Yup I get it now but I think it was way too quickly explained in the show.
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Rick and Morty S5 |OT| We Still Don't Know Why The Cat Can Talk
- Thread starter Z-Beat
- Start date
- Entertainment OT
Yup I get it now but I think it was way too quickly explained in the show.
This. 1000x times this, theor best episodes all work with the canon or tease stuff, the worst are some nonsense things like the sperm episode, that was terrible
I'm seeing S10E09 and S10E10 on HBO MAX right now as the two latest episodes. Are those the ones that were aired yesterday on [as]? Are those the ones where
appears?
Christopher Lloyd
I don't know why people think the writers don't like lore episodes. Rick complains, but Rick isn't the direct voice of authorial intent. He's wrong about a lot of things a lot of times. He hates lore episodes because they almost always turn out shitty for him.
They almost certainly don't want to constantly be doing them, but I don't think they're nearly as bothered as some of you seem to believe.
They almost certainly don't want to constantly be doing them, but I don't think they're nearly as bothered as some of you seem to believe.
Amazing pair of episodes honestly and a great end to a very, very solid season. I'm glad they kept a lot of the lore simple instead of turning it into this convoluted and protracted endeavor. Evil Morty explaining what makes a Morty feel "evil" to begin with satisfies me more than any other pet theory I've read for his origins. He's this thematic stand in for all Morty's eventually getting sick of Rick's control issues and growing up in spite of him.
him entering that yellow portal at the end is really the first time canonically ANY Morty achieves true agency and is finally free from the nearly-omnipotent control of Rick.
Great fuckin' show right here. I wonder if the writers view this as a soft reboot for the entire series.
him entering that yellow portal at the end is really the first time canonically ANY Morty achieves true agency and is finally free from the nearly-omnipotent control of Rick.
Great fuckin' show right here. I wonder if the writers view this as a soft reboot for the entire series.
Dan Harmon doesn't like doing lore/canon because fans guess/figure it out and ruin it for him. They put too much stock in surprise.
Dan Harmon: "You cannot write payoff-based TV anymore because the audience is essentially a render farm. They have an unlimited calculation capacity. There's no writers' room that can think more than 20 million people who can think about it for an hour a day."
Some writers on the show are so antagonistic to the concept of fan theories that they will actively try to make sure theories fans come up with are false simply for the sake of it.
Mike McMahan: "The fastest way to make sure your Rick & Morty fan theory is wrong is to tell me about it, because then I'll make sure it never happens. I can't guarantee that I'll have the sway to 100% keep it from happening, but I'll try. I'll try until I'm dead. It's no fun if somebody guesses a secret plot line, I'd rather be surprising than prove someone guessed right. Also: I'm a jerk."
I don't think the show writers hate canon, I think it's just an interesting 4th wall character trait that they gave Rick. And if Rick's canon is that his family is killed and he goes to live a meaningless peon life on the Citadel, then it makes sense why instead he tries to fill his life with episodic randomness instead.
yikes. this is partly why westworld went down the shitter.
like... just write a good story? if fans are guessing the outcome, it means well done: you wrote characters who people could understand and follow through to a logical conclusion.
Great finale. The possibility of a wilder multiverse where Ricks aren't dominant is a great conceit; the idea of infinity bound to Rick was always a thing that bothered me but to find it was an ego driven cage created by presumably C-137 is very satisfying.
What a dumb opinion by McMahan, how about you write the story before hand and if people somehow guessed it, it just means you are pretty good in laying the foundation of a story?
I don't mind they think like that or even act on it but being told it straight really bother me during the rant.
And after Central Finite Curve, there is no way the fandom treats every random term as a clue lol.
Yes, it makes sense that Rick conveniently is the most awesome smartest man of the universe because he closed off the possibilities where he isn't. He really is an insecure piece of shit.
Would Rick creating the Portal Gun be considered a Bootstrap Paradox?
Rick C-137 was informed of the existence of a Portal Gun by another, who then kills his Diane and Beth. C-137 then makes the Portal Gun. But what about the other Rick?
Or was Rick always on the path to create it?
Rick C-137 was informed of the existence of a Portal Gun by another, who then kills his Diane and Beth. C-137 then makes the Portal Gun. But what about the other Rick?
Or was Rick always on the path to create it?
OP
OP
No if only because it's a different Rick from a different universe, not the same Rick on a different part of the timeline
Right right.
And the paradox doesn't really apply to universal travel.
Yeah, this is nonsense. What a silly opinion to hold about stories and writing. It's not the destination etc etc etc. and if you want to write a story with a twist or whatever, maybe don't do a serialized show? There are plenty of mediums to tell stories in where a plot twist can work and enhance the story. Limited series, movies, books, etc.
I think more to the point, if people think about your show and guess the story and discuss it? They are going to ruin it for themselves anyway.
Just write the story you want to tell for people who want to enjoy it and fuck the rest.
Didn't C-137 have memories of when Morty was a baby? Where'd those come from if Rick just a universe where he abandoned Beth and came came years later?
I'd explain that away as him voyeuristically looking in on other realities where Beth lived and got to grow up and meet Jerry and have kids, during his murderous depression bender. Maybe even popping into one of those realities while its Rick is out and posing as himself to get to meet Morty as a baby
The finale was amazing.
I think the first episode and the last one are the peaks of this season, with everything in between being a mix of good and bad.
I do understand where the writers are coming from. It must suck the joy of writing and building up a story for years only to have the payoff be spoiled by the internet. I guess that's the world we live in now, but I think as long as the execution is good then most won't mind. Plus the vast majority of the people watching the show don't spend their free time analyzing it to death.
Overall I can't wait to see where it goes next but I just wish we never have an episode as bad as the sperm on again. It makes even the Dragon episode from season 4 look like a masterpiece.
I think the first episode and the last one are the peaks of this season, with everything in between being a mix of good and bad.
I do understand where the writers are coming from. It must suck the joy of writing and building up a story for years only to have the payoff be spoiled by the internet. I guess that's the world we live in now, but I think as long as the execution is good then most won't mind. Plus the vast majority of the people watching the show don't spend their free time analyzing it to death.
Overall I can't wait to see where it goes next but I just wish we never have an episode as bad as the sperm on again. It makes even the Dragon episode from season 4 look like a masterpiece.
So the maverick renegade is revealed to have a hidden backstory that ties them directly into the foundation of their society, while said society is revealed to be even more fucked up than we originally knew and was founded on the torture of children.
I'm guessing Dan Harmon must have really liked the last series of Doctor Who, huh? I mean Rick and Morty has always cribbed a lot from Who, but now they're actively riffing on a currently ongoing (and unfinished) storyline from the show.
Or it's a massive coincidence and Harmon is probably pissed Doctor Who beat him to the punch.
I'm guessing Dan Harmon must have really liked the last series of Doctor Who, huh? I mean Rick and Morty has always cribbed a lot from Who, but now they're actively riffing on a currently ongoing (and unfinished) storyline from the show.
Or it's a massive coincidence and Harmon is probably pissed Doctor Who beat him to the punch.
Ever since season 3 I've felt that the show was a victim of its own success and the slow-burn serialisation is proof of that. It really feels like they had a vague storyline that could have filled 4-5 seasons, maybe 3 on the low end if the show wasn't too popular. But then the show exploded in popularity, and that storyline had to be retooled to cover 10 seasons.
So if we follow the pattern they've used so far, then we'll pick up with Evil Morty again in season 7, then once more with season 9, then finish the show with season 10? All assuming that Adult Swim actually lets the show end and doesn't just order 70 more episodes after the current order is fulfilled.
OP
OP
Thoughts?
Rick and Morty S6 |OT| The Mortyverse of Madness
Rick and Morty S6 |OT| We Can Finally Stop Asking About It
Rick and Morty S6 |OT| It's Canon. All of it.
Rick and Morty S6 |OT| No Way Home
Rick and Morty S6 |OT| The Cinemorty Universe
Rick and Morty S6 |OT| Was The Dipping Sauce Worth It?
Rick and Morty S6 |OT| The Mortyverse of Madness
Rick and Morty S6 |OT| We Can Finally Stop Asking About It
Rick and Morty S6 |OT| It's Canon. All of it.
Rick and Morty S6 |OT| No Way Home
Rick and Morty S6 |OT| The Cinemorty Universe
Rick and Morty S6 |OT| Was The Dipping Sauce Worth It?
Was recovering from All Out... only for this to hit the fan.
Harmon and the others may not like the lore episodes, but it's been the source of their best episodes for the past couple of seasons, especially when it looks like they've been losing their touch with some of the stand-alone episodes. Keeping the show grounded in some sort of consequences from the past is what's going to keep the show fresh going forward.
It felt like the Storyteller episode from season 4 was a diss on that line of thinking and if annoyed me a bit. Some of those ideas could have been great. Hell, I would have loved for them to take a page of Samurai Jack and do an antagonist teamup episode and have it end the same way. It doesn't matter of it's done before or it's cliche because the nature of the show can still make it creative. The idea that the show itself should be above it all has led to some of it's worst episodes like the heist and DnD episodes.
Overall, the ending has me hyped in a way I've never had for this show. Evil Morty may have taken away Ricks' greatest tool and given it to himself. We don't even need to see the payoff to this next season. The ramifications that may happen alone could be enough for season 6.
Harmon and the others may not like the lore episodes, but it's been the source of their best episodes for the past couple of seasons, especially when it looks like they've been losing their touch with some of the stand-alone episodes. Keeping the show grounded in some sort of consequences from the past is what's going to keep the show fresh going forward.
It felt like the Storyteller episode from season 4 was a diss on that line of thinking and if annoyed me a bit. Some of those ideas could have been great. Hell, I would have loved for them to take a page of Samurai Jack and do an antagonist teamup episode and have it end the same way. It doesn't matter of it's done before or it's cliche because the nature of the show can still make it creative. The idea that the show itself should be above it all has led to some of it's worst episodes like the heist and DnD episodes.
Overall, the ending has me hyped in a way I've never had for this show. Evil Morty may have taken away Ricks' greatest tool and given it to himself. We don't even need to see the payoff to this next season. The ramifications that may happen alone could be enough for season 6.
Eh, the way it's presented in the string of memories, it makes more sense that he built the cage to protect himself and his family from threats he couldn't handle. Another smarter Rick killed his family and despite his brilliance he was unable to find him and get revenge. He built the Citadel and the cage after he killed off thousands of Ricks and the survivors begged him to stop. As soon as he was done building it he immediately left to find a family to live with. That doesn't sound like an ego trip.
Fans discussing a show don't ruin it for themselves. Generally the things Harmon and McMahan are afraid of are characteristics of GOOD storytelling. Plots that are ENTIRELY unpredictable can be less satisfying because they have no set-up and can feel like ass-pulls. It's the journey, not the destination; and part of enjoying that journey is discussing it and the destination.
Well, Rick literally got out a situation this episode with a screwdriver that disables technology just by touching it.
I remember an interview with Harmon or someone from the show where they said they were excited about the plots they were developing but they read fan theories and got upset that fans guessed where the plot was going so they decided to just throw it all in the trash. They have a really flawed outlook on fan theories.
They explained the cat:
"The cat subplot was an attempt to just have fun," Harmon told Decider. "The cat represents that voice in your head in the writers room that you're overthinking it."
Considering their dislike of fan theories, it was probably a shot at fans telling them to not overthink it and just have fun, as well. But thinking about things can be fun, and having things be unexplained can detract from fun. Different people like different things.
The writers making back to back plot heavy episodes after making fun of the audience for caring about the plot for several seasons:
(Finale was fun though)
(Finale was fun though)
Yeah, it's really confusing to me to see people saying the show hates canon when they go out of their way to make sure everything fits with callbacks going back to even the very first season.
Wait what? Ok so what were those ads then? Just that? Ads to promote the show? I'm confused.
The writers making back to back plot heavy episodes after making fun of the audience for caring about the plot for several seasons:
(Finale was fun though)
It wasn't just back to back episodes. It was three in a row. The last episode before these two was the Birdperson episode.
Sucks we won't get a follow up to the story line for 3 more years. Next season the canon episodes will be about the galactic government.
The behind the scenes thing at the end made it seem like they genuinely care about the lore and overall plot but:
A. Are afraid of screwing it up in a way that makes fans turn on them.
B. Overdo it and make it impossible to follow for people who aren't super fans.
C. (Not in the BTS but my thoughts previously) Are annoyed about getting bugged about the lore all the time.
The opened universe is interesting but I hope they don't go too crazy with it. The main difference between an open universe and the main universe is that there are more enemies that can challenge Rick, which is fine, but it's also a well that can be ran dry if they go to it too often.
A. Are afraid of screwing it up in a way that makes fans turn on them.
B. Overdo it and make it impossible to follow for people who aren't super fans.
C. (Not in the BTS but my thoughts previously) Are annoyed about getting bugged about the lore all the time.
The opened universe is interesting but I hope they don't go too crazy with it. The main difference between an open universe and the main universe is that there are more enemies that can challenge Rick, which is fine, but it's also a well that can be ran dry if they go to it too often.
I think they want t do more canon episodes but they don't want them to take over the series, so they keep them under several layers of irony and meta so they can keep doing the fun adventures.
That middle season stretch of ep 4-7 was pretty bad, but the rest was quite good. I'm glad that the ending seems to hint they might shake up the formula a bit going forward, because I was starting to worry that the show was running out of new ideas.
I got the impression that Weird Rick (the one who murders Diane and Beth) has been outside of the CFC the whole time, and hence why C-137 could never find him.
He could become a new big bad to replace Evil Morty (and honestly I would be happy to never see him again at this point - he won).
He could become a new big bad to replace Evil Morty (and honestly I would be happy to never see him again at this point - he won).
While i think that rick could be a random asshole who destroyed our rick's life, he definitly could be outside the CFC, where someone else can be the smartest person in the universe. I am curious about all these pre-citadel rick alliances, all of that doesn't need to be in the CFC and maybe that's why he couldn't find the killer. It could be one kind of climax to finally find him, but leaving that behind and moving on is as likley i think.
As for holding off till now for evil morty pay-off, breaking the CFC means there will be universes where someone other than rick can be the smartest, rick can be completly left out of those stories and make a whole different show about evil morty. I can already see the Loki parodies.
Why would the Central Finite Curve protect C-137 from the smarter Rick? The smarter Rick would very likely be in one of those Rick dominated universes that would live inside the Curve. As for protecting Morty's or their families from other things, that doesn't appear to be the point either given what we see in this episode of entire genocide piles of Morty's being used for re-cloning, as well as the manipulation of timelines to ensure a steady supply of Morty's.
Rick doesn't contradict Evil Morty's reasoning about the Curve either; it's a crib to create and tether Morty's to Ricks in order to serve them. He even implicitly admits it by saying Morty's really are bred for forgiveness when Morty apologises to Evil Morty. That is the Curve's purpose.
In general, no. Discussing the story and what everything means and what will happen? Not in every case ... but it is north of 99%
I'm surprised to see multiple times people say the Thanksgiving episode was bad. I loved that one.