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Armaros

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,902
I'll get flak for this I'm sure.

I'm 34 and out of the loop when it comes to streamers, the culture and the pay. I do knownits quite lucrative and these kids are making what seems like massive, life changing amount of money from their parents basements.

From personal experience I was very immature in a sense during my teen years and I'm sure most of us were no different. Most of us pushed the limits, unaware how massive the consequences would be for what seemed a minor risk.

This is no different IMO. The punishment is too harsh. The guys future is turned upside down from this. He should be banned for a good while, 6 months? Followed by a limited access probation period.

He didnt steal, or do anything with obvious malicious longterm intent ( imo, it was a one off stunt for views ) he simply fucked up doing one of a laundry list of TOS things he could have been "banned" for. It's his fault in entirety but the punishment is too harsh.

He literally went ouf of his way to try to shield his main account by using an alt account to cheat on. He knows cheating is against the rules, children know cheating is against the rules.
 

Biske

Member
Nov 11, 2017
8,290
If they're big enough, and they aren't blatantly advertising that they're cheating on their channel, I would think there's already a process in place to warn them and give them a slap on the wrist that others wouldn't get because of the influence they have.

Seriously. If you arent a dumb ass in this world, power and money protects power and money and all you powerful and or monied fucks win.
 

Deleted member 17207

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,208
This reminds me of college seminars where we'd study court cases, and the professor would throw out hypothetical cases in an attempt to drawing on our understanding of prior cases. The lesson I got from that (and granted, I was an undergrad, not a law student) is that in a lot of these cases, even given past settled literature and examples, people could reach radically different conclusions.

There are some details missing in this for me. My instinct, however, is that if you decided to do a second video after being banned once, I'd have a bit less sympathy for you. But if you framed the videos as a journalistic or explanatory exercise, in that case the story might be a bit different. Hard to say.

I'll add this: I genuinely dislike cheaters. I remember being exceedingly frustrated by them when I was a more avid PC gamer. But I don't view one game's worth of frustration as worthy of the disruption of someone's livelihood. If I got aimbotted by someone and then I was given the choice of whether that person should lose their job, I would say no.
He DID do that. He was banned on-stream (as far as I know) on that alternate account, and then went right into another one to continue making these videos of aimbotting - I'm basing this off of what I've read in this thread, so I could be wrong about it. Either way - he made an alternate account in the first place because he was afraid of his main account getting banned. He knew what he was getting into. His claims in his apology video of "if I had known the consequences..." - he did.

And him getting banned from Fortnite wasn't him losing his job. His job is still intact, which is being a Twitch streamer. ANYONE will be banned for cheating on Fortnite, HE chose to make his living playing that game specifically, and did the videos knowing full well what could happen. To me, if I can get banned for cheating, so could he - it just so happens that I only play for fun whereas he was making all of his money off of doing it. Why should our punishments be different for the same crime simply because we chose to play the same game for different reasons?
 

easter

Member
Nov 15, 2017
711
We should listen to ninja. He is the Michael Jordan of video games. What a joke take. The fact that he's famous blows my mind.
 

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
43,385
Grave seriousness? A dude was banned from playing a video game, there's nothing grave or serious about it. This is standard operating procedure for anyone who is caught using an aimbot.
I'm referring to how passionate people on this forum are that he never be allowed to play again. He just made a silly mistake in a video game, who cares.
 

Freezasaurus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,104
We should listen to ninja. He is the Michael Jordan of video games. What a joke take. The fact that he's famous blows my mind.
BrownAdmiredKomododragon-size_restricted.gif
 

Kaeden

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,929
US
I'm referring to how passionate people on this forum are that he never be allowed to play again. He just made a silly mistake in a video game, who cares.
I think a lot of people care if others cheat in a competitive game. You probably know this as well, so it's odd that you find it silly and meaningless.
 

ohitsluca

Member
Oct 29, 2017
731
Is the quoted text in the OP incorrect? If not, I don't see how it's saying what you feel he means.

can you tell me where in the quoted text he says the streamer shouldn't have been banned? He just says the effects of banning someone who makes a living off of the game is different than someone who doesn't, which is inarguably true.

the only place it says he shouldn't get banned is the video and thread title
 

Freezasaurus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,104
lol. What a joke. I'm guessing the majority of his fans are children? Adult fandom can't possibly be true. Brb going to go buy his book. Jesus, this reality...
Considering how bonkers a lot of kids are for Fornite, that's the impression I get. I never got into watching streams aside from when I need a walkthrough for a portion of whatever game I happen to be playing.
 

Deleted member 17207

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,208
can you tell me where in the quoted text he says the streamer shouldn't have been banned? He just says the effects of banning someone who makes a living off of the game is different than someone who doesn't, which is inarguably true.
Did you watch the video?

Even if he doesn't outright say what you're looking for, it's very heavily implied lol.
 

Mikhail Klimentov

Editor at Launcher (Washington Post)
Verified
Oct 31, 2019
11
He DID do that. He was banned on-stream (as far as I know) on that alternate account, and then went right into another one to continue making these videos of aimbotting - I'm basing this off of what I've read in this thread, so I could be wrong about it. Either way - he made an alternate account in the first place because he was afraid of his main account getting banned. He knew what he was getting into. His claims in his apology video of "if I had known the consequences..." - he did.

And him getting banned from Fortnite wasn't him losing his job. His job is still intact, which is being a Twitch streamer. ANYONE will be banned for cheating on Fortnite, HE chose to make his living playing that game specifically, and did the videos knowing full well what could happen. To me, if I can get banned for cheating, so could he - it just so happens that I only play for fun whereas he was making all of his money off of doing it. Why should our punishments be different for the same crime simply because we chose to play the same game for different reasons?

Not sure about the facts of making a second alt so I won't comment on that. If you're right that probably alters my thinking somewhat.

I think my final point on the matter is that yes he's still a streamer (though that sidesteps the fact that he was a competitive Fortnite player too) but the punishment is a bit more severe because he cannot play Fortnite again, whereas a casual player could create a new account with relative ease. So the punishments aren't really the same, and if we care primarily about an effective punishment for cheating, this doesn't really seem like one. Again, I think this comes down to perspective. Appreciate you chatting it through with me, though!
 

Deleted member 17207

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,208
It is no big deal. Yet people here are so passionate about it happening. I've seen it spread all over the internet too. It's absurd.
It's completely fucking absurd, man - I won't argue with you there. But you're also on a video game forum where people very passionately discuss anything related to video games. One could easily say that's absurd, too.

Not sure about the facts of making a second alt so I won't comment on that. If you're right that probably alters my thinking somewhat.

I think my final point on the matter is that yes he's still a streamer (though that sidesteps the fact that he was a competitive Fortnite player too) but the punishment is a bit more severe because he cannot play Fortnite again, whereas a casual player could create a new account with relative ease. So the punishments aren't really the same, and if we care primarily about an effective punishment for cheating, this doesn't really seem like one. Again, I think this comes down to perspective. Appreciate you chatting it through with me, though!
For sure. One final thing I want to say about the bolded text here: I've (very stupidly, no good explanation for it as there isn't one) spent my hard-earned cash on skins and stuff in Fortnite - which I'd lose if I was caught cheating and my account was banned. Although that's not quite the same as losing my livelihood, there's still a pretty big loss for me there - especially since I'm not a 17-year old millionaire lol.

Nice chattin'.
 

dom

▲ Legend ▲
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
10,477
This poster said it better than me:

The fact that he's losing his livelihood has nothing to do with Epic Games, Fortnite, etc. It's just the game he chose to stream on Twitch, which is how he makes his money. Twitch hasn't banned him, Epic Games/Fortnite has. Epic will ban anyone who is caught cheating - and that's pretty standard across all online games as far as I know. It's on this kid that he chose to make his living on Twitch playing this particular game, and then cheated knowing full well that he wasn't only putting his Fortnite gaming on the line, but his career.
He didn't do this on Twitch b/c twitch would have also banned him. It's against their ToS to cheat in online multiplayer games.
 
Oct 25, 2017
8,115
A person who promotes cheat programs by streaming it to possibly millions of people doesn't deserve the ban as much as some nobody playing the game? Ok, Ninja.
 

ohitsluca

Member
Oct 29, 2017
731
Did you watch the video?

Even if he doesn't outright say what you're looking for, it's very heavily implied lol.

I did and he said explicitly he thinks he should have been banned, but he didn't it should be permanent

which again, is up for debate but not the way his statement is being represented in this thread or the video title
 

Armaros

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,902
Considering how bonkers a lot of kids are for Fornite, that's the impression I get. I never got into watching streams aside from when I need a walkthrough for a portion of whatever game I happen to be playing.

He literally implied that jarvis should not have gotten a permanent ban but its fine if normal players that aimbot get permanent bans, he even called them 'pieces of shit'. As if being a famous steamer absolves someone of cheating.
 

Kaeden

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,929
US
can you tell me where in the quoted text he says the streamer shouldn't have been banned? He just says the effects of banning someone who makes a living off of the game is different than someone who doesn't, which is inarguably true.

the only place it says he shouldn't get banned is the video and thread title
You didn't answer my question. Again, if it's an accurate quote, it's pretty easy to see what he's saying from that.
 

Messofanego

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,387
UK
I'm referring to how passionate people on this forum are that he never be allowed to play again. He just made a silly mistake in a video game, who cares.
He didn't make a mistake, it was deliberate. He knew what he was doing, tried to be sneaky, and offended again. Perma ban worthy. I don't see how you can argue against that given the full details.
You should probably watch the Jarvis vid before putting your weight on that limb.

Guy goes through some half ass precautions to tank a game to try and not get banned, makes sure to play on a different account and pc so his main doesn't get banned (I.e. He obviously knows cheating is wrong and a bannable offense), gets banned on stream, and immediately makes a new account to continue cheating. Gleefully talks about giving him likes, so he'll do future aimbotting streams.

His apology is bullshit, he's just sad he screwed himself, not that he cheated. This is as open and shut as it could be.
 
OP
OP
Star-Lord

Star-Lord

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,856
can you tell me where in the quoted text he says the streamer shouldn't have been banned? He just says the effects of banning someone who makes a living off of the game is different than someone who doesn't, which is inarguably true.

the only place it says he shouldn't get banned is the video and thread title
You ban that kid and nothing happens to him. Nothing happens. Oh no! He can't cheat any more. You ban Jarvis – it's different.
He's stating average people get banned on no poor then but then flips it and says but Jarvis is different. Why should he be excluded? Oh he's 17, nope not a good enough excuse at that age you should know what's right and wrong. Every game has an agreement you must accept before playing and if you cheat you are held accountable. Even at 17 you make dumb choices but they still have consequences and it's a life lesson for him.
 

Freezasaurus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,104
He literally implied that jarvis should not have gotten a permanent ban but its fine if normal players that aimbot get permanent bans, he even called them 'pieces of shit'. As if being a famous steamer absolves someone of cheating.
oh, I understand that. I wasn't supporting Ninja, good heavens no. I was just talking to the other poster about where specifically Ninja's audience comes from.
 

komaruR

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,060
http://www.twitch.tv/komarur
any1 rember the kid what cheated on either pubg or fortnite and got sue by bluehole or epic?
wonder how that case turn out. if i remember correctly, that kid went and spread the cheat information on yt video which catches the dev attention. then the kid' mom got involve or something.
 

8byte

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt-account
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
9,880
Kansas
When your entire audience is basically children, you tend to think like a child because you're performing for children.

No one will be speaking his name within a decade and he'll be forgotten, so...just forget about his shit takes, lol.
 

Freezasaurus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,104
When your entire audience is basically children, you tend to think like a child because you're performing for children.

No one will be speaking his name within a decade and he'll be forgotten, so...just forget about his shit takes, lol.
I mean, good for him if he can make his money now and invest it wisely. But I hope he knows this shit ain't gonna last.
 

Armaros

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,902
I mean, good for him if he can make his money now and invest it wisely. But I hope he knows this shit ain't gonna last.

The true irony, the people saying his livelyhood is ruined. He had publically said he already made 2 million from streaming and fortnite. At 17 he is more set the most people on the planet and yet he has people crying for him.
 

8byte

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt-account
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
9,880
Kansas
I mean, good for him if he can make his money now and invest it wisely. But I hope he knows this shit ain't gonna last.

I'm not trying to knock his hustle, I'm just saying no one should really take any of his opinions seriously in any manner. If you spend the majority of your time being "on" and performing like an idiot, well, your brain effectively begins to adapt and it becomes who you are.
 

Freezasaurus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,104
The true irony, the people saying his livelyhood is ruined. He had publically said he already made 2 million from streaming and fortnite. At 17 he is more set the most people on the planet and yet he has people crying for him.
People are weird. Shit has only gotten more bizarre since the rise of social media.
 

lowmelody

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,101
Piece of shit """influencer''''' doesn't understand the stupid shit they say and do literally influences his viewers and it spreads like the virus it is.

Thats a new one. 🙄
 

Hokey

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,164
Apparently the only difference between a content creator and a piece of shit is based around how many views/subscribers one has. Also he thinks this is all about the person commiting the act instead of how it's affecting others.

What a moron.
 

Booya_base

Member
Oct 31, 2017
748
Jersey
Congratulations Ninja on entering the "Worst take hall of fame". This is so insanely wrong its almost unbelievable. As many here have said, as a role model you should be MORE responsible and receive more punishment or at the very least the same.

If he'd have said it seems like those with more followers or popularity receive less punishment currently he'd be spot on, but that's not how it should be, we should be actively fighting that.
 

MagicDoogies

Member
Oct 31, 2017
1,047
Boo fucking Hoo. The games developers create arent there to be your fucking money making platform. Companies are already dogshit at moderating users who violate their own ToS, so if you are so bad that even they notice and take action than suck up and move on. If your content is nothing more than glorified cheating and toxicity than you deserve to lose your revenue anyway.