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BigWinnie1

Banned
Feb 19, 2018
2,757
User banned (permanent): Concern trolling around sexual assault; history of long bans due to severe infractions.
legit feel like I watched a different movie to most. Like everyone is so angry that she prevented Finn from making a pointless sacrifice. Do fans just really want Finn dead or something?

Naw I dont want Finn dead I just dont eant the women who sexually assaulted him near him so I was a bit happy to see her near him in the last movie. She could have done more but I would have been more upset if she tried to spend more time with him.
 

Xaszatm

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,903
you literally can't tell me what I wanted. I told you that I don't care that Luke sacrificed himself. I just hated the dumb force hologram contrived fake out that just happened to be such a strain that he died at the exact moment kylo figures out the ruse. If you want to have a discussion try taking someone at their word instead of mapping your feelings about other fans on.

Maybe actually remember the movie you hate so much then. Luke doesn't die the exact moment Kylo figures out the ruse. He figures out the ruse then Luke tells him (and the audience) the point of the movie, then vanishes away.

Fine, you hate it. You won't tell me why you hate it, but you hate it so much that...well if I say anything I'm "mapping my feelings" so I need to discuss this with someone who will only tell me that they hate it without telling me why they hate it. Am I supposed to discuss an emotion?
 

Clefargle

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,124
Limburg
Maybe actually remember the movie you hate so much then. Luke doesn't die the exact moment Kylo figures out the ruse. He figures out the ruse then Luke tells him (and the audience) the point of the movie, then vanishes away.

Fine, you hate it. You won't tell me why you hate it, but you hate it so much that...well if I say anything I'm "mapping my feelings" so I need to discuss this with someone who will only tell me that they hate it without telling me why they hate it. Am I supposed to discuss an emotion?

it's all happening within moments of each other. Stop trying to pin down what things I find contrived and boring. The entire movie had me yawning and wishing for something, anything other than another chase sequence. And Luke sitting around grumpily refusing to leave his island full of green milk wasn't it. The final "battle" was another fake out and it isn't my fault Rian wrote his characters into an unwinnable scenario with ricketty equipment and a Jedi unwilling to show up and try to save the next generation. The movie blew chucks and I remember enough of the illogical shit that turned me off.
 

Xaszatm

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,903
Also, I want to reiterate why people aren't happy with KMT's small roll. KMT is literally our only Asian representation in Star Wars films. Asides from her, we have Buddhist Monk but Buddist is scribbled out and replaced with Jedi and said Monk's best friend who both die in the same movie they are introduced. Oh, and racist Japanese accents attached to rubber aliens. Can you see why me, as an Asian, might be a little miffed that our sole representation in this film series that reaches across multiple years and films gets a semi-decent role only to be put in barely a minute on screen? And why I won't be happy just because her role is more or less replaced by another women of color?
 

Clefargle

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,124
Limburg
Also, I want to reiterate why people aren't happy with KMT's small roll. KMT is literally our only Asian representation in Star Wars films. Asides from her, we have Buddhist Monk but Buddist is scribbled out and replaced with Jedi and said Monk's best friend who both die in the same movie they are introduced. Oh, and racist Japanese accents attached to rubber aliens. Can you see why me, as an Asian, might be a little miffed that our sole representation in this film series that reaches across multiple years and films gets a semi-decent role only to be put in barely a minute on screen? And why I won't be happy just because her role is more or less replaced by another women of color?

sure I could see why that would be frustrating
 

MrBadger

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,552
the women who sexually assaulted him

Well okay then.

I know you're determined to justify this weird hatred for a completely inoffensive character and to 'out-woke' this movie's script, but don't you think that's a bit much?

lol instead she made it possible for luke to make the pointless sacrifice?

Luke was gonna show up to confront Kylo anyway and Finn's death wouldn't have changed the outcome whatsoever. The movie is fairly clear about that
 

Deleted member 5596

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,747
Guys, you are missing the Forrest for the trees here. The point is not, "oh well Rose sucked anyway", which is your opinion and has no base for the character approach on RoS.

The thing is that Kelly, suffered bullying so hard (with racist and misogynistic traces) that she had to abandon social media. The result of Disney and JJ was not to stand behind the actress and instead appease to trolls and all-righters to basically humiliate both the character and the actress to please them.

I don't care you think TLJ sucked or didn't make sense, is about a mega corporation again pleasing it's toxic fanbase. I mean look at this:

 

subpar spatula

Refuses to Wash his Ass
Member
Oct 26, 2017
22,141
Makes sense that they would.
Guys, you are missing the Forrest for the trees here. The point is not, "oh well Rose sucked anyway", which is your opinion and has no base for the character approach on RoS.

The thing is that Kelly, suffered bullying so hard (with racist and misogynistic traces) that she had to abandon social media. The result of Disney and JJ was not to stand behind the actress and instead appease to trolls and all-righters to basically humiliate both the character and the actress to please them.

I don't care you think TLJ sucked or didn't make sense, is about a mega corporation again pleasing it's toxic fanbase. I mean look at this:


I believe she gets a double page in TLJ. Do films generally give back to back dual pages for side characters if the side character isn't prominent anymore?
 

DeathyBoy

Member
Oct 29, 2017
3,430
Under my Hela Hela
Makes sense that they would.

I believe she gets a double page in TLJ. Do films generally give back to back dual pages for side characters if the side character isn't prominent anymore?

Dominic M got a double page for spouting exposition and answering Reddit theories about TLJ. You telling me he needs two pages and Rose, who at the fucking least could have two pages filling in the gaps between films, doesn't?
 

Deleted member 42055

User requested account closure
Banned
Apr 12, 2018
11,215
Guys, you are missing the Forrest for the trees here. The point is not, "oh well Rose sucked anyway", which is your opinion and has no base for the character approach on RoS.

The thing is that Kelly, suffered bullying so hard (with racist and misogynistic traces) that she had to abandon social media. The result of Disney and JJ was not to stand behind the actress and instead appease to trolls and all-righters to basically humiliate both the character and the actress to please them.

I don't care you think TLJ sucked or didn't make sense, is about a mega corporation again pleasing it's toxic fanbase. I mean look at this:



Yup, repeating this in here :

I would Maybe be able to entertain the notion that her story line had concluded so that's why she doesn't have much to do here, but when you have shit like Dom Monaghan's character coming out of nowhere and getting exposition lines+screen time that don't make any sense, that could've easily been given to her ...smh.

I mean if Rose was translating all these texts or whatever she was doing at her desk job you could at least have that pay off with her being able to spout off some key information here or there, she gets to do absolutely fuck all, with a pat on the shoulder
 

Firefoxprime

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
520
Abrams's new Spider-Man comic makes me think it's because her character doesn't fit the racist trope of "rebellious Asian girl with dyed hair" which is apparently the only kind of Asian character that can exist.
Yeah....that's not a racist trope. 😕
Stereotype? Absolutely.

No one looks at that specific stereotypical trope and says "Yeah, this makes asian characters look lesser than their fellow characters".

Cookie cutter? Yes.
Prejudice based? More likely.
Racist? Eh.
 

Nida

Member
Aug 31, 2019
11,200
Everett, Washington
Well okay then.

I know you're determined to justify this weird hatred for a completely inoffensive character and to 'out-woke' this movie's script, but don't you think that's a bit much?



Luke was gonna show up to confront Kylo anyway and Finn's death wouldn't have changed the outcome whatsoever. The movie is fairly clear about that

Wait, when was there sexual assault?
 

Arta

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,445
Wow, and I thought she had about 10 minutes, not 1!

I'll never forgive Abrams or Disney for doing this to her. I didn't like the Last Jedi or her character decisions, but the proper solution is to write better material for her.

She was the fourth main character from the last movie, and now we got cameos from other JJ alums that lasted longer than her screen time. That would be shitty on it's own, but especially after all the abuse she suffered online it's inexcusable. Just shows that Disney's stance of encouraging representation in Star Wars is just for show with no real effort put into the characters or courage standing by the actors.
 

ZackieChan

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,056
Dominic M got a double page for spouting exposition and answering Reddit theories about TLJ. You telling me he needs two pages and Rose, who at the fucking least could have two pages filling in the gaps between films, doesn't?
It's possible he had a larger role that was cut down? I dunno. The movie was probably edited to hell and back to create what we got. That's apparently a big part of how JJ makes his films.
 

Iceman

Member
Oct 26, 2017
605
Alhambra, CA
My solution: I'm going to try to come up with a pitch for a Rose side-story film. Like
a low budget, Die Hard/Raid or post-apocalyptic/The Last of Us type of pure survival story. She could be sent to lead a small team on a diplomatic mission, as the now former resistance tries to pull together the various systems to rebuild a galactic senate/congress and she gets stuck in a battle between factions. Maybe influenced by Iraq/Afghanistan. Trick is how to work in the galaxy-trotting trope. My initial idea would be to move the stand-off (something like Die Hard or The Raid would normally be in a lone, fixed location - a "monster in the house" type scenario) onto a starship in the second half. She could take control of (or sabotage) the ship, crash land it on her home planet (a chance to showcase a planet ravaged by the First Order and get some meatier backstory), and use her familiarity with the planet to overcome insurmountable odds. I'd need at least one more planet - we'd probably have to start on a completely new planet carrying out some covert mission that makes use of Rose's mechanical ken as well as revealing her potential as diplomat. Next problem: how to incorporate the force. Maybe the small diplomatic team includes one of Rey's padawans? They could be young and weak in the force, and full of overcompensating bluster - they could have their own arc, but Rose would be the steady hand helping the padawan mature. And then the bigger concern: how does it set up further conflict in the greater Star Wars storyline. First guess is that one of the factions has plans to control their entire system and has developed a new technology/weapon to ward off interference from outsiders, like the new, new republic.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,495
Henderson, NV
Buncha worthless shitheels being validated by how much she was tossed off.
Amazing. The only reason I was even partly interested in this movie was to see what would happen between her and Finn as she was the most interesting character in the last movie - by FAR. For me at least. I'm actually amazed. I haven't seen the movie, and now i'm pretty certain that I won't be seeing it.
 

The Silver

Member
Oct 28, 2017
10,725
I don't really care so much that Rose was given a smaller role, I expected that to be the case when her character really only existed to serve Finn's development.(well I didn't expect her to get full on Jar Jar'd) But moreso I'm bothered that JJ had the gall to come out and try and win brownie points by saying Kelly/Rose was the best thing Rian did in TLJ only to throw her under the bus come movie time.
 
Oct 26, 2017
8,206
Have no issues with people saying Rose was a poorly written and cliché character. Nothing against the actress, it's Rians fault, slowed down and sidelined one of the promising new leads of the saga to retread already established ground. It was right of JJ to keep Rose in the background unless she had something meaningful to add. Fin & Poe were much better in TRoS as a trio, shouldn't be controversial to say this.
What established ground?

Also Finn hung out with Jannah more than he did either Poe or Rey. Another redundant new character alongside Hyde, Zorii, and D0.
 

SerAardvark

Member
Oct 25, 2017
986
Amazing. The only reason I was even partly interested in this movie was to see what would happen between her and Finn as she was the most interesting character in the last movie - by FAR. For me at least. I'm actually amazed. I haven't seen the movie, and now i'm pretty certain that I won't be seeing it.

Finn and Rose were actually de-coupled in the Resistance Reborn book that released right before the movie - Finn tells Poe that he and Rose are just friends and says the same about him and Rey.
 

Yukari

Member
Mar 28, 2018
11,712
Thailand
Guys, you are missing the Forrest for the trees here. The point is not, "oh well Rose sucked anyway", which is your opinion and has no base for the character approach on RoS.

The thing is that Kelly, suffered bullying so hard (with racist and misogynistic traces) that she had to abandon social media. The result of Disney and JJ was not to stand behind the actress and instead appease to trolls and all-righters to basically humiliate both the character and the actress to please them.

I don't care you think TLJ sucked or didn't make sense, is about a mega corporation again pleasing it's toxic fanbase. I mean look at this:



Even Pablo no idea to write her background?
 

Khanimus

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
40,215
Greater Vancouver
Finn and Rose were actually de-coupled in the Resistance Reborn book that released right before the movie - Finn tells Poe that he and Rose are just friends and says the same about him and Rey.
Lol so they wrote a book to try and curb the glaring hole in their relationship between the last movie and their new script to explain her new underwritten part. Great. I'm sure the actress appreciates it.
 

uncelestial

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,060
San Francisco, CA, USA
I mean look at this:


I'm sorry, do you think this is like, making a point? It's unintentionally paraphrasing Homer's ridiculous "Poochie" suggestions.

This character is not entitled to a bunch of screen time or extra consideration or importance. People noticing that she was not given extra screen time and lamenting "why isn't this Rose talking" or "whenever Rose isn't onscreen, everyone should be asking 'Where's Rose?'" or whatever else the Simpsons satirized 25 years ago without you taking heed, is not a thing worth sharing.

And I dunno if you noticed, but it looks like the picture cropped out more Rose coverage and this "barely a paragraph" seems to be a half-page, which isn't bad for someone with like 3 lines in the movie. Last movie? She got more coverage:

EMw0ZacX0AEuJu-


To be honest, the thread title should probably be "Star Wars reduces screentime for Rose Tico" rather than "sidelines Kelly Marie Tran," which is inflammatory to say the least.
 
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Shaun Solo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,079
Rose forced a kiss on Finn without his consent, and it was especially awkward as there was not even anything between them throughout the movie.
Calling it sexual assault is disingenuous af and people saying it are indeed trying to "out-woke" the movie as another poster perfectly put it.

And Rose absolutely has an interest in Finn from their first scene as she's enamored by his involvement in the Starkiller Base shit from TFA. She thinks he's a real ass hero like her sister but quickly realizes his self interest trumps everything else with him trying to abandon ship.

IMO, Finn's interest in Rose is their on paper but Johnson and Boyega do a poor job in those scenes in conveying that. The scene on Canto Bight where she's describing how she wishes she could "put [her] fist through this whole lousy beautiful town" (one of my favorite lines in any SW movie) has Finn looking at her in what I assume is meant to be the moment he begins to be inspired by her beliefs (and by extension, her) but Boyega's just got a blank stare on his face. There's also the scene with DJ on the ship where Rose gives him her necklace and Finn gets pissed and confronts him. There Boyega is fine but it comes off more like a older brother / protector thing rather than him getting worked up due to more personal feelings.

Then there's final scene with Finn looking over Rose as she's passed out from saving his life (mirroring the imagery of Finn being passed out and Rey watching over him at the end of TFA) that is clearly to leave a door open for those two characters' relationship to develop further in the sequel, but that's apparently completely killed in some filler book that the vast majority has no idea exists.

I can agree with saying it's shown to be one sided but to say there's absolutely nothing there prior to the kiss is wrong. And no, that doesn't make it sexual assault which again is a dumb and disingenuous reading of it meant to solely be inflammatory.
 

Haruko

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,641
It's possible he had a larger role that was cut down? I dunno. The movie was probably edited to hell and back to create what we got. That's apparently a big part of how JJ makes his films.

It's likely he was a part of the scene(s) that properly introduced Klaud (the slug alien) that was cut.
 

Charpunk

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,630
Guys, you are missing the Forrest for the trees here. The point is not, "oh well Rose sucked anyway", which is your opinion and has no base for the character approach on RoS.

The thing is that Kelly, suffered bullying so hard (with racist and misogynistic traces) that she had to abandon social media. The result of Disney and JJ was not to stand behind the actress and instead appease to trolls and all-righters to basically humiliate both the character and the actress to please them.

I don't care you think TLJ sucked or didn't make sense, is about a mega corporation again pleasing it's toxic fanbase. I mean look at this:



I still have absolutely no idea what point Dominic Monaghan's role served other than "friend of J.J. Abrams".
 

Zen

The Wise Ones
Member
Nov 1, 2017
9,658
The harassment of KMT is one of the worst stains on SW fandom and TROS not making her part of the main cast is really cowardly.
 

Arthands

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
8,039
It sucks but then again, the movie already has a lot on its plate. Heck we barely see R2D2 too
 

UltraMagnus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,670
I still have absolutely no idea what point Dominic Monaghan's role served other than "friend of J.J. Abrams".

He was supposed to be some kind of Sith/lore expert or some such and had more lines that were cut out of the film so much so that Monaghan at the premiere joked his character's name was "Blink And You'll Miss Me".
 

Deleted member 42055

User requested account closure
Banned
Apr 12, 2018
11,215
At least where I live, an unwanted kiss is literally sexual assault

Surely her most likely being concussed and out of her mind after nearly dying let's that accusation slide ...
He was supposed to be some kind of Sith/lore expert or some such and had more lines that were cut out of the film so much so that Monaghan at the premiere joked his character's name was "Blink And You'll Miss Me".
And this kind of, "wait what the heck? "type of thing is all over this film which has contributed to it settling so poorly for me. So many things not fleshed out enough, half baked, clearly suffering from a poor and haphazard edit And none of that is solved by repeat viewings
 

IHaveIce

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,749
So the lengths Era went to defend TLJ from any critic is the same length Era will go to attack TROS?

If they wanted Rose to be a more major leading character for the resistance, who interacted directly with Leia it sounds good, not really ununderstandable that Rose would want to be more one the strategic side after her dangerous experience in TLJ.

If the writer says they had to cut scenes than we have to believe it for now except Kelly herself will say something.
 

UltraMagnus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,670
I really do believe everyone working on these films is generally a good person, but I can't help but wonder if

1.) Finn had to get a new girlfriend for VIII because we can't be having the black lead and the white woman lead hooking up in such a big budget film. And so there's a common work around to this is to give the black male character an Asian or Hispanic or racially ambiguous girlfriend as a workaround.

2.) A lot of the backlash to KMT is there because she doesn't fit the trope (at least how its filmed as Rose) of the exotic fetishized sexy Asian woman. KMT is *gorgeous* as is evident in her blowing away everyone the red carpet I thought, but her character in VIII certainly isn't presented in that trope, and I've also heard people casually remark shit like "well if the actress who played Rose's sister (a more model-like type) was Rose, I'd have no problem with that character". Which is such bullshit, but I can't help but wonder if Rose would be riding along with the main cast if she looked more like Lucy Liu or Kelly Hu.
 

SparkleMotion

Banned
Nov 3, 2017
2,812
User Banned (2 Weeks): Inflammatory drive-by in a thread on concerns of representation
I'm glad she wasn't in the film more. She was the Jar Jar Binks of The Last Jedi.
 
Oct 26, 2017
213
I honestly thought Rose died at the end of the Last Jedi (hadn't seen it since it was in cinema). Then watching The Rise of Skywalker I was thinking, didn't she die? Why is everyone acting so normal around her? She came back from the dead. The dead.

I haven't even gone back to watch the last Jedi since. I will likely binge watch the newest trilogy when they are available at home to see TLJ again.
 

Sponged

Member
Oct 29, 2017
308
User Banned (2 Weeks): Inflammatory drive-by in a thread about concerns surrounding representation
Gonna get a lot of flak for my opinion here goes.

Just seen the film for the first time with my partner and we was both so glad they basically did away with her character as she was pointless and shoehorned in. The new characters were much better and served more of a purpose, also the film going back to its core trio and not splitting them up was a much better approach.

The less of Rian Johnson's mess of a film carried forward the better.

EDIT: They probably could have had her instead of the random slug that's on the falcon at the start, and have her help Finn take down the ship, but apart from that I'm fine with her not going on the main adventure.
 
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Zen

The Wise Ones
Member
Nov 1, 2017
9,658
Gonna get a lot of flak for my opinion here goes.

Just seen the film for the first time with my partner and we was both so glad they basically did away with her character as she was pointless and shoehorned in. The new characters were much better and served more of a purpose, also the film going back to its core trio and not splitting them up was a much better approach.

The less of Rian Johnson's mess of a film carried forward the better.

EDIT: They probably could have had her instead of the random slug that's on the falcon at the start, and have her help Finn take down the ship, but apart from that I'm fine with her not going on the main adventure.
I wasn't the biggest fan of her arc in TLJ, but I like her character and she is important as a representative of Asian Americans in the cast who isn't stereotyped to hell in a SW movie. As a mechanic she would know a lot about how ships work and would be a valuable part of the team. Instead we get Poe and Rey effortlessly doing most of that. Adventures are more fun with more people. They didn't have to stick to the trio aspect from the OT.
 

TalonJH

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,875
Louisville, KY
I was disappointed in the lack of Rose. It also felt like they erased Rose and Finn's relationship and replaced it with a shoulder pat. I still enjoyed the movie but she got a raw deal.
 

Green Mario

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,319
Shouldn't expect anything less from a fandom that harassed and threatened a ten year old boy for "ruining" their precious franchise. Fucking gross. I feel so bad for her.
 

KayMote

Member
Nov 5, 2017
1,326
It was so jarring too see how her role was handled in the movie with such a weak narrative excuse - at least I would have liked Rose to have a few more speaking lines which could have been easily achived - as others already pointed out - by getting rid of some other unnecessary speaking roles that didn't add anything at all. Rose may not have been my favorite character in TLJ, but she was fine and I really feel sorry for the actress and the missed potential of more diversity and representation in such a huge universe like Star Wars....

That being said - on a meta level - it is quite interesting too see the merging of pure fiction and reality within the Sequel trilogy. Now with Social Media and its toxic vocal fanbase playing such a huge role in our lifes it is almost impossible to view a fictious story in an isolated diegetic way.
Of course YOU CAN on an individual basis argue that you are glad she was written out, because you didn't like her character, but on a SYSTEMIC bigger scale it's still messed up to do so.