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Oct 26, 2017
6,577
There are for sure some people unsubscribing for legit reasons like no longer loving their content, so I wouldn't just assuming everybody that unsubscribed recently is a bigot.

At the same time though the drop is so big, so fast that it is clear a large part is because of them coming out. And fuck those people.
This drop is pretty much undeniably due to the coming out. Disgusting shit really especially since Sterling always championed tolerance and equality on their YouTube channel.
Personally I unsubscribed a couple years back, as the style of the Jimquisition videos just nurtured my depression and I had to quit watching. That being said I still sometimes watch an intro or quick episodewhen my mind is in a good place.
Still, they're voice is an important one. And this industry needs media personalities to hold them accountable.
 

Aether

Member
Jan 6, 2018
4,421
setting myself up here...
i myself was thinking about unsubscribing, but not because of the personal change, but the change in style over the last year.
The content seemed more focused, the jokes landed better, it was less an outlet to talk about the other interests
(figurines, toys, boglins, wrestling) that just really really dont interest me. It just screams "i need an editor" to me.
That the industry kinda runs in circles with how they make the same mistakes also does not help...
i also did not realize the coming out for a while, since back then they where already a rather openly queer
and colorfull personality, with costumes and colors and all, so i just asumes they liked that wig and did not think much about that.

with that said: the amount of unsubscriptions kinda suprises me, that is 100% trans/non binary phobia.
I'm not shure if its the reason for 100% of the unsubscribers, but probably the majority,
and i cant understand how those people followed them back then as they where always a big LGBTQ+ advocate.

For myself, i will wait till somewhat after E3, and then decide if there was at least one video that i
watched till the end, or if i just list interest in their style of content.
 

Paroni

Member
Dec 17, 2020
3,421
James is clearly the happiest they've been in a long time and it shows in their videos, but Gamers™️ just have to be trash. I love this hobby but my god is it filled with the worst people.

What also gets me is that James has always been explicitly pro LGBTQ+ but them coming out as NB is somehow too far now?

It is it's own kind of online nimbyism I suppose. "Sure I tolerate sexual/gender minorities wherever they are but do I really have to see and hear them myself?"
 

Razmos

Unshakeable One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 28, 2017
15,890
I walked away a long time before this, and while the timing is suspect, their content has become immensely stale of late, and is probably a small factor here.

How many times can we watch one person say the industry that produces our hobby is evil?
Your takeaway from this is that reporting on issues with the gaming industry is the problem rather than that the gaming industry continues to be shit over and over for the same reasons. lol
 
Plotted: Subscribers Over Time
Oct 26, 2017
1,030
For those downplaying how much of the recent downturn of subs is due to James Stephanie's coming out, here's a helpful graph:

img_20210608_0243426kjqe.jpg


So while the decline is in the 35-40k range (EDIT: this was off memory; it's actually ~33k) instead of the 100k range previously stated -- although they could have lost that many but gained some to offset it, I suppose -- it's more than clear what caused the recent large drop in subs.

Like, come on.
 
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firehawk12

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,205
There's a weird crossover between actual gamergate people and the "gamers rights" people that complain about bad practices, so I'm sure that caused a lot of the drop when the "anti-SJW anti-big corporation" gamer was confronted with the change.
 

Cenauru

Dragon Girl Supremacy
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,981
Not wanting to acknowledge transphobia and blame something else instead of acknowledging it is still transphobia, and is textbook TERF shit. Might want to be careful if you wanna avoid sounding like one. And using these threads to voice why you're "not one of the bad ones for not liking their content" only leads to suspicion as to why you feel the need to tell everyone.
 
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Messofanego

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,201
UK
I'm not saying their coming out had no impact on subscribers, simply that it doesn't account for the larger downward trend that started in the Fall of 2019. You can pretty clearly fit a trend line to their subscriber curve from Fall 2019 to now. Of course there are going to be bigots who abandoned them for coming out, but the larger downward trend of net subscribers is clearly more than a reaction to a single video or event.
So you are denying the loss in this amount of subscribers is specifically related to them coming out. Cause in the video which you should watch if you haven't, they go over that the possible reasons could be "repetition" in their content even though they argue doing new things makes you lose subscribers, queer content is made invisible by YouTube, subscribers don't even know when new video comes out, or naming the badness of capitalism. They still argue this level of drop is right after they came out where they lost 2000 subscribers in that coming out day, and a 1K every few days to then once a week, to where they are now. So if you want to stick to your logic, you're going against James Stephanie Sterling's arguments.
 

Bob Beat

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,916
Black ppl on this board have been saying it: gaming is problematic. You have to drag gaming into the 21st century. But that's always the rub. If you are popular, you have conservative fans and they are pushing to the right.

Hell, I've never been a fan of online gaming because of those dolts. We can't ignore it or be quiet about it.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,293
Hot take: society has such an ingrained hatred of women that the biggest fear men have is being perceived as feminine. Seeing another person who previously presented as a man suddenly present as a woman makes a lot of people really uncomfortable. My guess is the opposite transition would cause significantly less of a subscriber drop.
 

Zoator

Member
Oct 27, 2017
405
So you are denying the loss in this amount of subscribers is specifically related to them coming out. Cause in the video which you should watch if you haven't, they go over that the possible reasons could be "repetition" in their content even though they argue doing new things makes you lose subscribers, queer content is made invisible by YouTube, subscribers don't even know when new video comes out, or naming the badness of capitalism. They still argue this level of drop is right after they came out where they lost 2000 subscribers in that coming out day, and a 1K every few days to then once a week, to where they are now. So if you want to stick to your logic, you're going against James Stephanie Sterling's arguments.

I watched their video shortly after it was originally posted, and I don't disagree with their arguments. I was just contextualizing it in the broader view of the gradual decline of their channel over the past 1.5 years or so (and I acknowledged that this thread was not the right place to do that, and I apologized). Please see my post here for more details, but I don't want to distract from the discussion of the effects of transphobia any more in this thread.
 
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hidys

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
1,794
For those downplaying how much of the recent downturn of subs is due to James Stephanie's coming out, here's a helpful graph:

img_20210608_0243426kjqe.jpg


So while the decline is in the 35-40k range instead of the 100k range previously stated -- although they could have lost that many but gained some to offset it, I suppose -- it's more than clear what caused the recent large drop in subs.

Like, come on.
To see it like that with such a stark correlation is really disappointing.
 

NickMitch

Member
Nov 1, 2017
1,297
I fell of the Jim-train well before their expression change. The style is a non-factor for my interest in the channel. It's 100% content and competition that drives my interest.

For me the breakout of several GB-Crew profiles led me to follow them and thus pushed minor personalities aside.

With that said - people who stop following BECAUSE of the gender expression change, can FUCK RIGHT OFF.
 
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Adhrast

Member
Jan 17, 2018
784
I think the people who unsubscribed following their coming out have not been paying attention to Sterling all these years. I mean, I don't like to assume people's gender orientation, but the content they've always made was quite telling, it shouldn't have been a surprise for anyone.
Really, really disappointing though, the gaming community still has an excruciatingly long way to go before becoming truly inclusive.

EDIT: I see my post has been edited to amend the pronouns. Sorry about this, English is not my main language and though I've tried to use the correct ones, something might have slipped. I'll do my best so it doesn't happen again. Thanks for pointing it out!
 
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Aether

Member
Jan 6, 2018
4,421
For those downplaying how much of the recent downturn of subs is due to James Stephanie's coming out, here's a helpful graph:

img_20210608_0243426kjqe.jpg


So while the decline is in the 35-40k range instead of the 100k range previously stated -- although they could have lost that many but gained some to offset it, I suppose -- it's more than clear what caused the recent large drop in subs.

Like, come on.
I mean thats pretty conclusive.
On the one hand it supports me that the content did kinda lose its focus (usually even channels without content dont just loose subscribers, or stagnate), on the other i did not expect it to be this steep...and especially that long.
Did those people just not watch them in february?
Is it that those people only seen the change on a random video in april since they did not engage with the content on a regular, and then decided to unsubscribe?

Its just sad that even sterling has so many Queer phobic followers (or in this case, ex followers).

This also kinda puts me in an unconfortable position, since i would support this downward trend it i unsubscribe in the next weeks
 

Dwebble

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
9,627
I went the opposite direction- I unsubscribed from their content years ago, but I resubscribed after they came out, because I want to support queer content creators in the industry where I can.
 
Jun 29, 2020
612
Neverland
User Banned (Permanent): Dismissive Commentary in Sensitive Thread; Prior Ban for Ableism
relating to the topic

I remember liking a few videos from Philosophy Tube a while ago

then recently returned to the channel after not paying attention to it for years and was kinda surprised of the change

I support whatever makes people happy though. Just keep putting out good content and you're good in my book

I have no idea what kind of content the person this thread is about made though, to lose so many subs I'm assuming it was something on the conservative side, no?
 

inner-G

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
14,473
PNW
User Banned (3 Days): Thread Derail
This may be a weird take, but I think it kind of may tie in with the whole wrestling-esque 'character' schtick, and not typically sharing much of their personal life.

I'm not familiar with what they did before YouTube. But the channel sure talked about wrestling a lot. (I think I remember at one point they themselves actually wrestled?) They were/are presenting themselves in the videos as more of a 'character' or celebrity on YouTube than a more typical vloggy/millennial type person's channel typically would, or someone who doesn't you know, deliver videos from a podium like a dictator or something lol.

When I watched wrestling, I identified with "Macho Man" the character, not "Randy Savage" the individual. I don't know what baseball team Randy liked, what town he was from nor what he went on to do after wrestling. All I know is "OH YEEEAH" and the Sunglasses, you know what I mean?

Wrestling characters often go through big changes, character 'arcs' if you will, and these aren't always received positively by their existing fans. Sometimes they can cause a mid-tier wrestler to rise to top billing, but other times they can knock A-listers down a peg because the new direction doesn't connect with the core audience as much for various reasons. In any case, some people identified or related to 'Jim', over the years, and that's why some of them subscribed.

www.thesportster.com

Top 15 Most Drastic Character Changes in Wrestling History

On any great television drama, a character can change their looks, and even their entire personality, throughout the course of the series. Sometimes, the more outlandish changes could happen within th

It took a long time to build their channel up to 100k. If some of the subscribers drop off now, but they stay at it and keep making videos, I think James Stephanie can continue to build their channel up to the previous levels or higher, as people who may not have related or subscribed before, but now do, have the time to find the newer content and subscribe.

Not trying to make excuses or say that many of the unsubs aren't indeed narrow-minded people, but having a channel that is so based on a "character" makes it inherently vulnerable to any changes, or even perceived changes to said character, in my opinion.

Easy Allies has done a couple videos over the last month about Isla coming out as trans, and while it looks like their sub count has been kind of flat, it hasn't seen this kind of dramatic drop off looking at the stats on socialblade. That channel is different though, you watch EZA for the individuals, they talk about their SOs and pets and personal lives, and I think that just makes their channel kind of a different beast.

Or perhaps they attracted different subscriber bases because of their style and content. While the laid-back EZA crowd is more open minded, the amped-up Jimquisition crowd is more insecure, narrow-minded and prone to rage-quit something - whether it's a game, a publisher, or a YouTube creator?

Either way, I'm no expert just a straight guy. But I myself am also a YouTube creator, and have occasionally watched their vids before, so wanted to put my thoughts out there.
 

Damn Silly

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,194
"The content's repetitive, that must be it!"

giphy.gif


As if gaming YouTube doesn't revolve around repetitive content to begin with! Folks on YouTube rarely unsubscribe -- and certainly not en masse -- unless they're told something they don't want to hear. It fuckin' sucks that people will unsubscribe over someone being able to live their life, but fuck 'em, wouldn't want those kinda folks anyway.
 

Jockel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
683
Berlin
I'm not trying to be negative or denying that the falling subscriber count definitely had something to do with their coming out. And I do feel sorry for that. Personally though, I'm just not interested in their channel any more and unfollowed like a year ago. It's too one note for my taste, mostly focusing on bad games and company practices. Would have been great to see more positivity and recommendations for good stuff IMO. The videos that weren't the Jimquisition seemed kinda low effort as well tbh. Still a damn shame that gaming culture as a whole is so damn transphobic and full of assholes.
Edit: I'm sorry, I should not have posted this as it could come across as hand waving the issues away. As the mod post on the next page suggested, individual reasons why somebody unfollowed them are off topic. The focus is not on why the numbers go down, but why they go down in particular after the coming out.
 
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roguebubble

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Aug 8, 2018
1,134
On the one hand looking at the charts it seems that something happened late September that lost their audience since that when weekly video views collapsed from around an average of a million a week to under half that and subscriber growth started to stagnate (with a small boost in Dec which I presume was due to videos on Cyberpunk getting attention). Maybe they were a victim of a Youtube algorithm change or they decreased output of videos but there was definitely something going on before they came out that affected their channel's popularity

On the other it is undeniable there was big drop after coming out which was probably a result of transphobic viewers unsubscribing and since then there's been a steady bleeding of subscribers since which might be due to transphobia. I do slightly wonder why it's a steady drop instead on an instantaneous decline but hopefully they'll reach a point where all the trash who would leave over this are gone so their channel can start trending upwards again
 

G_O

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,960
I stopped watching well over a year ago when they kept forcing wrestling down our throats
 

Valcrist

Tic-Tac-Toe Champion
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,708
I unsubscribed because I couldn't deal with the constant negativity in the videos they release. I've been removing that from my sight not just on YouTube but also on this forum by ignoring threads that give me bad vibes. It helps.
 

Psittacus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,936
I'm disappointed but not surprised

https://www.resetera.com/threads/th...on-trans-issues-and-youtube-algorithm.426869/

I'm also not sure why you're massively inflating the numbers, when you then also post the link to the actual numbers. They were never "pushing a million" and the numbers of subscribers they lost are more in the 30k range.
Closer to 20k. The rate of decrease is still slightly elevated but it's mostly back to normal since late March
 

klier

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
937
User Banned (Permanent): Dismissive trolling, prior severe bans including a ban for dismissive trolling around bigotry.
*unsubscribes*
 
Oct 28, 2017
1,951
I never subscribed to Jim Sterling's channel, but I did watch videos frequently before an year ago (after which I stopped) and I lost interest in the content of the videos as they seemed repetitive.
 

Neiteio

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,137
I really admire how James handles "negative" content. They always start and end with some good-natured humor, with costumes and toys and nostalgic commercials. They ease you in with a laugh, and soothe you with some more humor at the end. And the critique in the middle is always thoughtfully written, with funny stock footage to take the edge off things. There are no personal attacks against anyone - James always focuses on how certain actions are hurting people in society, putting large issues into easily digestible perspective. It's uniformly excellent work.

Really, everyone should appreciate what James is doing. They are making sure that injustices in the system stay in the spotlight, which is necessary to increase awareness and ultimately correct those issues. And regarding their decision to come out, we should appreciate anyone brave enough to do so, because those people know the pain of being vulnerable, and it has made them empathetic to others who feel out of place, and if we were all more empathetic in that way, the world would be a much kinder and more comfortable place for everyone.
 

Sacul64

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,772
People in the previous thread (EA are evil) were actually suggesting that the subscriber drop had to do with their content. Not to mention drive by misgendering. Jim Stephanie really brings them out.

That's not even the previous thread now. The latest one is about WB wanting to support pride month by having you kick the ass out of poison ivy for prizes. And a general pointing out that companies like Disney are actively stifling lgbtq+ content while posting pride month stuff. And what a shock people ignored that topic. People really think they have been being slick in these topics and it's sad.
 

Dizzy Ukulele

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,013
Edit: Sorry. Wrong thread for personal anecdotes that don't respect the issue at hand.

Still subscribed but skipping a lot of the recent videos because it's just the same thing over and over.

'EA is Evil, Actually' = 20 minutes of stating the obvious. Or at least that's what I assumed when I never bothered to click on it. About as redundant as a title can get.
 
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Sacul64

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,772
Jesus. Some people are trash. Sterling has been progressive for years, if you liked their content this whole time, what changed besides their pronouns and look? Maybe a small percentage left because they don't enjoy the content anymore, but don't kid yourself into believing like 99% isn't because of them coming out.

There was a poster in the ea topic iirc that was saying they deserve it because of thier destructoid days 😡
 

calvinised

Member
May 24, 2021
410
Haven't really been keeping up with their videos for a while now, but that's so shitty that people would unsubscribe as the content hasn't changed from what I've seen but unfortunately people suck.
 

Fatmanp

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,438
I still watch Jim's content regularly and listen to the podcast weekly. There has been a drop on outpug but it's no surprise that some assholes would do this.
 

BassForever

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
29,942
CT
On the one hand looking at the charts it seems that something happened late September that lost their audience since that when weekly video views collapsed from around an average of a million a week to under half that and subscriber growth started to stagnate (with a small boost in Dec which I presume was due to videos on Cyberpunk getting attention). Maybe they were a victim of a Youtube algorithm change or they decreased output of videos but there was definitely something going on before they came out that affected their channel's popularity

On the other it is undeniable there was big drop after coming out which was probably a result of transphobic viewers unsubscribing and since then there's been a steady bleeding of subscribers since which might be due to transphobia. I do slightly wonder why it's a steady drop instead on an instantaneous decline but hopefully they'll reach a point where all the trash who would leave over this are gone so their channel can start trending upwards again

Last Summer was the big blow out of Ubisoft and their transgressions. That seems to be where view count started to suffer I guess Ubisoft fans are scarily loyal. Though 2021 the drop in views/subscribers has been 100% a result of the transition and that is extremely obvious.

Edit: I've decided to not bog this thread down, the focus should be on the transphobia in the general gamer audience and Jim's happiness since coming out as pansexual.
 
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G_O

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,960
I unsubscribed because I couldn't deal with the constant negativity in the videos they release. I've been removing that from my sight not just on YouTube but also on this forum by ignoring threads that give me bad vibes. It helps.
This is also a good point.

Form me video games are fun, I much prefer to avoid negativity surrounding them.
 

Siresly

Prophet of Regret
Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,583
It's sad that too many people are that way, but really, good riddance. Shedding these people surely greatly improves Sterling's community.
 

Bufbaf

Don't F5!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,670
Hamburg, Germany
Still subscribed but skipping a lot of the recent videos because it's just the same thing over and over.

'EA is Evil, Actually' = 20 minutes of stating the obvious. Or at least that's what I assumed when I never bothered to click on it. About as redundant as a title can get.
I really hate posts like this.
Or at least that's what I assume, I never bothered to read it.
 

BassForever

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
29,942
CT
This is also a good point.

Form me video games are fun, I much prefer to avoid negativity surrounding them.

That makes sense, but the numbers show negativity drives views. The only thing better would be to make videos in some kind of top 10 format the algorithm loves that.
 

Bufbaf

Don't F5!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,670
Hamburg, Germany
All these people stating they only unsubscribed because of Wrestling, or plastic toys, or reocurring topics or whatever: Why do you feel the need to underline this in this particular topic? You would clearly know, that the whole Wrestling stuff started WAY before Stephanie came out. You would clearly not be either the reason for this thread or the reason for the very current, very obvious trend of bleeding subs the literal moment they came out on stream?
 

Olli

Member
Feb 6, 2021
500
I'm probably going to unsubscribe because I'm tired of the same rehashed points and negativity, not to mention that they're obviously more interesting in wrestling nowadays. Would keep my sub if Sterling actually has anything new to say in the next few videos but recent content has been pretty awful. I'm sure anti lgbt also comes into it but I do think recent quality is also bleeding subs.
 

AHA-Lambda

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,812
I walked away a long time before this, and while the timing is suspect, their content has become immensely stale of late, and is probably a small factor here.

How many times can we watch one person say the industry that produces our hobby is evil?
Yeah I think it's somewhat of a factor over a long term historical view.

I think the timing of such a large drop is very much tied with their coming out, but the staleness of the content has been a factor for so long it's likely stemmed the growth of the channel as a whole
 

Aether

Member
Jan 6, 2018
4,421
Haven't really been keeping up with their videos for a while now, but that's so shitty that people would unsubscribe as the content hasn't changed from what I've seen but unfortunately people suck.
[Quote Removed]

They got more longwinded, complacant (i know their argument, if the companies are doing the same shit, why should they change the content...but from a viewer perspective it kinda feels like a cop out), the non jimquisition videos were always low effort, but it felt like they tried more to highlight positive gaming experiences.

The amount of sterling specific nostalgia (british comercials, toys, wrestling, toys, old shows, TOYS...) just got to big for my liking. I dont connect to ANY of that. And shure, it was always there,...but i never likd it, and it got more.

So "the content has not changed" does not stand.

With that said, it still sucks that the amount is so high, because it is clear that a lot if
not most of them unsubscribed because of the coming out.
 
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TuneTuneGuy

Member
Mar 11, 2020
531
Yeah, sounds like the audience who liked destructoid at the time they were there. They thought they were punk rock when they were just ren and stimpy.
 

Pryme

Member
Aug 23, 2018
8,164
Not really.

But 10% is not that much. I think their audience is already quite progressive.
A channel followed by more "general" Gamer ™ audience would have disappeared.

If only 10% of human was transphobic, it wouldn't be a major problem.

Actually seems more like a 4% drop, based on the chart posted earlier. Losing 25k subs out of 930k subs before coming out.

Anyone has any idea how the comments on their videos trend? I hope people are mostly supportive.