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What tendency/ideology do you best align with?

  • Anarchism

    Votes: 125 12.0%
  • Marxism

    Votes: 86 8.2%
  • Marxism-Leninism

    Votes: 79 7.6%
  • Left Communism

    Votes: 19 1.8%
  • Democratic Socialism

    Votes: 423 40.6%
  • Social Democracy

    Votes: 238 22.8%
  • Other

    Votes: 73 7.0%

  • Total voters
    1,043

Anton Sugar

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,946
Curious, what do you guys think about landlords/real estate investors?

Can't hate the player but hate the game? lol.
No matter how "mom and pop" your landlord can possibly be, they are still de facto exploiting housing as a commodity in a society that has a housing crisis. They're making money off of a basic human requirement for survival.

I'd also argue that if you're in a position to own more than one house, that's a privilege and shouldn't necessarily be exercised just because you can.

There is no such thing as a 'good landlord' (huckmag.com)
 

FliX

Master of the Reality Stone
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
9,879
Metro Detroit
No matter how "mom and pop" your landlord can possibly be, they are still de facto exploiting housing as a commodity in a society that has a housing crisis. They're making money off of a basic human requirement for survival.

I'd also argue that if you're in a position to own more than one house, that's a privilege and shouldn't necessarily be exercised just because you can.

There is no such thing as a 'good landlord' (huckmag.com)
Good article. Thanks for sharing. Probably just as applicable to most of the "west".
 

Chikor

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
14,239
Curious, what do you guys think about landlords/real estate investors?

Can't hate the player but hate the game? lol.
I try not to think about those issues on a personal, individualized level.
I think structurally, being able to make money from owning a house is not good, it's just another case of "making money because you have money", and I think those things are generally bad for society.
I am also just in general against private land ownership.
 

samoyed

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
15,191
The problem with "hate the game not the player" is it assumes no agency is possible or desirable in a faulty game, and implicitly justifies winning by any means necessary, which most people, even libs, would disagree with.

For example.

Monopoly is a crappy game. There are ways to play Monopoly such that it is miserable for everyone (overbuilding houses/hotels to deplete the pool) and ways to play that at least try to keep people happy and engaged (excluding the auction rule). The vast majority of casual Monopoly play is house-ruled to the point where it is basically a different game, and it is still shit on a structural level. That said, as you can see, the difference between "Cutthroat Monopoly" and "Fun Monopoly" comes down to intent, purpose and the results of the choices of the players. The systemic critique of Monopoly is "this shit sucks let's play a different game". The individualized critique of Monopoly is "do you have to monopolize the housing tokens?". Both are valid critiques and suited for different cases. Even in the context of a faulty game, there are more important things than winning (sometimes), such as engaging with people with kindness and love, and this is what agency/responsibility means in a rigged game.
 

gogosox82

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,385
Curious, what do you guys think about landlords/real estate investors?

Can't hate the player but hate the game? lol.
This assumes that the player has no agency which would be incorrect. They don't have to rent out their house or own thousands of acres of land. This is an implicit choice they are making knowing that people need housing to survive
 

Terrell

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,624
Canada
Curious, what do you guys think about landlords/real estate investors?

Can't hate the player but hate the game? lol.
The only acceptable scenario for owning rental property is to recover expenses of ownership because you're unable to sell it. Anything beyond that is, in fact, exploitation and exacerbating the unaffordable housing issue by having fewer available units for sale and driving up demand. To intentionally allow that to happen when someone has a means to relieve themselves of a property means that they're part of the problem, without question, it's at LEAST indirectly profiting off another person's misery, if not directly. And I won't even get into people who buy homes for the explicit purpose of renting them.
 

samoyed

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
15,191
I'm torn. On one hand, this is probably a left-ish comrade or near-comrade using their experience in Posting to Own the Libs to land a social media manager gig and deploying their ideological training in the service thereof, like how Arby's twitter manager is a papercrafts person and Wendy's twitter manager is just an irate weeb. On the other hand, brands larping as anti-establishment radicals is many layers of late stage hell.

Honestly cannot tell if this is better or worse than Pride at Raytheon.
 

Mekanos

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 17, 2018
44,185
Nah this is almost certainly a lib. Plenty of libs will acknowledge America's sordid past, but will say "this coup is different!"

Gonna chalk this up to stolen valor.
 

Terrell

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,624
Canada
"Hey Burger King, what do you think about your social media manager being a glorified jester for distracting the masses while corporate leaders get away with worker exploitation?"
 

Mekanos

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 17, 2018
44,185

3c730bbace09e5a9d9e19aa2478a5be0.gif
 

samoyed

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
15,191
Sphag, I expect an infographic on Implementing Communism In the Developed World in my inbox by Friday.
 

Deleted member 4346

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,976
We cannot hope to succeed in toppling the capitalist state without the cooperation of the US military. It's over, comrades. The dream is dead. Embrace capitalism, the American flag, and support our troops.
 

medinaria

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,546
my roadmap for implementing communism begins by making a drake parody called gosplan

I haven't really figured it out from there
 

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
60,214
www.nytimes.com

Lauren Berlant, Critic of the American Dream, Is Dead at 63 (Published 2021)

Professor Berlant’s book “Cruel Optimism” provided a popular term to describe false hopes in an increasingly unequal nation.

Professor Berlant (pronounced burr-LANT) — who used the pronoun she in her personal life but they professionally, Mr. Horswill said — taught in the English department of the University of Chicago and wrote books and essays that focused on a grab bag of Americana, from Nathaniel Hawthorne to Anita Hill, seeking in history and current events broader lessons about nationalism, sexuality and power.

The professor's signature phrase, "cruel optimism," referred to "when something you desire is actually an obstacle to your flourishing." That state of being is widespread in the United States, Professor Berlant argued, where the tools we depend on to achieve "the good life" — a safety net, job security, the meritocracy, even "durable intimacy" in our romantic lives — have degenerated into "fantasies" that bear "less and less relation to how people can live."

In a profile in The New Yorker, the staff writer Hua Hsu said that Professor Berlant's thought illustrated how despite "a gut-level suspicion that hard work, thrift, and following the rules" no longer "guarantee a happy ending," many people "keep on hoping."

The dating-app addict seeking love and the adjunct academic striving for tenure might be deluding themselves, harboring an outdated American dream of personal stability and expanding possibilities. Yet they form an attachment to their pursuits, however unrealistic, and that attachment might wind up constituting for the person "what it means to keep on living and to look forward to being in the world," Professor Berlant wrote — "cruel" though the underlying optimism may be.

"Cruel optimism" broke out of the confines of academic theory and became a device for understanding a colorful array of disappointments. Writers have used it to describe everything from a compulsion to follow Instagram "Momfluencers" to the assumption that technology will solve climate change.

Professor Berlant's writing could be abstruse — it included phrases like "the juxtapolitical domain of social immediacy" and "the becoming historical of the affective event" — but that did not stop the work from resonating with people in their 20s and 30s. Professor Berlant's death was mourned on Twitter by many young writers, including the critics Tobi Haslett and Jane Hu.

Moira Donegan, a columnist for The Guardian, recalled talking "furiously" with her friends about "Cruel Optimism" after she read it in her early 20s, around the time the book was published. She was surveying economic prospects grimmer than she had expected, but she found that she had the same aspirations anyway.

That apparent contradiction "felt not merely personal or psychological; it felt like a social phenomenon," Ms. Donegan said. "'Cruel Optimism' was the absolute perfect book to read at that time."

RIP. Some great contributions.
 

samoyed

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
15,191
This trend of left-ish academics dying in their middle ages is starting to make me conspiracy minded.
 

Mulligan

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,505
That guy was America's bestie, and while it's not unprecedent for the US to fall out of favor with an ally, the media would have almost certainly call him him a "strongman" or some shit if we wanted him dead.

Though you can never know for sure with those things.

Pol Pot was either a dictator or a freedom fighter against the repressive Vietnamese regime depending on what day it was for the media.

It does look like there was some consent manufacturing in February/March of this year, so it wouldn't surprise me if the US intel community cooked up a quick plot to kill Moise, and get another neoliberal politician with more liberal credibility in power before they lose their opportunity when Ryan takes Joseph's position.

If it was a quick plot, it kinda makes sense they would use a plethora of cheap Colombian mercs who are insane, but are regularly exploited to such a surprising degree (any Gulf State, Libya, Iraq War).
 

Chikor

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
14,239
Pol Pot was either a dictator or a freedom fighter against the repressive Vietnamese regime depending on what day it was for the media.

It does look like there was some consent manufacturing in February/March of this year, so it wouldn't surprise me if the US intel community cooked up a quick plot to kill Moise, and get another neoliberal politician with more liberal credibility in power before they lose their opportunity when Ryan takes Joseph's position.
The man refused to leave office when his term was over and you just didn't hear about it in western media.
Like yeah, anything is possible, but to not even have one "strongman clings to power" article?
That's not how America usually roll with regime change.
 

Mulligan

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,505
The man refused to leave office when his term was over and you just didn't hear about it in western media.
Like yeah, anything is possible, but to not even have one "strongman clings to power" article?
That's not how America usually roll with regime change.

There was some stuff in Voice of America around the time he dissolved Parliament, and then 2 weeks ago, VoA suddenly began reporting on armed revolutionary gangs in Haiti.

www.voanews.com

Haiti Gang Leader Launches 'Revolution' as Violence Escalates

Violence has spiked in Haiti's capital in recent weeks as rival groups battle with one another or the police for control of the streets
 
Oct 27, 2017
797
Berkeley, CA
Hello, I'm pretty new with Socialist and Communist ideology (most of my exposure is through some college classes and discussion with friends but that's probably not sufficient at all) and am ignorant with a lot of things. I'm trying to go through the readings in the OP and following the advice of trying to be critical with what I read/hear/experience/etc. I recently graduated from university and am planning to be a Software Engineer from which I understand has a high salary and would place me in the upper class and award me with several privileges that the lower classes do not have. I'm currently worried that due to these privileges, I will support policies that keep the status quo and prevent changes to the system. I'm wondering what I can do to limit supporting repression and "help the cause." This is a pretty vague asking admittedly so I'm sorry if it's the wrong perspective to have.

Sorry if a lot of this was awkwardly worded; I'm not really good with expressing myself lol
 

Mekanos

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 17, 2018
44,185
Hello, I'm pretty new with Socialist and Communist ideology (most of my exposure is through some college classes and discussion with friends but that's probably not sufficient at all) and am ignorant with a lot of things. I'm trying to go through the readings in the OP and following the advice of trying to be critical with what I read/hear/experience/etc. I recently graduated from university and am planning to be a Software Engineer from which I understand has a high salary and would place me in the upper class and award me with several privileges that the lower classes do not have. I'm currently worried that due to these privileges, I will support policies that keep the status quo and prevent changes to the system. I'm wondering what I can do to limit supporting repression and "help the cause." This is a pretty vague asking admittedly so I'm sorry if it's the wrong perspective to have.

Sorry if a lot of this was awkwardly worded; I'm not really good with expressing myself lol

Every good revolution needs class traitors.

Speaking a bit more seriously, it's not always obvious how to, but I think the current goal should be to support the working class and agitate against attempts to oppress them. So when thinking of political causes to support or not support, that should be your frame of reference. As for what you can do - there's always organizations to join, from more broadly "political" ones to ones that are involved in directly providing material aid. Do your research of course and make sure the organization is legit, but I think it's the best thing any of us can do, be involved and engaged in our local communities.

Building socialism should be thought of as a longterm project, and right now we just need to help and build, I think.