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Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order -- Lucasfilm Was Originally Resistant To The Idea
- Thread starter dex3108
- Start date
Ive seen this tier 3 fan meme popping up alot ,wats that about?
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You mean the dead lieutenant from Battlestar Galactica.
Make Papaltine come back Clearly bring the hard job to the story group.
As a fan the destruction to established lore gives me a headache. I can't imagine how he feels considering that's the main point of his job.
Make Papaltine come back Clearly bring the hard job to the story group.
I kind of feel that Jedi are sacred because anything overpowered or note worthy will have impact on the saga because of the Jedi myth.
But a bounty hunter? Do what you want, no one cares.
But a bounty hunter? Do what you want, no one cares.
And you wonder why EA isn't exactly jumping to make a bunch of SW games.
When you have a mandate that everything must be canon, that suddenly comes with a shit ton of caveats. Namely, you can't make a character like this:
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Then TROS gave us this anyway.
It's owned by Disney but operates independently. Something that some people have a real hard time getting their heads around. It's a difficult concept.
All star wars games are now "official cannon" whereas before they weren't really. I think George's old stance before Disney took over was something along the lines of "the movies are cannon and anything that doesn't conflict can be considered 'cannon' too but they don't really count." Disney has gone on record to say that all Star Wars content released under them is official cannon. I imagine that makes Lucasfilm a little more hesitant to green light a project. Especially when that project is about the most powerful and important characters in their universe.
Well, if they're working on a narrative-driven game, they should at least try to make it work with lore. That's my take. Lucasfilm stance on making everything "canon" has its set of pros and cons, I totally agree with this.
But a lot of people here seems to think Story Group's job is to tie everything with the movies, which is not really a case. EA also messed up here. Few years ago, we had times where they said people weren't interested in singleplayer games anymore. They didn't really had too much of singleplayer titles in their portfolio either. Even those outside of Star Wars licence.
Fallen Order mostly builds from stories told outside of main movies, the entire Inquisitors stuff came from comics and animated series. And while movies didn't do it justice, some of the stories already payed off in other media. For example, I've read somewhere that characters originally introduced in Battlefront II campaign had a massive role in one of the more recent novels that tied off to a lot of stuff from expanded media. I think it's a cool idea.
Imagine a video game not having something cool in it because 'canon is sacred'
Meanwhile they just released a film in theaters that directly contradicted every previous film
Meanwhile they just released a film in theaters that directly contradicted every previous film
This.
EA has still 2 SW games coming in the next years (EA Motive and JFO sequel) and maybe they have Battlefront 3 as well and if they released 3 games by the end of 2024, that's 6 titles in 10 years, a good amount.
LucasFilm is messing with this, and i'm pretty sure they wanted JFO to be out as soon as possible so they can push their multi-media SW with The Mandalorian and the new movie. KOTOR 3 is never happening or better a SW RPG will never see the light as long as Disney wants everything canon.
Lucas film OKd the latest film storyline and OKd putting the plot setup into fortnite exclusively instead of the film.
their opinion on storytelling doesn't seem very valuable right now.
their opinion on storytelling doesn't seem very valuable right now.
Wasn't that originally what Star Wars 1313 was supposed to be before it got canned?
I'm guessing "protective" does not equal "must never be allowed to feel sadness or fail at anything."
They aren't. The movie fillmakers only answer to Kathleen Kennedy. They can ignore the story group as much as they want. The process for fillmakers is 100% different than "licensees" trying to make Star Wars content.
Don't worry, in 5 - 10 years when Star Wars interest has waned significantly, I bet they'll drop the canon mandate so we can actually get some fun shit out of the series again.
Yeah free rein on Star Wars games, what good could ever come of that...
Probably as a reaction to two things in particular other than however the movie itself is:
1: Disney/LFilms Damage Controlling and office-politicizing creative process after TLJ's outrage
2: The alleged Disney's corporate meddling with the actual content of ROS that happened in the last months of production.
Restrain your creatives too much and they'll start to oust you for it. It's like when Patrick Weekes called out his boss's ego over the Mass Effect 3 ending.
Of all the things Rey can do in TLJ it's not her who has the biggest canonical inconsistency. That was a shock in Force Awakens, and TLJ did little to correct it. But in TLJ It's Luke. The way they portray what he is able to do at the end just shows they had a disproportionate idea of what should be possible with the force. In ROS the Force idiosynchrasies took a backseat in favor of that egrigous "Super-lightspeed jumping" sequence.
The force is the "magic" of Star Wars and even when you deal with magic you create implicit rules and barriers for it, so you don't end up with an audience saying "So if he can do X, how come Y hasn't also done it?" Imagine in the future there's 10 force users as strong as Luke just projecting holograms on planets they aren't even on that just beat all the bad guys. This is a recipe for incoherent stories.
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Yeah it's not like doing that killed him or anything.
Some force powers are harder for some individuals to do. We see this in multiple series.
Even if they do know force projection and are somehow strong enough for it to not kill them it leaves you with two issues.
1) If they're strong enough to survive doing a technique that killed one of the most powerful Jedi ever, then the bad guys were already screwed.
2) How are they supposed to beat them exactly? They're a projection. Luke's entire plan was to distract Kylo, not beat him.
There's a lot of "well why don't they just do such and such" moments in these films.
Star Wars Galaxy at Disney World had some props removed - like a hidden Ark of the Covenant - because "Tier-3 fans" complained it broke the immersion. "Tier-3" was the Disneyland term for uber-fans who obsess over everything.
After hearing about the hell that Amy Henning endured trying to get her Star Wars game off the ground and hearing these stories, I'm convinced Lucasfilm/Disney are WAAAAY too controlling and also have very little understanding of how difficult and time-consuming making a quality video game is compared to other ventures. I have friends who have worked on Star Wars projects under Disney who said it was utter hell - about how everything you develop is at a snail's pace because every tiny thing they did - from designing a blaster to creating a hairstyle - had to be approved first from the braintrust at Lucasfilm... and it rarely ever was. They'd get back stupid notes like "this hairstyle is not in vogue during this era of Star Wars" and "this material is not worn by citizens of Tatooine" and they'd just get a mountain of notes back on basic things to change, things even the craziest Star Wars fan wouldn't notice or care about.
You can't make a quality video game in a timely manner when someone is second-guessing every single thing you pitch, design, or program.
Fallen Order is a miracle it's as good as it is, even with all its flaws.
And the irony that Lucasfilm was THIS controlling over their games - yet RoS is so chaotic and poorly executed due to LACK of planning - makes me seriously wonder why their priorities are so skewed.
Ah yes. Because nothing fun ha ever come out of the Disney era.
Just ignore the multiple books, TV shows, comics, video games, and yes, movies, that a lot of people have clearly enjoyed.
I wonder if that's why the story and characters were bland throughout most of the game, if they were highly restrictive in what they could do story wise.
I feel like it's not specifically that the Jedi were sacred, but that the game was planned to be set post order 66, and that LF doesn't want 5468 Jedi to have survived that
Isn't Cal's backstory basically the same as Kanan? They might of thought it was redundant at first.
You mean the supremely generic backstory of "former Padawan hides from the empire"
Couldn't possibly be space for more than one of those.
It's always a mixture of both from everyone involved. It's how almost everything gets made because it's generally business people that can afford to drop $100 million + but lack creativity, and artsy creative people that have that vision but no money.
But when the artsy creative people have unlimited money they produce weird things that nobody likes but them so you're stuck with this mess of cooperative/competing visions that become the forge for creative projects.
Or to put it another way, without heat and pressure there's no diamonds.
I don't know that was literally my first thought.
"Wait didn't we do this story already?"
I'm just saying if this was one of the movies you know you'd have people moaning "oh my god look at how uncreative these hacks are." It wouldn't surprise me if they weren't sure if they wanted to do that again, which obviously they did anyway.
Going by the article, it seems Respawn wanted to make a game were you are a Jedi from the start. When they pulled it back and said he was a Padawan in hiding LFL was okay with it.
He also gave TFA 2/5. He seems to absolutely hate the "Nostalgia rehash" approach. He scored TLJ 4/5.
Yeah the contrast between pre-Disney Lucasfilm and post-canon Lucasfilm is pretty funny tbhWhen you have a mandate that everything must be canon, that suddenly comes with a shit ton of caveats. Namely, you can't make a character like this:
Force Unleashed basically reads like fanfiction. "Vader had a secret apprectice named Starkiller and he was super badass!!! He could kill Jedi and even could FORCE PULL A STAR DESTROYER!!!! He was so badass he beat Vader in a fight and almost killed Palpatine!!!!!!!!!!"
I enjoyed JFO, and I think the second half of the story really comes into its own, but you can tell how restrained they were by adhering to canon. We have all these customization options for Cal's lightsaber, but what about a red lightsaber? Nope, can't have that, it's canonically the Sith color. Also can't have a black one either, since the Darksaber is canonically the only black lightsaber. And we have to make sure everything lines up with the canon established by Clone Wars and Rebels, like the Inquisitors and the Night Sisters.
I mean, not that Force Unleashed's story was good (in fact it was terrible), but I feel like a Star Wars game could benefit from being less constrained. Being a Jedi is ultimately a power fantasy, and while TFU was clunky as hell and has aged like milk, I can at least appreciate what it was trying to do.
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Putting aside a lot from this post, you and a lot of people seem to be under the impression that the same people who are in charge of things like this are the same ones directing story for the films. The story group, from what I'm familiar with, doesn't tell the script writers of the movies what to write, they simply instruct them on the "rules" of the Star Wars universe or figure out how to have tie in media work with it. Rian Johnson talked about this; the light speed "holdo maneuver" was his idea, he got feedback, and the story group had to come up with how it fit in the wider scheme of things.
How Lucasfilm interacts with its licensees is wholly removed from how movie production works, from the process, to the people making executive and creative decisions - which is the NORM for things like this.
What about people like me who LIKE these stories adhering to canon? Why is it such a big deal you can't have a red lightsaber? You can already change it's color whenever you want when if they were that strict as you say you wouldn't be able to do the second he made his saber.
And didn't people also constantly complain about how stupidly OP Starkiller was?
The easy compromise, for aesthetic choices anyway, is to have a "Legends Mode" option in the menu. You want the red lightsaber, fine but you have to acknowledge that it's a part of Legends and not canon.