Shawn Layden blames publishers and developers for lack of PlayStation crossplay (Up: Wargroove dev Chucklefish responds in thread - "We were told no")

stan423321 · Feb 12, 2019

Here's a funny thing. The most likely alternative isn't Sony allowing everyone to set up crossplay. The most likely alternative isn't Sony saying straight that they'll allow it just for the big games either. The most likely alternative is Sony lying to both press and developers (by starting the enroll process and then proceeding with unmoving queue and/or neverending requirements). Instead they were honest to developers. We need to consider a situation where they decide now that that's what they were doing wrong.

Watershed · Feb 12, 2019

So Sony is "open for business" on crossplay with no "gating factors" except crossplay is only available to "select third parties" and we know for a fact that some publishers have been told no on enabling crossplay.

I KILL PXLS · Feb 12, 2019

Soprano said:
Something has to be lost in translation.

I feel like he's being pretty clear in how he laid it out. The sentence prior to the quote I quoted was "People keep saying, "Why doesn't Sony allow more people to have it?" It's pretty clear he's talking about access to cross play or at the very least the "beta" for cross play to which he then immediately after says they're "open for business". I'm not sure how else you could interpret that. But if that's true, why are devs still being stonewalled? Again, I'm willing to allow for the SLIGHTEST chance that he's either misinformed, or that word hasn't trickled down yet, but this beta has been going on for almost 5 months now which I feel makes that extremely unlikely.

Goodacre0081 · Feb 12, 2019

Umbrella Carp said:
Correct. No such period of testing ever existed. Cross-play just entered circulation naturally as the tech became possible. I think Rocket League was one of the trailblazers if I'm remembering right. Or maybe even as far back as Gears of War from 360 to PC

FFXI

cross-play between PC, PS2, Xbox360

Axisofweevils · Feb 12, 2019

denx said:
I don't remember Nintendo and Microsoft having a beta period for crossplay did they? They just rolled out the feature. Why Sony needs an extended beta period for crossplay then?

Actually we know, this beta thing is just bullshit spinning for the fact they don't want crossplay in their system and they're gatekeeping the feature, allowing just the most popular games to have that feature because they can strong arm Sony. Everyone else is shit out of luck.

Is super transparent yet people still do mental gymnastics over it. smh

I'm pretty sure even the Wii U had a multiplat crossplay chess game.

Synth · Feb 12, 2019

Goodacre0081 said:
FFXI

cross-play between PC, PS2, Xbox360

If we go back before PSN and XBL existed as walled services, then you also had Quake III Arena having Dreamcast vs PC crossplay.

Wandu · Feb 12, 2019

Jiraiya said:
Are you being serious?

Ingueferroque said:
Come. On.

I KILL PXLS said:
I'll refer back to this:

So either he's lying or, at best, he's being extremely misleading. Neither are a good look.

Shpeshal Ed said:
lol a "beta" for a "program" where they simply say yes or no to a developer.

SlipperyFishes said:
Open beta is an excuse they just roll out to prevent bigger games from leaving the platform. They put more effort into PlayStation Mobile then this.

chobel said:
Oh, I forgot the beta is exclusive to the people who pre-ordered crossplay.

MrNelson said:
You do know that Fortnite "accidentally" had crossplay for PS4 enabled for a short period long before Sony announced this "beta" crossplay program, right? It's the main reason why people are so vocal about it, because they had it ready to go for a long-ass time, and the only people in the way were Sony.

They're only using the "beta" term as an excuse to do selective rollouts. It seems that it has been possible for devs to do for a very long time at this point.

Take5GiantSteps said:
Yikes lol. The defense force is in full swing.

AndrewDean84 said:
Holy moly. I feel dizzy from the failed attempt at maximum spin.

The Living Tribunal said:

GMM said:
Sending and receiving TCP/UDP packets between the developers own server infrastructure is ludicrous to label as a beta, this is an internal Sony policy prohibiting developers from serving specific data.

Sony has everything implemented developers need to authenticate a user on their own game infrastructure. This is not a technical problem, it's a policy problem.

hemo memo said:
What a spin.

All ya'll can call it what you want. I was just stating a fact. The program/policy is in beta and only enabled on 2 games for Xbox/Switch.

If you really want spin, Sony does support crossplay with all platforms now through the beta.

MrNelson · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
All ya'll can call it what you want. I was just stating a fact. The program/policy is in beta and only enabled on 2 games for Xbox/Switch.

If you really want spin, Sony does support crossplay with all platforms now through the beta.

So why did Epic have Fortnite crossplay up and running a solid year before Sony decided to do their "beta" program?

https://kotaku.com/epic-accidentally-allows-xbox-and-ps4-cross-play-on-for-1818518611

S1lentSymph0ny · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
All ya'll can call it what you want. I was just stating a fact. The program/policy is in beta and only enabled on 2 games for Xbox/Switch.

If you really want spin, Sony does support crossplay with all platforms now through the beta.

lol, no you're buying bullshit dressed up as "facts" then getting upset when the critical thinkers aren't buying it with you. Also, I'm good without spin. That seems to be your/Sony's thing.

@dedmunk · Feb 12, 2019

Lmao Shawn wat is u doin

Aokiji · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
Yeah they said no because it is in beta. It's not open beta. I would say he is lying if it was officially live and out of beta. I mean, Sony certainly hasn't had an issue with crossplay with PC. That PR statement basically operates in the grey area because technically Sony has had crossplay enabled since PS2 and has more crossplay enabled games vs Xbox and Nintendo.

*guffaws*

collige · Feb 12, 2019

Goodacre0081 said:
FFXI

cross-play between PC, PS2, Xbox360

Phantasy Star also did this.

VeePs · Feb 12, 2019

Just wanting to bring up the benefits of crossplay again:

Synth · Feb 12, 2019

collige said:
Phantasy Star also did this.

That actually didn't have 360 crossplay though. MS only made the exception for Final Fantasy XI (likely because Square held their feet to the fire regarding the port of FFXIII). There was the PS2/PC server, and then the 360 server separately.

PSU didn't require XBL however, which may be the only other game aside from FFXI to be granted that exception.

SnatcherHunter · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
All ya'll can call it what you want. I was just stating a fact. The program/policy is in beta and only enabled on 2 games for Xbox/Switch.

If you really want spin, Sony does support crossplay with all platforms now through the beta.

Brotha

I suggest you get your facts straight before posting.

Deleted member 10847 · Feb 12, 2019

SnatcherHunter said:
Brotha

I suggest you get your facts straight before posting.

At this point i think he is just trolling.

Wandu · Feb 12, 2019

MrNelson said:
So why did Epic have Fortnite crossplay up and running a solid year before Sony decided to do their "beta" program?

https://kotaku.com/epic-accidentally-allows-xbox-and-ps4-cross-play-on-for-1818518611

I don't know why you are gonna have to ask them. That's not my job.

S1lentSymph0ny said:
lol, no you're buying bullshit dressed up as "facts" then getting upset when the critical thinkers aren't buying it with you. Also, I'm good without spin. That seems to be your/Sony's thing.

Not upset at all. Critical thinking refers to an objective analysis and evaluation of an issue in order to form a judgment. Stating that Shawn/Sony is lying is no where near critical thinking and, objectively, Sony does have crossplay with all platforms through beta. No spin, that is straight up facts. Just like its not factual to say they are against crossplay when they do have crossplay outside of beta with PC.

All I am saying is you can evaluate his statement once their policy is out of beta.

Deleted member 5028 · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
I don't know why you are gonna have to ask them. That's not my job.

Not upset at all. Critical thinking refers to an objective analysis and evaluation of an issue in order to form a judgment. Stating that Shawn/Sony is lying is no where near critical thinking and, objectively, Sony does have crossplay with all platforms through beta. No spin, that is straight up facts. Just like its not factual to say they are against crossplay when they do have crossplay outside of beta with PC.

All I am saying is you can evaluate his statement once their policy is out of beta.

You think this is ever coming out of beta? This is just a label they use until they quietly drop it

Synth · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
All I am saying is you can evaluate his statement once their policy is out of beta.

Man, they'd just LOVE that everyone simply shut up until they decide to take the magical "beta" tag off the program. That's the kind of argument that would have led to this "beta" program not even existing in the first place.

And yea, he's lying. He straight up says that he doesn't believe there's any gating factor to this. Even if we take the whole beta program at face value in the way you appear to be, that entire program is the damn gate.

LudicrousSpeed · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
All ya'll can call it what you want. I was just stating a fact. The program/policy is in beta and only enabled on 2 games for Xbox/Switch.

If you really want spin, Sony does support crossplay with all platforms now through the beta.

No one was confused on that. What they're stating is the obvious: There is no genuine need for a "beta". The actual reason the "beta" exists is that Sony has to give the impression that they care while they maintain the prohibition. Declaring that the program is in beta gives them that plus the ability to exempt high-profile games that might be able to bring pressure to bear upon Sony for prohibiting cross-play.

It's another example of the gaming industry abusing the term "beta".

Kage Maru · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
I don't know why you are gonna have to ask them. That's not my job.

Not upset at all. Critical thinking refers to an objective analysis and evaluation of an issue in order to form a judgment. Stating that Shawn/Sony is lying is no where near critical thinking and, objectively, Sony does have crossplay with all platforms through beta. No spin, that is straight up facts. Just like its not factual to say they are against crossplay when they do have crossplay outside of beta with PC.

All I am saying is you can evaluate his statement once their policy is out of beta.

The beta isn't real. It's something to hide behind so they can pick and choose who they approve. That's why people are laughing at you. You're believing in a lie.

Deleted member 32018 · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
Not upset at all. Critical thinking refers to an objective analysis and evaluation of an issue in order to form a judgment. Stating that Shawn/Sony is lying is no where near critical thinking and, objectively, Sony does have crossplay with all platforms through beta. No spin, that is straight up facts. Just like its not factual to say they are against crossplay when they do have crossplay outside of beta with PC.

All I am saying is you can evaluate his statement once their policy is out of beta.

You do realise that Sony are not paying you to say this right?

AndrewDean84 · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
All ya'll can call it what you want. I was just stating a fact. The program/policy is in beta and only enabled on 2 games for Xbox/Switch.

If you really want spin, Sony does support crossplay with all platforms now through the beta.

Doubling down on nonsense should be a position no one puts themselves in. But I kind of admire your courage in responding.

Jiraiya · Feb 12, 2019

Critical thinkers. Wandus argument is you're an idiot if you don't take Sony at their word even with contrary evidence. Literally...two games and the beta is real.

Papercuts · Feb 12, 2019

How can this thread keep delivering? How?

Mr_F_Snowman · Feb 12, 2019

Kind of hilarious to have a (well thought of) Sony exec straight up bullshitting and being called out for it.

If Nintendo can have cross play with no issue you really think its something Sony need to put in fucking beta? Nintendo don't even have in game chat and they can manage crossplay flawlessly. Anyone who actually believes this shit needs a fucking brain enema

VeePs · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
All ya'll can call it what you want. I was just stating a fact. The program/policy is in beta and only enabled on 2 games for Xbox/Switch.

If you really want spin, Sony does support crossplay with all platforms now through the beta.

Why does Sony even need a beta?

Nintendo and Microsoft don't.

PC is a far more open platform than Switch or Xbox One, and crossplay with PS4 and PC never needed a beta.

JayBee · Feb 12, 2019

VeePs said:
Just wanting to bring up the benefits of crossplay again:

Why is sony being so arrogant about this when it benefits the devs a lot. I know the 4theplayers thing was always just marketing but sony definitely stood for being very pro developers but this choice seems very against them

Wandu · Feb 12, 2019

SnatcherHunter said:
Brotha

I suggest you get your facts straight before posting.

What facts do I need to get straight? Also, you don't know me like that to be callin me brotha. I almost feel offended.

SlipperyFishes said:
You think this is ever coming out of beta? This is just a label they use until they quietly drop it

Maybe. It's possible. They did say it should be out of beta this year.

Synth said:
Man, they'd just LOVE that everyone simply shut up until they decide to take the magical "beta" tag off the program. That's the kind of argument that would have led to this "beta" program not even existing in the first place.

And yea, he's lying. He straight up says that he doesn't believe there's any gating factor to this. Even if we take the whole beta program at face value in the way you appear to be, that entire program is the damn gate.

It's a gate for Xbox/Switch, but not others. Fact is, it is officially in beta. That can change.

LudicrousSpeed said:
No one was confused on that. What they're stating is the obvious: There is no genuine need for a "beta". The actual reason the "beta" exists is that Sony has to give the impression that they care while they maintain the prohibition. Declaring that the program is in beta gives them that plus the ability to exempt high-profile games that might be able to bring pressure to bear upon Sony for prohibiting cross-play.

It's another example of the gaming industry abusing the term "beta".

While that can be true as a reason, it is still in beta.

Kage Maru said:
The beta isn't real. It's something to hide behind so they can pick and choose who they approve. That's why people are laughing at you. You're believing in a lie.

If the Xbox fans can believe everything that Phil Spencer has said, then I have no problem in believing this is in beta since that is what they stated.

steviejd1 said:
You do realise that Sony are not paying you to say this right?

I'm a Sony fan, not shill. Not making excuses, just stating that "to be fair, crossplay is in beta"

Youngfossil · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu, my guy/gal, sometimes you gotta take a step back and ask yourself, "Why am I the only one defending this / with this opinion.

Look at what your saying from a birds eye view.

Wandu · Feb 12, 2019

VeePs said:
Why does Sony even need a beta?

Nintendo and Microsoft don't.

PC is a far more open platform than Switch or Xbox One, and crossplay with PS4 and PC never needed a beta.

I don't know why. I blame it on their policy though.

Youngfossil said:
Wandu, my guy/gal, sometimes you gotta take a step back and ask yourself, "Why am I the only one defending this / with this opinion.

Look at what your saying from a birds eye view.

Yeah, but its a good read at least.

SnatcherHunter · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
What facts do I need to get straight? Also, you don't know me like that to be callin me brotha. I almost feel offended.

Maybe. It's possible. They did say it should be out of beta this year.

It's a gate for Xbox/Switch, but not others. Fact is, it is officially in beta. That can change.

While that can be true as a reason, it is still in beta.

If the Xbox fans can believe everything that Phil Spencer has said, then I have no problem in believing this is in beta since that is what they stated.

I'm a Sony fan, not shill. Not making excuses, just stating that "to be fair, crossplay is in beta"

I am trying to be nice.

Deleted member 5491 · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
I don't know why. I blame it on their policy though.

Yeah, but its a good read at least.

Their policy in saying ok, go ahead seems to be in "beta"

bsigg · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
I'm a Sony fan, not shill. Not making excuses, just stating that "to be fair, crossplay is in beta"

"Beta"

NLCPRESIDENT · Feb 12, 2019

Phil Brouard said:
Putting the blame on the devs. That's a new low in a thread full of corporate apologist.

What blame are you talking about? I'm talking about using people to console war for their cause. "4theplayers" tweets n shit when you dont know what's going on behind closed doors.

binarymelon said:
This isn't really on topic. Layden said one thing and devs are contradicting him. I'm not really sure how you escaped my ignore list from the plethora of cross play threads that came before this one.

should be right above my name, use it.

The Living Tribunal said:
And yet, his shit bait response manages to make more sense than your pathetic attempt at portraying these indie devs as some sort of bullies

Get out of here with this corporate apologist bullshit.

I'm not an apologist for nobody, some of yall make it hard to even want to agree or see your point with you how yall carry on. Anyway, imo, it could get handled better from both sides. "Not gonna happen" is that it? When, why? Wheres the story?

Synth · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
It's a gate for Xbox/Switch, but not others. Fact is, it is officially in beta. That can change.

A gate is a gate, and he claimed there wasn't one. Crossplay with Xbox/Switch is the context of the discussion. He knows this, and so do you.

Septic · Feb 12, 2019

Wein Cruz said:

Haha

derFeef · Feb 12, 2019

Folks it's in beta. Sony wins.
Or something.

TheGhost · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
I'm a Sony fan, not shill. Not making excuses, just stating that "to be fair, crossplay is in beta"

Oh it's a beta alright

It's counter productive to gamers. Stop thinking of camps, when we can be playing together why would we stick up for those blocking it?

Deleted member 32018 · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
I'm a Sony fan, not shill. Not making excuses, just stating that "to be fair, crossplay is in beta"

You can be a fan without toeing their corporate line. You can be a fan and still criticise them when they make stupid decisions. You are not acting like a fan, you are acting like someone who works for Sony.

Deleted member 18951 · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
All ya'll can call it what you want. I was just stating a fact. The program/policy is in beta and only enabled on 2 games for Xbox/Switch.

If you really want spin, Sony does support crossplay with all platforms now through the beta.

Just put this thread on ignore, it'll be better for you.

Deleted member 41104 · Feb 12, 2019

NLCPRESIDENT said:
What blame are you talking about? I'm talking about using people to console war for their cause. "4theplayers" tweets n shit when you dont know what's going on behind closed doors.

You're literally blaming devs, like the CEO of Chucklefish in this very thread, for what is going on.

And what's their bottom line, whats their cause ? Crossplay benefits all players, that's the bottom line.

NLCPRESIDENT said:
It's like these devs are using the players and communities to fight their battles, for their bottom lines.

Shpeshal Nick · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
All ya'll can call it what you want. I was just stating a fact. The program/policy is in beta and only enabled on 2 games for Xbox/Switch.

If you really want spin, Sony does support crossplay with all platforms now through the beta.

So you're doubling down on your naivety/gullibility by being wilfully obtuse?

Cool

Kage Maru · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
What facts do I need to get straight? Also, you don't know me like that to be callin me brotha. I almost feel offended.

Maybe. It's possible. They did say it should be out of beta this year.

It's a gate for Xbox/Switch, but not others. Fact is, it is officially in beta. That can change.

While that can be true as a reason, it is still in beta.

If the Xbox fans can believe everything that Phil Spencer has said, then I have no problem in believing this is in beta since that is what they stated.

I'm a Sony fan, not shill. Not making excuses, just stating that "to be fair, crossplay is in beta"

Anyone that believes everything a suit says when all the evidence points to the opposite is a fool. Show me an instance where Xbox fans or Nintendo fans eat up what Phil and Reggie says like you are doing here. Bringing up other companies, execs, and gamers is just childish when you can't even elaborate on and defend your own ignorant beliefs.

You're not acting like a fan, you're acting like a fanboy. I absolutely loved Spider-Man, but it's shocking how often people with Spider-Man avatars embarrass themselves here.

nolifebr · Feb 12, 2019

Sony has already made it clear that the cross-play for them is not just a push of a button for them, and they've said it several times:

Back in September, John Kodera said:

We are now in the planning process across the organization to support this change. We will update the community once we have more details to share, including more specifics regarding the beta timeframe, and what this means for other titles going forward.

Shawn Layden at PS Blogcast 308 (also in setember):

Like I said in Game Lab in Barcelona in June of this year, (2018) this is something we know about, this is a want, a desire and we want to deliver that in the best way possibile. Enabling crossplay, it's not just flipping a switch and there you go. It's a very multi dimensional kind off atribute or feature so we he have to take care of the technical point of view, we have to work with our partners and/on business point of view, we have to make sure that if we enable this, do we have the right customer support? Do we have the right messaging out there? Do we have all these different things that we have to do in line. And we have to do that in a certain order to the all set up and that's why its taking longer that I would wanted, but it will take as long it need to take to get it done and ready. So far so good (with Fornite) I haven't hear any feedback about disruptions, it's a BETA test, so we expect some hiccups along the way and we'll watch that carefully.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

About more games receiving cross-play: Right now we're in a BETA test program, we are trying to reduce the variable number of the equation; Certainly once we can prove that this is all holding together, stady and well, I would anticipate seeing other games in the service over time.

Justified · Feb 12, 2019

I'm not trying to defend Sony just wondering about the timing. Was the ask for Wargroove crossplay before or after the "crossplay beta" implemented? I would like to know that first before I jump on the Shawn Layden is lying train?

kambaybolongo · Feb 12, 2019

VeePs said:
Just wanting to bring up the benefits of crossplay again:

...did these metrics improve for Xbox or Switch?

stan423321 · Feb 12, 2019

Wandu said:
I'm a Sony fan, not shill. Not making excuses, just stating that "to be fair, crossplay is in beta"

This would be a perfectly fine excuse before that Layden interview. Smaller devs whine about cross play, but right now it's only for the bigger games because beta, I guess. But Sony/Layden threw that argument away. Consider it for a second: if that's the case, why tell them, effectively, that they could have contacted their support reps to start doing things and can do it right now?

MrNelson · Feb 12, 2019

nolifebr said:
Sony has already made it clear that the cross-play for them is not just a push of a button for them, and they've said it several times:

Back in September, John Kodera said:

Shawn Layden at PS Blogcast 308 (also in setember):

And yet

https://kotaku.com/epic-accidentally-allows-xbox-and-ps4-cross-play-on-for-1818518611

Synth · Feb 12, 2019

nolifebr said:
Sony has already made it clear that the cross-play for them is not just a push of a button for them, and they've said it several times:

Back in September, John Kodera said:

Shawn Layden at PS Blogcast 308 (also in setember):

I mean... they can make something clear and it still be nonsense.

If they had no crossplay at all, that point would be a little more convincing, but it's pretty hard to envision to "technical point of view" aspects that would be affecting crossplay with Xbox and Switch, yet not PC and mobile.

Shawn Layden blames publishers and developers for lack of PlayStation crossplay (Up: Wargroove dev Chucklefish responds in thread - "We were told no")

Community Resettler

Prophet of Truth

User requested account closure

User requested account closure

User requested account closure

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account

Prophet of Truth

Prophet of Truth

Alt-account

User requested account closure

User requested account closure

User requested account closure

User Requested Account Closure

Saw the truth behind the copied door

Community Resettler