Talking about Wano specifically so yeah. While endearing I think most queer folk find the previous depictions of trans characters really offensive.
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So what are some examples of good trans representation in media?
- Thread starter Failburger
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The House in Fata Morgana is something that touched me very deeply. It does a lot well, but IMO, without going into spoilers, it captures especially well just how empowering it is when you finally find the vocabulary to explain what you've been feeling, and how validating it is to realize that those feelings do mean what you want them to mean. It is a story with trans suffering, which is important to mention for those who aren't in a position to be exposed to that, but it also reflects a reality where the trans experience does not have to end at that suffering- it knows that the experience can be just as, if not more, marked by joy. It's a very powerful experience, and I fully recommend it.
I only made it through the first three stories in The House in Fata Morgana. Too much overwrought tragedy and suffering for my tastes, though it looks like I stopped right before it started getting more interesting. Maybe I'll give it a second shot if the PS4 version goes on sale or the remastered version of the game is released in English on PC.
Tokyo Godfathers recast for the English dub has a trans voice actor playing the role of said trans character in the film.
Alluka is just too precious.
Alluka from Hunter x Hunter. Was not expecting a shonen anime/manga to handle a subject like a trans character so well especially after how the authors prior series, Yu Yu Hakusho dealt with another trans character.
Zombieland Saga's Lily Hoshikawa seemed pretty good too.
As others who like awesome shit that not enough people appreciate have already said: Nicole Maines as Dreamer in Supergirl. There was one particularly amazing trans women are women episode in the last season that's super heartwarming, and the rest of the time she's just a rad character you love to see on screen.
I'm so bummed we're only getting one more season of Supergirl. Hopefully Dreamer migrates to another Berlantiverse show, because there's no reason to abandon the character while the universe continues, and her heroic journey has only just begun.
I'm so bummed we're only getting one more season of Supergirl. Hopefully Dreamer migrates to another Berlantiverse show, because there's no reason to abandon the character while the universe continues, and her heroic journey has only just begun.
This.
It's great representation of Black trans women and two of the show's executive producers are trans women (Janet Mock and Our Lady J).
EDIT: I'm offended that there are so many people who haven't seen Pose...
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Okay, I Googled, but I'm finding nothing - has rad been tainted by terfs or white supremacists!?
Did not know that, cool! Shakina Nayfack, they did a video about this. Good on GKIDS.
Carmen from It's Always Sunny?
Carmen
Carmen is a transgender woman who briefely dated Mac, much to his nervous embarrassment. She later had sex reassignment surgery and married Nick and the two had Dee act as the surrogate mother for their baby. The baby was conceived with Carmen's frozen sperm and a donor's egg, as Nick is unable...itsalwayssunny.fandom.com
I started watching It's Always Sunny, and the introductory dialogue in the fourth episode where this character first appears:
"Those dudes over there?"
"Yeah, that's a man, she's a tranny"
I immediately quit the episode. I read up to see if it got better later on, and it doesn't.
Brilliant thread OP and glad people have covered those I'd put forth already. Lots of other examples for me to check out too so appreciate it.
That and the photo with her mother when she was younger seemingly presenting as a boy.
I'm not sure if this is me being too sceptical or not but... Honestly the short hair could be a signifier because it's a story and it's more about the semiotics of the thing, but this is frankly so little and short hair is so normal for little girls (and often a characteristic of "tomboys") that it's hard to move on just that.
Is there more to this or...?
Not sure why you cut out the rest of the post that answers that since you're asking the same thing the person I quoted was.
The pride and trans flags in addition to the creator coming out as trans. If it's not enough for you that's fine, but seems pretty obvious to me (among others) when intermixed with the themes of the game.
You cut out the rest of the post just to do the exact thing it speaks to.
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Oh shit I didn't even notice I was quoting you. Sorry I wasn't following the conversation thread and just read what seemed more obviously on topic to Celeste.
Then read the rest of the post I guess. Not every trans character needs to have their identity blown up in bubble writing, for the benefit of those who refuse to see characters as anything other than cis without it.
The more we get examples of casual representation like this, the more people will hopefully not need a lot to assume someone isn't cishet white.Brilliant thread OP and glad people have covered those I'd put forth already. Lots of other examples for me to check out too so appreciate it.
That and the photo with her mother when she was younger seemingly presenting as a boy.
As Micerider mentioned it's nice to have someone being trans without it being a central confirmed focus of the character. The same with Blanche being non-binary in Pokemon Go. The idea that everyone is cishet unless explicitly stated otherwise is something we should try to move away from, as many see that as the boilerplate that everyone is unless they know different. We don't look to other characters that aren't stated as cis and question their cisness. Unfortunately with where it's at unless it's blown up in bubble letters people will endlessly pick at 'well actually' stances to try to push back on the notion that characters could be or are trans/nb, even when more subtle indicators are there.
What do we think of the character of Denise in Twin Peaks, played by David Duchovny? Do we agree with this article?
How Twin Peaks' Denise Bryson Was (and Wasn't) Ahead of Her Time | The Mary Sue
While there’s a veritable infinity of ways you could describe David Lynch’s cult classic television series Twin Peaks, socially progressive is not typically the first phrase fans reach for. The show, which aired from 1990 to 1991, has been an enduring cultural phenomenon, but upon rewatching...
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It was 1991 and sure, the character was played by a cis man, but I thought the way they handled the character was very well done and respectful (for the time).
I'll quote this because i really don't think my position on that is comparable to what you're putting forward there. I don't even personally know if it's a good example of what you referred to, since it points to different interpretations of your message. To say that it's good for a character not to have them being trans be the central tenet of their character does not acquire these potentially transgender characters the certainty of them being so in the first place through subtle references and clues, those two premises hang onto different kinds of interpretations and expectations. The former seems to want the representation to be "i am transgender, but more importantly, here's why it's so hard to be a teacher with how little they pay us" and the latter goes for a kind of hyper detail oriented search for symbols of potential transness. They operate on different kinds of communication from the creator and, personally, don't work well together because we're putting the audience in a place where they are both looking for the clues, i.e. not sure, but trusted to also understand that their search will only reveal a character's transness in a story where their transness is not to be the defining message of that character. I don't think that counts as very positive representation, personally.
I honestly got the feeling that Madeline was non binary just from playing the vanilla game, through what i can only explain as some deep sense of relatability that i can't put to clearer words because it's been so long since i've played it. My question here would be was that not a good representation of a trans character even before we had these clues (that i will not question or defend since that is not the point here), or, perhaps more specifically, of transness or the experience of being non binary? If the answer here is yes (which i tendentiously think it is), then these sorts of clues are pretty unnecessary, don't you think? However, if that's not the case, then these sorts of clues are a midway concession that aren't fruitful and only lead to the audience halfway being in on it and halfway standing on intuited ground.
That said, from a realistic and pragmatic point of view, i think it's more likely that the developer wanted to include some trans visibility in their game, maybe since they were more comfortable doing it at that point, and since the nature of development might have prohibited some bigger investment in letting us know through other more time/dev expensive ways, adding some suggestive assets was a high return low investment way of including it. Which, thinking about it now, is probably more of an indication of Madeline being "word of god" a trans/non-binary character than those screen shots. Because, honestly, short hair on little girls is an extremely common way of signifying some counter gender behaviour and i would not personally that as a little boy, but more as a little girl who had short hair who in my own head fit into the non gender conforming Madeline i already saw her as, but little more.
Preach.
Honestly not sure what you're getting at with all of this. I resonated with her and the themes of Celeste, and appreciated the subtle nods in that scene as a means to present a trans character as you would if you saw the bedroom of other trans people. Like I said before – if you feel that it's not good representation that's fine. I disagree and really appreciate that there's no fanfare around it but instead an accurate view of what her room might look like as a trans girl. I was never searching for clues or symbols, they were presented and I acknowledged them.
What do we think of the character of Denise in Twin Peaks, played by David Duchovny? Do we agree with this article?
How Twin Peaks' Denise Bryson Was (and Wasn't) Ahead of Her Time | The Mary Sue
While there’s a veritable infinity of ways you could describe David Lynch’s cult classic television series Twin Peaks, socially progressive is not typically the first phrase fans reach for. The show, which aired from 1990 to 1991, has been an enduring cultural phenomenon, but upon rewatching...
It was 1991 and sure, the character was played by a cis man, but I thought the way they handled the character was very well done and respectful (for the time).
David Lynch's personally-delivered line of: "Fix your hearts or die" from the third season in 2017 spoke more to me personally than any other person's examination of the character ever could.
Denise being played by Duchovny is a misstep of its time, and Season 3 featuring returning characters and cast meant Duchovny was back in the role for a cameo. I genuinely feel Lynch is an ally though, and would be casting the role with a transgender actress if it was a new project today.
Fix your hearts or die was a great line. Unfortunately in the same scene he dead named Denise, which doesn't make a lot of sense if she's been living as Denise around him for like 30 years.
Not a fan. Maybe the Denise character was "progressive" for the early 90's when Twin Peaks first debuted. But bringing her back for The Return with an out-of-date perspective of her identity from a whole generation ago was one of Lynch's biggest missteps in the series.
What do we think of the character of Denise in Twin Peaks, played by David Duchovny? Do we agree with this article?
How Twin Peaks' Denise Bryson Was (and Wasn't) Ahead of Her Time | The Mary Sue
While there’s a veritable infinity of ways you could describe David Lynch’s cult classic television series Twin Peaks, socially progressive is not typically the first phrase fans reach for. The show, which aired from 1990 to 1991, has been an enduring cultural phenomenon, but upon rewatching...
It was 1991 and sure, the character was played by a cis man, but I thought the way they handled the character was very well done and respectful (for the time).
The gang are shit heads, but her arc seems pretty good. Like they usually destroy the lives of people around them, for example Cricket, but she goes on to complete her transition and get married. I'm not really in a position to say if it's good overall however.
Designated Survivor brought both trans and gay representation into the show the second it moved from ABC to Netflix. Not many shows go right for representing both in equal measure after being a pretty straight laced show the previous two years.
It is interesting that the most unrealistic thing that show did was have an independent win re-election to the Presidency while representing those groups pretty well
It is interesting that the most unrealistic thing that show did was have an independent win re-election to the Presidency while representing those groups pretty well
To be fair, Ryan Murphy's name being attached to anything is a red flag to me (and I assume others). The actual showrunner, Steven Canals, doesn't get mentioned nearly enough.
This is true, I hope those who are participating in this thread give the first and second seasons a chance.