Star Trek Discovery - Season 2 |OT| Exploration is logical

deimosmasque · Mar 25, 2019

I couldn't find a screen cap online. But I recall the probe being more squid like than a geometric shape. And much more aggressive then the average Borg attack.

The Borg are methodical in there actions. The probe was aggressive and hostile.

Himynameischris · Mar 25, 2019

deimosmasque said:
I couldn't find a screen cap online. But I recall the probe being more squid like than a geometric shape. And much more aggressive then the average Borg attack.

The Borg are methodical in there actions. The probe was aggressive and hostile.

Here you go

deimosmasque · Mar 25, 2019

Yeah that doesn't real scream Borg to me.

VorpalNonsense · Mar 25, 2019

This out of Control stuff is probably a setup for why S31 is unknown/separated from Starfleet in the future, not for the borg. I think every time anything happens in any star trek show, somebody tries to assign it to the borg. The borg are the Idris Elba of Star Trek. Fans want them in everything.

Incoming theories about Prime Balthazar Edison using his assimilation tech to merge himself and his drone swarm with Control to become the Borg.

DBT85 · Mar 25, 2019

Only just caught up.

Can I say how thoroughly delighted I am that everyone who said it was Michael was wrong.

Not that I had any issue it being Michael, but another big plot point being telegraphed by this thread, as it was last year with Voq/Tyler, would have pissed me right off.

I swore at the start of the season I wouldn't browse here because of it, but I did just to have someone to talk to about it. Had it actually been Michael I'd have deffo not been for season 3.

DBT85 · Mar 25, 2019

Skyfireblaze said:
Hmm as fun as that sounds fun how does she end up in the Delta Quadrant? Also unless they retcon this, the Borg seem fully unaware of "humans" by the time the Enterprise D encounters them the first time. And there's a unused script for a Voyager episode that describes the Borg's origins as a failed defensive-weapon of a Delta Quadrant species that went out of control. Originally the system was supposed to infect any attackers and simply make them non-hostile.

The borg assimilated humans long before D met them. Seven and her parents and their ship.

DieEnteWurzel · Mar 25, 2019

getting some strong LOST vibes from this, everything just ends in a overhasty plot twist that may or may not make any sense in future episodes
Spock being hunted thoughout the galaxy because they have video footage of him killing people that most certainly was not manipulated in any way, turns out you just have to switch to infrared to see it was faked using holograms. Found 100% matching bio-neural signature of Michael in Red-Angel data that cannot be faked, turns out it's not Michael. Really having a hard time taking any of this serious (and WTF are they going for with Tilly?)

did I miss the reason Michael had to "die" the way she did? Couldn't they just sedate her during all this?

Skyfireblaze · Mar 25, 2019

DBT85 said:
The borg assimilated humans long before D met them. Seven and her parents and their ship.

Oh right how could I have forgotten that!

deimosmasque · Mar 25, 2019

Skyfireblaze said:
Oh right how could I have forgotten that!

And before the Enterprise's encounter the Borg was uprooting and assimilating Federation and Romulan Outpost on both sides of the Nuetrel Zone.

Skyfireblaze · Mar 25, 2019

deimosmasque said:
And before the Enterprise's encounter the Borg was uprooting and assimilating Federation and Romulan Outpost on both sides of the Nuetrel Zone.

Well that shows how long ago my last rewatch of TNG was, wow.

deimosmasque · Mar 25, 2019

Don't worry it was a minor point in a really bad Season 1 episode. The one where they defrost people from the 90s to show how unevolved we viewers are compared to the ultra amazing Enterprise crew.

Mr. Pointy · Mar 25, 2019

Calling it. There's more than one Red Angel. You'd think future time travelers wouldn't have a contingency?

Mr. Pointy · Mar 25, 2019

rsfour said:
Burnham's dad is gonna be Lance Reddick

I hope so.

Keeping this double post for future generations.

Window · Mar 25, 2019

DieEnteWurzel said:
getting some strong LOST vibes from this, everything just ends in a overhasty plot twist that may or may not make any sense in future episodes
Spock being hunted thoughout the galaxy because they have video footage of him killing people that most certainly was not manipulated in any way, turns out you just have to switch to infrared to see it was faked using holograms. Found 100% matching bio-neural signature of Michael in Red-Angel data that cannot be faked, turns out it's not Michael. Really having a hard time taking any of this serious (and WTF are they going for with Tilly?)

did I miss the reason Michael had to "die" the way she did? Couldn't they just sedate her during all this?

Yeah I found the irrefutable video evidence easily debunked by switching filters to be really dumb as well.

On Michael having to die though - it makes sense as they were under the impression that the red angel is Michael and under a closed time loop she cannot die therefore attempts to kill her will mean her future self (or something else) will have to keep her alive (to keep the loop closed). Sedation wouldn't work. Turns out none of that is true and the red angel is Michael's mom and she cares about her daughter enough to come out of hiding (and Michael could have really died there).

SRG01 · Mar 25, 2019

Mr. Pointy said:
Calling it. There's more than one Red Angel. You'd think future time travelers wouldn't have a contingency?

I was going to post a theory earlier that all of the Red Angels are clones. But Michael's mom got stuck somehow, and had a child.

DBT85 · Mar 25, 2019

SRG01 said:
I was going to post a theory earlier that all of the Red Angels are clones. But Michael's mom got stuck somehow, and had a child.

I find the former unlikely. The latter however is entirely possible.

Himynameischris · Mar 26, 2019

Window said:
Yeah I found the irrefutable video evidence easily debunked by switching filters to be really dumb as well.

On Michael having to die though - it makes sense as they were under the impression that the red angel is Michael and under a closed time loop she cannot die therefore attempts to kill her will mean her future self (or something else) will have to keep her alive (to keep the loop closed). Sedation wouldn't work. Turns out none of that is true and the red angel is Michael's mom and she cares about her daughter enough to come out of hiding (and Michael could have really died there).

And also because the two times Michael was about to die (In Vulcan as a young child and on the asteroid in Eps 1 of season 2) the Red Angel both showed up so it's reasonable to assume it'd show up again if Michael was about to die (or does as in the episode).

As far as the evidence, Cornwell said "I verified the source code, the images come straight from Psych" So she didn't verify if the video had been doctored, just where it came from. Easy enough for Control/Section 31 to fake.

DieEnteWurzel · Mar 26, 2019

Window said:
Yeah I found the irrefutable video evidence easily debunked by switching filters to be really dumb as well.

On Michael having to die though - it makes sense as they were under the impression that the red angel is Michael and under a closed time loop she cannot die therefore attempts to kill her will mean her future self (or something else) will have to keep her alive (to keep the loop closed). Sedation wouldn't work. Turns out none of that is true and the red angel is Michael's mom and she cares about her daughter enough to come out of hiding (and Michael could have really died there).

I understand why Burnham must die, just don't think it makes sense to torture her the way they did (other than dramatic effect ofc)

She doesn't have to be conscious for the plan to work

Window · Mar 26, 2019

Himynameischris said:
And also because the two times Michael was about to die (In Vulcan as a young child and on the asteroid in Eps 1 of season 2) the Red Angel both showed up so it's reasonable to assume it'd show up again if Michael was about to die (or does as in the episode).

As far as the evidence, Cornwell said "I verified the source code, the images come straight from Psych" So she didn't verify if the video had been doctored, just where it came from. Easy enough for Control/Section 31 to fake.

It's not just about her though, Spock was deemed a fugitive by the entire Federation. Given his reputation and contacts, you'd think some basic checks of evidence would be conducted.

DieEnteWurzel said:
I understand why Burnham must die, just don't think it makes sense to torture her the way they did (other than dramatic effect ofc)

She doesn't have to be conscious for the plan to work

Right yeah. That was definitely excessive. I thought the entire episode was pretty silly tbh. Everything in this show is OTT and dialed up to 11, which has its pros and cons.

Deleted member 13496 · Mar 26, 2019

God damn this show is getting difficult to watch. I'm starting to actually skip forward through some of the scenes because of Michael's constant overwrought dramatic crying. It's past the point of me being able to turn off my brain and go with along with the ride. It's painfully awkward and unpleasant to watch now. I actually hope the character dies so we don't have to watch this shit continue for another season.

Christ almighty can we make this show fun to watch again? Literally every scene she's in, she ends up crying. I don't understand how people are enjoying this. Absolutely ruining the show for me.

DBT85 · Mar 26, 2019

Switch Back 9 said:
God damn this show is getting difficult to watch. I'm starting to actually skip forward through some of the scenes because of Michael's constant overwrought dramatic crying. It's past the point of me being able to turn off my brain and go with along with the ride. It's painfully awkward and unpleasant to watch now. I actually hope the character dies so we don't have to watch this shit continue for another season.

Christ almighty can we make this show fun to watch again? Literally every scene she's in, she ends up crying. I don't understand how people are enjoying this. Absolutely ruining the show for me.

Don't hide your feelings. Share with the group.

Joeytj · Mar 26, 2019

Switch Back 9 said:
God damn this show is getting difficult to watch. I'm starting to actually skip forward through some of the scenes because of Michael's constant overwrought dramatic crying. It's past the point of me being able to turn off my brain and go with along with the ride. It's painfully awkward and unpleasant to watch now. I actually hope the character dies so we don't have to watch this shit continue for another season.

Christ almighty can we make this show fun to watch again? Literally every scene she's in, she ends up crying. I don't understand how people are enjoying this. Absolutely ruining the show for me.

I duhno. Hearing nothing but praise from others in person. Even from my brother, who hate-watched season 1.

I'm loving the season so far, but I agree that Michael's drama gets cringy, although I liked that Spock and other characters on the show are actually addressing her self-importance.

And, ironically, I thought this was actually the first time Michael's drama was justified, at least more so than before. Sonequa even managed to actually cry this time, and not just have that pained expression she's having all the time.

Tunesmith · Mar 26, 2019

Skyfireblaze said:
Hmm as fun as that sounds fun how does she end up in the Delta Quadrant? Also unless they retcon this, the Borg seem fully unaware of "humans" by the time the Enterprise D encounters them the first time. And there's a unused script for a Voyager episode that describes the Borg's origins as a failed defensive-weapon of a Delta Quadrant species that went out of control. Originally the system was supposed to infect any attackers and simply make them non-hostile.

Not to go too deeply down this real silly rabbit hole theory, but Airam had her memory completely wiped before the burial so no inherent awareness of Humans in her.

StallionDan · Mar 26, 2019

Guppeth said:
My guess is that the data was was planted by Control to manipulate them.

As Spock points out though, a false positive has no point, whether it is Micheal or not it has no effect on their plan to capture the red angel.

There is no reason for Control to lie and say it is Micheal.

Skyfireblaze · Mar 26, 2019

Tunesmith said:
Not to go too deeply down this real silly rabbit hole theory, but Airam had her memory completely wiped before the burial so no inherent awareness of Humans in her.

Hmm good point, I forgot about that, well let's see where they go with this if anywhere.

StallionDan · Mar 26, 2019

Remember that guy suing CBS for copying his game featuring Tardigrade space travel, a gay blonde botanist scientist dating a PoC, with blue lights like the spores, and some Tilly/Burnham lookalikes etc?

Well an update, apparently CBS refused discovery (that is legal discovery, the handing over of evidence to the other side) several times, which is illegal, so the guys lawyers went to the judge who declared "Oh, you're gonna hand it over" as a warning to CBS, they agreed (never had a choice) but basically said "Even though the STD creators may have looked at the guys game, they came up with the ideas by themselves" and tried to have the case dismissed. It didn't work because the claim it couldn't have influence is ridiculous.

So it's looking pretty good so far for the guy they copied.

deimosmasque · Mar 26, 2019

I wish him luck. Truth is if the work is a certain amount different it is legal to make derivative works.

Guy will have better luck if they settle in my opinion.

Deleted member 14568 · Mar 26, 2019

StallionDan said:
Well an update, apparently CBS refused discovery (that is legal discovery, the handing over of evidence to the other side) several times, which is illegal, so the guys lawyers went to the judge who declared "Oh, you're gonna hand it over" as a warning to CBS, they agreed (never had a choice) but basically said "Even though the STD creators may have looked at the guys game, they came up with the ideas by themselves" and tried to have the case dismissed. It didn't work because the claim it couldn't have influence is ridiculous.

Source?

StallionDan · Mar 26, 2019

Deleted as informed shit sources.

berzeli · Mar 26, 2019

StallionDan said:
This video goes into it (actual lawyer) https://youtu.be/39hL_k_TAD8 about 45 minutes in. But it's not discussed in a clear to follow way and full of interuptions.

I just skimmed this video while looking for a easier source, I think it has a shorter breakdown and easier to watch, it actually covers bits from the first link video, so watch this instead I guess.

Congratulations, you linked the following:

1) The alt-right lawyer who is representing Vic Mignogna and has posted a lot of really ugly rantings about "sjws"
2) A very upset nerd that complains about Captain Marvel, the female Doctor in Doctor Who, claimed that Discovery was getting cancelled in January, etc., etc.

Here is the blogpost the gamemaker did. It's not a exactly good blogpost and if he was being smart about the lawsuit he wouldn't have made it. It's a one sided affair that doesn't actually claim that CBS avoided discovery, doesn't understand legal arguments (and admits he doesn't understand legal arguments), and in general isn't that useful as a source.

I would say I was surprised but this is so very on brand for you.

Spectromixer · Mar 26, 2019

The best video I have found discussing the lawsuit from a legal sense is here, not a recent update but still worth watching if you are actually interested in the lawsuit and not alt-right trolling

HeavenlyOne · Mar 26, 2019

Kzinti said:
Source?

Here's a better source.

Joeytj · Mar 26, 2019

StallionDan said:
This video goes into it (actual lawyer) https://youtu.be/39hL_k_TAD8 about 45 minutes in. But it's not discussed in a clear to follow way and full of interuptions.

I just skimmed this video while looking for a easier source, I think it has a shorter breakdown and easier to watch, it actually covers bits from the first link video, so watch this instead I guess.

Don't bring that alt-right nonesense here dude.

That channel is pure trash. You can get legit legal info about he case from better sources.

DBT85 · Mar 26, 2019

Shocker, he's taken the thread on a tangent.

Guppeth · Mar 26, 2019

StallionDan said:
As Spock points out though, a false positive has no point, whether it is Micheal or not it has no effect on their plan to capture the red angel.

There is no reason for Control to lie and say it is Micheal.

The lie made them put Michael in danger, which gave the red angel, MICHAEL'S MOTHER, no choice but to intervene to save her daughter. If it had been anyone but Michael she wouldn't have appeared at that moment.

Spock sees no strategic reason for this data to be falsified because he doesn't know that the red angel is MICHAEL'S MOTHER.

Maybe there's a "Discovery plot explained" YouTube channel you should subscribe to instead of the absolute shitbags you watch currently.

StallionDan · Mar 26, 2019

berzeli said:
Congratulations, you linked the following:

1) The alt-right lawyer who is representing Vic Mignogna and has posted a lot of really ugly rantings about "sjws"
2) A very upset nerd that complains about Captain Marvel, the female Doctor in Doctor Who, claimed that Discovery was getting cancelled in January, etc., etc.

Here is the blogpost the gamemaker did. It's not a exactly good blogpost and if he was being smart about the lawsuit he wouldn't have made it. It's a one sided affair that doesn't actually claim that CBS avoided discovery, doesn't understand legal arguments (and admits he doesn't understand legal arguments), and in general isn't that useful as a source.

I would say I was surprised but this is so very on brand for you.

Like I can know the history of everything on the internet. I sub to like 7 channels on YouTube and that's 99% of what I watch. None of the subs are these two and I've never seen a video of either of them before. Poster asked for a source and I googled for one and those were first results not from last year.

You can shove that on brand comment up your arse. I don't and never have supported alt right and now I know I'll delete my last post.

berzeli · Mar 26, 2019

StallionDan said:
Like I can know the history of everything on the internet. I sub to like 7 channels on YouTube and that's 99% of what I watch. None of the subs are these two and I've never seen a video of either of them before. Poster asked for a source and I googled for one and those were first results not from last year.

You can shove that on brand comment up your arse. I don't and never have supported alt right and now I know I'll delete my last post.

Oh, the on brand part was flailing at any opportunity to shit on the show and shit up the thread no matter how flimsy the source is. Not the alt right part. Don't want you to get confused over that.

Quinton · Mar 26, 2019

TrekCore has compiled a collection of intriguing quotes. There's a fair bit more at the link.

Speaking with SyFy Wire in a new set of interviews published this evening, Alex Kurtzman once again addressed fan criticism of how Star Trek: Discovery may not seem to fit into the overall Star Trek history that we know, ramping up his rebuttal to that feedback:

"We are entirely aware of everyone's questions and criticisms; I've read everything, and I see where everyone's like, 'Well, the spore drive never existed!' and 'What, Discovery was never around!' and all of those things, we're totally aware. You will get an answer," exec producer Alex Kurtzman told SYFY WIRE. But will that answer be satisfying? "I damn well think so, yes."

ETHAN PECK: "I personally think that the end of the season is going to be tremendous … when [Kurtzman] first told me about it I was like in tears, I just had chills."

DOUG JONES: "As I read the final script for Season 2, my jaw dropped, and I'm dumbfounded with where we're headed. So I think the fans can expect to boldly go where no Star Trek series has ever gone before."

WILSON CRUZ: "Expect the unexpected, is what my mother always says, and it couldn't be more true, especially on this season, cause it'll change everything.

I don't think I've been the only one flirting with the notion that Discovery might either become a time-traveling show or get flung into the late 24th century on a permanent basis. When "Calypso" arrived late last year some of us doubled down on such thoughts.

I'm tripling down now. :P

Deleted member 14568 · Mar 26, 2019

oh dear well i just hope they won't bring back the visual of TOS

Himynameischris · Mar 26, 2019

Hmm would suck if they left this era now because that means no more pike or spock, amanda, sarek, enterprise, probably cornwell or phillipa maybe even ash. Would be a pretty drastic change, just ignore the complainers

DBT85 · Mar 26, 2019

Himynameischris said:
Hmm would suck if they left this era now because that means no more pike or spock, amanda, sarek, enterprise, probably cornwell or phillipa maybe even ash. Would be a pretty drastic change, just ignore the complainers

Depends whos on board when it all goes belly up. Ash could easily till be there.

Naturally some daft sod will eventually realise that making a Pike/Spock show is an easy way to print money and they'll finally announce it so I can stop tweeting about it every week.

Though wasn't Phillipa supposed to be in S3 as well as her own show?

Himynameischris · Mar 26, 2019

Well her show is on section 31, if they travel to the future (or get lost) that can't really happen

But you're right I think they said she's coming back....so we'll see

Tunesmith · Mar 26, 2019

Have to set the stage for a cameo crossover episode with the Picard show somehow right?

I hope they don't.

Quinton · Mar 26, 2019

Himynameischris said:
Well her show is on section 31, if they travel to the future (or get lost) that can't really happen

But you're right I think they said she's coming back....so we'll see

I reckon we'd still get more of characters like the ones you mentioned upthread courtesy of the Section 31 show, presuming of course it remains in the 23rd century.

Deleted member 13496 · Mar 26, 2019

DBT85 said:
Don't hide your feelings. Share with the group.

I am, that's exactly what I'm doing. What a dumb reply.

Anyways, love Pike, Stamets, Spock, even Tilly, but I'm waaaay over Michael's character. That pained teary expression seems to be the only tool in her acting box and it got old several episodes ago.

Spectromixer · Mar 26, 2019

Quinton said:
TrekCore has compiled a collection of intriguing quotes. There's a fair bit more at the link.

I don't think I've been the only one flirting with the notion that Discovery might either become a time-traveling show or get flung into the late 24th century on a permanent basis. When "Calypso" arrived late last year some of us doubled down on such thoughts.

I'm tripling down now. :P

That will be wild if it happens

DrEvil · Mar 27, 2019

Season one was supposed to end with them in VOY era under the original leadership, so who knows.

Himynameischris · Mar 27, 2019

Something towards the bottom of that article that I think would be cool if we don't get a Pike/Spock 5 year mission show

While we don't know how Anson Mount's Pike will be exiting Discovery, some fans have speculated we might see Pike join the Starfleet Academy series first rumored to be in development last summer, would could serve as a connection to his ultimate fate.

Moose · Mar 27, 2019

I love Discovery, but I feel like they're thinking of doing too many spinoffs. The S31 spinoff seems to be the least appealing.

Goodlifr · Mar 27, 2019

Probably already covered, but what the actual fuck with the whole section 31 / red angel reveal.

Wow, wonder what this mysterious angel like creature with wings is, seems like they are travelling in time.
10 episodes later "Oh, yeah, btw we designed a time travel suit a few years ago, which looks like an angel with wings"

(Did I miss something??! Watched the episode on a long haul flight, so was a bit distracted a couple of times)

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