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Son of Sparda

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,613
If the leak from that other thread is true, which it has proven to be thus far, then that narrator was Kamala Khan and she'll be the one to bring back the Avengers together.

So I'm not worried about the game not having PoC in it just yet.
 

Lukemia SL

Member
Jan 30, 2018
9,384
The match that Lady Bow & I got for our voice actress comparison for the narrator was for Kathreen Khavari, a first-generation Iranian-American actress who has been voicing Ms. Marvel/Kamala Khan since Avengers Assemble. Unless Square-Enix got a sound-alike who was a white woman, we should be in the clear on that front.


All signs (leaks, VA, etc.) point to that being the case.

Good stuff then šŸ˜ƒ
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,109
What is stopping these characters from appearing? This is a GaaS game and this is just trailer 1 where they basically just showcased the main cast of Avengers from the movies since the release of Avengers 1 in 2012.

I'd say you have a better case if after some time there are no PoC characters, then there is obviously a problem.
They have started preorders, if you are taking money you got to tell people what they are getting
 

Freakzilla

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
5,710
That's exactly what you said with your absolute, ridicuoulus statements.
*everything we touch* in the original post I commented on and you tried to get me on the hook for.
*every piece of media*
You don't get to deny it now.
Maybe don't use exaggerated language in the future.

Using exaggerated language doesn't negate the sentiment of my posts. If you can't help but get hung up on mono documentaries or white people making music or creating content and totally dismiss the issue at hand, then you are part of the problem.
 

Neoxon

Spotlighting Black Excellence - Diversity Analyst
Member
Oct 25, 2017
85,367
Houston, TX
It's a teaser/trailler of the early minutes of the game. No one here has absolutely no idea on how much inclusion there ir or isn't in the game, specially if the narrator is Kamala like it was leaked.
The main complaint (from what I can tell) is that they didn't have a person of color in the debut trailer. For example, all signs point to Kamala being in the base game, yet they showed Hank Pym at E3 over her.

We're not saying that there won't be any people of color in the game at all. The issue is that we should have seen at least one from the get-go. Though given that Black Panther of all characters was saved for DLC in MvCI, I wouldn't be surprised if Ms. Marvel was the only person of color in the base game.
 

TheGhost

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
28,137
Long Island
I mean it seems pretty intentional to me (not the lack of POC but the characters used here). Seems to me like the story may go that the original Avengers fail and that we'll see different Avengers join them later which will include a lot more variety.

I don't think it was mentioned in the trailer but is the narrator Ms Marvel?
The most likely scenario.
These are the OG's and new heroes will come in once we rebuild trust with humanity again.
 

plagiarize

It's not a loop. It's a spiral.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
27,545
Cape Cod, MA
We've still not seen proper gameplay and story related stuff and you're already coming to this conclusion?
We aren't concluding the game itself will have this problem. We're talking about how unveiling it in this way shows at the very least a lack of consideration about the wider fandom. Imagine if the sting had been Kamala instead of Pym, that would have been way more hype.

But they didn't even consider that they were only featuring white characters in the debut trailer. And that shows that these devs still need to learn a thing or two more about representation.
 

Soriku

Member
Nov 12, 2017
6,903
They have started preorders, if you are taking money you got to tell people what they are getting

They open up preorders early as hell. If you don't like what you see now, obviously don't preorder. Especially with a GaaS it's beneficial to you to wait. Anyone preordering now is probably a diehard and doesn't care.
 

Neoxon

Spotlighting Black Excellence - Diversity Analyst
Member
Oct 25, 2017
85,367
Houston, TX

Iztok

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,138
Using exaggerated language doesn't negate the sentiment of my posts. If you can't help but get hung up on mono documentaries or white people making music or creating content and totally dismiss the issue at hand, then you are part of the problem.

Ultra exaggerated language does exactly that, it completely detracts from any point you might have made that everyone can and does agree on.
And if you insist on seeking out division in this manner, you are part of the problem, not the ones trying to keep sensitive discussions hyperbole free.

It's really special how so many of you here go out of your way to strawman and bait people in to your preconcieved ideas of who your opponents are. It's more then a little unsettling.

I didn't "dismiss the issue at hand". In my very first reply I stated my opinion that there's always a better reason to include PoC, even if there are (concievable) reasons not to.
 
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CosmicArmor

Banned
Nov 15, 2018
28
This is definitely premature and reactionary. PoC will obviously be present. I'm surprised to see people so obsessed with race anyway.
We aren't concluding the game itself will have this problem. We're talking about how unveiling it in this way shows at the very least a lack of consideration about the wider fandom. Imagine if the sting had been Kamala instead of Pym, that would have been way more hype.

But they didn't even consider that they were only featuring white characters in the debut trailer. And that shows that these devs still need to learn a thing or two more about representation.

Am I the only one who thinks this is a weird nitpick? They decided not to show Kamala.. so what? Maybe they don't want to spoil anything? I don't understand why this is really a big deal.
 

plagiarize

It's not a loop. It's a spiral.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
27,545
Cape Cod, MA
This is definitely premature and reactionary. PoC will obviously be present. I'm surprised to see people so obsessed with race anyway.

Am I the only one who thinks this is a weird nitpick? They decided not to show Kamala.. so what? Maybe they don't want to spoil anything? I don't understand why this is really a big deal.
Maybe if society constantly made you wear your race around your neck like a sign of shame you'd be more 'obsessed' with race as an issue.

They spoiled Pym.
 

WrenchNinja

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,743
Canada
"They just used the original Avengers"

This isn't the original Avengers team.

"They just used the original MCU Avengers, stop complaining"

Where's Hawkeye then?

"They need to set up Black Panther and Captain Marvel"

Why? They didn't set up anyone else.

"That's Ms. Marvel narrating"

That's speculation, and she's still not featured visibly in the trailer which is the point of the criticism.

"Just be patient"

Why the fuck should anyone be patient?
 

CosmicArmor

Banned
Nov 15, 2018
28
It seems completely wild to me that after the massive success of Black Panther, Avengers Endgame and even Aquaman, the people at Square Enix decided to go with an exclusively white Avengers team. Even the OG Avengers movie at the very least featured Nick Fury, but Square proudly showed off a game in 2019 with 0 PoC and even threw in another white character as a stinger., What the actual hell is happening at the studio?

It... surprised you that they went with the main team..? Fury isn't as involved as these characters are when it comes to Avengers. Game looks amazing and I can't wait. They'll add more characters and PoC are definitely present in the story. Kamala could be unlockable as well.
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,109
"They just used the original Avengers"

This isn't the original Avengers team.

"They just used the original MCU Avengers, stop complaining"

Where's Hawkeye then?

"They need to set up Black Panther and Captain Marvel"

Why? They didn't set up anyone else.

"That's Ms. Marvel narrating"

That's speculation, and she's still not featured visibly in the trailer which is the point of the criticism.
On point. a whole bunch of "See what had happen was"
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,109
It... surprised you that they went with the main team..? Fury isn't as involved as these characters are when it comes to Avengers. Game looks amazing and I can't wait. They'll add more characters and PoC are definitely present in the story. Kamala could be unlockable as well.
Main team? Where's Hawkeye
 

Neoxon

Spotlighting Black Excellence - Diversity Analyst
Member
Oct 25, 2017
85,367
Houston, TX
It... surprised you that they went with the main team..? Fury isn't as involved as these characters are when it comes to Avengers. Game looks amazing and I can't wait. They'll add more characters and PoC are definitely present in the story. Kamala could be unlockable as well.
If the rumors are accurate (which they have been), Kamala is one of the first character you take control of.
 

CosmicArmor

Banned
Nov 15, 2018
28
User Banned (2 Weeks): Denying Societal Racism and Dismissive Commentary over Multiple Posts in this Thread; Account in Junior Phase
Maybe if society constantly made you wear your race around your neck like a sign of shame you'd be more 'obsessed' with race as an issue.

They spoiled Pym.

I disagree that society makes people wear their race around their necks like a sign of shame.

That wasn't the point. They choose to show Pym but don't want to show Kamala, considering she is seemingly heavily tied to the story of the game. This is a non-issue.
 

Bunkles

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
5,663
The OP has a point, tbh. i don't usually participate in threads like these but it was glaringly obvious during the reveal and especially when they showed the voice acting cast. There's no reason why they couldn't have BP, Fury, etc in the mix too.

This was the first time the game was shown to the world. This is what Square Enix wanted us to see and what superheroes we would be playing upon purchase. To say "bu bu bu more are coming soon" really isn't the point. Show, don't tell.
 

Neoxon

Spotlighting Black Excellence - Diversity Analyst
Member
Oct 25, 2017
85,367
Houston, TX
"That's Ms. Marvel narrating"

That's speculation, and she's still not featured visibly in the trailer which is the point of the criticism.
The speculation is actually a leak, & it came from this.
You're correct. I'd never intentionally lie to any of you guys. Obviously, things are subject to change throughout development, but I can confidently state the following details.

-Kamala Khan will 100% be a central protagonist in Avengers Project. The Avengers have been disbanded for a while (due to a "catastrophic" event) and she will play an integral role in reassembling the team.
-Heavy story focus throughout (drawing moreso from comics vs MCU)
-Can be played entirely SOLO with you controlling 1 character and AI taking over the remaining 1-3. Up to 4 player co-op with friends (this # hasn't changed last I heard).
-Crashed Helicarrier will serve as your main hub.
-Kingdom Hearts-like world/level design. Think multiple large worlds/levels vs 1 huge open world map. The levels are large enough to accomodate flight based characters.
-There's definitely no "loot" like you'd find in your typical looter shooter (common - legendary drops). Everything is mostly powers based, hence the character skill trees. For example, you won't be finding Iron Man thrusters of different rarities throughout the map.
-Unless it's changed, Ms. Marvel, Iron Man and Hulk will make up the team build early on in the game (story reason).

There are 1 or 2 spoilery story details that I'm keeping for myself (wouldn't want to ruin it for you guys), but that's the majority of it.
SavageSquirtle91 later accurately predicted the tragedy in the West Coast as being the catastrophic event that splits up the team.
 

xICHIGOx

Member
Oct 27, 2017
370
It seems completely wild to me that after the massive success of Black Panther, Avengers Endgame and even Aquaman, the people at Square Enix decided to go with an exclusively white Avengers team. Even the OG Avengers movie at the very least featured Nick Fury, but Square proudly showed off a game in 2019 with 0 PoC and even threw in another white character as a stinger., What the actual hell is happening at the studio?
Hulk is green, end of discussion /s
 

plagiarize

It's not a loop. It's a spiral.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
27,545
Cape Cod, MA
Far too many people aren't willing to hear criticism from an upset minority and expect the minority to shut up so they can enjoy this without feeling guilty about being excited.

Just wait before sharing your opinion about that. Maybe we'll stop complaining before the game comes out when and if it becomes clear that the game represents all of Marvel's fans.

If you think black people owe anyone the benefit of doubt you are mistaken.
 

Burrman

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,633
This shit is too common in games sadly. No one gives a shit when Kojima fills his game with nothing but white people. Black panther was an obvious must.
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,109
Because I'm currently being choked to death on characters with bows
The Mightiest Archer in two universe's
6492932-rco026_1468904945.jpg
 

Freakzilla

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
5,710
Ultra exaggerated language does exactly that, it completely detracts from any point you might have made that everyone can and does agree on.
And if you insist on seeking out division in this manner, you are part of the problem, not the ones trying to keep sensitive discussions hyperbole free.

It's really special how so many of you here go out of your way to strawman and bait people in to your preconcieved ideas of who your opponents are. It's more then a little unsettling.

It only detracts to people who are not on board with the change. And if you can't see past the possible hyperbole in my post ( which was in direct response to hyperbole defending the lack of diversity) no matter small, then you are just looking for any excuse to defend the lack of inclusion or diversity.


They absolutely have to be troll posts/bait mocking the community. Black Panther not being there (yet) was nowhere near my mind while I was watching that. I both love and hate this place sometimes.

Hell.. Some people think Ms. Marvel was the girl talking. We don't know yet. We don't know anything. We have hardly seen the game but this is what bothers Reset?

It almost offends me that they think we are going to feel like shit if a POC isn't on literally everything we touch. I don't mind playing a white guy sometimes. I really don't...

Edit: There is zero chance that there won't be more representation when the new mcu phase starts. We just need to wait


This was the original post I quoted. Why do you have nothing to say about the Hyperbole in that post? When I said there should be a PoC on everything we touch it was in direct response to that post. Why do you harp on what I'm saying?
 

SliceSabre

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,556
They have started preorders, if you are taking money you got to tell people what they are getting
I mean you say that like countless games haven't said "And these 5 characters are coming! BUT WHO ARE THEY!?" I mean technically speaking it's probably smarter not to tell people. A lot of people like the surprise and companies know they can bank off that. Why tell people which ruins the surprise and may make people not buy the game?
 

dat boi

Member
Oct 28, 2017
448
Crystal Dynamics is making this so I'm sure there will be diversification down the road. They're usually pretty cognizant of this kinda thing.
 

ArjanN

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,113
Honestly I assume they just went with the safest option in the original movie Avengers, and Fury is more of a guy on the radio/quest giver character.
 

Z-Beat

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,847
I mean you say that like countless games haven't said "And these 5 characters are coming! BUT WHO ARE THEY!?" I mean technically speaking it's probably smarter not to tell people. A lot of people like the surprise and companies know they can bank off that. Why tell people which ruins the surprise and may make people not buy the game?
I don't think that helps sales. It helped kill the hype for the Playstation Classic, and the amount of people you'd get in from confirming characters dwarfs the amount you'd lose from confirming characters, especially in an age where more can always be added with DLC.
 

Kalentan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,660
Are Miles and Peter not safe?

When it comes to those two it depends on whether or not this is set in the same universe as the PS4 game (and whether or not the PS4 game is set before or after the time skip)

That game does specifically have Peter say that the Avengers are on the West coast dealing with stuff. And this game does begin with a huge attack.
 

Z-Beat

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,847
When it comes to those two it depends on whether or not this is set in the same universe as the PS4 game (and whether or not the PS4 game is set before or after the time skip)

That game does specifically have Peter say that the Avengers are on the West coast dealing with stuff. And this game does begin with a huge attack.
That's fair if it's all one big crossover