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Star Trek: Picard - Season 1 |OT| Re-ENGAGE!
- Thread starter Spectromixer
- Start date
I thought this episode was fine, more so the second half to the first for data, Riker and Picard. They still have a long way to go to get me to care about some of the newer cast though, but they do seem to have strong foundations to build upon if they can get the writing there.
The Data stuff did nothing for me and part of that is because I am very opposed to the philosophy articulated in it. The dogmatic humanism on mortality and meaning is a parochial and unadventurous insight into what it does or can mean to be human. Meaning is tied to the contingencies of being human and those contingencies alter that meaning depending on what we are, or - there is no stable meaning and this can be thought of in light of our mortality being contingent on our ability to understand and control the different facets of our material being, our bodies. At some point, we could adapt to non-aging, given the appropriate knowledge and circumstance. In the Star Trek universe, it's especially ridiculous that this paradigm shift hasn't been explored seeing as the technology is right there with borg nano-probes and even some of the stuff they've already shown through their medical technology.
Also, Picard 'cutting the cord' with Data seems like an unethical assisted suicide. If we're to take the Data simulation as a living conscious being, then Picard is basically killing somebody who isn't terminally ill (was the pseudo-Data supposed to be eternally trapped in this thing?) . 'Kill me because I want to be dead and isn't it clever that my quest to be human lines up with this too' doesn't seem like a justified reason to kill someone. It reminds me of the Voyager episode where the one Q wanted to end its existence because it was bored of being immortal and omnipotent. I'm a suicide counsellor and I find these kinds of outlooks really negative. I think people consider agelessness in a way that makes them frightened of its potential. It's understandable but ultimately misguided, at least in the sense that it isn't a reason to tie it into dogmas of meaning. The absolute that is exposed in how the writing conceives of meaning this way is repressive.
Also, Picard 'cutting the cord' with Data seems like an unethical assisted suicide. If we're to take the Data simulation as a living conscious being, then Picard is basically killing somebody who isn't terminally ill (was the pseudo-Data supposed to be eternally trapped in this thing?) . 'Kill me because I want to be dead and isn't it clever that my quest to be human lines up with this too' doesn't seem like a justified reason to kill someone. It reminds me of the Voyager episode where the one Q wanted to end its existence because it was bored of being immortal and omnipotent. I'm a suicide counsellor and I find these kinds of outlooks really negative. I think people consider agelessness in a way that makes them frightened of its potential. It's understandable but ultimately misguided, at least in the sense that it isn't a reason to tie it into dogmas of meaning. The absolute that is exposed in how the writing conceives of meaning this way is repressive.
I am just going to jump in on this point and say that I hope this style of writing/TV comes back. You can build towards epic, apocolyptic events with your cast but give them time to gel, to have inside jokes, adventures and history instead of trying to do it in the first season. This is very similar to the DC attempt at Justice League. Spend the time and lay the groundwork. If this was season 4 or 5 of Picard, and it ended with him dying (not getting resurrected), the emotional impact would have been much higher. This is why the episodes (or scenes in certain episodes) that have callbacks to history (Riker, Troi, Data, even Seven to a lesser extent) are the strongest episodes in the series.
The acting was superb.
The overall story, while placed poorly, was fantastically written.
The resolution of Data's storyline.
The wonderful use of legacy characters in respectful ways.
The growth and recovery of Picard.
It had its rough spots but it is by far and wide the best first season of Trek ever.
You can't judge it objectively. Everyone's reasons for liking it are entirely personal and unique. The only objectively wrong opinions are things like "that episode was 20 minutes long" or "Scarlett Johansson played Data".
Ikea is timeless!JFC, they used IKEA lamps... IKEA lamps!!
This is not my Star Trek!
JFC, they used IKEA lamps... IKEA lamps!!
This is not my Star Trek!
? That happens all the time. Set decoration isn't 'magic lets fab new things for everything'
iMI am not going to begrudge people not liking this or even hating it,
I can't tell if this is satire at this point. Trek re-used props all the time, and I really don't get the issue with using off the shelf stuff...JFC, they used IKEA lamps... IKEA lamps!!
This is not my Star Trek!
I liked it pretty well, though it is at times pretty dumb. My biggest beef is with Agnes after a certain point.
Talking about it positively here got some people to demand justifications for opinions and called the thread a circle jerk which was pretty silly considering it's mostly negative.
When you are caught up and join the convo, us who enjoy the show could use some more company.
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I hear the actress is growing out her mustache so can twirl it while delivering her borderline incestuous lines to her brother.
Seriously though they totally ADR'd Seven's "This is for Hugh!!" action hero line. I wonder what happened to put that in there.
She was originally going to say "we couldn't afford rails".
"I hope you learned to swim!"
I mean the Borg cube is half submerged after all.
Imagine holding the original TNG to today's standard. :P
It wasn't good in your opinion, it was good in mine.
Watched the last 3 episodes last night. Solid season. Some good character development and interactions, kept pace reasonably well. Writing was iffy in spots but I think it held up overall. Between this and Discovery I think it's two good entries into the series and the fact they're happening at once is pretty sweet.
Some nice CGI at the end there too.
Some nice CGI at the end there too.
Him dropping was odd, but given that he was by far my least favorite thing about the show I didn't mind much.
Interview with the showrunner:
variety.com
A bit about negative fan response
Some outlook on season 2:
Also seems to confirm that Seven and Raffi are gay
‘Star Trek: Picard’ Is Divisive — and Showrunner Michael Chabon Doesn’t Mind at All
In a candid conversation, showrunner Michael Chabon discussed the challenges and rewards in boldly going where no "Trek" has gone before.
variety.com
A bit about negative fan response
Some outlook on season 2:
Also seems to confirm that Seven and Raffi are gay
I wonder if the replicator spits out everything in pieces that you order from Ikea in the 24th century and you have to put it together...
Starfleet seems to keep ships in service for a long time. With Starfleet's main shipyard destroyed in the synth attack they would likely have to keep older ships in service even longer than they were. It doesn't make sense that Starfleet was somehow able to bring hundreds of the same brand new ship for the battle and nothing else.
Interview with the showrunner:
‘Star Trek: Picard’ Is Divisive — and Showrunner Michael Chabon Doesn’t Mind at All
In a candid conversation, showrunner Michael Chabon discussed the challenges and rewards in boldly going where no "Trek" has gone before.
A bit about negative fan response
Some outlook on season 2:
Also seems to confirm that Seven and Raffi are gay
This isnt just about expectations. Its also about fundamental failures in crafting a cohesive, compelling and logical story.
Youtube review videos, Amazon UK reviews, Metacritic. It's not just Era.
However you are right, most people do seemed to have liked it. But don't let that fool you because there is no benefit in making a show that annoys a large minority of some of the most hardcore fans.
And more importantly PIC wont have the sort of longevity that previous ST shows had. It's like how Nintendo went after casuals with the Wii only to see them disappear.
I like it when you post about why you dislike it. That's interesting to me, to hear people's opinions. And yours are very different to mine, so it's a good perspective to hear.
Speak for yourself. Have faith in your own taste. Don't try to justify yourself with "other people feel the same".
Picard is only running another season or two, Stewart has said he doesn't want another 7-8 years working on a tv show.
TNG is one of the very best and very worst of tv history. I love TNG but these days I skip so much of it for the actual good episodes and encourage other people to do the same.
I think if TNG aired today it would have been sadly cancelled before it got good, especially given the increased competition. Evengood modern tv shows like The Expanse are lucky to survive.
I watched this to the end and so throughly disliked it. Amazing how it does not capitalise correctly on it's own themes, ignores built up Character traits, and indeed managed to be so incredibly cliched. It reminded me of a Marvel movie - I felt literal embarassment multiple times while watching it.
This was not good :(
This was not good :(
This is such a polarising season for me. Data Makes me cry but the rest is mostly trash. This episode was horrible. Every character just jumping out from behind the camera ignoring actual geograph; the Romulans have 5 different planetary sterilisation patterns? (Actually that maybe doesn't surprise me); synths are ok now gh they have clearly shown themselves able to wipe out all organic life if they have a tantrum; are seven and Rafro a thing now!?
I wonder if Jonathan Del Arco (Hugh) and Jeri Ryan had a hand in that. Jonathan is gay but wasnt out when he did I, Borg. Over the years he became good friends with Jeri somehow and even appeared in at least one Voyager episode as an alien of the week.
I seem to recall an interview with Jonathan about how he and Jeri were advocates for showing homosexuality openly and plainly in Trek. Maybe they had some success.
'but did it come from anywhere:? Had seven and Raffi even spent any time together in the show before they're locking fingers?
I am only pointing out to him what I have heard from others.
You guys probably already know the differing reasons that many of us dislike this show.
I'd heard this somewhere too, which makes the whole "golem" thing at the end totally unnecessary. His brain condition could have persisted but not have progressed much throughout the run of the show and that gives you a good plotline for the last season and to finally close out the character. That the body doesn't even make him live longer (absent the stupid death in the episode) makes it even less needed, but it was a stupid Voyager-style reset for no real reason other than 30-seconds worth of characters crying over Picard.