So, about that PSVR 2...

[Anthony Hopkins]

I hope for
4k
Add on
Roomscale like oculus S/quest.

But more then anything
Some, AA. 5 AAA game investment from sony's top devs.

 

[Stef]

Yes but you say that a stand alone would cost the same as a peripheral, when the stand alone has more hardware in it. The stand alone would be pricier, the add-on would be cheaper = more sales.

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I said that a PS5 + a PSVR2 headset (non-stand alone) would probably cost 399 + 399.

A 399 stand-alone headset (of course, LESS powerful than the PS5+PSVR2 hypothesis) could sell better, if Sony publishes good games for it.

What's the problem with this concept?

 

[Fisty]

It will fail if it is.

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Yeah a lot of AAA support for VR comes with little bonus modes in the big games, we would miss out on a ton of content if they were completely independent

I said that a PS5 + a PSVR2 headset (non-stand alone) would probably cost 399 + 399.

A 399 stand-alone headset (of course, LESS powerful than the PS5+PSVR2 hypothesis) could sell better, if Sony publishes good games for it.

What's the problem with this concept?

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Multiple dev environments, for one. They couldn't support the Vita so they had to streamline, Nintendo also combined development pipleines. Supporting a peripheral is hard enough, let alone another (basically) console. Also most everything worth playing on it would need the PS5 any way, and the remaining smaller experiences and multimedia functions would probably be much more robust on other platforms regardless.

 

[MetalBoi]

It will fail if it is.

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If it can't stand on its own, it deserves to fail.

 

[Aztechnology]

I do not see them going standalone. They are all about their ecosystem and that just wouldn't work well for them.

 

[Optional Objectives]

.

 

[Fisty]

If it can't stand on its own, it deserves to fail.

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I dont think that adage applies to hardware peripherals... in fact it makes no sense at all.

 

[MetalBoi]

I dont think that adage applies to hardware peripherals... in fact it makes no sense at all.

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Good because I'm talking hypothetically about a stand-alone device.

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

I said that a PS5 + a PSVR2 headset (non-stand alone) would probably cost 399 + 399.

A 399 stand-alone headset (of course, LESS powerful than the PS5+PSVR2 hypothesis) could sell better, if Sony publishes good games for it.

What's the problem with this concept?

Click to shrink...

I don't know how much simpler I can explain it, you keep misunderstanding. I'll use your example.

Standalone PSVR2 ($399) Hardware is in the unit so it is pricier than the add-on by itself.

PS5 ($399) + PSVR2 as add-on ($150-$200) Add-on headset by itself is CHEAPER TO PRODUCE since it has NO HARDWARE in it.

To the people that own PS5s already, a cheaper add-on headset is easier to swallow compared to how it is now. Yes, the combined price of the PS5 and PSVR2 might be more expensive than the standalone, but the standalone is a worse value proposition since it is a separate ecosystem, will have worse visuals, and the portable battery will be drain doubly as much powering stand-alone hardware and the screen simultaneously.

 

[Anthony Hopkins]

I don't know how much simpler I can explain it, you keep misunderstanding. I'll use your example.

Standalone PSVR2 ($399) Hardware is in the unit so it is pricier than the add-on by itself.

PS5 ($399) + PSVR2 as add-on ($150-$200) Add-on headset is CHEAPER TO PRODUCE since it has NO HARDWARE in it.

To the people that own PS5s already, a cheaper add-on headset is easier to swallow, than purchasing a standalone that has no connection or compatibility to the PS5, is a seperate ecosystem, as well as being underpowered. Yes, the combined price of the PS5 and PSVR2 might be more expensive than the standalone, but the standalone is a worse value proposition since it is a separate ecosystem, will have worse visuals, and the portable battery will be drain doubly as much powering stand-alone hardware and the screen simultaneously.

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If that's the case why is the oculus S (PC add on) the same price as the oculus quest (standalone headset)

 

[Inugami]

Most importantly, it needs roomscale.

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I don't see Sony doing Roomscale without inside out tracking. Hopefully the tech will be better about that by the time that's out. As imprecise as it currently is, inside out will be the way to get VR into peoples homes. The mass market isn't going to want to wire up lighthouses in their living rooms.

 

[Fafalada]

I really think that a stand-alone PSVR2 headset, while of course less performing than a PS5 add-on, could provide a VR experience which would go way beyond what we have now with PSVR.

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Other than tracking improvements I'm not seeing the math here. This is like asking for a portable ps5 that's also a dramatic leap over ps4.

 

[Fisty]

Good because I'm talking hypothetically about a stand-alone device.

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Well the problem with that statement is that if you force it to stand alone, it will fail because you are forcing it to stand alone. You think people are going to run out in droves and pick up a standalone Sony headset where devs have to make games for a completely different architecture (slowing dev) and them not look a whole lot better than what you could get with PSVR and PS4 in 2016? "Yeah we could tether the headset to this 10-12 tflop console, but nah let's just throw an ARM board with less power than a PS4 in the headset and tell devs to figure it out"

 

[MetalBoi]

Well the problem with that statement is that if you force it to stand alone, it will fail because you are forcing it to stand alone. You think people are going to run out in droves and pick up a standalone Sony headset where devs have to make games for a completely different architecture (slowing dev) and them not look a whole lot better than what you could get with PSVR and PS4 in 2016? "Yeah we could tether the headset to this 10-12 tflop console, but nah let's just throw an ARM board with less power than a PS4 in the headset and tell devs to figure it out"

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I gave the opinion that I hope the next iteration of PSVR is separate from PS5 because I want absolutely nothing to do with it, and I don't want Sony giving any resources to it at all, and would rather they spend them all on PS5 in a traditional sense.

 

[Deleted member 44129]

I think we will see a "PSVR PRO" pretty soon at or near the launch of the PS5. It will have better tracking and higher resolution. It will probably just use Move Controllers rather than a new solution to the controller issue, but new Playstation VR software will absolutely be backwards compatible with the current stuff.

 

[Fisty]

I gave the opinion that I hope the next iteration of PSVR is separate from PS5 because I want absolutely nothing to do with it, and I don't want Sony giving any resources to it at all, and would rather they spend them all on PS5 in a traditional sense.

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Cool

 

[RestEerie]

Addon to PS5 but i think it will no longer need a camera to do tracking. It will essentially be like the new occulus S.

 

[MetalBoi]

Cool

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That way if they insist on continuing with this PSVR nonsense, it won't be tied in or associated with PS5. One can dream. :)

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

I gave the opinion that I hope the next iteration of PSVR is separate from PS5 because I want absolutely nothing to do with it, and I don't want Sony giving any resources to it at all, and would rather they spend them all on PS5 in a traditional sense.

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"I want the next Sony (Playstation)VR to be seperate from PS5"

"I also want Sony to not spend a dime on PSVR"

Wait what?

You know it's optional anyway right? There are no games that are "not being made" because of the existence of PSVR games. This is as silly as people thinking that HD remasters were occupying the production resources that could go into a new game. What perceived harm has this optional device done to the PS4/Pro in your opinion?

 

[MetalBoi]

"I want the next Sony (Playstation)VR to be seperate from PS5"

"I also want Sony to not spend a dime on PSVR"

Wait what?

You know it's optional anyway right? There are no games that are "not being made" because of the existence of PSVR. This is as silly as people thinking that HD remasters were occupying the production resources that could go into a new game.

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You don't know that. Only three or four exclusives for the final two years of PS4s life, yet you assure me the continuation of PSVR isn't interfering with PlayStation business? Yeah...

 

[TitanicFall]

Consider that PS4 is a 6 years old hardware and will probably be 7/8 years old when PSVR2 will launch.

I really think that a stand-alone PSVR2 headset, while of course less performing than a PS5 add-on, could provide a VR experience which would go way beyond what we have now with PSVR.

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Seems like too big a financial commitment for little gain. A built-in CPU/GPU, cooling solution, plus sufficient storage is going to be expensive. Game sizes tend to go up each gen. Stuff like RE7 is 15+ gigs already. The alternative is to not go for that caliber of game and just do the short VR experiences we are already getting. I don't really get the need for a standalone headset. A wireless headset would be great, but a standalone headset doesn't give me anything I'm not already getting. It's not like I'm going to pack a VR headset in my backpack to use on a commute.

 

[2Blackcats]

I think we will see a "PSVR PRO" pretty soon at or near the launch of the PS5. It will have better tracking and higher resolution. It will probably just use Move Controllers rather than a new solution to the controller issue, but new Playstation VR software will absolutely be backwards compatible with the current stuff.

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I reckon we'll get the opposite. We might get a new PSVR but it will essentially be the same tech (same resolution, etc) around PS5 launch. A tidier version let's say.

But I think we'll get new controllers. They may even be the standard controller for the PS5. PSVR2 will be later, at least a year.

 

[Fisty]

You don't know that. Only three or four exclusives for the final two years of PS4s life, yet you assure me the continuation of PSVR isn't interfering with PlayStation business? Yeah...

Click to shrink...

MS doesnt have many exclusives announced, they must be going all in on VR!

Also, I can name like 8 big non-VR exclusives coming to PS4

 

[Mr_Antimatter]

All I want is for games to be bc with the psvr1 headset.

For the psvr 2 set I want room scale tracking and a higher resolution screen.

Oh, and improved motion controllers.

 

[copelandmaster]

Preferably hybrid, so they can go toe to toe with the Quest and the HTC Cosmos. A bunch of devs are going to start targeting for Quest anyway, its the new common denominator.
That said, Sony's track record for portability being the PSP and Vita has me hesitant.

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

You don't know that. Only three or four exclusives for the final two years of PS4s life, yet you assure me the continuation of PSVR isn't interfering with PlayStation business? Yeah...

Click to shrink...

So your argument against PSVR is basically that it took away hypothetical mystery titles that you don't know existed or ever did? You don't see the lack of logic there?

And you still didn't answer my question, how has the PSVR hampered your experience on PS4?

Did you also complain when Sony released PS Move, PSEye, etc? Why are you against optional peripherals that appeal to different kinds of gamers?

 

[MetalBoi]

So your argument against PSVR is basically that it took away hypothetical mystery titles that you don't know existed or ever did? You don't see the lack of logic there?

And you still didn't answer my question, how has the PSVR hampered your experience on PS4?

Did you also complain when Sony released PS Move, PSEye, etc? Why are you against optional peripherals that appeal to different kinds of gamers?

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Are any of those accessories in the $400 dollar range? I just don't think they should bother with something that only a 5-10% of the base got tricked in to.

 

[MetalBoi]

MS doesnt have many exclusives announced, they must be going all in on VR!

Also, I can name like 8 big non-VR exclusives coming to PS4

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Cool.

 

[SecondNature]

When is this going to be cheap enough to make it standard dammit

I want a bundle option day 1.

 

[Weltall Zero]

PSVR represents less than 5% of the install base of PS4.

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Is there a particular reason you're ignoring that's still 4 million headsets, making it the best selling VR headset ever?

 

[Weltall Zero]

Kinda still is until ALL of Sony's big franchises are made with VR in mind. Is there any current or upcoming AAA franchises using VR?

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You don't know that. Only three or four exclusives for the final two years of PS4s life, yet you assure me the continuation of PSVR isn't interfering with PlayStation business? Yeah...

Click to shrink...

Few VR games made: "it's a gimmick with no real support from Sony".
Many VR games made: "it's interfering with PlayStation business".

For extra hilarity, both takes have been in response to the same announcements. :D

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

Are any of those accessories in the $400 dollar range?

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It doesn't matter the price, it still sold incredibly well at that value. If it hadn't and tanked, and Sony was STILL investing in it for the PS5, you might have had a point.

got tricked in to.

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Yeah you're clearly arguing in good faith here /s

Listen, you need to understand that maybe PSVR isn't for you, but it was for millions, myself included. PSVR/VR was literally another Mario 64 moment for me the first time I demoed it, something I never thought I'd experience again. It's been amazing, and I want more as long as it's part of gaming.

I just don't think they should bother with something that only a 5-10% of the base got

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And this logic is just braindead. Could you imagine this business sense applied to Sony's first party games development? "Yeah, let's not fund Horizon 2, the first game only appealed to 5%-10% of the PS4 fanbase."

 

[Quample]

Peripheral. VR needs as much power as it can get right now. They're coming up with cool tricks for VR like ASW but it won't replace raw power, especially if you want considerably higher resolution/solid performance

When dynamic foveated rendering comes out, standalone will be something. An order of magnitude less power required for the same results. PSVR2 will miss the boat on that tech, so definitely needs the console power. Plus the game ecosystem would be entirely different.

It's the same reason I'm only half excited about the Oculus Quest. Yes I think it might have more mainstream appeal and it has it's advantages, but the sacrifices aren't worth the benefits to me. Hopefully they figure out a cheap wireless solution, best of both worlds.

 

[MetalBoi]

Doesn't like my opinions, so out come the personal insults. Another one for the blocked house.

 

[Deleted member 27315]

PSVR2 will miss the boat on that tech, so definitely needs the console power. Plus the game ecosystem would be entirely different.

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If it comes out 2022-23 maybe will not miss this boat.

If I was Sony, I would make a psvr1 slim with some improvements, and I would support the previous versions until the arrival of psvr2(dynamic foveated rendering). PS5 alone could make a huge difference in image quality of psvr1.

 

[Quample]

If it comes out 2022-23 maybe will not miss this boat.

If I was Sony, I would make a psvr1 slim with some improvements, and I would support the previous version until the arrival of psvr2 with dynamic foveated rendering. PS5 alone could make a huge difference in image quality.

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I agree, they should wait "if" the tech is ready by then. It's a big if though, especially if Sony is trying to keep their price reasonable. If foveated rendering is possible, then it would be pointless to release it with less than say 4k per eye, which means more expensive screens, and of course the price of the eye tracking hardware (which may not be horribly expensive at that point, but it will definitely add up). It will also enable more efficient wireless data transfer, which means going wireless makes more sense, which again, is more expensive. My guess is even if we are on the verge of foveated rendering around that time, Sony will opt out and go with Oculus Rift S level tech with a better screen. Honestly that would still be a decent jump, considering. And if that's what they do, they could do it at a very reasonable price point, maybe even $300.

 

[Jon God]

A hybrid device sounds like a win-win. Share games with the PS4/5, but be able to play without them

 

[Yokijirou]

All PS5 consoles come with a VR Headset because that's the console. 🙀

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

Doesn't like my opinions, so out come the personal insults. Another one for the blocked house.

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In case this is referring to me, note that I called your logic braindead, and not you personally (which by the way, you did actually infer an insult to all PSVR owners as people dumb enough who got tricked into buying it).

It sounds more to me like you didn't have a good enough rebuttal to my arguments, and chose to block me instead. If that's the furthest discourse can go with you, then you're doing us both a favor. Enjoy Sony's massive future investment into PSVR, I know I will :)

 

[Dan Thunder]

They better not pull Kinect like shit on us by making it mandatory buy with PS5, otherwise I don't care much about what they do with it.

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No console maker is going to force a £250-300 peripheral onto consumers on top of the £350-400 it'd cost for the console. It'd be commercial suicide.

 

[Dan Thunder]

I think we will see a "PSVR PRO" pretty soon at or near the launch of the PS5. It will have better tracking and higher resolution. It will probably just use Move Controllers rather than a new solution to the controller issue, but new Playstation VR software will absolutely be backwards compatible with the current stuff.

Click to shrink...

That's my thinking. To me that's the best way to test the waters to see how open people will be to it in the next-gen. No point spending a fortune developing an entirely new system when it shouldn't be too hard to bump up the specs of the current headset to a more current standard.

Maybe they'll somehow be able to get rid of the little hardware box and market it as for PS5 only.

 

[gofreak]

It could be both - a standalone that can reach out to a local PS5 for an enhanced experience - but I'm not sure things are mature enough yet. I think it'll be an add-on for cost control, and to ensure a high minimum base for software to deliver a big step forward.

If it could be both it would be great though, but I'm not sure we're at that point of convergence yet, between high end VR and self-contained VR.

 

[Alucardx23]

Would you rather have it as an add-on peripheral for PlayStation 5, just like it happens with PSVR and PS4?

Or would you like Sony to take the Oculus Quest route and develop a stand-alone device that works on its own, without the need of a paired console?

Note: when I say "peripheral", that could also be completely wireless, not necessarily connected to the console by cables.

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You are missing the option that I want. A stand alone unit that also can connect to the PS5. There is nothing stopping Sony from releasing two PSVR models, just like Oculus is doing. One unit that must be connected to the PS5 to work, hopefully with a wired and wireless connection as options. Another option that is basically like the Oculus Quest but with the option to have a wired or wireless connection to the PS5.

 

[Yankee Ruin X]

Sod streaming and go all in with VR please Sony. All I want is higher resolution screens, better tracking and some god damn thumbsticks on the new Move controllers and I'm set for next gen.

 

[p3n]

Roomscale with super robust tracking and wireless would be killer. Preferably as an add-on for the next gen console(s) and usable on PC.

But...

Wireless is a pipe dream with currently available tech. Batteries are too heavy or don't last long enough. It will probably be USB3/TB VR-port single cable without breakout box.

Roomscale is either too expensive or has crappy inside-out tracking. I don't know if Sony will be the company to solve tracking for the mass market.

 

[IvanSlavkov]

If it is wireless it will be great if it's not I'm fine.

 

[Ricky_R]

Whichever lets them improve IQ.

 

[1-D_FE]

It could be both - a standalone that can reach out to a local PS5 for an enhanced experience - but I'm not sure things are mature enough yet. I think it'll be an add-on for cost control, and to ensure a high minimum base for software to deliver a big step forward.

If it could be both it would be great though, but I'm not sure we're at that point of convergence yet, between high end VR and self-contained VR.

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Really comes down to price. It's definitely now possible. Qualcomm is showing a new hybrid reference design using a Snapdragon 845. It's not only a reference design for hybrid VR devices, but it's a hybrid device that supports 60hz wireless for the "tethered" mode. When doing the wireless "tethered", the snapdragon is used to help with the wireless compression.

This really should be the next-gen standard for all high end models. Heck, even if the mythical Valve VR headset was true, I think they'd be a little crazy to ignore this.

https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/18/18271385/qualcomm-wireless-vr-headset-standalone-connect-to-pc

I don't even think it's that unreasonable. If we assume PS5 is launching fall 2020 and they don't want to launch 2 major devices in the same year, it would leave fall 2021 for VR. That's another 2.5 years for prices to come down.

 

[Thatguy]

VR needs to become like TV. They need standards. PS5 needs to support PSVR, PSVR2, Oculus, Vive, Samsung, just as it will support TVs from all manufacturers. VR will not really take off until this is realized.

 

[Sidewinder]

Hybrid - standalone that can connect to a stationary device as well.

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Best of both worlds, I'd take that if possible.

If not, then definitely peripheral like PSVR, I don't want a device that can't profit from the full power of a nextgen device and would be an entirely different platform just like a Vita. I expect far more hybrid games nextgen from 1st party and other devs, if eye tracking and foveated rendering is a thing.