• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.

Mentalist

Member
Mar 14, 2019
17,976
.


I don't think the world wants to deal with Putin anymore. Ultimately up to Ukraine but I feel the world is done with Putin and this is about the only chance to force him out one way or another.

Ukraine does not want a repeat of 1917-1922 again.

The way to make Russia not be a threat again, is for the Russian Army to cease to exist within Ukraine's internationally recognized borders
 

Strikerrr

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,095
These things sill exist O.o? I thought towed AT cannons died out in the 50s and 60s...
The Soviets continued to develop AT guns into the 80s. They are equipped with radar and are capable of firing AT missiles as well.
Ukraine still has a few as well
www.thedrive.com

Ukraine Rolls Out Soviet-Era Radar-Equipped Anti-Tank Guns

Cold War-era MT-12R anti-tank guns could help bolster Ukraine's anti-armor capabilities in any conflict in the near future.
 

Pantaghana

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
1,220
Croatia

Map of minefields in Bosnia
Zgcjnmk.jpeg

morgan-freeman-good-luck.gif


The Yugoslav wars were.. an interesting time
 

Nola

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
8,025
Yeah... this will not end well.
There's a pretty easy case to be made that while I doubt Putin expected to meet this type of resistance, the net result could end up still being a win for Putin domestically depending on how this ends up going because this war, of his making, is allowing him to justify even more draconian noose tightening on the levers of power and influence within Russia and taking out any oppositional forces, either in the oligarchy, the intelligence sphere, and the populace.

And he can then use those powers to ensure his survival and then shape narratives
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,428
You literally said Ukraine is more corrupt then Russia, and absolutely insane statement that everything from this war has shown to just not be true. A Ukraine more corrupt then Russia is not one that is able to field an army as competent as they are. Which we know because the deeply corrupt Russian military is bumblefucking there way into the dirt.

That's not even getting into acting like Azov is some majority of the army. There also not police.
I don't think your a bot. Your statement just included stuff that's downright nonsensical

I'll concede the Russia comparison, my main point overall is that corruption is a serious problem in the Ukraine. They have powerful oligarchs just like Russia and they have bought a lot of the politicians and institutions out. Yes, Ukraine can unite itself when being invaded, that's great, it doesn't negate what happened in pre-war Ukraine though. They couldn't even staff their anti-corruption courts because the judges themselves were corrupt, and even Zelensky's own party kept voting down anti-corruption laws. https://www.economist.com/europe/20...titutional-court-attacks-anti-corruption-laws

Also up until 2021, Ukraine was lower than Russia on the Corruption Perception's index, but it has since surpassed it, so I'll concede that.

At the risk of being accused of posting pro-Russian propaganda, you can read this article by Freedom House from 2018 which shows how far-right attacks in the country against minorities have been tolerated if not supported by law enforcement: https://freedomhouse.org/report/analytical-brief/2018/far-right-extremism-threat-ukrainian-democracy

BTW I never said they were a majority, I said they were formalized and institutionalized, which they are,

And what the hell are you talking about with the "you know trying to defend the state of Ukranian corruption and democracy is a dead-end?" I have no interest in arguing such things.

Lol I figured. Stop quoting me.

edit: Before I get another barrage of misdirected quotes, I'm arguing against Ukraine getting a fast track into the EU, not for Russia's invasion of Ukraine. Forward quoting because after many pages my arguments keep getting misconstrued. I won't be defending things I never said or even believe in.

Sounds a lot like the US tbqh. I don't know what you're trying to accomplish aside from side step the issue that Russia is belligerently attacking Ukraine.

So... just like the US, UK, France, Spain, Italy, Japan, Australia, Brazil, China, India... and most of the rest of the planet?

Please point me to the country where "far-right attacks against minorities" have not "been tolerated / supported by law enforcement" in the last few decades?

Actually, don't.

Russia didn't invade Ukraine due to some bullshit "denazification" excuse, and even arguing about it gives more credence to the Kremlin's propaganda than it deserves.

Can I suggest if you are concerned about being accused to posting pro-Russian propoganda then maybe *stop posting fucking Russian propoganda?*?

Like on what planet do you think coming into the thread where Ukrainian civilians are being shown being murdered by a hostile invading army and going 'well, actually ukraines quite bad' is a good move? Either you're a Russian propoganda pusher or a useful idiot who hasn't a shred of decent or common sense.

It's frankly fucking disgusting people still think this is acceptable or okay.
 
Last edited:

Nappuccino

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
13,008
At the risk of being accused of posting pro-Russian propaganda, you can read this article by Freedom House from 2018 which shows how far-right attacks in the country against minorities have been tolerated if not supported by law enforcement: https://freedomhouse.org/report/analytical-brief/2018/far-right-extremism-threat-ukrainian-democracy
Sounds a lot like the US tbqh. I don't know what you're trying to accomplish aside from side step the issue that Russia is belligerently attacking Ukraine.
 

cyrribrae

Chicken Chaser
Member
Jan 21, 2019
12,723
Maybe all of this was an excuse for Putin to get more control over Russia and go after whatever opposition remained?
The thought has crossed my mind the last day (and I wrote as much here). Putin has used unconscionable crises in the past to consolidate power in the past. Even when they have left him weaker in some ways, it was worthwhile in the long run. I do not think it is worthwhile in the long run any longer, but it may have been a big calculation for doing this at all in the first place. Or at least probably not within Putin's lifetime.

But... the moves toward further totalitarianism that he has enacted with this conflict as the background will not be reversed so quickly, even if Russia fully withdraws - even out of Crimea. Unless these protests really do grow, how likely is it that the Duma reverses this ban on fake news? Or relaxes protest laws? Or allows independent media and real political opposition? Or decentralizes security and money and power accumulation in Moscow away from the territories?

Pretty dang unlikely, I think.... No matter what happens in Ukraine.
 

Rokal

Member
Oct 25, 2017
505
Zelensky's Chief of Staff:




Cannot be stressed how lucky we are that this is happening while we have rational, sane, executive branch leadership in the US. This would have been a complete shit show with 45 or another disingenuous Republican in office. All the Kremlin propaganda would be constantly getting signal boosted by American leadership on the national stage.
 

Mentalist

Member
Mar 14, 2019
17,976
But if Bosnia joins NATO, won't ALL OF NATO then pounce on Russia if they try this shit?
Bosnia has a tripartite presidential system that requires consensus to vote on policy.
Republika Srpska has a veto power on any movement towards EU and NATO.

Incidentally, this is the situation Russia wanted to put Ukraine in via reintegrating the occupied Donbass regions as autonomies with a veto power, via the Minsk Agreements.
 

Henrar

Member
Nov 27, 2017
1,905
What's this all about, Russian plane in Poland

X28eDOS.png
Probably "humanitarian" flight as they are still allowed and Russia tries to make all their flights humanitarian. They also supply nuclear fuel to Slovakia

Article in Polish:

Rosyjskie samoloty nad Polską mimo zakazu. "Sankcje dziurawe jak sito"

Rosyjskie samoloty próbują omijać sankcje i ściągają turystów z kurortów pod pretekstem lotów biorących udział w akcji humanitarnej za pośrednictwem zaprzyjaźnionych krajów, m.in. Węgier. Trasy co najmniej dwóch takich lotów wiodły również przez Polskę - dowiedział się Onet. – Specjalne loty...
 

EagleClaw

Member
Dec 31, 2018
10,682
NATO will further strengthen the eastern borders to Russia.




Also again talking about "crimes/war crimes", there is no "easy" off ramp anymore for Putin.
 

Sheepinator

Member
Jul 25, 2018
27,956
Does Bosnia have a lot of tractors?

Cannot be stressed how lucky we are that this is happening while we have rational, sane, executive branch leadership in the US. This would have been a complete shit show with 45 or another disingenuous Republican in office. All the Kremlin propaganda would be constantly getting signal boosted by American leadership on the national stage.
Indeed. It's not just the calm, measured response from the WH. It's also the world united, after 45 spent years undermining NATO, undermining US relations with Europe, sucking up to authoritarians including Putin, and blackmailing Ukraine. We'd be facing another Helsinki moment if 45 was still here. "I spoke to Putin, he says it's just a special operation and they'll be gone soon, and I believe him."
 

Nola

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
8,025
The thought has crossed my mind the last day (and I wrote as much here). Putin has used unconscionable crises in the past to consolidate power in the past. Even when they have left him weaker in some ways, it was worthwhile in the long run. I do not think it is worthwhile in the long run any longer, but it may have been a big calculation for doing this at all in the first place. Or at least probably not within Putin's lifetime.

But... the moves toward further totalitarianism that he has enacted with this conflict as the background will not be reversed so quickly, even if Russia fully withdraws - even out of Crimea. Unless these protests really do grow, how likely is it that the Duma reverses this ban on fake news? Or relaxes protest laws? Or allows independent media and real political opposition? Or decentralizes security and money and power accumulation in Moscow away from the territories?

Pretty dang unlikely, I think.... No matter what happens in Ukraine.
Yep, it's basically been his go-to since coming to power. The guy literally created a false flag early in his first term to do just that
 

CrunchyB

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,107
They will broadcast this on their western facing platforms to make themselves seem neutral or even compassionate to the Ukraine cause, but what really matters is if they broadcast this on their domestic platforms.

Not even what they broadcast, but what they allow to appear on their heavily censored domestic platforms. They allowed a lot of pro-Russia trash on their social media previously.
 

Sheepinator

Member
Jul 25, 2018
27,956


The start of a pivot?

This started yesterday. China came out with strong pro-trade comments, also promoting calm markets, which suggests they favor trade with the West over sanctions for siding with Russia. Their stock market took off yesterday as a result. Also interesting that Lavrov's plane returned to Russia while it was en route to China.

 

FliX

Master of the Reality Stone
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
9,868
Metro Detroit
Official Staff Communication
Stop it with the talk about US elections, we will have plenty of time and fun with that when the time comes in other threads. Not here.
 

Divvy

Teyvat Traveler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,904
Not even what they broadcast, but what they allow to appear on their heavily censored domestic platforms. They allowed a lot of pro-Russia trash on their social media previously.
Yep, China does not want their people to empathize with the Ukrainian people and learn lessons from them about civil unrest. China does not want a EuroMaidan happening anywhere in their borders.
 

mael

Avenger
Nov 3, 2017
16,764
The poster wrote "beacon of meritocracy".
Aren't we in this long haul because the Russian army is such a den of corruption that their army is basically a shell unable to quickly end this conflict?
Like if Ukraine had worse corruption than Russia, it would have folded already because whatever weapon they bought would be sold by people stealing them.
 

EagleClaw

Member
Dec 31, 2018
10,682
China didn't recognise those "people republics", they will not play a role in this conflict.

Maybe they will send rations to Russia, but that is it.

Of course they will use the "bad west" sentiment for their people.
 

smisk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,999
Re: Azov I've never heard a definitive explanation on them, just vauge stuff on Twitter and elsewhere.. If I understand correctly they started out as a nationalist militia group, and at some point became part of the regular military or territorial defense?