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So everyone knows Joker movie isn't really a movie about the Joker right?

DragonSJG

DragonSJG

Banned
Mar 4, 2019
14,341
Despite the title, the movie really has little to do with the title character IMO.. The movie is more about how someone with mental illness is driven to the edge and has some interesting social commentary. I think its more accurate to say that Joaquin Phoenix portrays Arthur Fleck instead of the Joker

Edit: Should change my title. IMO, I don't see it as a movie really about the Joker
 
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Dest

Dest

Has seen more 10s than EA ever will
Coward
Jun 4, 2018
14,057
Work
it's uh
his origin story
it's about him for sure
it's about his battles with the health care system and his mental health issues
 
Kewlmyc

Kewlmyc

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
26,722
There are multiple iterations of the Joker due to comics having multiple writers and story for one character. This takes elements from a lot of them to tell a new origin story of the character.

It is absolutely about the Joker, or maybe you could say a Joker.
 
TheMan

TheMan

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,264
Hey guys this movie about how the joker became the joker isn't actually about the joker
 
Haloid1177

Haloid1177

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,533
I agree but not in the same sense. Most Joker origins have Batman's inability to save him from falling into the vat of chemicals as the catalyst for the birth of Joker, since a key question in the Batman mythos is does he exist to stop supervillains or do supervillains exist in Gotham because of him and this movie misses that. But it's supposed to be a Joker movie so it doesn't matter. But it kinda matters.

I'm real mixed on this in case that wasn't clear lol.
 
SJRB

SJRB

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
4,861
The whole "no no you're misunderstanding this movie" sentiment is hilarious.
 
5taquitos

5taquitos

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,893
OR
So everyone knows Batman Begins isn't really movie about Batman right?

Despite the title, the movie really has little to do with the title character. The movie is more about how someone with mental illness is driven to the edge and has some interesting social commentary. I think its more accurate to say that Christian Bale portrays Bruce Wayne instead of the Batman
 
Jimnymebob

Jimnymebob

Member
Oct 26, 2017
19,636
5taquitos said:
So everyone knows Batman Begins isn't really movie about Batman right?

Despite the title, the movie really has little to do with the title character. The movie is more about how someone with mental illness is driven to the edge and has some interesting social commentary. I think its more accurate to say that Christian Bale portrays Bruce Wayne instead of the Batman
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Was that Bruce Wayne Begins?
 

Deleted member 9035

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
8,686
OP I believe what you meant to say is that Arthur's struggles reflect a wider trend that exists outside of comic books, and that we should be more sensitive to others, especially those with mental illness.
 
Hollywood Duo

Hollywood Duo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
41,968
Yeah it is and its worse off for it. The
final scene where they shoehorn batman's origin is the worst part of the movie
 
OP
OP
DragonSJG

DragonSJG

Banned
Mar 4, 2019
14,341
5taquitos said:
So everyone knows Batman Begins isn't really movie about Batman right?

Despite the title, the movie really has little to do with the title character. The movie is more about how someone with mental illness is driven to the edge and has some interesting social commentary. I think its more accurate to say that Christian Bale portrays Bruce Wayne instead of the Batman
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Click to shrink...
Todd Philips himself said its ambigous if he really is the Joker or just inspires him.
 
thecouncil

thecouncil

Member
Oct 29, 2017
12,341
Besides the title and the million references to Batman, Gotham and Joker, yeah, it's not about Joker. Good call. Not sure why people aren't getting that.
 
Tabaxi

Tabaxi

Member
Nov 18, 2018
12,918
DragonSJG said:
Despite the title, the movie really has little to do with the title character. The movie is more about how someone with mental illness is driven to the edge and has some interesting social commentary. I think its more accurate to say that Joaquin Phoenix portrays Arthur Fleck instead of the Joker
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Not it doesn't. It's the same "mental illness and violence" narrative that's been done a billion times. The lone male figure chipped away at society isn't social commentary, it's reinforcing a cliche. And a boring, safe one at that.

I really liked the movie. Don't get me wrong. But it's absolutely a mindless blockbuster, and it doesn't work as anything deeper than that.
 
Nali

Nali

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,654
The Batman connections were intentionally flimsy, yes.
"We didn't make the movie to push buttons," Phillips told TheWrap's Sharon Waxman in an interview last Friday about the filmmaking process. "I literally described to Joaquin at one point in those three months as like, 'Look at this as a way to sneak a real movie in the studio system under the guise of a comic book film'. It wasn't, 'We want to glorify this behavior.' It was literally like 'Let's make a real movie with a real budget and we'll call it f–ing Joker'. That's what it was."
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captive

captive

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,999
Houston
DragonSJG said:
Despite the title, the movie really has little to do with the title character. The movie is more about how someone with mental illness is driven to the edge and has some interesting social commentary. I think its more accurate to say that Joaquin Phoenix portrays Arthur Fleck instead of the Joker
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Click to shrink...
the first part is bullshit.
and I would argue does more harm to people with mental illness than help it.
There are lots of people with mental illness that dont go around blaming their problems on everyone else and killing people.

The social commentary is relevant a little bit, there is something to be said about how society fails to address mental illness.
 
Vampirolol

Vampirolol

Member
Dec 13, 2017
5,822
It's 100% a comic book movie though.

captive said:
the first part is bullshit.
and I would argue does more harm to people with mental illness than help it.
There are lots of people with mental illness that dont go around blaming their problems on everyone else and killing people.

The social commentary is relevant a little bit, there is something to be said about how society fails to address mental illness.
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Also this, so much. I would say that the worst part about having a mental illness is that hollywood will always sell you as a psycho.
 
Tokio Blues

Tokio Blues

Member
Sep 14, 2018
551
Joker's origin was always a mistery, there is no such a thing as an official "origin". They are all interpretations, and this is a valid and very good one. Also "Arthur Fleck" isn't his official name because.

he is adopted, so we will never know his real name

Comics like "The White Knight" and "The Killing Joke" explains his origins in some way.. and they are all different.
 
Meg Cherry

Meg Cherry

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,279
Seattle, WA
I feel like it'd be a better movie if that's actually what was going on. Instead, it's very much positioned as an origin story for the Joker - even building up an origin story and feud for Batman that will never be paid off.
 
I Don't Like

I Don't Like

Member
Dec 11, 2017
14,918
Just because parts of his experience can be applied to a broader context, doesn't mean the movie isn't about him. I saw it and it's definitely about Joker.
 
Stinkles

Stinkles

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,459
I heard it's a movie about what happens when a large group of homo sapiens combines efforts and creates systems and rules within which to live - ostensibly for each member's benefit, but that those systems and rules aren't always equitable. If only we had a collective term for that sort of arrangement. Oh well.
 
Canucked

Canucked

Comics Council 2020 & Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,416
Canada
It's called the Joker. Made by Warner Bros., owners of the Joker. As a possible origin story of a Joker.

In the movie he asked to be called Joker. One day he may fight Batman.
 
OP
OP
DragonSJG

DragonSJG

Banned
Mar 4, 2019
14,341
captive said:
the first part is bullshit.
and I would argue does more harm to people with mental illness than help it.
There are lots of people with mental illness that dont go around blaming their problems on everyone else and killing people.

The social commentary is relevant a little bit, there is something to be said about how society fails to address mental illness.
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Really, that's what a friend of mine brought up when she discussed it as with others
 

Deleted member 11008

User requested account closure
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
6,627
Tokio Blues said:
Comics like "The White Knight" and "The Killing Joke" explains his origins in some way.. and they are all different.
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I don't remember where (maybe was The Killing Joke? ), but I like how Joker said he don't remember his past and he likes to invent any backstory depending the moment. I bring this to my cowoker and it blow his mind hahaha
 
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