• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
  • We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.

Which is the better movie?

  • Revenge of the Sith

    Votes: 493 36.4%
  • The Last Jedi

    Votes: 860 63.6%

  • Total voters
    1,353

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
56,954
Doesn't explain why the guards in front are not attacking his head while he's showing his dominance.

Explains even less why they do decide to attack the saber planted in the ground ... Like if they were intimated they wouldn't attack at all...
It absolutely does... Kylo is very powerful despite his insecurities, and his show of force worked as intended.

The guards are probably shitting it under their helmets when facing him.

Revenge of the Sith is what Star Wars is all about, so that one.
Except...

The PTs are the story of Anakin's fall... and they utterly, 100%, fluffed the journey and landing.
 
Dec 31, 2017
7,098
TLJ is without a doubt the better movie in terms of acting, cinematography, plot. I can understand if people find ROTS more entertaining however, as it is a pretty crazy ride.

00732b63c5675a2e406d835fc257c2c1.gif

This scene was actually incredibly done in the movie.
 

Slaythe

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,852

obin_gam

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,032
Sollefteå, Sweden
What was yoda wearing again ?

How come it was so similar to Obiwan's desert clothes even though he was on a swamp planet ?

And before you answer, keep in mind Anakin's force ghost wears the exact same clothes.

Thanks.
Yoda wore raggedy robes because he was an old man in a swamp...
Iron_Studios_Star_Wars_Episode_V_Yoda_Legacy_Replica_1_4_Statue1_grande.jpg


Obi Wan has desert robes, the same as "og-anakin" becase they both lived on Tatooine.
 

Deleted member 7051

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,254
This just shows how sad the sequel trilogy is so far.

Oh I agree. When the original trilogy released its second movie, we got that amazing first battle between Luke and Vader. The prequel trilogy didn't even wait until the second film to give us a crazy awesome duel, it just threw one at us at the end of The Phantom Menace.

The sequel trilogy hasn't had shit in comparison. The fight at the end of The Force Awakens is amateurish, which is fine since Rey has never held a lightsaber before and Ben is gravely wounded, but what excuse does The Last Jedi have? Instead of having Ben fight Snoke and kill him in battle, we get some lame faceless guards who couldn't even use the Force and we're meant to buy they're a threat?

Rise of Skywalker really has a lot of work to do in that particular topic.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
56,954
I get lots of lightsabers, jedi and sith. I'm content.
That's my favorite aspect about Star Wars, it's why I hope we really are getting that KOTOR movie
Without meaning to be rude, you're only in it for the aesthetic?

I just don't get people's love for the PT when they utterly fuck up Anakin's fall which is the entire point...
 

Genryu

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
954
How do Anakin and Obi-Wan even fight in RotS when they should have died being that close to lava?
 

Foxnull

Alt-Account
Banned
May 30, 2019
1,651
Oh, then there's this masterfully crafted scene. How could I forget? The whole damn theatre cringed at that moment. What's this then, another small hiccup?
 

.exe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,230
ROTS was campy as hell, but I enjoyed it. Great performance by Ewan, and McDiarmid hamming it up will never not make me smile.

Similarly, Daisy Ridley and Adam Driver are great in TLJ. I think some of the highs from TLJ are higher than ROTS (outside of Obi-wan's brutal killshot on Anakin). But I was not really into like half that movie though. Felt like it spread itself a little thin.

ROTS gets the edge. Mostly because... feelings, not advanced cinematic analysis.
 
Last edited:
Dec 31, 2017
7,098
It's a cool scene. With several hiccups that you can draw attention to with looping gifs. That's the point.

Who gives a fuck about looping gifs. Take the scene in its totality, just like Obi vs. Anakin should be taken in its totality. You can take apart any sword fight choreography if you zoom in and slow down. The looping gif of Anakin vs. Obi is funny, but that's not the main problem with that fight - overall all of the hits are light and lack impact. They seem more like they are touching their sabers together as a dance.

Overall the choreography and fights in TLJ have been far superior. The throne room was incredibly tense and well executed. I like Obi vs. Anakin actually, but the general manner in which sword fighting was choreographed in the PT lacked any sort of "oomph" and intention - this really took away from the fight. The ST improved upon that greatly.
 

Deleted member 7051

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,254
I get lots of lightsabers, jedi and sith. I'm content.
That's my favorite aspect about Star Wars, it's why I hope we really are getting that KOTOR movie

At this point, the closest thing we get to that is those The Old Republic cinematics. Which is kinda everything I'd want from a Star Wars movie, if I'm honest. That trailer with Vaylin proves you could make a movie with epic lightsaber duels, crazy Force shenanigans and still have compelling characters.
 

matrix-cat

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,284
I just hate the loop of the ROTS fight when it's literally 0.2% of the whole fight. So that's a taste of their own medicine.

That's absolutely fair. Judging fight scenes by gifs is a really bad way of going about it, full stop. They're typically cropped to the wrong aspect ratio, zoomed in on and endlessly looping whatever the creator wants to shit on, missing frames or running at the wrong speed, and obviously missing sound which is one of the most crucial elements of an action scene.

To give an example of how misleading gifs can be, take the famous Force Kick from ROTJ:

source.gif


Awful. How could they just leave it in the movie, right there in the middle of the frame, right? Except when you actually watch the scene at the right aspect ratio, with the preceding shot included to establish that your eyes are naturally going to be following movement from the right to the left of the screen...

giphy52j4w.gif


You can still see it if you know what you're looking for, obviously, but you can see how the first gif misrepresents the actual scene. And I'm aware of the irony of using a gif to argue against using gifs. If you watch the actual scene without any looping it's even less noticeable again (this one isn't in the right aspect ratio either, but I'm doing my best :P:




tl;dr you can ruin any fight scene with bad gifs. People are still going to use the Russian bootleg ones in the next TLJ thread, though :P
 

AgentLampshade

Sweet Commander
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,310
I've been wondering why there's so many Star Wars threads lately, but then I remembered the fucking movie is out like this month haha. Completely slipped my mind.
 

Slaythe

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,852
He is outnumbered and also half-focused on Rey....

Then maybe planting your sword in the ground and becoming defenseless isn't a right idea....

Anyway it's clear that was a missing cue, the stunt was supposed to attack sooner and Kylo would have deflected, as opposed so Kylo planting the sword and the guard attacking the saber instead of his face.
Yoda wore raggedy robes because he was an old man in a swamp...
Iron_Studios_Star_Wars_Episode_V_Yoda_Legacy_Replica_1_4_Statue1_grande.jpg


Obi Wan has desert robes, the same as "og-anakin" becase they both lived on Tatooine.

Lol. Yeah of course.

So Anakin, as a force ghost, after coming back to the light side of the force and taking the appearance he had as a Jedi Knight (since he regrew limbs, hair, removed scars, picked new clothes etc...), decided to ... pick tatooine farm clothes. (that happen to be identical to Obiwan's !)

And yoda just happened to wear very similar rags with the same color palette.


It does not, but the point of "who fucking cares" remains.

I think the "emotion" and "stakes" in ROTJ are beyond fighting "random guards". The point about cinematography is subjective, to each his own.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
56,954
Then maybe planting your sword in the ground and becoming defenseless isn't a right idea....

Anyway it's clear that was a missing cue, the stunt was supposed to attack sooner and Kylo would have deflected, as opposed so Kylo planting the sword and the guard attacking the saber instead of his face.
He was mostly distracted later.

And no, it's not a missing cue. It's Kylo throwing a battle tantrum and his rage and power holding his opponents back for a moment.

And he as not defenless ever, he has the force and they do not.
 

OfficerRob

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,101
Well this one is easy. The prequels are the three worst Star Wars films (yes, worse than Solo, which is the fourth worst), so TLJ easily. ROTS is the best of the prequels, but that's not saying much.
 

obin_gam

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,032
Sollefteå, Sweden
So Anakin, as a force ghost, after coming back to the light side of the force and taking the appearance he had as a Jedi Knight (since he regrew limbs, hair, removed scars, picked new clothes etc...), decided to ... pick tatooine farm clothes. (that happen to be identical to Obiwan's !)
I'm talking OG Anakin = Sebastian Shaw though. He takes the appearance of a "clean" Anakin, and the tatooine robes were just that - that's his home clothes.
 

Hamchan

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
4,966
TLJ is a better movie but ROTS is the one I'm more likely to watch again and again.
 

hidys

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
1,794
The poll has decided.

TLJ > ROTS

The question is finally settled for good and there won't be any more arguments about it on the internet ever.
Let's face it.

All Star Wars discussions from now until the end of time will eventually turn into a debate about The Last Jedi.

This will continue even when IX comes out.
 

Rassilon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,589
UK
Let's face it.

All Star Wars discussions from now until the end of time will eventually turn into a debate about The Last Jedi.

This will continue even when IX comes out.
I remember when folk endlessly screamed at each other about TFA.

The chalice was passed to TLJ, and it will pass again to TRoS.
 

Jawmuncher

Crisis Dino
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
38,500
Ibis Island
Without meaning to be rude, you're only in it for the aesthetic?

I just don't get people's love for the PT when they utterly fuck up Anakin's fall which is the entire point...

Star Wars is one of those IPs where I greatly enjoy the universe and side content more than the "main story" because there's so much there. ROTS feels like a SW comic book on the big screen and I love that.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
56,954
Star Wars is one of those IPs where I greatly enjoy the universe and side content more than the "main story" because there's so much there. ROTS feels like a SW comic book on the big screen and I love that.

Gotcha, and fair enough. For me the CGI detracts from the SW magic too much, but I get the appeal of them going all out in showing so many aspects of the universe.

The sequels feel more in-line with the originals to me. The Mandalorian even more so.
 

Khanimus

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
40,210
Greater Vancouver
What's fucking wild is you could have literally ended the fight with this:

rMe_Fb.gif


This is literally the most genuinely interesting part of the entire fight. The first couple minutes of the battle are literally the same left-right exchange between the two of them, and it's fucking weightless and shitty and so fucking boring. So much of this fight feels like them repeating the same five moves again and again and again.

But this bit has some actual fucking character. Anakin choking Obi-Wan with his metal hand, forcing Obi-Wan's own lightsaber to his face. It's sadistic, it's forceful, it's Anakin venting his bloodlust that isn't just twirling like a jackass for 15 minutes. You can build a moment around this. Like, y'know, a movie. Anakin is so fixated on killing the person he hates, he's ignoring how this facility is coming down around him. Obi-Wan could even be trying to warn him. Or Obi-Wan's grasp of the force, not built around hatred for Anakin, enables him to save himself or just end the fight another way. Like, if not this, you would have think Anakin would vent his rage more strongly by literally pinning Obi-Wan to the ground and bashing his face in with his metal hand. Like.. that thing would fucking hurt, wouldn't it? Surely that's a more powerful image of someone venting their hatred than some fancy dance moves.


Instead, Obi-Wan just gives him a little kick in the bum and then they get back to their routine left-right-left-right--counter-spin-right-left-stagger. Well, y'know, until Obi-Wan discovers a hill, a jedi's kryptonite.


Know what movie has a fun externalized conflict of internalized ideas that plays directly into the thematic core of its characters? X-Men: First Class.



As humanity indiscriminately fires upon all the mutants on the beach, X-Men and Brotherhood alike, Magneto stops the attack, and retaliates. As Xavier tries to stop him, it is just two men scuffling on a beach, but every strike Charles lands weakens Magneto's attack. And likewise, every strike Magneto chooses to take upon Xavier only distracts him from his goal of fighting humanity. But as Moira, the sole homo sapien on the beach, tries to strike back against Magneto, Erik inadvertently ends up crippling Charles - one of his own, someone at this point he views as only a misguided brother. And as Magneto is about to exact vengeance on Moira who he blames, Charles pointedly tells Erik it wasn't her fault, but his own.

That shit is literally the fucking conflict between Magneto and Xavier made manifest as Mags wages his war on humankind. It isn't subtle, but it screams about who these characters are and what is happening with them. The theater fucking gasped when Xavier gets hit with the bullet that ultimately cripples him.


Whereas Anakin loses to Obi-Wan because... he over-estimates his vaulting ability?
 
Last edited:

Slaythe

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,852
Well, y'know, until Obi-Wan discovers a hill, a jedi's kryptonite.

Had that argument a bit earlier.

Anakin is the middle of lava, if Obiwan uses force push he dies.
if he tries to counter with force push he dies. (they made the point earlier that they have equal power so it clashes and they both get knocked mad far away)
If he jumps he dies. It's over.
 

Deleted member 7051

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,254
Star Wars is one of those IPs where I greatly enjoy the universe and side content more than the "main story" because there's so much there. ROTS feels like a SW comic book on the big screen and I love that.

It kinda helps that the "side content" like The Clone Wars is pretty amazing stuff with far more entertaining and compelling versions of the prequel trilogy characters than the movies themselves.

Like sure, Anakin's fall to the dark side isn't explained that well in Revenge of the Sith but if you watch The Clone Wars he's basically a ticking time bomb and his fall makes much more sense as a result.

The sequels feel more in-line with the originals to me. The Mandalorian even more so.

Which is a huge problem the sequel trilogy has, actually. Say what you want about the prequel trilogy but it has its own visual identity. It stands out with unique designs and planets and it's less interested in living up to the original trilogy than it is being its own thing while also providing us a look at what would evolve into the Empire later.

The sequel trilogy, though? It has no identity of its own. Everything it does, everything it shows, is just copied from the original trilogy and then made sadder for some reason. Rey is just Luke but more depressing, Stormtroopers are literally just Imperial Stormtroopers except now they're kidnapped and indoctrinated rather than recruited, Ben is just a nerdier version of Vader... the list goes on.

When the sequel trilogy is all said and done, what new ideas will it be remembered for? In what way will it have progressed the galaxy of Star Wars narratively? What will the point have been?
 

Altairre

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,049
The prequel trilogy is good for the memes and that's about it. I will never understand why people go to bat for things like the lightsaber duel between Anakin and Obi-Wan. It's fucking boring, goes on for way too long and requires an investment in a relationship between these characters that we never actually get to see. But Anakin kills a bunch of kids and that's dark and edgy I guess. The Vader "nooooo" at least encapsulates my feelings looking at this poll somewhat accurately.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
56,954
It kinda helps that the "side content" like The Clone Wars is pretty amazing stuff with far more entertaining and compelling versions of the prequel trilogy characters than the movies themselves.

Like sure, Anakin's fall to the dark side isn't explained that well in Revenge of the Sith but if you watch The Clone Wars he's basically a ticking time bomb and his fall makes much more sense as a result.



Which is a huge problem the sequel trilogy has, actually. Say what you want about the prequel trilogy but it has its own visual identity. It stands out with unique designs and planets and it's less interested in living up to the original trilogy than it is being its own thing while also providing us a look at what would evolve into the Empire later.

The sequel trilogy, though? It has no identity of its own. Everything it does, everything it shows, is just copied from the original trilogy and then made sadder for some reason. Rey is just Luke but more depressing, Stormtroopers are literally just Imperial Stormtroopers except now they're kidnapped and indoctrinated rather than recruited, Ben is just a nerdier version of Vader... the list goes on.

When the sequel trilogy is all said and done, what new ideas will it be remembered for? In what way will it have progressed the galaxy of Star Wars narratively?
That's not a huge problem at all, it's the entire point. The PT's "visual identity" is awful CGI dispelling most of the magic of SW. While it does attempt to show a civilization at a higher point, it utterly bumbles it due to the awful CGI and some incredibly bland art direction. It has moments, yes, but it too often looks sterile.

The level of tech in the parts we see in the ST is higher, too, the PT is post-collapse, the FO are remnants of the Empire and the Rebels are ragtag. It makes perfect sense to have similar tech on show. And not only does it fit in lore wise it also retains the magic of the OT.
 

Altairre

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,049
It kinda helps that the "side content" like The Clone Wars is pretty amazing stuff with far more entertaining and compelling versions of the prequel trilogy characters than the movies themselves.

Like sure, Anakin's fall to the dark side isn't explained that well in Revenge of the Sith but if you watch The Clone Wars he's basically a ticking time bomb and his fall makes much more sense as a result.
Man I love the Clone Wars series but it doesn't make the prequels any less shit.
 

Deleted member 7051

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,254
That's not a huge problem at all, it's the entire point. The PT's "visual identity" is awful CGI dispelling most of the magic of SW. While it does attempt to show a civilization at a higher point, it utterly bumbles it due to the awful CGI and some incredibly bland art direction. It has moments, yes, but it too often looks sterile.

The level of tech in the parts we see in the ST is higher, too, the PT is post-collapse, the FO are remnants of the Empire and the Rebels are ragtag. It makes perfect sense to have similar tech on show. And not only does it fit in lore wise it also retains the magic of the OT.

The entire point of the sequel trilogy is to do nothing new? You're really going with that argument?