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Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
13,370
Barcelona
Not even close.

Sigrun has a ridiculous health pool, some cheap moves and is more frustrating than fun.

But TBH there's lots of action games with far better bosses than GoW 2018, Sigrun is a OK fight in a game filled with bad minibosses and a really bad lack of main bosses.
 

nib95

Contains No Misinformation on Philly Cheesesteaks
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,498
My 7 year old son beat Nergigante. He can't beat a From Soft boss.


Nergigante is honestly quite easy compared to most From bosses, and certainly compared to Sigrun. I beat Nergigante fairly easily on my very first try, whereas Sigrun took me like 15+ lol (though that was on GMAC difficulty).

I feel like even an average player could beat Nerg on their first try if they're fairly well levelled and have done some due diligence (eg have a strong thunder weapon), but only someone insanely skilled with impeccable timing, awareness and reaction time is going to beat Sigrun first time, no matter how well levelled or geared up they are. Hell I've not read a single person on this forum who's claimed as much. She simply has too many unique attacks, patterns, moves and is so insanely fast, accurate, limited in hit box area, and ferocious, that you have to be completely on your A game, have all her patterns down, all your attack, parry, rune and dodge timings down, with barely any room for error. The skill and mastery barrier is super high.
 
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Datajoy

use of an alt account
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
12,081
Angola / Zaire border region.
I thought the Valkyrie fights were super cheap. The bosses in From games follow clear rules, I thought the Valkyries had so many inconsistencies, like whether or not certain attacks had armor, or if they would even take damage at certain times ffs.
 

Scarf

Member
Oct 27, 2017
402
Nergigante is honestly quite easy compared to most From bosses, and certainly compared to Sigrun. I beat Nergigante fairly easily on my very first try, whereas Sigrun took me like 20+ lol (though that was on GMAC difficulty).

I feel like even an average player could beat Nerg on their first try if they're fairly well levelled and have done some due diligence (eg have a strong thunder weapon), but only someone insanely skilled with impeccable timing, awareness and reaction time is going to beat Sigrun first time, no matter how well levelled or geared up they are. Hell I've not read a single person on this forum who's claimed as much. She simply has too many unique attacks, patterns, moves and is so insanely fast, accurate, limited in hit box area, and ferocious, that you have to be completely on your A game, have all her patterns down, all your attack, parry, rune and dodge timings down, with barely any room for error. The skill and mastery barrier is super high.

Arch Tempered Nergigante is coming this month so let's see if you can beat him on your first try. ;)
 

KushalaDaora

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,838
Yeah, I don't understand this at all. Once you know her move set and find out how to counter her moves you can beat her without taking damage. She rekt me for a long time until I stopped trying be aggressive and countered. Was an awesome feeling when it all came together and she only hit me twice before I killed her. Great fucking boss and if you think it's cheap you probably just don't know how to avoid/counter what she does.

Same, she rekt me 3-4 times because I played too aggressively. Then I take time to learn which attack gives me trouble the most, and learn when to time Runic attack and Atreus arrow,

Once I learned about her pattern, especially the 3-time sweeping attack, managed to beat her without res stone. Even managed to parry her several times lol.
 

Yog-Sothoth

Member
Oct 1, 2018
3,225
Lmao at Sigrun being cheap. I'm sorry to say it but if you consider any of her attacks cheap you either didn't learn the game's mechanics enough or you need to git gud.
 

sxiebonjour

Member
Oct 25, 2017
697
Nice thread dude, always wanted to discuss this topic.
I haven't digged too much in Sekiro, but as far as I'm concerned, Sigrun on god of war difficulty is better than any bosses in the soulborne series.

I defeated her on give me god of war difficulty on my first playthrough, a hell of experience and achievement.
She was crazy unforgiving on GMGOW, basically requiring you to do a flawless battle (I was level 8 and I couldn't stand more than 3 hits). Beside that, the health pool was crazy as well, normal attack literally only reduced a pixel of her health bar. Not to mention she had all 8 valkyries' movements all together for you to memorize.
As much daunting as those sound, here comes the best part : it was a fair battle. By fair I mean every movement of hers had a counter strategy : strafing right as her strafes left, turning around to avoid being blinded, throwing axe to counter her one-shot smash, etc. And in order to beat her on the highest difficulty, you need to master them all. It felt so satisfying and rewarding seeing yourself from keeping dying at first tick of her health bar to defeating her flawlessly.

On the other hand, not that I think soulsbornes have inferior boss fight designs, in fact Dark Eater Midir and Sister Friede are crazy good. The problem for me is soulsborne are actually too generously forgiving. You have 15 sunny D or 20 V8 at your disposal, meaning that you can still recover and beat the bosses while keeping making mistakes and not knowing all mechanics. In fact that was my experience with orphan of kos. I killed it on my first try, even though I kept getting hit by his movements. It still felt good, just not as rewarding and satisfying as I defeated Sigrun.

I think this is also the reason people feel Sekiro is harder cause it is less forgiving, but after you conquer the challenges, it feels so good. I am really looking forward to Sekiro as I have more free time next month.
 

nib95

Contains No Misinformation on Philly Cheesesteaks
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,498
I'm seeing MH mentioned a lot and I'm shocked. From videos I've watched it has looked like a button mashy RPG. I'll have to check it out

MHW is an incredible game and I'd highly recommend it, but you're a seasoned action game player. It really is considerably more floaty and far more liberal in terms of timings and overall difficulty or necessity for precision, but of course it would be given the kind of game it is. The main moments MH is demanding on the level you're more accustomed to with the kind of action games you historically play, at the kinds of difficulties you do, is mostly when you're trying to do speed run kills. Still, give it a go for sure.
 

Bruceleeroy

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
5,381
Orange County
MHW is an incredible game and I'd highly recommend it, but you're a seasoned action game player. It really is considerably more floaty and far more liberal in terms of timings and overall difficulty or necessity for precision, but of course it would be given the kind of game it is. The main moments MH is demanding on the level you're more accustomed to with the kind of action games you historically play, at the kinds of difficulties you do, is mostly when you're trying to do speed run kills. Still, give it a go for sure.

Ahh gotcha thanks for the breakdown Nib
 

Yabberwocky

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,261
Fighting Sigrun was certainly a memorable experience! For me, I'd put Sigrun at the middle of the range/harder end of the From Software bosses. I thought it was a really fun (albeit tense) boss fight, and I found out the hard way that I couldn't lose awareness of what she was doing for even a moment or poor Kratos would get mauled. It was also an interesting challenge having to memorize so many attack patterns, and to know how to react to each one. I can't remember the last boss I fought with that many attack patterns, actually.

I'm definitely looking forward to seeing what SSM does with humanoid bosses in the future. The Valkyries had great designs, too - hopefully they return as NPCs.
 

MetalGear?

Member
Nov 8, 2017
600
VALHALLA!! I agree, loved every second of those fights and they did in fact gave me that same heart-pounding feeling as a FROM boss would.
 

MetalGear?

Member
Nov 8, 2017
600
Fighting Sigrun was certainly a memorable experience! For me, I'd put Sigrun at the middle of the range/harder end of the From Software bosses. I thought it was a really fun (albeit tense) boss fight, and I found out the hard way that I couldn't lose awareness of what she was doing for even a moment or poor Kratos would get mauled. It was also an interesting challenge having to memorize so many attack patterns, and to know how to react to each one. I can't remember the last boss I fought with that many attack patterns, actually.

I'm definitely looking forward to seeing what SSM does with humanoid bosses in the future. The Valkyries had great designs, too - hopefully they return as NPCs.
I agree about the many attacks, very cool. The smart thing they do is that by the time you fight sigrun, you internalized a lot of different other Valkyrie fights. So while she has a lot of moves, you already know 70% of them. Thought that was cool.
 

Zemst

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,096
Arch Tempered Nergigante is coming this month so let's see if you can beat him on your first try. ;)
I don't think any arch tempered monster so far has been as hard as lunastra and I say that not to brag but how balanced the arch tempered fights so far have been once you gear correctly imo. Honestly I'm with him in that it's easy but it's a type of easy that forces you to get good then you can have fun with him. Partbreaking his spikes before they regrow to stagger is one of the coolest features of his design so I want to see if they add or switch up anything at all for him upcoming release. Hopefully more divebombs haha that has always scared the shit out of me and the hitbox is wide as hell.
 

Scarf

Member
Oct 27, 2017
402
I don't think any arch tempered monster so far has been as hard as lunastra and I say that not to brag but how balanced the arch tempered fights so far have been once you gear correctly imo. Honestly I'm with him in that it's easy but it's a type of easy that forces you to get good then you can have fun with him. Partbreaking his spikes before they regrow to stagger is one of the coolest features of his design so I want to see if they add or switch up anything at all for him upcoming release. Hopefully more divebombs haha that has always scared the shit out of me and the hitbox is wide as hell.

Yeah, I hope they go all out with him since Nergigante is the flagship monster.

I agree, Lunastra is definitely the hardest fight in the game (and not really that fun to fight against) after EX-Behemoth.
 

Gotdatmoney

Member
Oct 28, 2017
14,501
Monster Hunter trashing is wild. Last year I fought Bloodbath Diablos and got fucking wrecked. Slowly worked my way up to competency. Some of the G rank Deviants in Generation Ultimate are fucking insanely satisfying.
 

Deleted member 41931

User requested account closure
Member
Apr 10, 2018
3,744
I mean, you were already exposed to every single move Sigrun has once you reach her, since the other Valkyries share the moveset, so it is impossible to raise this point

Once you reach her you know exactly what you should do, you just have to be good at executing everything you have learned up until that point with the others
Just because she's not the first to use it doesn't change the fact it's still fundamentally poorly desinged move that's a part of her moveset. Its an issue with the general philosophy of their difficulty design. If you land a stun in a Souls game, the game gives it to you.
A1Oq4x.gif

Where as Sigrun can just decide to not be stunned for a meaningful amount of time and rob you.
agifi6ve4agskryjcgyv.gif

This isn't satisfying. If you're going to give her so much health, at least let her take damage. Like Artorias, Fume Knight still manages to be harder without stuff like this.
Her jump attack is similar to something like Ludwigs' (which is 1 of From's best, personally my 2nd favorite From boss), slow wind up to give you enough time to dodge an off screen attack, From don't always have those attacks be on screen.
It's off screen, but you still have a visual indication with the blood drops. You can also dodge it without knowing when he's going to land by just booking it in any direction.
 

-Tetsuo-

Unlimited Capacity
Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,598
Strongly disagree. From is known for being tough, but fair because no matter what, it's possible to win on the first time if you're good enough. That's not nearly as feesible with Sigrun because she's doing stuff like jumping off screen. Sure, you can learn the timing, but you're not going to know it the first time since you're not psychic. Compare that to Artorias. When he leaps you can see the whole thing and if you get hit, its only because you weren't good enough.
Even without having to rely on cheap tricks, he still manages to be harder.


Artorias isn't anywhere close to as hard as Sigrun lol
 

Bundy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,931
Agree. No bullshit hitbox issues, no minons around her to make the fight harder/longer. Just a brutal, amazing, fast 1vs1 fight. It's amazing.
 

Assenzio

Alt account
Banned
Mar 18, 2019
775
Is this serious thread? Not even close, c'mon.

Sigrun is what we call artificial difficulty, huge health pool, huge damage, limited and repetitive attacks and patterns. One of the most boring boss fights ever.

GoW was my Goty 2018, but don't you dare ever again compare bosses from FS games to GoW4. It's literally its only fault, shitty boss fights.

If you chose somebody from the original series maybe, but the last one? no chance
 

nib95

Contains No Misinformation on Philly Cheesesteaks
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,498
Just because she's not the first to use it doesn't change the fact it's still fundamentally poorly desinged move that's a part of her moveset. Its an issue with the general philosophy of their difficulty design. If you land a stun in a Souls game, the game gives it to you.
A1Oq4x.gif

Where as Sigrun can just decide to not be stunned for a meaningful amount of time and rob you.
agifi6ve4agskryjcgyv.gif

This isn't satisfying. If you're going to give her so much health, at least let her take damage. Like Artorias, Fume Knight still manages to be harder without stuff like this.
It's off screen, but you still have a visual indication with the blood drops. You can also dodge it without knowing when he's going to land by just booking it in any direction.

The mistake in this GIF is that the player started the rune attack before Sigrun was in a stun lock or in a proper timing window. The start of the rune attack doesn't stun lock in itself, else it would make the fight much easier (since you could keep spamming rune attacks, with both weapons). Sigrun realises the power of certain rune attacks and thus avoids them like in this GIF example. You simply have to be more tactical and skillful about how and when you attempt a long animated rune attack, because worse than her simply not getting stun locked by one, is her dodging the attack and then annihilating you whilst you're in the middle of a long powerful move, all because you decided to pull it off at the wrong time. This is part of what makes Sigrun so challenging.
 

NSESN

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,324
The Valkyries were great bosses, and if that's the point you are making, hardly anyone would disagree. But I disagree that it's the "closest a boss has managed to reach the height of the best From Software bosses". For instance, see also: Monster Hunter. Nergigante alone clowns every God of War fight, and many, many FromSoft ones.
and nergigante isnt even the best MH can offer, i think Brachydios is better, really hope he is introduced with Iceborn
 

nib95

Contains No Misinformation on Philly Cheesesteaks
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,498
That's not good game design.

I mean, it's not good game design for people who want an easier fight, sure, but to those who revel in the whole 'git gud' mantra, its great. It simply forces players to be more strategic and meticulous about when they use their powerful rune attacks, or even which rune attacks they have equipped in the first place (some are simply too slow to be as effective against Sigrun). Basically you can't just rely on ultra powerful magic/rune combos/attacks to coast or brute force your way through the fight, you actually have to time everything you do.
 
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Fahdi

Member
Jun 5, 2018
1,390
Can we take a moment and acknowledge how cool the Valkyrie designs are? I assure you had these character appeared on any GoW before this they'd have their breasts and half a butt cheek hanging out. Santa Monica has grown.

Nudity is part of Greek Mythos. The games also have an M rating? I'll also take nudity over obscene amounts of violence anyday. Dont think Norse lore had much nudity in it hence the designs.

Anyway, back to the topic. I had a blast playing against all the valkyries! Sigrun was DEFINITELY the toughest. Who was the one you had to beat in the challenges?
 

TitanicFall

Member
Nov 12, 2017
8,277
What I appreciate about the Valkryie fights is that they don't waste my time by me having to traverse through a level just to get back to them if I die unlike From games. I can spend time doing what matters, which is learning how to beat the boss.
 

sph3re

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
8,403
I mean, it's not good game design for people who want an easier fight, sure, but to those who revel in the whole 'git gud' mantra, its great. It simply forces players to he more strategic and meticulous about when they use their powerful rune attacks, or even which rune attacks they have equipped in the first place (some are simply too slow to be as effective against Sigrun). Basically you can't just rely on ultra powerful magic/rune combos/attacks to coast or brute force your way through the fight, you actually have to time everything you do.

Sorry, my understanding of your original post was that Sigrun, the AI, actually recognizes when she may be receiving a lot of damage and avoids the damage. Is that not the case?

Assuming that some attacks are "too slow," I would posit that, in a thread suggesting that Sigrun is close to the pinnacle of Soulsborne bosses is incorrect, based solely on the idea that you cannot use every tool in your toolkit against her.

So the AI acting like a real opponent ?, and evading your attacks is not good game design ?..
You missed the point more than Kratos missed Sigrun in that GIF.
 

nib95

Contains No Misinformation on Philly Cheesesteaks
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,498
Sorry, my understanding of your original post was that Sigrun, the AI, actually recognizes when she may be receiving a lot of damage and avoids the damage. Is that not the case?

Assuming that some attacks are "too slow," I would posit that, in a thread suggesting that Sigrun is close to the pinnacle of Soulsborne bosses is incorrect, based solely on the idea that you cannot use every tool in your toolkit against her.

You missed the point more than Kratos missed Sigrun in that GIF.

Yes, she avoids that damage if you've started the rune attack when she's in her, let's called it, 'maximum alert/attack' mode. There are however times where after she's performed certain attacks, she'll momentarily need down time and is more vulnerable, or other times straight after you've performed a specific attack or shield parry or whatever, where she'll go into a stun lock, and it's in those moments where you ideally want to initiate a rune attack and where she won't simply be able to dodge out of it.

And whilst you can use whatever you want in your arsenal against her, certain moves are simply more effective or easy to pull off than others. If you have rune attacks with more invincibility frames or quicker attack times for example, you'll have a bit more leeway in pulling them off, whereas slower rune attacks require much more precise timing windows, but then do more damage too. It's risk reward I guess, but for me with Sigrun I find the quicker rune attacks more effective, probably because I'm not skilled or precise enough to constantly perfectly time the longer ones.
 

banter

Member
Jan 12, 2018
4,127

Skrams

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 27, 2017
47
Some posts have mentioned it, but I'll echo it. I really enjoyed the boss fight with Sigrun and most of the Valkyries because they're very very fair for the most part. My only real gripe being the one who summons mobs. I understood it was the gimmick of the fight, but ehhh.

But yeah, I really love when a game puts me up against a boss where each attack has a pretty much definitive answer to it. Sigrun has a fuckton of moves because she pulled from all the other Valkyries, so you have to be prepared for a lot. She strafes left, you know this is coming, strafes right? Her other thing is happening. I remember initially thinking those had little pattern for the thrust moves until I linked the movements with them. I also just didn't know what to do about her big blindness move, and people might judge me for it, but I looked up that you had to turn around since that's not very intuitive to me. I also did the same thing with the shield bash against guarding wings. Like, logistically, they make sense, but the game never really programed me to connect those dots for those certain things. While I have those complaints, I still really love a pretty well choreographed fight that just takes time and practice to get everything down right for the one perfect run.

Also I played on GMGOW first which is honestly a horribly balanced difficulty, but yeah, my run had to be perfect. God help me if I got hit by her grab where I died 99% of the time from full health without being able to mash out. Also yeah, she was fucking spongy as hell.

And because the Valkyries are so puzzle focused in how to deal with the moves unlike Souls/MH Dodge Good style, I don't think they're super comparable. God of War just becomes more arcadey and a lot less free flow to me when comparing the big fights. I also don't even particularly like the combat in GoW. It's incredibly limiting and I always find it weird when people try to tote it as character action or whatever.
 

Strings

Member
Oct 27, 2017
31,429
My vote would go to Hino-Enma, who is by far the best boss from Nioh (unfortunately also just the second one in the game), and manages to capture the intimidation factor of From bosses, while still having a really clear and satisfying route to victory when she 'clicks'.
 
Oct 28, 2017
14
Loved the fight with Sigrun and all the other Valkyries. Definitely up there with the standouts from the best character action games for me. I love a challenge and long, execution heavy fights though. Well, as long as the combat system is my thing anyway.

Now that I think about it, Sigrun even held up when I played through GMGoW staying under level 3 with most of the HUD off (because I'm a fuckin weirdo who wanted more of a challenge, but to still use some of the fun stuff like the witch-time tailsman). I think its usually a testament to character action games' design when they can be beaten at starting levels or without taking damage and still be reasonable without needing luck and/or a million hours. Hell, crazier people have done it on level 1 too. From games, the best 2d Castlevanias and most character action games like DMC really invite that type of challenge and so does Sigrun.

The low-level fight with her like that was incredibly intense, everything can kill you, most attacks are unblockable too, but it was completely fair, learnable, and beatable. Like yeah, you have to keep your eyes on her at nearly all times for like 15 minutes, but all her moves have tells and all can be countered one way or another if you're watching closely and ready to react. Also positioning becomes so important, you absolutely have to be wary of getting cornered, otherwise attacks like her lava meteors can leave you no where to dodge. So it becomes not just attacking and dodging, but doing both those things from angles that will leave you with an advantageous position. When I finally beat her after that grueling fight it was such a feel good moment in the game for me. I dunno, just really fun. Afterwards I reloaded my save and equipped all my good gear and nuked her partially as a victory lap and partially just because I wanted to keep playing that fight. Great job, Santa Monica!

 

Deleted member 41931

User requested account closure
Member
Apr 10, 2018
3,744
The mistake in this GIF is that the player started the rune attack before Sigrun was in a stun lock or in a proper timing window. The start of the rune attack doesn't stun lock in itself, else it would make the fight much easier (since you could keep spamming rune attacks, with both weapons). Sigrun realises the power of certain rune attacks and thus avoids them like in this GIF example. You simply have to be more tactical and skillful about how and when you attempt a long animated rune attack, because worse than her simply not getting stun locked by one, is her dodging the attack and then annihilating you whilst you're in the middle of a long powerful move, all because you decided to pull it off at the wrong time. This is part of what makes Sigrun so challenging.
Unless I'm forgetting something, but she's only enemy who can do that. All the others would have been stunned which is my point in that she just operates on seperate rules to make the fight more difficult.
 
Oct 31, 2017
2,423
You guys just gave me hope, I may be able to beat souls games. Sigrun was tough but one of the earlier valkyries was tougher probably because of my build at the time.
 

Noema

Member
Jan 17, 2018
4,908
Mexico CIty
By far the best part of the game.

Since it's a 1v1 fight, it doesn't really suffer from the worst aspect of the game, which is the 'cinematic' FoV that makes fighting several enemies at once a pain. This fight is good despite the game it is in.

It's also commendable how she's an ammalgamation of all the previous Valkeries. Her moveset is a superset of all the Valkeries that you have to defeat in order to face her, which means that even though she has a ton of moves, you've already faced them broken down into smaller, more digestible chunks. Her 'Valhalla' slam might feel cheap, but you've already dealt with it so you know how to deal with it because you've already fought Ròta The challenge is putting the pieces of the puzzle together, and executing. It's great. None of her moves are cheap. There are ways to deal with each and everyone of them unscathed.

Beating her in Give me God of War difficulty was absolutely exhilarating. It took me 3 days and close to 200 tries, but the satisfaction was akin to beating a hard From boss, yes. By the time I beat her I'd gotten so good at the fight that she almost didn't even hit me; I only took damage from a mistimed parry and a bad dodge.

The fight is not perfect, though, and its problems stem from a more general problem that plagues GoW on higher difficulties: enemies are way too spongy, to the point of being infuriating, and the Valkeries are no exception. The instance in which I finally beat Sigrun in GmGoW took a whopping 16 minutes because she takes a billion hits to kill and she kills you in two (if you are lucky). The game cheats by making her not take damage if you hit her too many times. It cheats by giving her stagger resistance after a few hits.

Something From has always understood about difficulty is that spongy, high HP enemies are no fun. Usually enemies in their games are dangerous becuase they come in groups, or they have complex movesets, or they make you fight them under unfavorable circumstances. Bosses hit hard, but they all have weaknesses and you can just melt their health away if you know what you are doing. It's amazing how, in Sekiro, a boss that seems invincible with infinite posture just bends to your will if you are able to string a few deflected combos with some pressure of your own, putting him against the ropes.

Against Sigrun, you have no choice but to patiently chip away at her for 15 minutes. That's my only complain concerning the fight; it's superbly designed otherwise and I wish there was more content like that in the game, since the main story bosses are all cinematic snoozefests.

With all that said, as good as Sigrun is, Nioh's bosses are much closer to From's in almost every way, and much better overall than anything found in GoW. Hino-Emna, Tachibana Muneshige, Neu, Giant Toad and Yuki-Ona are all FromSoft tier, or close to it. Better than a lot of the bosses in DS2, that's for sure.
 
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Datajoy

use of an alt account
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
12,081
Angola / Zaire border region.
The Valkyrie fights in particular really make me wish that God of War would have had a fully detached 3D camera, and that they wouldn't have cut so many corners with the combat system.
 

IIFloodyII

Member
Oct 26, 2017
23,991
Just because she's not the first to use it doesn't change the fact it's still fundamentally poorly desinged move that's a part of her moveset. Its an issue with the general philosophy of their difficulty design. If you land a stun in a Souls game, the game gives it to you.
A1Oq4x.gif

Where as Sigrun can just decide to not be stunned for a meaningful amount of time and rob you.
agifi6ve4agskryjcgyv.gif

This isn't satisfying. If you're going to give her so much health, at least let her take damage. Like Artorias, Fume Knight still manages to be harder without stuff like this.
It's off screen, but you still have a visual indication with the blood drops. You can also dodge it without knowing when he's going to land by just booking it in any direction.
There's visual indications before she takes off too. You can block/parry or interrupt her jump attack with your axe before she takes off.
 

Bruceleeroy

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
5,381
Orange County
Loved the fight with Sigrun and all the other Valkyries. Definitely up there with the standouts from the best character action games for me. I love a challenge and long, execution heavy fights though. Well, as long as the combat system is my thing anyway.

Now that I think about it, Sigrun even held up when I played through GMGoW staying under level 3 with most of the HUD off (because I'm a fuckin weirdo who wanted more of a challenge, but to still use some of the fun stuff like the witch-time tailsman). I think its usually a testament to character action games' design when they can be beaten at starting levels or without taking damage and still be reasonable without needing luck and/or a million hours. Hell, crazier people have done it on level 1 too. From games, the best 2d Castlevanias and most character action games like DMC really invite that type of challenge and so does Sigrun.

The low-level fight with her like that was incredibly intense, everything can kill you, most attacks are unblockable too, but it was completely fair, learnable, and beatable. Like yeah, you have to keep your eyes on her at nearly all times for like 15 minutes, but all her moves have tells and all can be countered one way or another if you're watching closely and ready to react. Also positioning becomes so important, you absolutely have to be wary of getting cornered, otherwise attacks like her lava meteors can leave you no where to dodge. So it becomes not just attacking and dodging, but doing both those things from angles that will leave you with an advantageous position. When I finally beat her after that grueling fight it was such a feel good moment in the game for me. I dunno, just really fun. Afterwards I reloaded my save and equipped all my good gear and nuked her partially as a victory lap and partially just because I wanted to keep playing that fight. Great job, Santa Monica!




First lordy that just reminds me how incredible GoW felt to play. Just watching that made my fingers itch. One of the best action games of all time.
And your post really does put to rest if she was well designed or not.
The hallmark of great design is being able to beat it at any level range regardless of skills.
Something the Souls games are masters at and if people can beat her at Level 1 well there you go.

The Valkyrie fights in particular really make me wish that God of War would have had a fully detached 3D camera, and that they wouldn't have cut so many corners with the combat system.

Where did they cut corners with the combat?
The combat is clearly an intense painstaking labor of love.
 

Overflow

Member
Oct 29, 2017
3,156
Wollongong
Totally agree OP. Really elevated the game for me actually. My friend stopped playing just before trying to beat the last Valkyries (including Sigrun) and I've been bugging him to get on that ASAP
 

JCHandsom

Avenger
Nov 3, 2017
4,218
Loved that fight, so satisfying when I got her, really fun rhythm of pattern recognition->GO IN