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Deleted member 3812

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,821
Reuters is reporting that financial technology company Wirecard that got a spot less than two years ago on Germany's DAX stock index has now become the first member of the DAX to collapse, owing $4 billion, however due to how the company collapsed, it's unlikely creditors can get the money back from Wirecard:

www.reuters.com

'The money's gone': Wirecard collapses owing $4 billion

Wirecard collapsed on Thursday owing creditors almost $4 billion after disclosing a gaping hole in its books that its auditor EY said was the result of a sophisticated global fraud.

FRANKFURT (Reuters) - Wirecard collapsed on Thursday owing creditors almost $4 billion after disclosing a gaping hole in its books that its auditor EY said was the result of a sophisticated global fraud.

The payments company filed for insolvency at a Munich court saying that, with 1.3 billion euros ($1.5 billion) of loans due within a week its survival as a going concern was "not assured".

Wirecard's implosion came just seven days after EY, its auditor for more than a decade, refused to sign off on the 2019 accounts, forcing out Chief Executive Markus Braun and leading it to admit that $2.1 billion of its cash probably didn't exist.

"There are clear indications that this was an elaborate and sophisticated fraud involving multiple parties around the world," EY said in a statement.

EY said while it was completing the 2019 audit, it was provided with false confirmations with regard to escrow accounts and reported them to the relevant authorities.

The financial technology company is the first member of Germany's prestigious DAX stock index to go bust, barely two years after winning a spot among the country's top 30 listed companies with a market valuation of $28 billion.

"The Wirecard case damages corporate Germany. It should be a wake-up call for reforms," said Volker Potthoff, chairman of corporate governance think-tank ArMID.

Creditors have scant hope of getting back the 3.5 billion euros they are owed, sources familiar with the matter said. Of that total, Wirecard has borrowed 1.75 billion from 15 banks and issued 500 million in bonds.

"The money's gone," said one banker. "We may recoup a few euros in a couple of years but will write off the loan now."
 

platocplx

2020 Member Elect
Member
Oct 30, 2017
36,072
Excuse me but how the fuck they were able to lie about 2.1 billion in cash
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,113
Man i wish i could call up capital one and say "Sorry B, money's gone" and just skipoff to do the shit again
 

platocplx

2020 Member Elect
Member
Oct 30, 2017
36,072
Man i wish i could call up capital one and say "Sorry B, money's gone" and just skipoff to do the shit again
Listen. this is like the theranos lady or Enron. Millions/billions just poof gone. white collar criminals get off way too easy, and companies just like welp we will write it off. Systems like this enable fraud.
 

whatsinaname

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,061
Robinhood traders at market open tomorrow!

giphy.gif
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,113
Listen. this is like the theranos lady or Enron. Millions/billions just poof gone. white collar criminals get off way too easy, and companies just like welp we will write it off. Systems like this enable fraud.
Crazy you can get to a point where not only you can ripoff millions but people will happy to sign it over. But let you be a dollar short when a check hits your account.
 

Cantaim

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,351
The Stussining
I saw this on my LinkedIn the other day. Unfortunately a German version of Enron. I feel for all the employees that worked their asses off only to have the rug pulled out from under them. Jesus this is gonna ruin so many lives. I still meet people that have direct relatives or family friends that had their lives ruined by Enron.

*one of the big four is about to eat massive shit.
 

EloKa

GSP
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
1,906
Crazy you can get to a point where not only you can ripoff millions but people will happy to sign it over. But let you be a dollar short when a check hits your account.
This point happened when the 2 original founders where still in charge and manipulated the books. One of those currently on the run and supposedly somewhere in the Philippines and the other one turned himself in. In early 2020 a new guy become basically the CEO, started an investigation and came to the conclusion that the money from the books is non-existent. Imho it's highly unlikely that the two original founders will not end up in jail for their fraud.
 

Cascadero

Member
Nov 8, 2017
1,526
Financial Times did a really great longread about this case. Purely criminal behaviour and it's good that the authorities acted to arrest the top management. The regulator should be looked into as well because they purposely ignored previous alerts, apparently.
 

Penny Royal

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
4,158
QLD, Australia
The instant a company's auditors refuse to sign off on the company accunts should trigger an independent regulatory investigation, which TBH as this is Germany I'm really surprised didn't happen, which has much more stringent FS regs IIRC.

But then I'm guessing Wirecard was some new, snazzy thing that existing legislation doesn't cover adequately as it possibly falls between traditional regulatory regimes.
 

behOemoth

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,623
The CEO sold all his stock after he stepped back and went to the police and was arrested. He paid 5 million € to bail out, but I have the feeling that me made way more money.
 

hateradio

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,750
welcome, nowhere
Never heard of this company.


We really shouldn't give any company that's less than 20 years old IPOs. (Although, I know that would lead to some other BS, like companies buying startups more often and inflating their own self worth. Ultimately, causing more harm. Banks, anyone?)
 

Banjo Tango

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 28, 2017
363
So the Invisibilia podcast did an episode about a British investor who was very publicly shorting Wirecard stock, and they were harassing him nonstop... Sending guys to his remote countryside home, having him followed, an unending barrage of phishing attempts, smearing him with fake articles.

Worth a listen, and glad the guy is now vindicated after what he endured.
 

Irminsul

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,039
Wirecard:" We have 2.1billy in cash"
Accountants:" Can we see it?"
Wirecard:" It's in canada with my girlfriend"
More accurately "in the Philippines with my best friend" in this case, but yeah.

Shocking stuff. I hope everyone involved (within Wirecard, EY, German regulatory oversight) is happy there's now the first company listed in Germany's top stock index that filed for insolvency.
 
Oct 28, 2017
1,865
So the Invisibilia podcast did an episode about a British investor who was very publicly shorting Wirecard stock, and they were harassing him nonstop... Sending guys to his remote countryside home, having him followed, an unending barrage of phishing attempts, smearing him with fake articles.

Worth a listen, and glad the guy is now vindicated after what he endured.

Short sellers have been keeping a close eye on Wirecard for the better part of a decade and more than a few have been threatened or extorted. It's more or less been an open secret for a long time that Wirecard is a fraud.
 

Kyougar

Cute Animal Whisperer
Member
Nov 3, 2017
9,359
Crazy you can get to a point where not only you can ripoff millions but people will happy to sign it over. But let you be a dollar short when a check hits your account.

"If you owe the Bank $1000 Dollar, it is your problem"
"If you owe the Bank $1 Billion Dollar, it is the Banks problem"
 

jelly

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
33,841
It's astounding how they are allowed to go this far.

How the hell does Deutsche Bank still exist as well.
 

Dehnus

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
1,900
Excuse me but how the fuck they were able to lie about 2.1 billion in cash
Basically most traders at that level are scam artists. They know how to game the system in their favour and find joy in it. There are exceptions, well meaning folk that try to do the right thing and even have it work for good causes. But most find joy in scamming the government, people (rich and poor) and just getting away with it.

So they usually find a way to do it.

Again there are exceptions!

I also can assure you someone is getting rich of this scam busting and going to 0.
 
Jun 10, 2018
8,847
The level of deception and manipulation involved in this story is unreal. I feel most for the employees though who were unwitting participants to an otherwise elaborate money laundering scheme and will soon be out of work.

I really hope significantly harsh penalties are levied against the perpetrators. A light sentence for this level of fraud just won't cut it.

Edit: the wildest thing about that Wirecard timeline is that the alarm bells about potential fraud was sounded as early as 2008 and yet they were still allowed to operate for nearly TWELVE YEARS afterward!! And all because of a technicality 🤦🏾‍♂️
 
Last edited:
Oct 25, 2017
2,636
As far as I can tell, the only reason EY is still able to operate is because all of the big four's reputations are in the trash. Just add this to the pile of scandals.
 

LunaSerena

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,525
So, even before E&Y refused to sign the financial statements, the KPMG report was published saying there were valid doubts about all the documents.

What in the world was the regulator doing? A report like that should have lit a fire under their ass. Didn't they learn anything from 2008?
 

LJ11

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,489
Short sellers have been keeping a close eye on Wirecard for the better part of a decade and more than a few have been threatened or extorted. It's more or less been an open secret for a long time that Wirecard is a fraud.
It's rather insane/comical, even BaFin, went after the shorts. Great reporting by the FT from the jump.
 

Lobster Roll

signature-less, now and forever
Member
Sep 24, 2019
34,373
Man i wish i could call up capital one and say "Sorry B, money's gone" and just skipoff to do the shit again
Slayven: "Sorry, I overdrew my account by $2 for a millisecond."
Bank: "And? You owe us $37 now. You'll get a call from a collections company in 4 seconds."

Bank: "I overdrew my account by $2.1 billion over several years."
Govt: "Hey, that's just business, baby. How much you need to get back on your feet?"
 

Psychotext

Member
Oct 30, 2017
16,703
Oops... just got an email from Curve saying they'll have to temporarily suspend operations whilst they transition fully away. I had no idea they were involved with Wirecard.