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The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,228
Like teaches want to spend any more time with y'all bad kids

[hand raise]

My wife teaches "bad kids" at an inner city school for kids who are usually legally involved or have some toher reason for why they can't attend the normal urban public schools. She's exhausted by the end of the day like most teachers in her scenario, but it breaks her heart to see her students kicked out of school at 1:30PM with nowhere to go, a cold house they can't go home to, and so they end up basically being treated like homeless for 4 hours if their parents work or they don't have a grandparent or aunt who can take care of them. THey fall behind academically because there is no institutional support.

From the sounds of it, this proposal is to fund the extension of school hours not so that my public school teachers like my wife have to continue teaching, but so that schools can hire new staff or pay existing staff to keep the doors open, instead of booting kids into the street.

A warm room where a student can do his/her homework can make a big difference towards learning and outcomes. Access to a computer after 2PM can make a major difference in kids lives.

Are there challenges? Of course. FUnding, safety, curriculum, a balance of home/school life. But, for kids who are literally walking the street in the cold in December until it's dark out or parents who can't hold a stable job because they can only work 830-130, this is a first step to a solution.

(Sorry originally quoted MPrice the post above this one instead of DrFunk -- sorry for the incorrect notification!)
 

Alavard

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
5,374
Who's going to stay with the kids during this period? Appointed counselors? Cause it sure as shit won't be teachers. It would be en masse exodus.

I mean, it's in the article.

Teachers and faculty, the bill says, would not have to work additional hours unless they sign up for an extra shift, for which they would be compensated at the rate they get during normal school hours.
 

wenis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,147
grant money going to after school programming is a great idea. more funding for the arts please.
 
Oct 27, 2017
21,619
That's a terrible idea. Kids spend enough time at school, extending it another three hours would be torturing them. Not to mention costs to operate schools would skyrocket.
 

GoldenEye 007

Roll Tide, Y'all!
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,833
Texas
Teachers aren't opposed to working longer hours as long as they're compensated for it. This proposal is a federal compensation program. They're not asking teachers to work hours without being paid, like currently happens in a lot of under-funded school districts.
Teachers are already putting in a lot of hours per day. There comes a point where you're just working too much and additional dollars don't matter that much when taking into account work/life during the semester. Going for 12 hours a day or more catches up to people very quickly.

And yes that may be made up during summer, but when normalized over the year, many teachers already are working just as many hours as any other job.
 

BDS

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,845
Kamala the Cop continues to come up with the most ass-backwards liberal solutions to problems instead of recognizing capitalism is the problem.
 

Tathanen

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,062
The only way this could make sense is if they completely abolish homework. The remaining three hours would have to be specifically for like, doing "homework-esque tasks" and teachers working on lesson plans. Glorified study hall? I dunno man I get it but there are a lot of issues here.
 

SpitztheGreat

Member
May 16, 2019
2,879
I remember it being super nice to have a little bit of time to myself before my parents came home when I was in school. When you're a kid, even in high school, you make few decisions for yourself and have no place to call you're own because you're always in your parents' house. So those couple of hours alone were precious to me, even if all I did was watch TRL or Dragon Ball.
 

Alucrid

Chicken Photographer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,481
[hand raise]

My wife teaches "bad kids" at an inner city school for kids who are usually legally involved or have some toher reason for why they can't attend the normal urban public schools. She's exhausted by the end of the day like most teachers in her scenario, but it breaks her heart to see her students kicked out of school at 1:30PM with nowhere to go, a cold house they can't go home to, and so they end up basically being treated like homeless for 4 hours if their parents work or they don't have a grandparent or aunt who can take care of them. THey fall behind academically because there is no institutional support.

From the sounds of it, this proposal is to fund the extension of school hours not so that my public school teachers like my wife have to continue teaching, but so that schools can hire new staff or pay existing staff to keep the doors open, instead of booting kids into the street.

A warm room where a student can do his/her homework can make a big difference towards learning and outcomes. Access to a computer after 2PM can make a major difference in kids lives.

Are there challenges? Of course. FUnding, safety, curriculum, a balance of home/school life. But, for kids who are literally walking the street in the cold in December until it's dark out or parents who can't hold a stable job because they can only work 830-130, this is a first step to a solution.

(Sorry originally quoted MPrice the post above this one instead of DrFunk -- sorry for the incorrect notification!)

yeah kids having a place to go with some structure after school in certain areas (it would probably be a useful option everywhere tbh) sounds great. i think the real problem is how they're selling it (an extension to school), how they're staffing it (volunteer only) and how they're funding it (5 mil over 5 years per district seems way too low).
 

RDreamer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,114
I remember it being super nice to have a little bit of time to myself before my parents came home when I was in school. When you're a kid, even in high school, you make few decisions for yourself and have no place to call you're own because you're always in your parents' house. So those couple of hours alone were precious to me, even if all I did was watch TRL or Dragon Ball.
Nowadays everyone's super paranoid about this though so kids probably aren't left alone as young as they used to be. 16 or 17 years old? Sure. Younger and you may get CPS called.
 

Aesthet1c

Member
Oct 27, 2017
924
Not that she was really in the running, but this will probably kill her presidential run lol.

I get the intent behind this bill, but man, that's a really shitty way to resolve this problem.
 
OP
OP
Metallix87

Metallix87

User Requested Self-Ban
Banned
Nov 1, 2017
10,533
The only way this could make sense is if they completely abolish homework. The remaining three hours would have to be specifically for like, doing "homework-esque tasks" and teachers working on lesson plans. Glorified study hall? I dunno man I get it but there are a lot of issues here.
... Was it common for you to do homework for three hours a day?
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,228
The reactions in these threads remind me of people reacting negatively to 100% School lunch funding programs... like "BLECHT! WHO WANTS TO BE FORCED TO EAT SCHOOL LUNCH?!?!?"

For kids who don't have food otherwise, 100% school lunch is a godsend, it might be somebodys only meal of the day.

Teachers are already putting in a lot of hours per day. There comes a point where you're just working too much and additional dollars don't matter that much when taking into account work/life during the semester. Going for 12 hours a day or more catches up to people very quickly.

And yes that may be made up during summer, but when normalized over the year, many teachers already are working just as many hours as any other job.

This program, as least as its described, talks about hiring more staff and compensating current staff. My wife is a teacher in a school system that would be included in this working with student who would benefit from this, I know how many hours she puts in. In the OP, as described, it would provide funding to hire more staff and/or compensate existing staff who volunteer.

The alternative today is that kids are basically homeless for four hours. My wife has students who break down crying at the end of the day because they have nowhere to go, and the school system needs more funding for after school programs which it doesn't have.
 

Dyle

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
30,119
What a garbage proposal, kids are spending too much time in the classroom, not too little. I'm all for programs that allow kids to spend time after school as part of the educational process, through extra-currriculars and time for independent learning, but the last thing they need is more time in the classroom. It makes no sense for anyone in the Senate to propose this when the DoE doesn't have the resources or authority to handle the minutae of such a program and the money they propose for the program is comically low given the existing funding problems the education field is facing
 

Hydrus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,298
So kids who get bullied and want to get the day over as soon as possible, get an additional 3 hours of bullying time per day. Thanks Harris!!
 

SpitztheGreat

Member
May 16, 2019
2,879
The only way this could make sense is if they completely abolish homework. The remaining three hours would have to be specifically for like, doing "homework-esque tasks" and teachers working on lesson plans. Glorified study hall? I dunno man I get it but there are a lot of issues here.
It strikes me that this is a plan conceived by that person that you couldn't stand in high school. The person who would actively ask for more homework, or extra credit, would argue with their teacher if they only got a A-, basically the pushy overachiever that cannot conceptualize that others think differently. Kamala was probably the kind of kid that did not understand when other students complained about homework or tests; in her world why wouldn't you want go to school for 12 hours a day?

I don't think Kamala and I would have been friends.
 

GoldenEye 007

Roll Tide, Y'all!
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,833
Texas
yeah kids having a place to go with some structure after school in certain areas sounds great. i think the real problem is how they're selling it (an extension to school), how they're staffing it (volunteer only) and how they're funding it (5 mil over 5 years per district seems way too low).
Also, do these kids stay in the same school? Or a different location? If staying, how can a teacher prep for the next day when their classroom is still full of kids?
 

ItIsOkBro

Happy New Year!!
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
9,563
this is like the 3rd time she is has tried to solve a problem in the worst possible way
 

MPrice

Alt account
Banned
Oct 18, 2019
654
Not that she was really in the running, but this will probably kill her presidential run lol.

I get the intent behind this bill, but man, that's a really shitty way to resolve this problem.

Yeah everybody realizes the root issue but this is just a terrible way to solve it. To make school longer for every student when the issues only effect a subset of students is completely non sensical.

Its like having a couple fire ant hills in your yard and deciding to burn your whole property to ashes.
 

Maximus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,586
Why not shorten the work day/week instead of having daycare programs and making kids suffer through more school.
 

Zhengi

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
1,907
Maybe they should make an after school program where kids can get additional tutoring and help with their homework until their parents can pick them up? Have the federal government provide funding for that and any teachers who stay to help with the program will get additional compensation. I remember reading studies that after school programs help low income families immensely and helps to keep kids out of trouble as well.

Fake Edit: As a parent, I would love it if my kid came out at 6 pm as I can then pick him up from school then.
 

Big Yoshi

Member
Nov 25, 2018
1,818
Am I a fucking idiot or would this not makes a shitton more sense if it just required schools to offer after school activities untip 6 each day? then kids can choose to stay if they want their parents to pick them up. Because this looks dumb as fuck.
 
Nov 2, 2017
2,254
From another article on this from Mother Jones, a bit of the bill that emphasizes just what neoliberal nonsense this is:
The bill would also require the school to find a private or non-federal public funding source, such as state grants or philanthropy organizations, to match 10 percent of the federal grant money, a stipulation intended to help the programs remain sustainable after the initial grant money has run out. The matches can be money or an in-kind contribution in the form of volunteer staff time, meeting spaces, or equipment.

Either your school system gets really good at navigating the grant system, or you're going to have sponsored classes in order to keep it up.

Just incredibly tone-deaf, but it's not surprising coming from Harris.
 

Tukarrs

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,842
I don't think it's necessarily bad for schools to offer free (government sponsored) childcare/study spaces/events after school until 6.

Parents who can afford to pick up their child can do so at the regular time.

(And it shouldn't be teachers but actual childcare workers.)
 

SpitztheGreat

Member
May 16, 2019
2,879
The reactions in these threads remind me of people reacting negatively to 100% School lunch funding programs... like "BLECHT! WHO WANTS TO BE FORCED TO EAT SCHOOL LUNCH?!?!?"

For kids who don't have food otherwise, 100% school lunch is a godsend, it might be somebodys only meal of the day.
This program is NOTHING like school lunch funding programs.
 

GoldenEye 007

Roll Tide, Y'all!
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,833
Texas
This program, as least as its described, talks about hiring more staff and compensating current staff. My wife is a teacher in a school system that would be included in this working with student who would benefit from this, I know how many hours she puts in. In the OP, as described, it would provide funding to hire more staff and/or compensate existing staff who volunteer.

The alternative today is that kids are basically homeless for four hours. My wife has students who break down crying at the end of the day because they have nowhere to go, and the school system needs more funding for after school programs which it doesn't have.
Yes, my wife teaches in a Title I district, so she sees that stuff too. The entire school and district by default is free/reduced lunch, free pre-k, etc. I guess I'm confused on how this would compare versus subsidizing after-school care programs instead. Under this plan, do these kids stay in the same school? Even if a teacher isn't there and a different staff is, even something as simple as room prep is disrupted.
 

sangreal

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,890
The bill proposes that the grant money go to extracurricular activities like electives in "music, arts, athletics, writing and engineering," Harris' senate office told CNBC. The extra time can also go toward dance and theater programs, among other enrichment activities, the office said. but it leaves the scheduling of the day open to school administrators.

Why is she framing this as extended school hours? These are just your every day after school programs.