RLTTP: BOTW. This is next-generation game design.

[Vex]

BOTW. This damn Zelda game is incredible. They just throw you into an open world with minimal hints and off ya go.

"Can I pick this up?"

"Can I set this on fire?"

Can I now CARRY this object that is on fire?

Ok now I'M on fire. Can I wash this off?

OMG I can chop down ANY tree?

I wonder if I can shoot this apple out of the air - OH SHIT?!

I can surf on my shield?

I can throw my weapons?


...and more OH SHIT, THAT ACTUALLY WORKS! feelings.

And for hours this keeps happening. All of the physics and gameplay systems interacting with each other. You can tell there is a lot of stuff under the hood with his game. To me, this is next generation. You gave me a ton of tools and just let me try whatever I want to solve my problems. The ultimate sandbox. Divinity original sin also gets a shoutout here as well for letting you go to town with all of elemental abilities and tricks. The fact that the game seems balanced across all of these abilities and systems is just amazing to me. I just got my first horse and went to meet that old lady btw to let you know where I am at.

Oh, and the game looks incredible. I am still early on but this could very well be.... *the best looking game I have EVER seen in my entire life (see disclaimer). You have to see it in motion to believe it. The art-style is STRONG AF. And to me the grass is so impressive. Every grass blade looks so good in motion.

My only peeve is that weapons break a *bit* too quick, but I am unsure if that has to do with me doubling the framerate or not? I get what they were trying to do. They wanted you to throw the weapon for big damage/stun after you were through with it (like SUPERHOT), but man... sometimes you get a cool looking weapon and just wanna hang on to it a bit longer ya know?

Also, no in-game recipe book for cooking is a disaster.

Jesus. Nintendo gamers got it made, man. WOW, you guys have been living good haha! If we could get more games to have interactivity on a level like this... WEW!

*Disclaimer: I am running BOTW @ 4k60. So my experience may be slightly different from others.

 

[Deleted member 8752]

It's a rare example of when everything comes together to offer something that is so much greater than the sum of its parts. The systems are so densely layered on top of each other, but so natural at the same time so that you don't even know most of them are there until you discover them for yourself.

Like, I put 200 hours into BotW and I didn't even realize you can shoot an apple with your arrow until you posted it in the OP. That's how deep the well goes. There's seemingly always more detail to uncover, and most of it brings a smile to your face when you figure it out for yourself.

 

[ASilentProtagonist]

No open world has come close to it for me yet, the exploration and sense of discovery is second to none. The gameplay systems compliment each other extremely well, and the game is just a joy to play. Brilliant game design all around!

I think Elden Ring will be the next one to do open world extremely well, and will be breath of fresh air. Excited to see Fromsoftware's take on the genre.

i'm so bored with questions marks on maps and collecthons in Western open world games. The Ubisoft formula that almost all of them use sucks..

 

[DailyCalmSpirit]

I'm genuinely jealous of reactions like this.

Like, I look at that list of things you can do, and, I acknowledge that it's cool, but, I just see them and I just wish there was a reason for me to do any of it. Like, if you could have all of that, but, also with an interesting story that gives any action you do in the game a purpose, I'd be right on board. Otherwise to me it just looks like a list of stuff you can do for no reason.

But, as I say, I honestly wish I could appreciate it like so many of you do. Just makes me feel like a curmudgeon.

 

[Anteo]

re: weapon durability, early game weapons break a bit too quickly, late game weapons last for too long to the point you have to throw them away yourself to pick up new stuff.

also, rlttp? your are both late and returning to the party?

 

[lucionm]

I wonder if it is possible to BoTW2 to overcome the original
Even with better technological resources (more memory, etc.)

Can they replicate the magic ??

 

[808s & Villainy]

I think it's because we have very few sandbox games that actually try and simulate the various physical systems BOTW does, very few physics driven games of its scale, and even really no other open world games that try and do all that aside from...Far Cry 2 (I haven't played it, but I've heard it's similarly very interactive). It's priorities compared to other open world games made it INCREDIBLY unique. And in general Zelda games have always been more about problem solving than others and this took it to the next level by extending that to all aspects of the world/combat

Like, I look at that list of things you can do, and, I acknowledge that it's cool, but, I just see them and I just wish there was a reason for me to do any of it. Like, if you could have all of that, but, also with an interesting story that gives any action you do in the game a purpose, I'd be right on board. Otherwise to me it just looks like a list of stuff you can do for no reason.

Click to shrink...

It's a game about exploration and the story is set up so that it unfolds as a reward for exploration. If that isn't what you look for in a game, specifically how gameplay and narration are in relation to one another, then I can see why you wouldn't enjoy it as much

 

[Estarossa]

Other developers just don't have the vernacular/nintendo magic, sadly.

 

[Deleted member 2254]

BOTW is a great game, although it bored me after a while with its incredible slowness. This level of interaction and "in-game" logic isn't really nothing new, though. Look at Minecraft where, likewise, you can interact/destroy/build everything. Fire can run over an entire village. Water can flood an entire cave. Weapons break. You can combine potions and such. That's how open world survival games roll. What's surprising is Nintendo succeeding in throwing a Zelda game in that formula and still make it work without ruining what makes the franchise so iconic and liked. It's no small feat taking something like ARK and Minecraft and turning it into an effective Zelda game.

 

[Yuntu]

I'm genuinely jealous of reactions like this.

Like, I look at that list of things you can do, and, I acknowledge that it's cool, but, I just see them and I just wish there was a reason for me to do any of it. Like, if you could have all of that, but, also with an interesting story that gives any action you do in the game a purpose, I'd be right on board. Otherwise to me it just looks like a list of stuff you can do for no reason.

But, as I say, I honestly wish I could appreciate it like so many of you do. Just makes me feel like a curmudgeon.

Click to shrink...

That's kinda me. Though I have that issue with the entire franchise, I love all its ideas but I don't care about the worlds they are put in. It's slightly different from your perspectiv but stuff like Origami King shows me that I love the ideas in Action Adventure games ala Zelda and just need them be put into context I care about.

Please no one take this as me shitting on the game, I am jealous that I can't get into it (and the franchise as a whole behind it).

 

[Deleted member 54292]

I think you nailed why it feels so fun to just play around in the world. The game begs you to question the possibilities. I remember seeing a big boulder that looked as if I could push it in such a way that it maybe would roll down a hill and hit a Hinox. Gave it a shot. It went as planned and took like half his health. So good.

 

[Tora]

Yeah this game is an example of "next gen" gameplay and it was made with a Wii U in mind lol

 

[WestEgg]

I wonder if it is possible to BoTW2 to overcome the original
Even with better technological resources (more memory, etc.)

Can they replicate the magic ??

Click to shrink...

I think it's less likely they replicate the magic and more likely they just go for a different kind of magic, like OoT to MM.

 

[Dphex]

Other developers just don't have the vernacular/nintendo magic, sadly.

Click to shrink...

In BOTW the Nintendo magic evaporates after leaving the plateau though. the game is empty, you know what you will find(shrines/seeds) and
i don´t think this game has next generation game design at all.

between the "watching the green circle" climbing sessions, cooking some portions for 15minutes, snack size mini riddles in form of the shrines and lackluster dungeons, this game continues to be one of the most overrated games of all time and the praises this game gets are nothing short of overblown.

 

[gunlovefiction]

botw saved my marriage

 

[SunBroDave]

Immersive Sims in general have and continue to be the best impressively designed games available, so seeing Zelda start to incorporate those elements into a Skyrim-like experience was incredible. Cyberpunk 2077 looks to be the next game to release with these sorts of elements

 

[808s & Villainy]

Look at Minecraft where, likewise, you can interact/destroy/build everything. Fire can run over an entire village. Water can flood an entire cave. Weapons break. You can combine potions and such. That's how open world survival games roll.

Click to shrink...

You mean that's how a whole 2 games out of dozens roll. There's a reason Minecraft is also as popular as it is, and it isn't because there are tons of games in similar genres doing the same thing. Many games use bits and pieces of these systems in smaller sections, but few combine them all in massive open worlds because that tends to lead to players "breaking" the game. For Minecraft, that's the point, but for BOTW which is very much a crafted world, it's still pretty unique

 

[Transistor]

BotW with the Pro HUD is open world done right. Best open world experience since Morrowind.

 

[Wreckord Collection]

I'm genuinely jealous of reactions like this.

Like, I look at that list of things you can do, and, I acknowledge that it's cool, but, I just see them and I just wish there was a reason for me to do any of it. Like, if you could have all of that, but, also with an interesting story that gives any action you do in the game a purpose, I'd be right on board. Otherwise to me it just looks like a list of stuff you can do for no reason.

But, as I say, I honestly wish I could appreciate it like so many of you do. Just makes me feel like a curmudgeon.

Click to shrink...

Same. I love the systems at play in BOTW, but after completing it I don't really have any reason to go do some of the things the OP posted. Cool to know they're there, but... [shrug]

If BOTW is this gen's OOT, I'm sitting here waiting for Majora's Mask: something that uses the same tech for something a little more creatively fulfilling.

 

[DrDeckard]

Zelda breath of the wild is the proof to me that a game does not need "next gen" graphics to be truly next gen.

I don't think I have genuinely felt anything like I did playing BOTW in my adult years, no hyperbole. I feel for anyone that didn't get hit with the same majestic vibes I did.

 

[Deleted member 18161]

It's a rare example of when everything comes together to offer something that is so much greater than the sum of its parts. The systems are so densely layered on top of each other, but so natural at the same time so that you don't even know most of them are there until you discover them for yourself.

Like, I put 200 hours into BotW and I didn't even realize you can shoot an apple with your arrow until you posted it in the OP. That's how deep the well goes. There's seemingly always more detail to uncover, and most of it brings a smile to your face when you figure it out for yourself.

Click to shrink...

Great post. It was certainly more "next gen" in terms of it's wealth of physics systems, it's systemic World and how they all come together than anything I've played on PS4/XB1.

I hope many more PS5/SeriesX games take these systems and add them into their incredibly stunning looking games with great narratives. The best of both Worlds. I have faith that Horizon II might nail it.

What specs do you have to run it at 4k/60? Also is it a pain to make an iso of the WiiU disc? I'd need to buy one as I only have it on Switch or do I already own a license to the game? The law is confusing lol.

 

[Deleted member 37739]

Reading the list in the OP, I wonder if BotW is a lot people's first Zelda game.

I had a lot of fun with the game, but these kind of systems have been part of the Zelda DNA for decades now and it's what always made the series unique for me. That they were so cleverly translated into an open world setting is impressive, but I really can't imagine an open world Zelda without it - more than dungeons or captive princesses it's the moment to moment lifeblood of the entire franchise.

 

[Transistor]

Zelda breath of the wild is the proof to me that a game does not need "next gen" graphics to be truly next gen.

I don't think I have genuinely felt anything like I did playing BOTW in my adult years, no hyperbole. I feel for anyone that didn't get hit with the same majestic vibes I did.

Click to shrink...

Kind of a tangent here, but I highly suggest you play The Outer Wilds. It has that same "thrown into the world have to find my way" feel.

 

[-Le Monde-]

You really should play Death Stranding too.
A mix of these two games would be mind blowing for traversal, and exploration.

 

[Lobster Roll]

I'm genuinely jealous of reactions like this.

Like, I look at that list of things you can do, and, I acknowledge that it's cool, but, I just see them and I just wish there was a reason for me to do any of it. Like, if you could have all of that, but, also with an interesting story that gives any action you do in the game a purpose, I'd be right on board. Otherwise to me it just looks like a list of stuff you can do for no reason.

But, as I say, I honestly wish I could appreciate it like so many of you do. Just makes me feel like a curmudgeon.

Click to shrink...

If your friends ask you to go on a hike, do you need a plaque at the top that explains the history and lore of the mountain? It's a game about going into an open, fantasy world and exploring. The story is your own to write.

 

[papercan]

I'm genuinely jealous of reactions like this.

Like, I look at that list of things you can do, and, I acknowledge that it's cool, but, I just see them and I just wish there was a reason for me to do any of it. Like, if you could have all of that, but, also with an interesting story that gives any action you do in the game a purpose, I'd be right on board. Otherwise to me it just looks like a list of stuff you can do for no reason.

But, as I say, I honestly wish I could appreciate it like so many of you do. Just makes me feel like a curmudgeon.

Click to shrink...

I'm in a similar boat, huge zelda fan and loves almost all entries.
If they just took all that stuff and made you use those tools and capabilities in some proper themed dungeons and temples then i'd be happy. It got too old too quickly for me once i realised that all the enemies would be the same in each region and all the dungeons would look the same, the poor story didn't help much either.
It has the base set for an incredible game which i'm hoping the sequel will be able to achieve because they can re-use the engine and a lot of existing assets freeing up more time for the story and variety.
Shrink the world by 50%, add more variety in enemies and bring back some dungeons with themes.

 

[Acido]

Best game of all time periodt !

 

[DailyCalmSpirit]

If your friends ask you to go on a hike, do you need a plaque at the top that explains the history and lore of the mountain? It's a game about going into an open, fantasy world and exploring. The story is your own to write.

Click to shrink...

I mean, BotW isn't a co-op game and I don't go on hikes, so, not sure what to tell ya ;)

 

[Techno]

BotW with the Pro HUD is open world done right. Best open world experience since Morrowind.

Click to shrink...

100% agreed, that's how I played the entire game even on my first playthrough.

Amazing game. My bro who doesn't even play games generally, played and finished this game.

 

[dynamitejim]

I'll never understand the fascination with physics-based gameplay. It always seems so gimmicky. Give me well thought out scenarios/action set pieces, tight combat, and interesting readable/pattern based AI any day of the week.

That said, the overworld in BOTW is amazingly designed. Maaaaybe 20% too big for it's own good.

 

[nanskee]

BOTW is a great game, although it bored me after a while with its incredible slowness. This level of interaction and "in-game" logic isn't really nothing new, though. Look at Minecraft where, likewise, you can interact/destroy/build everything. Fire can run over an entire village. Water can flood an entire cave. Weapons break. You can combine potions and such. That's how open world survival games roll. What's surprising is Nintendo succeeding in throwing a Zelda game in that formula and still make it work without ruining what makes the franchise so iconic and liked. It's no small feat taking something like ARK and Minecraft and turning it into an effective Zelda game.

Click to shrink...

For sure Minecraft is one of the best games last gen, arguably game of the generation. That game is something else, who knew Microsoft buying it for 2b would actually be a steal.

 

[Lobster Roll]

I mean, BotW isn't a co-op game and I don't go on hikes, so, not sure what to tell ya ;)

Click to shrink...

Ok, if you wanted to go on a hike yourself. Same question lol ... but you said you don't go on hikes, so maybe that explains why BOTW may not have resonated with you. It definitely taps into the curiosities that the natural world provides that pull a person from one location to another.

 

[808s & Villainy]

Reading the list in the OP, I wonder if BotW is a lot people's first Zelda game.

Click to shrink...

No other Zelda games have applied these types of systems outside of dungeons on this large a scale. You had the 2D games that sort of did, but the 3D games mainly just had "areas" that were connected through fairly sparse open worlds (Hyrule Field, the ocean, the sky). Skyward Sword made the areas around its dungeon much more involved, but they were still segregated and not seamlessly connected. BOTW changed that

And like I said earlier, I think the game had such an impact because it went for a COMPLETELY different focus when compared to other open world games and the systems they simulated. Many of them attempt to simulate people/behavioral/societal systems. When we speak of interconnectedness it's with quests and if you behave this way to x person it'll affect y person or quest line. Very few focus on physical simulations aside from basic physics.

I'll never understand the fascination with physics-based gameplay. It always seems so gimmicky. Give me well thought out scenarios/action set pieces, tight combat, and interesting readable/pattern based AI any day of the week.

That said, the overworld in BOTW is amazingly designed. Maaaaybe 20% too big for it's own good.

Click to shrink...

Are you saying BOTW didn't have these things? I'd say the shrines were pretty well thought and the AI behaved in fairly reliable and consistent ways

 

[dep9000]

OP, reading your post makes me want to go back and replay Botw from the beginning. So good.

Hopefully we start seeing similar game design in next gen games. It's been long enough from when Botw released that devs can start copying them and implementing similar systems.

 

[DrDeckard]

Kind of a tangent here, but I highly suggest you play The Outer Wilds. It has that same "thrown into the world have to find my way" feel.

Click to shrink...

You just reminded me that I need to get onto that. I played a very short amount and got totally blown away by it. Then for some silly reason I jumped onto some other game and haven't got back to it yet.

Thx for reminding me :)

 

[spacer]

If lack of traditional Zelda dungeons, too much fluff, and a stupid weapon system that makes me hoard all of the cool and interesting weapons rather than use them is "next gen game design" for Zelda, I don't want it. Climbing on anything/everything was great though. I hope that comes back.

 

[DailyCalmSpirit]

Ok, if you wanted to go on a hike yourself. Same question lol ... but you said you don't go on hikes, so maybe that explains why BOTW may not have resonated with you. It definitely taps into the curiosities that the natural world provides that pull a person from one location to another.

Click to shrink...

You could be right, actually. The idea of exploration doesn't come naturally to me. I tend to enjoy Bethesda games for the exploration, though, so, I dunno.

I'm hopeful for the sequel, however!

 

[Cake Boss]

BOTW/Switch saved gaming for me and especially last gen.

 

[PlanetSmasher]

I'm genuinely jealous of reactions like this.

Like, I look at that list of things you can do, and, I acknowledge that it's cool, but, I just see them and I just wish there was a reason for me to do any of it. Like, if you could have all of that, but, also with an interesting story that gives any action you do in the game a purpose, I'd be right on board. Otherwise to me it just looks like a list of stuff you can do for no reason.

But, as I say, I honestly wish I could appreciate it like so many of you do. Just makes me feel like a curmudgeon.

Click to shrink...

I feel kind of the same way. There's tons of cool mechanics, and I like that, but there's no point to actually doing any of the content in the game because of how repetitive and bland it all is. There's nothing actually cool to find, no permanent rewards to really make you feel proud of yourself for going somewhere interesting, etc. It's just a bunch of empty space with a ton of cool systems in it.

 

[Lobster Roll]

If lack of traditional Zelda dungeons, too much fluff, and a stupid weapon system that makes me hoard all of the cool and interesting weapons rather than use them is "next gen game design" for Zelda, I don't want it. Climbing on anything/everything was great though. I hope that comes back.

Click to shrink...

Who told you to hoard anything? If anything, you prevented yourself from obtaining more powerful and more durable weapons by doing this.

 

[Soapbox Killer]

Reading the list in the OP, I wonder if BotW is a lot people's first Zelda game.

I had a lot of fun with the game, but these kind of systems have been part of the Zelda DNA for decades now and it's what always made the series unique for me. That they were so cleverly translated into an open world setting is impressive, but I really can't imagine an open world Zelda without it - more than dungeons or captive princesses it's the moment to moment lifeblood of the entire franchise.

Click to shrink...

I get what you mean but the extent that BOTW elevates this to levels beyond what we have seen in a Zelda game in the past, I don't blame anyone for feeling like this is something else entirely.

Climbing anything with this open air system coupled with the "can I do that...shit yeah" levels of curiosity makes this a very unique experience even for an old salt Zelda player such as myself.

 

[Deleted member 8752]

I'm genuinely jealous of reactions like this.

Like, I look at that list of things you can do, and, I acknowledge that it's cool, but, I just see them and I just wish there was a reason for me to do any of it. Like, if you could have all of that, but, also with an interesting story that gives any action you do in the game a purpose, I'd be right on board. Otherwise to me it just looks like a list of stuff you can do for no reason.

But, as I say, I honestly wish I could appreciate it like so many of you do. Just makes me feel like a curmudgeon.

Click to shrink...

When you were a kid, did you ever pretend to be a hero and go on a grand quest and do a lot of different things to save the world? BotW is kind of like that feeling.

There is no obligation to do any of it other than to defeat the final boss. No checklists, no score, not even stats other than the armor. Just the feeling of actually being on a grand storied adventure.

Not one that is told to you through narrative, but one that you experience through the emergent gameplay, itself.

It is the type of game you will ruin for yourself if you see footage or read too much about it in advance. But if you go in blind, you uncover more and more of these systems, gameplay moments, and landmarks that beg you to just keep going to see what is around the corner, again and again.

It's all about discovery and the journey. Like the opposite of gaming for achievements or platinum trophies.

 

[NPTinker]

Playing any open world game after this felt so bland. Botw was truly an enchanting experience

 

[Titanpaul]

An incredibly well designed (and sometimes fun) playground.

I just wish there was a better game (for me) there.

 

[Maverick14]

In BOTW the Nintendo magic evaporates after leaving the plateau though. the game is empty, you know what you will find(shrines/seeds) and
i don´t think this game has next generation game design at all.

between the "watching the green circle" climbing sessions, cooking some portions for 15minutes, snack size mini riddles in form of the shrines and lackluster dungeons, this game continues to be one of the most overrated games of all time and the praises this game gets are nothing short of overblown.

Click to shrink...

"The game is empty" is one of the worst alternative facts I have ever read. Everywhere you look there is something to do...Korok puzzles to complete...monsters to attack in a myriad of ways subject to your imagination, mysteries and magical areas to uncover, items to collect, animals to hunt or sometimes ride, treasure to find, destinations to spot and travel to, backstory to uncover, villages to find and NPCs to interact with..along with shrines and towers.

I do get that its non linear nature and exploration may not be everyone's cup of tea...but it is the opposite of empty and if you enjoy writing your own adventure there is nothing comes close to its sense of discovery and achievement!

Heres a good point if discussion : Skyrim's traversal is emptier than BOTW's....Discuss.

 

[Thera]

You gave me a ton of tools and just let me try whatever I want to solve my problems.

Click to shrink...

The problem is that there isn't problem to solve with all those "tools". I watched good uses of those tools by speed runner, but for "normal" gameplay, you don't need them.
I really hope it will be a big focus off the sequel, adding puzzles in the overworld.

the exploration and sense of discovery is second to none

Click to shrink...

I have mixed feelings about that.
For exemple, I loved :

Spoiler: location

Everything about releasing The Blue Dragon, or the Forgotten Temple

.
Otherwise, spending 25-30 minutes to a location and having a shrine or an ennemy camp with a bad reward chest gets pretty old quickly for me.

i'm so bored with questions marks on maps and collecthons in Western open world games. The Ubisoft formula that almost all of them use sucks..

Click to shrink...

Yep

 

[Hazzuh]

Thinking of this as "next generation game design" is almost getting the whole concept on its head. This sort of systemic game design is in direct conflict with high visual fidelity, detailed cutscenes etc that people mean by "next-gen". This school of design is incredibly old and well-explored just not in the AAA space. There is a reason so many of the games with the most complex interacting systems use ASCII art (Nethack, Dwarf Fortress) and many of the recent examples are not that visually complex (eg Noita). It is incredibly telling & appropriate that they developed so many of the design concepts for BOTW in a modified version of the Zelda 1 engine.

 

[Deleted member 37739]

No other Zelda games have applied these types of systems outside of dungeons on this large a scale. You had the 2D games that sort of did, but the 3D games mainly just had "areas" that were connected through fairly sparse open worlds (Hyrule Field, the ocean, the sky). Skyward Sword made the areas around its dungeon much more involved, but they were still segregated and not seamlessly connected. BOTW changed that.

Click to shrink...

As I say, I was an impressive translation to the setting and, undoubtedly, quite at odds with the more typical open world approach. The point I'm making is that a Breath of the Wild without those things wouldn't have felt true to the spirit of the series because almost every element listed in the OP are things that have typically defined the world and puzzle design of the previous games in the series.

I love those things - they're so Zelda in my mind - but I wasn't shocked to find them, I'd have been shocked to not find them.

Climbing anything with this open air system coupled with the "can I do that...shit yeah" levels of curiosity makes this a very unique experience even for an old salt Zelda player such as myself.

Click to shrink...

Ah, for me it was sort of similar but I'd do something, find it worked and be like 'yep, that's Zelda logic, alright' - not in a smug way, but in like a sort of fresh but familiar way. It's great, but, like I say, I can't imagine them having done it any other way and it having felt like Zelda.

 

[HylianMaster2020]

BOTW's legacy is it's temples, boss battles etc. that get overlooked, I look at things like sword building, crafting etc. as extra how about those new characters?

 

[PlanetSmasher]

Otherwise, spending 25-30 minutes to a location and having a shrine or an ennemy camp with a bad reward chest gets pretty old quickly for me.

Click to shrink...

Yup. I can't count how many times I was rewarded for 20+ minutes worth of effort with a crappy gem I would never use or a piece of Korok poop or a sword I already had 8 copies of already.