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Deleted member 12790

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Oct 27, 2017
24,537
For people asking for refund, do you have a PS4? I mean, it is still an option...

you just reminded me that I actually got my best friend in Denver to back this. He backed for PC way back in the day, and then the last time he saw me 6 months ago, he had me build him a LINUX PC. He's not computer savvy but wanted to dink around with SteamOS, and I had told him he could play Shenmue III with Steam Proton. I have to call my friend now and tell him the bad news, fuck.
 

GhostTrick

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,316
Wouldn't it be better if it forced them to provide Steam keys to backers instead? : /


That would be. But I don't expect it. Worse than that, we still don't know if the game is a timed exclusive or not. And if we're getting Steam keys, that might be in a year (if it's timed exclusive indeed). They sold their backers.
 

Deleted member 12790

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Oct 27, 2017
24,537
Sure as shit not supporting anything on Kickstarter again.

I've seen lots of comments like this and it infuriates me. Not that I'm mad at you or anyone else feeling so burned by KS that they won't back anything else again, because I can understand that, but rather for Shenmue III poisoning the well like this. I say this because I have been planning a KS campaign for a long time, and reading this stuff makes me realize that Deep Silver's greed here is literally affecting completely unrelated projects. And, potentially, my own bottom line. Fucking greed.
 

floridaguy954

Member
Oct 29, 2017
3,631

Spaghetti

Member
Dec 2, 2017
2,740
They're the publisher
They should pay for their misdeeds. In this case lose money.
Sumio Mondo covered it.

That Kickstarter money isn't going to Deep Silver, if there's even anything left beyond funds for rewards fulfillment. You can still register your unhappiness with the decision while still getting the rewards you pledged for by switching platform and sending a strongly worded message.

Oh yeah, that would be awesome. However, I even doubt that will happen.
I'm going to keep my fingers crossed and see how this develops, it's still early days and the backlash probably hasn't fully reverberated to the point where they'll be discussion options.

It would be an easy way to pour water on this fire, and should contracts allow it, they should do it.
 

elyetis

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,556
The money has already been spent. They would in fact be getting a saving if they don't have to ship backer rewards to you.
How would giving me a digtal ps4 copy, cost them more than refunding me my copy ? Is sony somehow making them pay each key generation more than the price they made me pay for the game during kickstarter ?
 

BAN PUNCHER

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
4,945
For people asking for refund, do you have a PS4? I mean, it is still an option...
WhiteAltruisticFirefly-size_restricted.gif
 
Oct 25, 2017
651
$500 backer here. Huge fan of the series and was really looking forward to this. Really disappointed in this decision but unlikely to be able to do a charge back since they charged my card back in 2015.
 

Deleted member 1849

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,986
you just reminded me that I actually got my best friend in Denver to back this. He backed for PC way back in the day, and then the last time he saw me 6 months ago, he had me build him a LINUX PC. He's not computer savvy but wanted to dink around with SteamOS, and I had told him he could play Shenmue III with Steam Proton. I have to call my friend now and tell him the bad news, fuck.

Oh boy, I feel really sorry for that friend of yours.

Epic have been absolutely awful for the state of Linux gaming.
 

ThatOneGuy831

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
1,337
I dont quite get this problem. So long as the person has the game what does it matter how you got it? Like if it was a physical copy, why does it matter if I bought it at Best Buy or Target? What matters I have the game and get to play.
I know you've already been banned for this, but for future reference instead of coming into a thread and spouting stupid bullshit like this, how about you do some research on the topic?
 
Jun 26, 2018
3,829
How would giving me a digtal ps4 copy, cost them more than refunding me my copy ? Is sony somehow making them pay each key generation more than the price they made me pay for the game during kickstarter ?

Sorry, I didn't know if you had physical backer rewards or not, but regardless the money from the Kickstarter has surely been spent, but I still wish you luck in trying to get a refund.
 

Alucrid

Chicken Photographer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,434
Sumio Mondo covered it.

That Kickstarter money isn't going to Deep Silver, if there's even anything left beyond funds for rewards fulfillment. You can still register your unhappiness with the decision while still getting the rewards you pledged for by switching platform and sending a strongly worded message.


I'm going to keep my fingers crossed and see how this develops, it's still early days and the backlash probably hasn't fully reverberated to the point where they'll be discussion options.

It would be an easy way to pour water on this fire, and should contracts allow it, they should do it.

no thanks, i'd rather get a refund unless someone held a gun to yu suzuki's head to agree to this.
 

Deleted member 50949

User Requested Account Closure
Banned
Dec 16, 2018
489
I've seen lots of comments like this and it infuriates me. Not that I'm mad at you or anyone else feeling so burned by KS that they won't back anything else again, because I can understand that, but rather for Shenmue III poisoning the well like this. I say this because I have been planning a KS campaign for a long time, and reading this stuff makes me realize that Deep Silver's greed here is literally affecting completely unrelated projects. And, potentially, my own bottom line. Fucking greed.
to be fair, people have stopped backing games because of multiple projects failing to deliver their promises like Mighty Number 9 (The biggest offender since it was the first major game to do so) and Project Phoenix IIRC. Shenmue 3 is now part of the list of KS games looking undesirable or fail to deliver (still not out yet but this is not a good look).
 

Dandy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,462
But most importantly, in looking for the most enjoyable experience on PC, it was decided together with Deep Silver after much discussion that the Epic Games Store would be the best distribution platform option.
This is such a load of bullshit. What exactly about the EGS makes it a more enjoyable experience on PC? Is it all of the amazing features it offers consumers?

What a bunch of lying assholes.
 

Deleted member 1849

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,986
I've seen lots of comments like this and it infuriates me. Not that I'm mad at you or anyone else feeling so burned by KS that they won't back anything else again, because I can understand that, but rather for Shenmue III poisoning the well like this. I say this because I have been planning a KS campaign for a long time, and reading this stuff makes me realize that Deep Silver's greed here is literally affecting completely unrelated projects. And, potentially, my own bottom line. Fucking greed.
Yup, and it's completely reasonable for people to not trust Kickstarters any more when things like this happen. It's awful. Epic are severely damaging whatever trust people still had in crowdfunding.

Fwiw, I feel the same way, but will still kickstart a project if it seems interesting enough and small enough in scope to not get Tim's attention. No way am I kickstarting larger projects.
 

Tohsaka

Member
Nov 17, 2017
6,796
This is such a load of bullshit. What exactly about the EGS makes it a more enjoyable experience on PC? Is it all of the amazing features it offers consumers?

What a bunch of lying assholes.
You won't be distracted by superfluous features like cloud saving, forums, user reviews, unconditional refunds, etc. You can just focus on the game itself.
 

Garlador

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
14,131
I was getting it on PS4, but I agree that this is total bollocks for those that went in for the Steam version.
 

Deleted member 12790

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
24,537
I'm not a PC gamer. Could someone explain to me why people hate EGS? What's wrong?

Firstly, understand that when people talk about steam, and the epic game store, they're actually talking about two different things at the exact same time. It's confusing to people who don't intimately understand technology, but these things, launchers are some call them, are a combination of store front, and technology suite. I'm sure you've heard of things like OpenGL or DirectX, those are technologies that help make games, specifically those technologies are middlewares that drive graphics cards. They make up a standard language so a game developer can target a "virtual" openGL or directX card, and the people behind OpenGL and DirectX (Khronos and Microsoft) then take care of making their "virtual" card work with physical cards. So from the perspective of a developer, you write for one "virtual" card, and the makers of that "virtual" card spend lots of money making it work with lots of real, physical cards. This is called interfacing.

Steam, the client, has a store bundled with it, but it is also a suite of tools. Steam, the client, can be thought of like DirectX, it does lots and lots of things beyond merely selling you the game. For example, there is this thing called Steam Proton which is an automatic translation layer for linux. With steam proton, you can run any windows game in linux, something thought absolutely impossible years ago. Steam is brimming with technologies like this, like Steam Input, which is how things like Dual Shock Controllers work.

You don't have to buy from Steam, the store, to use Steam, the client's tools. When you buy a game from, like, amazon, the sale goes entirely through amazon, and valve doesn't take 30% because they didn't actually facilitate the sale. But when you buy that game from amazon, or target.com, or where ever, they give you a special "installer" that you can pop into the steam client, and it'll use all the steam client features.

The Epic Games Store is, like the steam client, both a store and a suite of tools. But as a suite of tools, it's anemic. Not a fraction of what steam, the client, does. But worse than that, Epic is relying on people's confusion and inability to understand the difference between a store front and a suite of tools to muddy the picture. Were, for example, Epic Game Store just selling Steam Client installers, like Uplay does, nobody would have a fucking problem at all. But they don't. Instead, when something is "epic store exclusive," that means epic paid to both keep the game off of Valve's technology suite, AND keep it off of every other store besides their own. When something uses steam's technology, they are NOT exclusive to steam, the store. But people who don't know the difference think everything using steam's technology is the same as being exclusive to steam, the store.

By making things exclusive to epic games store, not only are they limiting the number of places where a buyer can purchase from (which has the demonstrable effect of raising game prices), it also cuts features from certain games by keeping them from using steam technologies.

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In short, when things go "Epic games store" exclusive, they are limiting the places one can buy from, limiting the feature set of said, usually raising the price of said game, for absolutely no benefit to the consumer at all.

And, as an indie developer, Epic itself creates this division between games it allows onto the store, and games it does not. For games that are not allowed onto the store, it creates an unfair stigma, like those games are somehow lesser games, that actually hurts bottom lines. I don't want to use a specific example by name, because the specific dev got harassed when they made this known, but there was a well known, well reviewed game on steam that got denied a spot on epic game store, and after it got denied, the narrative on twitter turned into "something must clearly be wrong with the game if it got denied a spot on the store" and their sales actually slumped. One of the best features of steam, the store, from the perspective of small developers, is that it puts everyone on equal footing. A dude in bedroom can make a game and it's sold right alongside games made by 1000 person studios with million dollar budgets as though they were equals. EGS creates a division of haves vs have nots that hurt small developers.

EGS is bad for PC gaming all around.
 
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Uhyve

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,167
Last edited:

Spikey

Banned
Jan 28, 2018
141
An announcement like this should immediately be followed by clarification. What a PR disaster.
 
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