• Light/Dark
  • Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.

Reuters: "Exclusive: Facebook says Apple rejected its attempt to tell users about App Store fees"

Dakhil

Dakhil

Member
Mar 26, 2019
4,459
Orange County, CA
www.reuters.com

Exclusive: Facebook says Apple rejected its attempt to tell users about App Store fees

Facebook Inc on Thursday told Reuters that Apple Inc rejected its attempt to tell users the iPhone maker would take a 30% cut of sales in a new online events feature, forcing Facebook to remove the message to get the tool to users.
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com
(Reuters) - Facebook Inc on Thursday told Reuters that Apple Inc rejected its attempt to tell users the iPhone maker would take a 30% cut of sales in a new online events feature, forcing Facebook to remove the message to get the tool to users.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Mod Edit: Removed the completely copied article
 
Last edited by a moderator:
TeenageFBI

TeenageFBI

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,229
All these companies smelling blood in the water and there's no one to root for; Everyone involved is terrible.
 

Deleted member 4874

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,113
I really wish apple would create some Facebook-like social media thing which focused on people's privacy as a key feature. I think they could make a dent in the social media sphere if they pushed it right.
 
Davidion

Davidion

Charitable King
Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,069
The momentum is building. Fun strategies in play.

That having been said, Apple could punch a baby and it wouldn't make them as toxic and worthy of being thrown in a tree chipper as Facebook
 
Lobster Roll

Lobster Roll

signature-less, now and forever
Member
Sep 24, 2019
34,324
I want one of these companies in this fight to be straight-up about their intentions. I'd respect their play so much more of they weren't pretending it's to benefit the little guy when their only goal is to improve their bottom lines.
 

lupinko

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,154
Who cares about Apple's App Store fees. These are the same fees that the console manufacturers give out, and same applies to Google and iirc Valve.

Facebook gotta take that L.
 
Darknight

Darknight

"I'd buy that for a dollar!"
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,805
Sayuz said:
Ah, yes, Facebook, a true hero to small businesses.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I think we all need to realize that the only companies who have any clout to try to change Apple's policies are all going to have issues and angles of why they want it to go away. It seems counter productive to constantly point out how some company has their own motives or issues when trying to get this changed which would actually affect everyone across the board and not just these big billion dollar companies.
 
Darknight

Darknight

"I'd buy that for a dollar!"
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,805
lupinko said:
Who cares about Apple's App Store fees. These are the same fees that the console manufacturers give out, and same applies to Google and iirc Valve.

Facebook gotta take that L.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

It's not the same. Explain why I can subscribe and manage my Netflix account on Android, PS4, and Xbox but not an Apple device? Explain why I can rent and purchase videos on Vudu on Android, PS4, and Xbox but not an Apple device? Explain why I can buy comics in the Comixology app on Android but not on an Apple device? Apple's policies are clearly not the same as everyone else, so we need to stop pretending that they are.
 
krazen

krazen

Member
Oct 27, 2017
13,123
Gentrified Brooklyn
Sayuz said:
Ah, yes, Facebook, a true hero to small businesses.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Yeah, this is spin as fuck.

"We felt bad for all the closed bars:( We are Facebook are known for our 'lit' parties and wanted to keep the 'litness' happening! So by coordinating with your friends using WhatsApp (c) and our products like Facebook Messenger Rooms (c) we want to help you raise revenue after taking our cut to keep the party popping in a pandemic!"
 
Cantaim

Cantaim

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,322
The Stussining
Lol Facebook won't get an iota of sympathy from me. Unless they put up a notification every time you like or share something explaining what they do with that information and where they store it.
 
EloKa

EloKa

GSP
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
1,905
Good guy Facebook trying to fight for the small guy and against that evil 30% cut and getting all that positive PR spin. Also Facebook:
ZOMYucN
 
Parthenios

Parthenios

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
13,605
Why is Apple taking a cut of the revenue here? What service have they provided? If they think they deserve that fee, why would they feel the need to not disclose it?

How did we end up in a position where we have to agree with Facebook on something?
 
Antrax

Antrax

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,276
Darknight said:
I think we all need to realize that the only companies who have any clout to try to change Apple's policies are all going to have issues and angles of why they want it to go away. It seems counter productive to constantly point out how some company has their own motives or issues when trying to get this changed which would actually affect everyone across the board and not just these big billion dollar companies.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Yeah, true. Jim Bob's Mom and Pop may sound more altruistic but also they have literally zero chance of even getting an email read by Apple, let alone changing any policy
 
Parthenios

Parthenios

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
13,605
Palette Swap said:
Epic used the same language and I hate that they do that.
Whine all you want about your mutual business issues, but stop saying tax, fucking assholes.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Tax is a great word though. What else do you pay that is a percentage, and not a flat price or rate?

You don't roll through the drive-through and get charged 1% of your income for a combo-meal.

In a better analogy, landlords charge businesses a flat rate (rent) to operate there, not a percentage of their revenue. The stores don't have manufacturers sell goods in their stores directly to consumers and then take a percentage fee; they buy the goods up front for a fixed price and it's up to the shops to sell them.
 
Menx64

Menx64

Member
Oct 30, 2017
5,774
The European commission of antitrust is going to have a field day with all this news...
 
Hellsing321

Hellsing321

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,810
Parthenios said:
Tax is a great word though. What else do you pay that is a percentage, and not a flat price or rate?

You don't roll through the drive-through and get charged 1% of your income for a combo-meal.

In a better analogy, landlords charge businesses a flat rate (rent) to operate there, not a percentage of their revenue. The stores don't have manufacturers sell goods in their stores directly to consumers and then take a percentage fee; they buy the goods up front for a fixed price and it's up to the shops to sell them.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Some malls do charge businesses a percentage of their revenue for rent on top of a base rate.
 
platocplx

platocplx

2020 Member Elect
Member
Oct 30, 2017
36,072
EloKa said:
Good guy Facebook trying to fight for the small guy and against that evil 30% cut and getting all that positive PR spin. Also Facebook:
ZOMYucN
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Right lol. They just wanna charge 30% on folks and not 60% lmao hilarious. They can make their own phone OS for this shit.
 
Inugami

Inugami

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,995
I can't help but see this ultimately being a good thing for consumers.... so letthemfight.gif
 
Mammoth Jones

Mammoth Jones

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,299
New York
EloKa said:
Good guy Facebook trying to fight for the small guy and against that evil 30% cut and getting all that positive PR spin. Also Facebook:
ZOMYucN
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

This is what gets me. The selective outrage over this STANDARD practice. Don't like it, play ball somewhere else. What's that? Apple's marketplace is lucrative as fuck. Then be content with 70% rather than 0% and make your money.

App store changed the game and made these companies a TON of money. Obviously Apple is going to take their cut. I would too, lol. I see FB agrees.

JohnsonUT said:
You root for legislators to finally do their job and regulate an incredibly powerful (and growing) tech industry.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Last thing I want is for politicians to fuck with app distribution markets. Fuckers don't even understand why giving the NSA a black door into my phone is a bad idea.
 
SeeingeyeDug

SeeingeyeDug

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,004
lupinko said:
Who cares about Apple's App Store fees. These are the same fees that the console manufacturers give out, and same applies to Google and iirc Valve.

Facebook gotta take that L.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

The problem isn't the fees themselves but Apple disallowing Facebook from informing their users about where their fees were going. Apple wants to charge the 30% but doesn't want anyone to be informed about that 30%. Holding your app hostage just because you want to inform your customers is shitty. No matter what kind of Apple fan you might be.
 
JohnsonUT

JohnsonUT

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,032
Mammoth Jones said:
Last thing I want is for politicians to fuck with app distribution markets. Fuckers don't even understand why giving the NSA a black door into my phone is a bad idea.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

What's funny is this is always one of the arguments used by those with monopoly power. That's why splitting companies up has historically been one of the most effective methods of enforcing antitrust law. Congress doesn't have to know anything and can create competition in a market that does not have it.
 
spam musubi

spam musubi

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,380
EloKa said:
Good guy Facebook trying to fight for the small guy and against that evil 30% cut and getting all that positive PR spin. Also Facebook:
ZOMYucN
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Surely the oculus store (an App Store Facebook runs) also takes 30%, right? This hypocrisy from large companies who smell blood in the water is palpable.
 
Mammoth Jones

Mammoth Jones

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,299
New York
JohnsonUT said:
What's funny is this is always one of the arguments used by those with monopoly power. That's why splitting companies up has historically been one of the most effective methods of enforcing antitrust law. Congress doesn't have to know anything and can create competition in a market that does not have it.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Apple doesn't have a monopoly in the smartphone market. Nor in the smartphone OS market. Nor in the wider computer market.

As a consumer the last thing I want is the government fixing what clearly isn't broken. The App Store is fine. These companies are fine. Everyone is making money. There's a reason the App Store changed the game and a reason it makes money and a reason why consumers tend to spend far more there than on competing platforms.

If these companies don't like it they need to decline doing business until enough of them do to force Apple to alter their terms. But that would require actually taking a stand and declining revenue because of it. Which they of course aren't really going to do.

But this PR nonsense while simultaneously doing the same shit is just hypocritical grandstanding to me.
 
Last edited:
Kirbivore

Kirbivore

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,925
Its hard for me to get behind this when the arguments are being made by companies who already have billions of dollars and said issue has zero impact on the end user.
 
Palette Swap

Palette Swap

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
11,201
Parthenios said:
Tax is a great word though. What else do you pay that is a percentage, and not a flat price or rate?

You don't roll through the drive-through and get charged 1% of your income for a combo-meal.

In a better analogy, landlords charge businesses a flat rate (rent) to operate there, not a percentage of their revenue. The stores don't have manufacturers sell goods in their stores directly to consumers and then take a percentage fee; they buy the goods up front for a fixed price and it's up to the shops to sell them.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It's a fee that happens to be linear, not a tax.
When I sell something on eBay, I don't call it a tax, it's a fee. There are tons of pricing models that involve these kinds of cuts, particularly in B2B.

Taxes are levied by governments, and calling fees you don't like taxes is toxic as it fosters the idea that taxes are singularly bad.
 
MetatronM

MetatronM

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,851
Parthenios said:
What.

That's effing insane.

Some great life advice is that generally anything (other than taxes) charging a percentage of your take is a get rich scheme by the other party.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
If you're providing a service that actively facilitates someone's ability to do business, it's not a strange thing to get a cut of said business (in the case of malls, it's because it's simultaneously both a real estate deal AND an advertising deal, as opposed to something like an office rental which wouldn't typically take a cut of revenue). That's how just about any agent relationship works, and tech works much the same way in the sense that you wouldn't be able to build your product or get it to customers at all in most cases without the help of middleware or platform manufacturers. That they're taking a percentage isn't really the major objectionable issue here.
 
JohnsonUT

JohnsonUT

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,032
Mammoth Jones said:
Apple doesn't have a monopoly in the smartphone market. Nor in the smartphone OS market. Nor in the wider computer market.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...


Apple certainly is nearing monopoly on app store market. 65-70% of all app store revenue runs through Apple's app store. And, there is a single competitor. Hardly a competitive market. App developers are completely at the mercy of Apple and have to hope for benevolent dictatorship from the company.


Just to be clear though, you don't even have to have a monopoly. You just have to use your power to engage in anti competitive behavior. For example, running the most important app store in the US and giving your own apps favorable positioning. Or using your competitor's app data, which you have access to, in order to steal market share. Both are anti-competitive practices.
 

lupinko

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,154
Anyway this is the thread I was looking for haha.

So to those two that quoted me in the earlier pages. It's Apple's platform they can dictate whatever they want. Also what's this stanning for Zuckerberg anyway. And accusing me of being an Apple fan? What kind of argument is that? I don't obsess over these faceless companies like many others on this forum. I'm not going to shed a tear if Tim Cook isn't going to get another bonus if the iPhone 12 doesn't sell a gazillion units.

For example Microsoft used to lock streaming services behind their paywall on Xbox for many years, and they still lock F2P games behind their paywall to this day iirc. Their competition doesn't do that, but they did and do, because it's their platform. They decide what goes, if you don't like it then take your business elsewhere. This is no different with Apple dictating their own rules.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.