I am too, but I think they had a deal with Netflix years before they launched Max
-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
-
We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.
Show runner of cancelled Netflix show talks about how Netflix only wants to renews shows that viewers immediately binge
- Thread starter Dalek
- Start date
As others have said the fact that it is a WB property means that if (worst case scenario) this adaptation completely shits the bed Warners will simply wait a few years and then simply 'try again' on HBO Max....or whatever it is renamed in the next couple of years.
OP
OP
Yeah it was Mike Flanagan. Who incidentally was told by Netflix that Midnight Mass didn't do good numbers.
Squid games exploded and was all over the zeitgeist. I had no clue a baby sitters club show existed
Pretty significant difference there. Squid game will have long tail drive just for the first season alone.
Yea the folks behind MST3K said the exact same thing how Netflix cares purely on their binge metrics and how many binge and complete a show and the speed in which it happens. When they did their 2nd season they tried to design it around making it more binge friendly and that they were pushing viewers to sit and binge watch marathon it. They kept harping on this fact.
I suspect that's why he's doing The Fall of the House of Usher. Midnight Mass was his passion project, now it's a return to the $$$ makers.
Netflix executives acting like the Mechanicus from 40K. Except their Omnisiah is the Almighty Algorithm.
What's worse is that whatever is made through Netflix for some reason rarely comes to physical media so it's literally just dead and buried on their service.
I still haven't finished The Witcher S2, not because it's "not engaging enough" or whatever, but because I'm watching like 8 other shows on Netflix alone, plus a few others on other services. I'm not usually the type to watch through an 8-episode season in less than a week.
Edit: I actually finished their adaptation of Cowboy Bebop in about a week or so, but ironically, it was canceled because not many other people binged it, I guess.
Edit: I actually finished their adaptation of Cowboy Bebop in about a week or so, but ironically, it was canceled because not many other people binged it, I guess.
Last edited:
I do wonder about their overall strategy. I watched that Ryan Reynolds movie The Adam Project yesterday and it was… fine. It's pretty much exactly what you'd expect out of a Ryan Reynolds sci-fi comedy, for good or ill.
It seemed relatively expensive so out of curiosity I checked its budget and it's $116 million. That's as much as Venom, which made $850 million at the box office.
Is a movie like that with no theatrical release really moving the needle much as far as gaining new subscribers or retaining existing ones? I know Netflix doesn't have to spend basically anything on marketing but that still seems pretty high budget to me for a movie that will ultimately just come and go.
This was pretty obvious when they cancelled Tuca and Bertie despite being critically acclaimed, meanwhile Adult Swim picked it up and renewed it for a third season.
Yeah I'm not sure what the end game is, especially if the "looking for subscribers in other countries" thing is true. Even if they've maxed out in North America, that number is just going to go down and fast if they don't have a lot of shows coming. Especially since, if they rely on the binge, people aren't going to have a ton of time dedicated to each show before they run out. It's kind of the opposite of Disney and Paramount, where they're digging hard into their franchise niches and seemingly not being willing to cancel anything (yet).
The only thing I can think of is maybe "Bob's Burgers," but that may need some episode skipping depending on how young the kids are. I guess the Marvel/Star Wars animated shows under Disney straddle the line too, but they're heavy genre shows so it's not quite the same thing.
OP
OP
Yeah she's into all the Marvel shows so we do watch those. And we've gotten her into The Amazing Race.
It sucks for the creators but it would be great if this behavior from Netflix would result in shorter shows that tell stories with a conclusive ending at the end of a season. I'm so tired of shows ending their seasons on cliffhangers because creators always assume they have all the time and money in the world to tell their stories when that isn't the case. I don't have the time for that and I certainly don't care about cliffhangers when I can watch the whole season in a weekend but have to wait 12-18 months for the continuation, if it ever happens. I'm so tired of this. Plan ahead, plant a couple of seeds here and there but make sure you're telling a story from start to finish in a single season first.
Last edited:
Some of them do. Others like Centaurworld and Cuphead are a single order of episodes arbitrarily split into two "seasons" because Netflix still considers that the magic number.
A lot of the time it's just Netflix splitting up an order to make it look bigger, so they're not immune either. I think the recent second season reveal of Cuphead was just the second half of the episodes they ordered originally. It's cheaper to buy in bulk than to order an actual second season.
Yep we already started to stop watching new netflix stuff until its further in or has an ending. They are just instilling this value into people by doing this and eventually everyone will stop using them
Last edited:
OP
OP
I thought about this before. Netfilx focuses on short term gains and short term everything like new shows are roughly always 8 episodes(it's pretty much how society and companies, work in general now but that's another matter). It makes it easy for me to drop, as there's no Simpsons or Seinfield or some long running show that has lots of episodes.
Like not every show has to be the best immediately I think that's what Netflix doesn't understand. Sometimes you just want to watch stuff that's ok that's average that's good but not great I don't know. And there's no chance of any show growing into becoming really good later on because they aren't allowed to grow slowly organically. With there strategy I can binge Netflix for a couple of months and then cancel it for six months and not really miss anything. Even standard TV has long ago figured this out you don't need the best shows, you just need to create viewing habits where people are compelled to watch things that are on every day or every few days. Or maybe it is different now and people only watch the best.
Like not every show has to be the best immediately I think that's what Netflix doesn't understand. Sometimes you just want to watch stuff that's ok that's average that's good but not great I don't know. And there's no chance of any show growing into becoming really good later on because they aren't allowed to grow slowly organically. With there strategy I can binge Netflix for a couple of months and then cancel it for six months and not really miss anything. Even standard TV has long ago figured this out you don't need the best shows, you just need to create viewing habits where people are compelled to watch things that are on every day or every few days. Or maybe it is different now and people only watch the best.
Yeah I am also confused by this. For one, isn't people not binging shows a... good thing, for a subscription service? You want people drawing out their viewership of stuff, don't you? Not gobbling it up in a few days and then moving on?
For two, not everything is going to be a megahit. If you aim to be a one stop shop for streaming entertainment, then you need to invest in a broader array of content that might not all be a Squid Game.
I assume Netflix aren't braindead, so there must be some kind of economic calculus going on here that I'm not seeing - but I really don't know what it could be.
Maybe they want a really big and diverse back catalog? Only thing that makes sense to me
Also a little similar to what Cartoon Network used to do, where most shows had a limited lifespan to avoid giving their cast and crew raises.
Netflix, despite having some amazing shows that I want to continue to watch (The Witcher, Derry Girls, Sex Education, Peaky Blinders, etc.) continues to do everything in its power to make me cancel my sub.
-They've cancelled many shows I've enjoyed; The OA, One Day at a Time, god knows what else.
-they raise prices continually.
-they're testing new methods to fuck over password sharing.
Meanwhile Prime just sort of exists and has some good stuff, Disney+ is great, and Apple TV+ is absolutely killing it in price:great show ratio. Netflix is too busy giving trucks full of money to Adam Sandler, etc.
-They've cancelled many shows I've enjoyed; The OA, One Day at a Time, god knows what else.
-they raise prices continually.
-they're testing new methods to fuck over password sharing.
Meanwhile Prime just sort of exists and has some good stuff, Disney+ is great, and Apple TV+ is absolutely killing it in price:great show ratio. Netflix is too busy giving trucks full of money to Adam Sandler, etc.
OP
OP
I've suspected in the past that Netflix would rather have 8 one season long shows than 1 eight season long shows. Because that's 8 icons to scroll through as opposed to 1 and gives the impression of added value.
It's obvious that their decisions are largely data driven, like making projects solely to target a specific market. I'm guessing they crunched the numbers and found that once people subscribed for a show, they generally stuck around anyways even if it gets cancelled. Which makes sense. If you stuck around for 2 years (2 seasons) for one show you probably found other reasons to keep your subscription.
But then why bother continuing a show? Often if one becomes successful it actually makes less money over time because costs increase (budget + actors). Might as well make something else for another market to bring in more subscribers. Netflix doesn't make entertainment, it makes subscription bait, lol.
This is why people need to cancel their subscription when a show they like goes. It's the only thing Netflix cares about.
Netflix's strategy makes sense if we assume that :
- Netflix views user acquisition as more important than user retention
- Binge-viewing figures are a better proxy for user acquisition than just total viewer-hours.
Netflix might have the full back catalogue of Star Trek TNG that generates loads of viewer-hours, but this sort of content doesn't advertise the service much because noones talking about it.
I agree.
Their original content for the most part is not that great.
HBO and Disney both have better stuff (IMO).
And they even hold anime episodes until the whole season is complete in Japan, WTF
Talking and speculating is half the fun
It's truly insane, because they know exactly how valuable a long running show is. The Office and Friends were binged endlessly on Netflix, and they paid a shit ton of money to secure Seinfeld, but they have no interest whatsoever in cultivating the next Office or Seinfeld.
If Netflix had been running NBC in the 90's and aughts, they would have cancelled the Office and Seinfeld after Season 2.
If Netflix had been running NBC in the 90's and aughts, they would have cancelled the Office and Seinfeld after Season 2.
This...
Such an original and funny show! I don't trust Netflix at all anymore. After that I was very skeptical about watching anything, including a potential can't miss in The Witcher. I'm too old and have too little free time to get invested in something just to have it ripped out from under me. I know that's how this medium has always been but Netflix is so cancel happy it feels like playing roulette with every show. I'm surprised they even let Lost in Space finish...
They've decided that social media buzz is the most important thing. Seinfeld, Friends, and the Office create buzz. New huge hits like Squid Game create buzz. Babysitters Club doesn't.
They've based their business model on rapid (unsustainable) growth and the only way to hit their targets is through aggressively appealing to FOMO.
To be fair, they probably create much more shows than companies did back in the day.
Central Park on Apple TV is very good. We are rewatching Ted Lasso, and although it has a couple of sexually suggestive scenes is pretty good for the family (my kids are 11 and 13).
It's so good. Timothy Olyphant is so great in it.
I've also been wary to get into new shows since the abrupt cancellation of Santa Clarita. I don't mind shows only getting 2-3 seasons, but I do mind these shows getting cancelled without warning. If the shows got wrapped up properly I wouldn't mind it so much.
Dropping everything at once absolutely kills conversation about it, fan theories, suspense, mystery etc. is all dead because of binging. Weekly on other services has been nice because then I have time to watch it and then can browse a thread about it for ten minutes for other people's thoughts.
You would think this will eventually hurt Netflix.
You are less likely to try new shows if there is a high likelihood of it being cancelled and left unfinished.
What is a back catalogue of incomplete shows really worth? If a show is finished and didn't have a chance to close off threads in a reasonable way I doubt I would start it.
I prefer the binge model but I am not always in the mood to watch the particular show as soon as it drops.
You are less likely to try new shows if there is a high likelihood of it being cancelled and left unfinished.
What is a back catalogue of incomplete shows really worth? If a show is finished and didn't have a chance to close off threads in a reasonable way I doubt I would start it.
I prefer the binge model but I am not always in the mood to watch the particular show as soon as it drops.