarious

 

[Jangowuzhere]

Why didn't Finn and Poe kiss at the end too? Everyone else kissed without any buildup to it or any chemistry?

Joking aside it's funny that they showed two women kissing but never show two men. It's good this was included but Hollywood still NEVER show two men kissing in big budget movies like this. Always has to be two women when showing same sex relationships. Still progress I suppose.

Click to shrink...

I won't give them any brownie points at all for this.

They couldn't even be bothered to show the same sex kiss on screen. It was a background extra moment that I didn't even see.

 

[Creamium]

Also why does it seem like everyone knows who the Sith are now?

Click to shrink...

It feels surreal to bring this up but the Sith were namedropped in the galaxy-wide audio broadcast mentioned in the crawl, heard in Fortnite. So people could at least know the Sith were a thing from that broadcast.

 

[Jiggy]

It feels surreal to bring this up but the Sith were namedropped in the galaxy-wide audio broadcast mentioned in the crawl, heard in Fortnite. So people could at least know the Sith were a thing from that broadcast.

Click to shrink...

Does uhh, Fortnite exist in-universe?

 

[Jangowuzhere]

It feels surreal to bring this up but the Sith were namedropped in the galaxy-wide audio broadcast mentioned in the crawl, heard in Fortnite. So people could at least know the Sith were a thing from that broadcast.

Click to shrink...

The actual beginning of TROS conflict isn't in the movie itself...but instead Fortnite.

Prequels are better.

 

[Lump]

Does uhh, Fortnite exist in-universe?

Click to shrink...

It might as well, anything can happen now for no reason at all.

 

[Xaszatm]

Ok fanfiction mode time since I'm "in a mood" right now and, I mean, it probably won't be as bad as JJ's stuff?

If I had control of TROS, I would have made the real bad guy not a person but an idea: specifically apathy, or extreme self-interest. On the Resistance side, planets are still cold feet in joining but this time its because they don't want to get dragged in another galactic war because another Skywalker has emotional issues. Meanwhile on the First Order side, Kylo's embarrassing defeat leaves him in a very tenuous grasp of power with very little people respecting him, only following him out of fear (i.e. the Joffrey treatment). As a result, many (but not all) planets gain independence from the First Order but now take a selfish "My Planet first" attitude that allows the First Order to fester and still recover.

So the heroes need to go around the galaxy and reinforce why they need to unite to eliminate the First Order by showing that evil should never be allowed to fester unseen while Ben slowly loses everything piece by piece (helped by Hux scheming his downfall). Maybe have the First Order be in the process of building another Starkiller Base because remember these guys are Empire nuts so of course they would try the same tactic again. But have it end with everyone united to finish off the First Order as a pathetic shell of even its pathetic beginnings, wretched and hateful, consumed from within by its own misery and hate and lust for power and not even given a dignified death but a necessary one to keep true peace across the galaxy.

Why yes I like my politics and themes with all the subtlety of a sledgehammer, why do you ask?

 

[Tragicomedy]

The actual beginning of TROS conflict isn't in the movie itself...but instead Fortnite.

Prequels are better.

Click to shrink...

This was a decent Star Wars movie. The prequels are awful movies, period.

 

[Aadiboy]

Yeah, if you didn't watch the trailers or knew about Palps coming back you would be totally lost going into this, which is just terrible.

 

[takriel]

Yeah, if you didn't watch the trailers or knew about Palps coming back you would be totally lost going into this, which is just terrible.

Click to shrink...

Not at all. The three persons I was with didn't know anything about Palpatine and managed to follow just nicely.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

This was a decent Star Wars movie. The prequels are awful movies, period.

Click to shrink...

In no universe is this a decent movie.

This is a horrible movie. The editing alone is some of the worst I've seen in a modern blockbuster film.

 

[Biske]

People will seemingly never get over the fact that The Force is literally fucking magic.

Every. Single. Time. someone does something new with The Force "NUH UH THE FORCE DOESN'T WORK THAT WAY!"

Click to shrink...

Lol for real I have a lot of problems with the movies but what the force can or can't do is silly

 

[DeltaRed]

You could have this exact same film but swap out Palatine for Snoke, he has a bunch of clone bodies for himself and the real one is kept alive by machines like Palpatine and pulls the strings. Make Rey his granddaughter if you must. I think that would have tied these three films together better.

 

[Mariolee]

If Adam Driver doesn't win the Oscar this year, he's going to soon. Ten years from now we're going to look back on this movie and realise that it had ADAM DRIVER contractually obligated to do whatever they wanted him to, and the best they could come up with was putting him in a mask for half the movie and then didn't give him any lines once he took it off.

Click to shrink...

We'll always have The Last Jedi.

 

[808s & Villainy]

This was a decent Star Wars movie. The prequels are awful movies, period.

Click to shrink...

This wasn't even a decent movie. This was literally a collection of references, callbacks and tying up of lose ends. It barely resembled an actual movie with a plot and was more a bunch of barely explained location jumps

 

[UltraMagnus]

Finally actually saw it, my thoughts are .... it wasn't as bad as I expected. It was entertaining and even in moments somewhat emotional.

If you're looking for Star Wars movies to be some masterclass on fantasy storytelling, that certainly wasn't it, but it also wasn't dull either.

In a way I think JJ Abrams just made like the best Harry Potter movie ever, lol, because it felt kind of like a Harry Potter plot with a Star Wars motif on cocaine.

If you're super serious about these movies, you can pick them apart, but I suspect there will be a lot of 8-13 year olds that enjoy this quite a bit, if I was in that age range I probably would like it too.

The thing about the movie (good and bad) is it doesn't linger on anything too long, so if you don't like one thing, you're quickly on to something else.

The ending I think is the only misstep as far as what the film was going for, instead of Jedi voices, JJ might as well have gone all the way and had all the Jedi ghosts appear behind Rey. If you're gonna do fan service, then you might as well bring out all the stops.

 

[roflwaffles]

Does it really matter which bad movie is more bad than the other?

 

[roguesquirrel]

*finn on his deathbed*
"Rey..."
"Yes?"
"There's something I have to tell you...."
"I...think I know. I don't think I feel the same way, but that does not mean you are not dear to me and...."
"No, Rey..... Listen. Let me say it....I need to say it."
"...okay"
"I'm...force sensitive."
"I know you do- wait, what?"
"I can feel the force."
"Um....oh, cool? what does that mean for you? What does this mean for us?"
"Ab...solutely...no....thing."
"wha....did you want me to train you or something?"
"I...honestly don't know...but I'm force sensitive. I need you to know that, rey. I'm....force....sensitive...."
*finn dies*
"NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO..............................."

Click to shrink...

I dont understand whats so funny about this its OBVIOUS*




*if you willfully misinterpret the movie and characters seven different ways

EDIT- WAIT I JUST FOLLOWED THE QUOTE CHAIN AND JJ CONFIRMED IT????? AY DIOS MIO

 

[JetBlackPanda]

Does it really matter which bad movie is more bad than the other?

Click to shrink...

thats just Star Wars these days

I loved TROS though

 

[Lotus]

Does it really matter which bad movie is more bad than the other?

Click to shrink...

No

 

[UltraMagnus]

Oddly enough that actually felt the most like a Marvel movie out of all the Star Wars movies. Pacing and even a little more comedy.

I was bracing for the first half to be bad but I actually found myself kinda ... enjoying it? It was moving so fast that it felt like a pulpy comic book.

 

[Operations]

This wasn't even a decent movie. This was literally a collection of references, callbacks and tying up of lose ends. It barely resembled an actual movie with a plot and was more a bunch of barely explained location jumps

Click to shrink...

Thank you, well put. Just watched the movie, simply disgraceful. Criticize the prequels all you want, the execution was poor but at least the plot made sense and was easy to follow along the three movies. This abomination was a patchwork monstrosity that shouldn't have ever been made.

 

[Hot Priest]

If Adam Driver doesn't win the Oscar this year, he's going to soon. Ten years from now we're going to look back on this movie and realise that it had ADAM DRIVER contractually obligated to do whatever they wanted him to, and the best they could come up with was putting him in a mask for half the movie and then didn't give him any lines once he took it off.

Click to shrink...

This was one of the craziest things about the movie. He only had like a few lines with the mask off when meeting Rey at the Death Star and then two or three with Han, other than that he never spoke with the mask off and had the rest of his lines with the mask on, and even then had less dialogue than in TFA or TLJ.

 

[KingSnake]

He was a sniveling brat who hated his boss more than he cared about the "cause"

His motivation is the greatest display of pettiness in cinema!

It was grand.

Click to shrink...

That would work if the other movie of J.J. didn't have this great Hitlerish speech against the traitors of the First Order.

It was a Spaceballs level twist just to give him the option to have another Tarkin.

 

[Mariolee]

Some of my friends absolutely love it, so there's at least enough there to enjoy. I personally am disappointed by it, but I can understand people just enjoying the ride.

 

[Rotobit]

I was bracing for the first half to be bad but I actually found myself kinda ... enjoying it? It was moving so fast that it felt like a pulpy comic book.

Click to shrink...

Yeah, it's the sort of movie where if you turn your brain off to trying to follow the plot it becomes a really fun ride. The ending is basically a stock shonen anime with a massive cast coming together to defeat the cackling lightning man's army while the main character basically yells "MY FRIENDS ARE MY POWER"

After my opinion started souring around the midway point (C3PO getting "killed" in a really tonally bizarre way) I decided to just root for it going as stupid and overblown as possible, and I was only slightly disappointed. Shoulda been an army of ghost Jedi.

I'm still really let down though, especially as my brain fixates on the issues and remembers how good The Last Jedi was, but I won't exactly say no to rewatching it. That's something I can't say for Attack of the Clones.

 

[Veelk]

EDIT- WAIT I JUST FOLLOWED THE QUOTE CHAIN AND JJ CONFIRMED IT????? AY DIOS MIO

Click to shrink...

Film Critic Hulk made a quote stating "I don't think JJ Abrams knows what a story actually is" and that's really the root of the problem with him and this film. It really doesn't feel like it's a movie so much as a montage of OT flashbacks.

This is the best explanation I have for stuff like this. Finn needs a mystery box, so he wants to say something, but he doesn't for no reason so there can be a mystery. This means that we are lead to believe the most probably outcome but instead is a mundane thing that he has no reason to keep from anyone. But he needs the mystery box, otherwise there is no intrigue in JJ's mind.

 

[Tragicomedy]

In no universe is this a decent movie.

This is a horrible movie. The editing alone is some of the worst I've seen in a modern blockbuster film.

Click to shrink...

This wasn't even a decent movie. This was literally a collection of references, callbacks and tying up of lose ends. It barely resembled an actual movie with a plot and was more a bunch of barely explained location jumps

Click to shrink...

I disagree. It was a very decent movie. And Oscar worthy compared to the prequels, which had worse writing, acting, and dialogue with none of the production quality to mask the awfulness.

 

[UltraMagnus]

Palpatine is always interesting when ever he's on screen, but I felt like the movie was missing a character. It need a Palpatine acolyte/loyalist as a speaking character in the film, maybe the main devotee that was mostly responsible for him being back.

Palps being hooked up literally to a life support machine was cool. Exogol in general was cool.

 

[DvergrBlod]

What was the planet in the beginning where Kylo slaughtered people and who were those people?

 

[Ushojax]

This movie should have been so much simpler. Have the First Order occupying the major star systems in the galaxy, in control of the shipyards, natural resources, trading outposts. Have a lonely Kylo obsessed with finding Rey while the military brass of the First Order try and convince him to focus on building their military strength. Hux eventually convinces the other generals to dispose of Ren due to his shoddy leadership. The ghost of Luke Skywalker frequently haunts Kylo as he tries in vain to reach out to Rey through their Force bond.

Meanwhile the return of Luke Skywalker has energised the Resistance and led to many less important worlds pledging their support, as Rey, Finn and Poe search the galaxy for potential Jedi. The Knights of Ren have been given the same mission, only they are to exterminate them and destroy any hope of the Jedi returning.

That kind of framework could still have allowed for Ben's turn and a nice adventure for the main trio as they rally support around the galaxy while recruiting Force sensitives. We didn't need this Palpatine shit, it is total nonsense and has nothing to do with the previous films. The ST didn't need to "top" the OT, it should have been a nice coda to it. The scale just got completely out of control with TROS and it ruins everything.

 

[The Silver]

What was the planet in the beginning where Kylo slaughtered people and who were those people?

Click to shrink...

It was Mustafar, those people were Vader cultists

 

[UltraMagnus]

Also I thought Disney wouldn't allow the movie to get too grisley, but dayyyyum, Palpatine got messed up at the end lol.

 

[Rotobit]

What was the planet in the beginning where Kylo slaughtered people and who were those people?

Click to shrink...

According to the visual dictionary, Mustafar. The place Obiwan and Anakin dueled it out, Vader was born, and the cool castle in Rogue One.

Yes it's very ridiculous the movie doesn't establish that considering it is theoretically Kylo Ren's mecca.

 

[roflwaffles]

It was Mustafar, those people were Vader cultists

Click to shrink...

Wait when was it established that they were Vader cultists?



Overall I do think the movie is bad but the chemistry between Rey and Kylo elevate it to at least watchable status for me. They're literally the only good thing in the movie for me though.

 

[UltraMagnus]

If you go into the movie with a super serious mindset and big expectations that it must be this epic, serious finale, you're not gonna be happy most likely.

For me I had read all the spoilers before hand and had time to digest that stuff and really we had planned to see it tonight because of conflicting schedules with friends, and all day was super busy so it wasn't really until sitting down in the theater I just went ... "just be entertaining please".

And I have to say on that front it mostly was. There were a few stretches of the movie where it starts to lose gas, but I think part of the upside of such a rapid fire story pace is if there's some section you don't like ... the movie doesn't linger anywhere for too long and keeps humming along.

That said for the bigger reveals ... think they needed a good extra 5 minutes added to the film to let those moments reverberate.

 

[Kadey]

Kylo put a kid into Rey. Why else would he be touching her stomach.

 

[Fliesen]

You know, i really think JJ's desire to please everyone and to play it overly safe as to not have to face any real backlash is really the result of the trauma he experienced during the "fan" backlash over Felicity cutting her hair.

Like, when the fanbase of a 'coming of age college girl' TV series becomes super toxic over a haircut, he's definitely not gonna kill off C3PO, or Chewbacca, or anyone he isn't in a sense contractually obligated to kill off (*cough* Han Solo *cough*).

 

[SlumberingGiant]

This movie should have been so much simpler. Have the First Order occupying the major star systems in the galaxy, in control of the shipyards, natural resources, trading outposts. Have a lonely Kylo obsessed with finding Rey while the military brass of the First Order try and convince him to focus on building their military strength. Hux eventually convinces the other generals to dispose of Ren due to his shoddy leadership. The ghost of Luke Skywalker frequently haunts Kylo as he tries in vain to reach out to Rey through their Force bond.

Meanwhile the return of Luke Skywalker has energised the Resistance and led to many less important worlds pledging their support, as Rey, Finn and Poe search the galaxy for potential Jedi. The Knights of Ren have been given the same mission, only they are to exterminate them and destroy any hope of the Jedi returning.

That kind of framework could still have allowed for Ben's turn and a nice adventure for the main trio as they rally support around the galaxy while recruiting Force sensitives. We didn't need this Palpatine shit, it is total nonsense and has nothing to do with the previous films. The ST didn't need to "top" the OT, it should have been a nice coda to it. The scale just got completely out of control with TROS and it ruins everything.

Click to shrink...

Yeah palpatine just tanked the film, feel like they gave it away in marketing because they knew it was dumb and were trying to get people used to it