The people who are freaking about the patch note, know that it's nothing compared to the whole list of promises including the single player campaign lmao.
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Star Citizen is selling a $40,000 ship bundle.
- Thread starter Coyote Starrk
- Start date
Not trying to be an active detractor, but wasn't Server Meshing originally promised to be a thing back in 2018? I feel like it's been 6 months away for the past several years. It's like having voice and facial capture for Squadron 42 only "recently" finishing when the single player campaign was originally closed to being done back in 2016.
Server Meshing and true persistence really need to come to the PU asap. It seems that CIG trying to make so much of Squadron 42's content and underlying systems cross-compatible with the PU really puts a damper on momentum for both.
I personally hope they due end up achieving their lofty goals, mostly for the sake of the whales and gamers who have waited so long for, and invested so much time in, S42 and the PU hopeful realization.
Based on this, they started work on it in 2018:
Server Meshing and Persistent Streaming Q&A - Roberts Space Industries | Follow the development of Star Citizen and Squadron 42
Roberts Space Industries is the official go-to website for all news about Star Citizen and Squadron 42. It also hosts the online store for game items and merch, as well as all the community tools used by our fans.
robertsspaceindustries.com
That's in the "What is the current state of the server meshing tech and what are the biggest issues holding it back?" And they mention what progress they made each year since.
400 million is an insane amount of money for a pure dev cycle targeting one platform with minimal marketing.
In terms of AAA 600 is actually fairly small. Most Ubisoft games or stuff like Call of Duty have 2 or 3k people that work on them, but 400 million is ludicrous. Something like GTA only has a 100 - 150 million dollar budget.
The issue with star citizen is it's been like 8 years and there still isn't a finished game with that amount of time and money.
Based on this, they started work on it in 2018:
Server Meshing and Persistent Streaming Q&A - Roberts Space Industries | Follow the development of Star Citizen and Squadron 42
Roberts Space Industries is the official go-to website for all news about Star Citizen and Squadron 42. It also hosts the online store for game items and merch, as well as all the community tools used by our fans.robertsspaceindustries.com
That's in the "What is the current state of the server meshing tech and what are the biggest issues holding it back?" And they mention what progress they made each year since.
From reading that, I highly doubt even Static Server meshing will make 2022. It doesn't seem like CIG is all that certain themselves. Dynamic server meshing looks even less clear when it comes to timelines.
Have there been any substantive updates on S42 when it comes to a potential beta? It was originally close to beta back in 2020 correct? Then CIG clarified that it was supposed to be an "internal beta", then said that it's no longer making the projected date.
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This is not me nitpicking in a condescending manner or anything I just happened to Google this exact thing because of this thread earlier and GTA v had a $265 million dollar budget.
So Star Citizen really just doesn't have a single solitary leg to stand on here lol
It was initially powered by "hopes and dreams, starry eyed ultimate space game". Now it's mostly "we'll prove all of them wrong!!!" energy.
So yeah, self sustaining.
My bad, I just remember the headlines when GTA IV cracked the 100 million budget mark. Didn't think about GTA 5 must have been even bigger. 400 million in crowd funding plus their corporate investments is still a ludicrous amount of money for star citizen in comparison though.
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It is and for them to not even have a halfway finished product despite that 400 million price tag is kind of insane. Like I said earlier in the thread it is either a straight-up scam or it is the single most mismanaged project in the history of gaming.
There is literally no defense for them being this far into development with that kind of budget and having next to nothing to show for it.
I've played a lot of SC over the last month and a bit, and its honestly amazing. I was thinking about doing a thread about it actually as I get the impression most people think that there is no game there at all, where in actual fact there is a surprising amount of game there right now, and I'm actually enjoying the hell out of it.
Yes the fact that they are selling ships for so much is potentially skeezy (although most can be bought ingame), but the fact remains that for me, theres no other game like it, and its given me some of the best ingame experiences I've had in any game ever, even in the short few months I've been playing.
Yes the fact that they are selling ships for so much is potentially skeezy (although most can be bought ingame), but the fact remains that for me, theres no other game like it, and its given me some of the best ingame experiences I've had in any game ever, even in the short few months I've been playing.
I bought Tarkov after hearing similar things......however thus far SC is the only game that I can say there are moments that are truly unique that I cannot replicate in any game. I have had some crazy buggy things happen but on the flip I have had some things that blew my mind to the point that I think I can write some fan fiction nonsense just based off my own experiences (something I have never even thought of doing before). If they can give the things promised and continue to at least deliver the things on the roadmap at the pace they have been lately, this will be a different conversation in the near future. As for Tarkov.....that game just gives me frayed nerves.
When is Squadron 42 coming out? I feel like that should be a pretty simple question for people saying this entire endeavour isn't a scam right?
If the more linear, vertical slice of the bigger project is nowhere to be seen as of 2022 I feel like people have to give up the ghost on this one.
If the more linear, vertical slice of the bigger project is nowhere to be seen as of 2022 I feel like people have to give up the ghost on this one.
Is Server Meshing the thing that's also gonna help performance? I've been told the main performance issues are server-based so I haven't tried the game as much as I'd want to because performance is still really bad.
Probably 2025 ?
Episode 1 won t be out in 2022 for sure, so it s 2023, then at least a year per episode... and we need 3 for the SQ42 campaign (they announced the campaign will be released as an episodic trilogy) :(
It has taken a nose dive for me ever since they embraced the need to have FPS components, and showed that sq42 was not free of it, on the contrary, with call of duty style segments in the campaign and other styles intermixed with stealth invasion of locations.
i only wanted wing commander ...
Does the game even do a lot? The free fly events I tried made the game seem like a pretty hollow experience.
In part, yes. Eve Online, No Man's Sky and Elite Dangerous all cover parts of the game promises. For the whole scope of what Star Citizen promises? No, but then Star Citizen doesn't even live up to everything it's promised.
One thing that has always amuses me about Star Citizen and it's defenders is how people leap into obscure bits of technology that no-one normally hears about at all to defend what they are doing. How often does 'server meshing' get mentioned at all during normal game discussion? Yet with Star Citizen it's the holy grail that will fix all problems. It's this bizarre news to find something to hook onto to explain and defend what's going on that makes everyone still supporting the game bizarre tech enthusiasts for gaming development tools no-one normally ever hears about.
Check ship tours on YouTube alone, what's there is incredible. The game is super intriguing at times with stuff no other game has and i kinda want to try it for those things. The walkable ship interiors are amazing, some planets and cities look fantastic, the hidden Christmas tree is spectacular and you couldn't do it exactly like this in any other game i think.
Do I think it will live up to what was promised ever? Hell no. It will likely be a working game at some point with a healthy community of fans getting something out of it, but it will absolutely have no chance of ever being finished without fans complaining and keeping to ask for long promised content.
Do I think it will live up to what was promised ever? Hell no. It will likely be a working game at some point with a healthy community of fans getting something out of it, but it will absolutely have no chance of ever being finished without fans complaining and keeping to ask for long promised content.
Bot Elite and NMS were announced after Star Citizen and were both released and expanded several times since then. But, hey, Robert's ego must be as big as Derek Smart's.
Inflaction adjusted:
Cyberpunk 2077: 316M
Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2: 300M
List of most expensive video games to develop - Wikipedia
It's not as much as 400, but Star Citizen is supposed to be much bigger than those two games.
So you'd need to adjust the 400mil to inflation as well, for the last 10 years, no? Seems like a wobbly argument, if I'm not missing anything here.Inflaction adjusted:
Cyberpunk 2077: 316M
Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2: 300M
List of most expensive video games to develop - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
It's not as much as 400, but Star Citizen is supposed to be much bigger than those two games.
In any case, it should easily be the most expensive production in video games at this point.
Inflaction adjusted:
Cyberpunk 2077: 316M
Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2: 300M
List of most expensive video games to develop - Wikipedia
It's not as much as 400, but Star Citizen is supposed to be much bigger than those two games.
You cant adjust for inflation for those games and then not for Star Citizen. It's been gathering funding for longer than Cyberpunk was in development.
Equally, Star Citizen has already spent *way* more than those games and has astronomically less to show for it. The vast majority of their promises are just words on a page right now with no evidence to show they will ever deliver on them. This is not a comparison that makes Star Citizen look in any way reasonable!
So weird how there are still defenders for this game. It may not be a full out scam since there is a playable game, but it is still clearly a grift.
Inflaction adjusted:
Cyberpunk 2077: 316M
Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2: 300M
List of most expensive video games to develop - Wikipedia
It's not as much as 400, but Star Citizen is supposed to be much bigger than those two games.
I like how you ONLY adjusted for inflation for everything else, but not Star Citizen. Also those game actually released. Star Citizen is 400+ million so far
1) I don't know any of the details of what Chris Roberts has done. I'm not defending him and in general I don't believe anyone should be earning 7 figure salaries while other people struggle. With that said, my point was just that this situation (in terms of development costs and whatnot) isn't all that different to what you get with many main stream studios and their live service games but in those cases, far less of what consumers spend is put back into the development of the game.
2) I think it's odd to categorise them as finished and unfinished products. Fortnite took several billion from consumers while it was still in 'beta', was it a finished product then? Plus, live service games are always changing, never finished, at any one time you're buying into the state of the game, at that one time. You're still buying into them with the promise that that future will be positive, and add value to the game.
3) 400 million is not by far and away, the most spent on a games development. It's not even close. Most studios don't put out these numbers, but most AAA live service games are in the billions. And when we start talking about marketing budgets too, many more games exceed 500m. Even many non-live service triple A games exceed 500m in total costs when you factor in how much is spent marketing those titles.
Today, triple A games (non-live service) cost ball park 100m to produce. Games like Shadow of the Tomb Raider, that's 100m in development costs, not factoring in their marketing costs. Many publishers will spend several times that budget marketing the game.
Just estimating, but something like TLOU2 likely cost Sony close to the 200m mark in dev costs alone and that's with splitting factions into a separate multiplayer experience. When factoring the cost of marketing TLOU2 you're likely beyond 400m. The on-going cost of developing factions and then marketing and supporting it, will probably end up exceeding 1B.
Even old games, like Final Fantasy 7, inflation adjusted estimates put that games development costs almost 250m, and that was a game that was made by a small team (150 people) by todays standards over just a 3 year period. Today you have studios employing over 1000 people to work on a game for maybe 5 years, and often 10+ years for live service games. The development costs are much more than you seem to believe them to be.
I'm not saying Chris Roberts is a good guy or y'all should be buying space ships in Star Citizen, I'm just it seems a little odd when I see people whose post comes down to 'what the hell are they doing with 400m!? They could make 10 games!'. It's likely that Star Citizens ambition really will cost hundreds of millions of $ to achieve and that the ratio of what consumers spend that goes into the development costs of the game is greater (more so in the consumers favour here) than it is with many other triple As.
But again, as for the ethical and moral questions that regard Chris Roberts behaviour, I can't speak on them because I don't know anything about the games development with the level of intimacy required to comment.
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But you're gonna be a citizen of all the Stars tho, not just one tiny piffling city. /s
Does this money train keep going once the game comes out? A lot of this is people dumping money into what they think the game will be and when it doesn't just exist in their hopes and dreams I don't know if people are going to keep buying ship packs for tens of thousands. People who funded this thing to the tune of millions damn near a decade ago wanted a kick ass modern Wing Commander style game.
EA pooped out Star Wars Squadrons in like 3 years and it was great. I imagine Squadron 42 will be bigger in scope, but they've had a decade and literally nothing to show for it on the campaign front. It's clear that Chris Roberts is someone who needs a boss or a publisher, someone to answer to, and by that I don't mean the type of people hooked by his dream of the game that could be. Microsoft tossed him off Freelancer because they know that a game needs to actually be released and sell copies
EA pooped out Star Wars Squadrons in like 3 years and it was great. I imagine Squadron 42 will be bigger in scope, but they've had a decade and literally nothing to show for it on the campaign front. It's clear that Chris Roberts is someone who needs a boss or a publisher, someone to answer to, and by that I don't mean the type of people hooked by his dream of the game that could be. Microsoft tossed him off Freelancer because they know that a game needs to actually be released and sell copies
Please adjust SC numbers and account for inflation and look at the target platforms for Cyberpunk and COD.Inflaction adjusted:
Cyberpunk 2077: 316M
Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2: 300M
List of most expensive video games to develop - Wikipedia
It's not as much as 400, but Star Citizen is supposed to be much bigger than those two games.
I want to see and play a finished SC, but at this point, I'm not sure we will. You have games like COD and Battlefield that are massive in scope, targeting multiple platforms but have a much shorter and contained dev cycle. Much bigger isn't always better, especially for a new dev house.
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It's also worth keeping in mind that it's hard to compare other games to the promises of StarCitizen because SC keeps adding more promises. You could make an argument that with all of its expansions, Elite is approaching the original vision of SC, though it obviously isn't close to the version of SC that has nearly a decade of feature creep.
Nah. It's not at all odd to categorize released games as finished and unreleased games as unfinished. Pro tip: a game in beta is not a released game. It's in a testing phase. Live service games can certainly change significantly over time, but they're doing so off of a core, completed base. People who buy released games don't buy them for what they might become, but instead for the fun they'll have playing them NOW. Because they're finished and released. And not in beta.
Can you prove even a single one of the claims you've made as to the development costs you're claiming for other games? Even a single one? You say TLOU2 cost 200m for development alone and then 400m after marketing, but have nothing to back that up. Someone posted this link earlier:
List of most expensive video games to develop - Wikipedia
I looked at that list and TLOU2 is nowhere on it. I tried to find it myself, despite the burden of proof of your claims being on you and the best I could find is this:
They estimate the budget at maybe around $100 million. Where are you getting your figures from?
You also cite inflation when discussing other games. Why not cite inflation for all the previous years of funding Star Citizen has raised? How much would their initial Kickstarter money be today adjusted for inflation? You keep writing these long posts defending Star Citizen while claiming not to defend them while also making all sorts of claims that you haven't backed up.
And before you say it, no, I won't do your research for you. No one here should be doing that. YOU made the outrageous claim so it's on YOU to back it up. Cite your sources for the development costs of the games you mention above, along with your methodology for adjusting for inflation. If you can't do that, then accept that maybe your position on this topic is not quite as defensible as you think it is. Additionally, if you're going to continue using inflation adjustments, be sure to adjust Star Citizen's cost per year so far for inflation so that you're making a true direct comparison.
