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bixente

Member
Jan 27, 2019
2,249
I hate rogue lites, roguelikes, rogue likes and I even hate that the makers of these games can't decide on a common way to call them.

But there are few exceptions.

Enter the Gungeon is great. One of the best Bullet-hell games and arcade games I have played.
Hades is this years true GOTY. Absolutely amazing action and art direction and storytelling through death and runs.
Enter The Breach is such a simple and yet deep game. It reminds me of Chess in every single good way.
Slay the Spire is brutal with it's runs but it forces you to get better. You can't play it and be stuck. You just get better. Awesome game.

I have played some that I didn't enjoy
Darkest Dungeons
Crypt of the Necrodancer
Binding of Isaac
Downwell

But I have for some odd reason learned to really enjoy roguelites. Dunno what happened.

So tell me based on these what should I get next? I have Star Renegades waiting on my Switch, which is my main platform, but PC or XSX is ok too.

I recommend Children of Morta. Like Hades it has a great story to go with its gameplay and the pixel work is beautiful. Also the game is narrated by a guy with a David Attenborough esque voice.
 

Timppis

Banned
Apr 27, 2018
2,857
FYI Griftlands has a free demo.
Awesome. I gotta check that out :)

To expand on the above explanation (and yes, the nomenclature is horrendous, and not widely agreed upon), by the most common definition of these terms, roguelike is a genre (like "fighting game", or "first person shooter"), while roguelite is a characteristic (like "multiplayer", or "turn-based"). For example EtG is a twin-stick shooter (genre) that happens to have a roguelite characteristic, just like it has a multiplayer characteristic. Into the Breach is a tactics game (although I can also see the case for "puzzle game") that also happens to have a roguelite characteristic.

Now, based on your likes, I would highly suggest to check:
- Hand of Fate 2, because you liked Slay the Spire. An incredible game where the deckbuilding part is actually the overarching structure rather than the run structure; that is, you make a deck before starting each run, with your deck including not only equipment cards but also quests and encounters. Completing these quest cards unlock more cards, e.g. the next step of the quest, for future runs. The combat is actually action-based and somewhat similar to Batman Arkham games. Available on PC and Switch.

Faster than Light (FTL), because you liked Into the Breach (same devs, you'll even find interface similarities). A multimillion seller and one of my favorite games ever, roguelite or otherwise; it puts you in command of a spaceship jumping from sector to sector, fighting other ships, and upgrading your ship. The most interesting characteristic is its micromanagement of the crew: you don't control the ship directly; you control your crew and move them around your ship to man stations, put out fires, repair hull breaches, fight off invaders, etc. Available on PC and iPad.
Thank you. Those sound intriguing. I have seen FTL being praised quite a bit, but never managed to snatch it. It sounds a lot like one of my favourite board games Space Alert.

I recommend Children of Morta. Like Hades it has a great story to go with its gameplay and the pixel work is beautiful. Also the game is narrated by a guy with a David Attenborough esque voice.
Thank you. I'll check that one out too. I have had some great recommendations.
 

alundra311

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,231
The warehouse allows you to manage your inventory a bit by using pots etc. to synthesize stuff and do other things. The storage facility allows you to sell items directly from its menus if you want. I usually just store all and then withdraw or sell stuff i want or don't need.


If you threw something and it passed through a wall you probably have a bracelet on that allows your thrown items to pass through enemies. It's a useful item if you want to affect multiple enemies with the effects of seals or grass.
Ah, that makes sense. I think I remember having that bracelet on.

Thank you.
 

More_Badass

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,622
To expand on the above explanation (and yes, the nomenclature is horrendous, and not widely agreed upon), by the most common definition of these terms, roguelike is a genre (like "fighting game", or "first person shooter"), while roguelite is a characteristic (like "multiplayer", or "turn-based"). For example EtG is a twin-stick shooter (genre) that happens to have a roguelite characteristic, just like it has a multiplayer characteristic. Into the Breach is a tactics game (although I can also see the case for "puzzle game") that also happens to have a roguelite characteristic.

Now, based on your likes, I would highly suggest to check:
- Hand of Fate 2, because you liked Slay the Spire. An incredible game where the deckbuilding part is actually the overarching structure rather than the run structure; that is, you make a deck before starting each run, with your deck including not only equipment cards but also quests and encounters. Completing these quest cards unlock more cards, e.g. the next step of the quest, for future runs. The combat is actually action-based and somewhat similar to Batman Arkham games. Available on PC and Switch.

Faster than Light (FTL), because you liked Into the Breach (same devs, you'll even find interface similarities). A multimillion seller and one of my favorite games ever, roguelite or otherwise; it puts you in command of a spaceship jumping from sector to sector, fighting other ships, and upgrading your ship. The most interesting characteristic is its micromanagement of the crew: you don't control the ship directly; you control your crew and move them around your ship to man stations, put out fires, repair hull breaches, fight off invaders, etc. Available on PC and iPad.
For me at least, outside of the very obviously roguelike design, it comes down to how the systems-driven and emergent the game is. Like technically Spelunky, Noita, Into The Breach, and FTL would probably fit more in the roguelite category due to being hybrids with rogue elements, but I consider them roguelikes because they allow for that improvisation and learning of systems and emergent unpredictability. Enter The Gungeon or Binding don't have that aspect.
 

Weltall Zero

Game Developer
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
19,343
Madrid
For me at least, outside of the very obviously roguelike design, it comes down to how the systems-driven and emergent the game is. Like technically Spelunky, Noita, Into The Breach, and FTL would probably fit more in the roguelite category due to being hybrids with rogue elements, but I consider them roguelikes because they allow for that improvisation and learning of systems and emergent unpredictability. Enter The Gungeon or Binding don't have that aspect.

The problems with such a distinction is that a) it's quantitative, nor qualitative, and b) as a consequence, it's subjective, not objective. Even if we were to agree on this specific definition, we almost certainly would not on what games fit each category. This makes for a very poor basis to decide whether to use one term or the other on, especially in the context of taxonomizing games.

It's fine to disagree with definitions or what a term should be applied to (see: Smash as a fighting game, Dark Souls as a JRPG), but at some point we have to at least attempt to define them in a way that it's objectively defined in a way that most people (should they adopt that specific definition) would clearly classify items on; otherwise communication, the whole reason for them existing in the first place, breaks down. A definition that leaves it to personal opinion whether each game is a "like" or "lite", conveys no actual useful information in conversation.

Aside from that, the distinction between "roguelike" as a strict genre, and roguelite as a characteristic of a game in potentially any genre, is still necessaty. Using the terms in that way you suggest would necessitate the creation of new terms for these two other meanings (which I'm not necessarily opposed to, if it removes the ambiguity seemingly historically inherent to "roguelite" and "roguelike" :) ).
 

Tim

Member
Oct 25, 2017
441
ADOM is on sale, how does it compare to some of the other recent traditional roguelikes?
 

ara

Member
Oct 26, 2017
13,000
Dungeon of the Endless didn't do much for me, but I like the art style of this one at least.

Looking forward to the even more improved sequels, Dungeon Is Endless and Endlessly Dungeoneering.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,097
Taiwan
You guys don't really understand. I got linked this video without knowing the five Ws and I was thinking is this related to dungeon of the endless?

Watched to end, thought feels like it. When over I saw the dev and I lost my marbles. Hyped!


They're really calling it Endless Dungeon after making a game called Dungeon of the Endless. I get that Endless is a franchise but geeze.
This is maximum confusion GG.
I hope they consider a name change, but definitely looking forward to it. Amplitude's Endless series really has a unique energy behind it.
 

MrCinos

Member
Oct 26, 2017
740
More Tales of Maj'Eyal progress.

Monolith armour, stat-stacking, 1h + off-hand dagger + telekinetic gem, Zombie Mindslayer Insane RL winner is done - https://te4.org/characters/106938/tome/fd58b673-d182-4e24-a362-4660e00441e5

My 2nd Insane rl winner and the 1st build winner of mine where I didn't take the build from a character vault as a template. My first build who did 6, 7 and 8k single damage attacks too. Had easier time clearing High Peak than on my previous Skirmisher winner, but survivability-wise if not for Subcatenous Metallisation prodigy I'd have died quite a few times in the East, lol. Then again, I might have not played as recklessly without it. Still, for the past 200+ hours of in-game time I often thought of making SM prodigy work for me and this build was the first where I felt like I wasn't gimping myself with it. Now I can forget about it and move on, lol.

Last fight, though, took me more time than on Scirmisher. I didn't realize that I've been healing one of the bosses with my blight damage Frenzied Focus and Retch. Oh, well, had a lot of fun with the build and if I to change something:
Thermal Shield 5/5 => 1-2/5
Kinetic Aura 2/5 => 1/5
Pyrokinesis 1/5 => 5/5

As for Generic Talents, I should probably have went for:

Dagger mastery 2/5 => 1/5
Retch 3/5 => 1/5
Quick as Thought 1/5 => 4-5/5 getting one more point by sacrificing either 1 point from Danger Sense or Form and Function.

I left Quick as Thought as 1/5 because I thought I won't have muchPpsi due to -70% fatigue from Monolith armour, but after I leveled voracity talents from 1 to 3 near/at 50 lvl, I stopped having any psi problems.
 

Arturo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
521
Sooo I've been playing Rogue on my mac… on the Terminal (iTerm 2, to be more exact), and it's fantastic. I love the simplistic look of it, it can't be more barebones than that. I know I can play the DOS version using Boxer, but the Terminal version has a certain charm to it and it let's me play quick games while waiting for some processes to finish… :P


3f8dMID.png

A bit later I died due to starvation btw… XD
 

Zissou

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,887
Can anybody comment on the current state of Griftlands? It looks really interesting, but I'm debating whether to wait until it's out of early access. The most recent stuff I can find from Klei indicates they had planned to hit 1.0 late 2020, but the window is closing on that pretty fast.
 

Zissou

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,887
It's like 90% done, Just the third character's last day content is still missing. The first two characters are 100% done.

What's the structure of the game (in terms of the characters)? Like is each one compartmentalized, so I could play the first two while holding off on the third until they're done?
 

spineduke

Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
8,745
What's the structure of the game (in terms of the characters)? Like is each one compartmentalized, so I could play the first two while holding off on the third until they're done?

Yes totally. I highly recommend it - its very unique in how you have to manage social elements that can have consequences in and out of combat. Befriending the right faction can come in useful in a job where you may unexpectably encounter them. Social links unlock powerful abilities, so you'll have to balance your agenda with which links you want to preserve.
 

Zissou

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,887
Yes totally. I highly recommend it - its very unique in how you have to manage social elements that can have consequences in and out of combat. Befriending the right faction can come in useful in a job where you may unexpectably encounter them. Social links unlock powerful abilities, so you'll have to balance your agenda with which links you want to preserve.

Awesome— thanks to both of you for the info. Will be picking it up soon then!
 

spineduke

Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
8,745
Has anyone played Stoneshard? It looks fantastic, but would like to hear more from people



y9dZQAt.gif
 
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butzopower

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,856
London
Sooo I've been playing Rogue on my mac… on the Terminal (iTerm 2, to be more exact), and it's fantastic. I love the simplistic look of it, it can't be more barebones than that. I know I can play the DOS version using Boxer, but the Terminal version has a certain charm to it and it let's me play quick games while waiting for some processes to finish… :P


3f8dMID.png

A bit later I died due to starvation btw… XD

BTW brogue is also available via homebrew if you want another terminal RL.
 

Shodan14

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
9,410
Where all them roguelike deals at?

Has anyone played Stoneshard? It looks fantastic, but would like to hear more from people



y9dZQAt.gif

It's probably the roguelike with the most accessible UI to date. It's fun at the moment and updated pretty rapidly, but a lot of the main systems are still missing so it's more like a fun tech demo currently. Which isn't too bad, because dying it real easy. Probably a good gateway roguelike and nice if you like keeping up with the game as it's getting done.
 

Zissou

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,887
Picked up Griftlands— played through the story of the first character and managed to win, and then had a run with the second character where I died to what I assume was the final boss. Very cool/interesting game, but I wish the runs weren't so long. The failed run with the second character was at least four hours or something, but for my tastes, I like runs that are like 30 min, with an hour or something being the upper limit.
 

Klyka

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,423
Germany
Has anyone played Stoneshard? It looks fantastic, but would like to hear more from people



y9dZQAt.gif

Game is gonna be fantastic when finished. Already has a lot of fun stuff in it but it's still so small compared to what they want to accomplish.
I specifically bought it to support the devs and help them realize their intention
 

spineduke

Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
8,745
Where all them roguelike deals at?


It's probably the roguelike with the most accessible UI to date. It's fun at the moment and updated pretty rapidly, but a lot of the main systems are still missing so it's more like a fun tech demo currently. Which isn't too bad, because dying it real easy. Probably a good gateway roguelike and nice if you like keeping up with the game as it's getting done.
Game is gonna be fantastic when finished. Already has a lot of fun stuff in it but it's still so small compared to what they want to accomplish.
I specifically bought it to support the devs and help them realize their intention

Yeah I decided to wait on it - all the comments about balance made me realize I'm not ready to be jostled around, rather just have a smooth time with the game from day one.
 

Klyka

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,423
Germany
Yeah I decided to wait on it - all the comments about balance made me realize I'm not ready to be jostled around, rather just have a smooth time with the game from day one.
If you look at the roadmap, they want to release the "City of Gold" update in Q2 of this year.
That's the one that will add the caravan mode, the global map mode etc... to the game which are basically THE big systems of the game.
So that's the update to keep an eye on.
Also, try out the free demo!
It's a kinda tutorial/scripted prologue to the game's story and is REALLY well done.
 

1upsuper

Member
Jan 30, 2018
5,485
Loop Hero, the Devolver game they showed off recently at TGS 2020, is looking really good. Some journalists published really positive impressions recently which makes me hope it will come out soon.

Here's the old reveal trailer:
 

Cugel

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Nov 7, 2017
4,412
Game is gonna be fantastic when finished. Already has a lot of fun stuff in it but it's still so small compared to what they want to accomplish.
I specifically bought it to support the devs and help them realize their intention
That looks great! Where can I learn more about it?
 

Lulu

Saw the truth behind the copied door
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
26,680
So Skul is out on 1.0, any impressions? Also a big update for Rogue Legacy 2 is supposed to drop any day, probably will jump in when it does.
 

Weltall Zero

Game Developer
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
19,343
Madrid
Loop Hero, the Devolver game they showed off recently at TGS 2020, is looking really good. Some journalists published really positive impressions recently which makes me hope it will come out soon.

Here's the old reveal trailer:


You can actually download and play Loop Hero's alpha version for free on itch.io:
I've played a bit of it and it seems interesting. It's much more of a roguelite than it is an "idle game"; sure, the game has your character fight automatically, but so did Half Minute Hero. You get stuff after each (very short) fight that you want to either equip or place in the map right away, to either improve your hero's stats, or spawn more enemies to fight.
 

EdibleKnife

Member
Oct 29, 2017
7,723
Loop Hero, the Devolver game they showed off recently at TGS 2020, is looking really good. Some journalists published really positive impressions recently which makes me hope it will come out soon.

Here's the old reveal trailer:

There's also a good 20 minute playthrough from Easy Allies:


Definitely in the top 5 of my most anticipated for 2021
 

Karlinel

Prophet of Truth
Banned
Nov 10, 2017
7,826
Mallorca, Spain
Hi, I'm a recent adept at roguelitin' and I was considering my options for both ps5/xbox. I like Dead Cells, Children of Morta and Everspace (I guess I like the combat style), is there any other accessible roguelike with permanent progression you'd recommend?
 

spineduke

Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
8,745
Hi, I'm a recent adept at roguelitin' and I was considering my options for both ps5/xbox. I like Dead Cells, Children of Morta and Everspace (I guess I like the combat style), is there any other accessible roguelike with permanent progression you'd recommend?

Maybe its obvious, but still worth mentioning - Hades?
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,025
I use to play a roguelike back in the day, I think the name was Epona? I think it was originally japanese but got translated. Anyone know what I am talking about?