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Dr. Monkey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,029
Presented at a thing on games in academia yesterday and we were the only women presenting, of course. It's weird... when we go to conferences to do games things, there are always tons of women involved, but it isn't always reflected in people chosen to speak. Wonder what could possibly account for that.
 

spider

CLANG
On Break
Oct 23, 2017
973
Australia
Presented at a thing on games in academia yesterday and we were the only women presenting, of course. It's weird... when we go to conferences to do games things, there are always tons of women involved, but it isn't always reflected in people chosen to speak. Wonder what could possibly account for that.
Women voices still not quite allowed proper chance to speak and be heard within some (most) industries. I appreciate you, kikimon!
 

sabrina

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,174
newport beach, CA
Presented at a thing on games in academia yesterday and we were the only women presenting, of course. It's weird... when we go to conferences to do games things, there are always tons of women involved, but it isn't always reflected in people chosen to speak. Wonder what could possibly account for that.
Regardless, I'm glad you were there. Hopefully more representation leads to yet more representation.
 

Studge

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,071
I know. I'm a game dev too, and I got banned once on the old site for calling people who only buy used games "cheap" :P

you don't have to mansplain this
Well then my apologies. With so many devs on this forum I really need to just start assuming everyone is one or has knowledge of such things.
 

Rory

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,159
you don't have to mansplain this
Maybe my memory is just not good enough to keep the gender information of so many people in my long term memory. Or is it like spider sense?

First I thought you actually bothered to check for his gender on his profile, but it isn't even listed there.

The way he wrote and acted I just assumed he's female.
 

sabrina

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,174
newport beach, CA
Well then my apologies. With so many devs on this forum I really need to just start assuming everyone is one or has knowledge of such things.

That's what's worked for me. Maybe it's naive but I believe people will ask questions if they have them.


Maybe my memory is just not good enough to keep the gender information of so many people in my long term memory. Or is it like spider sense?

First I thought you actually bothered to check for his gender on his profile, but it isn't even listed there.

The way he wrote and acted I just assumed he's female.

On the whole site, yeah, that'd be a pain. But it's not that hard to keep track of the half dozen or so guys who frequent GirlERA.
 

Studge

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,071
Maybe my memory is just not good enough to keep the gender information of so many people in my long term memory. Or is it like spider sense?

First I thought you actually bothered to check for his gender on his profile, but it isn't even listed there.

The way he wrote and acted I just assumed he's female.
It's not? Weird, I remember checking "male" when I signed up. I'll have to fix that. So yeah, I'm a dude, and yeah I guess I was mansplaining. Although, it's something I tend to do to lots of people, regardless of gender, and I've been working to be more conscious of it. I've always enjoyed explaining how things work and I think I do it unprompted to reinforce my own understanding of a subject but I'm realizing that it doesn't come off that great to others.
 

GraphicViolets

Resettlement Advisor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
985
It's not? Weird, I remember checking "male" when I signed up. I'll have to fix that. So yeah, I'm a dude, and yeah I guess I was mansplaining. Although, it's something I tend to do to lots of people, regardless of gender, and I've been working to be more conscious of it. I've always enjoyed explaining how things work and I think I do it unprompted to reinforce my own understanding of a subject but I'm realizing that it doesn't come off that great to others.
I come across as a bit of a know-it-all irl so I've been trying to explain less things to people but they keep enabling me by not knowing things :O
its different on the internet tho cause it feels like everyone knows more than me which is so weird

(not to butt in and derail :X)
 

Pet

More helpful than the IRS
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
7,070
SoCal
It's not? Weird, I remember checking "male" when I signed up. I'll have to fix that. So yeah, I'm a dude, and yeah I guess I was mansplaining. Although, it's something I tend to do to lots of people, regardless of gender, and I've been working to be more conscious of it. I've always enjoyed explaining how things work and I think I do it unprompted to reinforce my own understanding of a subject but I'm realizing that it doesn't come off that great to others.

I do this too, as does my husband, and yeah it can be tone deaf but thank you for reacting the way you did and not immediately becoming defensive!
 

sabrina

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,174
newport beach, CA
(not to butt in and derail :X)
It's a good discussion. Butt on in.

I love explaining things so I know how it is (and I won't pretend to be innocent of condescension). One of my friends pointed out to me the other day that I was being condescending to him, and he was totally right. So I thanked him. Sometimes you gotta take your lumps and try to be better going forward.
 

Pirate Bae

Edelgard Feet Appreciator
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
6,792
??
You never learn unless you fuck up. It's part of growing and becoming a better person.
 

dee_activate

Member
Oct 25, 2017
186
world
Referring to the conventions and general creepiness. When guys find out I'm into gaming, board gaming, films and whiskey I suddenly get attention I don't want at all. I'm not extremely attractive or fit just someone with breasts that has the same interests. I was actually at a whiskey festival over the weekend, there were not that many women there, apart from the serving staff that were all female looked 18, white tall and blond (pandering much). Besides from having some creeps just watch as i moved from stand to stand, I was called "cutie" "sweetie" and (yep creeped out) "my precious" and then some guy thought it was ok to comment that if I used my boobs I could carry more glasses. I finally caved and asked one of my male friends if we could go around together for the rest of the fest. It sucked that I had to have a babysitter so I could focus on what I paid good money for, the whiskey tasting.
 

Studge

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,071
I do this too, as does my husband, and yeah it can be tone deaf but thank you for reacting the way you did and not immediately becoming defensive!
I learned a while ago from my wife that getting defensive is never a winning move, and not because of some sexist "the wife is always right" kinda bullshit. If I said something shitty that hurt or offended, telling her "You interpreted my words wrong. It's you're fault you feel hurt!" just lead to anger, resentment, and further misunderstanding, especially since she always criticized me about that stuff in good faith. That was a bit of a dark time in our relationship but it was good it happened.

So correct me all you want when necessary, I'm open to it all to be a better person. Setting a good example for my daughter of what a man and father should be is something I do not what to fuck up.
 

GraphicViolets

Resettlement Advisor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
985
It's a good discussion. Butt on in.

I love explaining things so I know how it is (and I won't pretend to be innocent of condescension). One of my friends pointed out to me the other day that I was being condescending to him, and he was totally right. So I thanked him. Sometimes you gotta take your lumps and try to be better going forward.
I don't think I'm condescending per se but it can definitely be hard not to feel kinda smug about it.
I always wonder how much its about feeling like I got a pat on the back since answering questions right was one of the best ways to get my parents happy with me growing up


Studge that's a really good attitude to have imo :)
doesn't help that so many disagreements come from misunderstanding.
 

Fiction

Fanthropologist
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,727
Elf Tower, New Mexico
I think it's absolutely amazing how guys lose their shit when they see a girl in their nerdy circles. Awful, but amazing.

Like every time I go to a card shop to play Magic with my friends, I get like fifty dudes coming up to me to try to play / hit on me / whatever.

I started showing up in sweatpants so they'd leave me alone.
And this is why I stopped playing Magic. Seriously.

Hey do you want me to teach you how to play?

Kid I've been playing since beta step off.

Nice you come here to support your boyfriend!

Bitch I got him into this game.

Ugh
 

sabrina

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,174
newport beach, CA
Reminds me. When I was in college I got asked if my then boyfriend got me into programming. Uh, no haha. I've been programming since I was twelve, thank you very much.
 

Pirate Bae

Edelgard Feet Appreciator
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
6,792
??
When I was at Game Stop I used to get asked all the time if I played games

Like...dude...
 

Nilou

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,715
When I was at Game Stop I used to get asked all the time if I played games

Like...dude...

"No you see Mr all great and knowledgeable worker, I'm just a unknowing feeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeemale who walked into here looking to get my perfect boyfriend some gamey related thing as I know he'd love it! Teehee"
 

Pirate Bae

Edelgard Feet Appreciator
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
6,792
??
"No you see Mr all great and knowledgeable worker, I'm just a unknowing feeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeemale who walked into here looking to get my perfect boyfriend some gamey related thing as I know he'd love it! Teehee"
No like I worked there

I worked at a game store and people asked me if I liked games
 

Nilou

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,715
No like I worked there

I worked at a game store and people asked me if I liked games

Now that I think of it I think I do remember you mentioned before that you did work there for a time. I haven't been to my local gamestop in years but when it opened in 2009 there were a couple of kickass women working there, for a couple years, they always made midnight releases fun too. Those people must not be very bright among other things to ask you that..
 

Pirate Bae

Edelgard Feet Appreciator
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
6,792
??
Now that I think of it I think I do remember you mentioned before that you did work there for a time. I haven't been to my local gamestop in years but when it opened in 2009 there were a couple of kickass women working there, for a couple years, they always made midnight releases fun too. Those people must not be very bright among other things to ask you that..
That whole experience was kind of a dumpster fire, but I would do it again.

I got a lot of free shit and it was good money for a broke college kid.
 

Nilou

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,715
That whole experience was kind of a dumpster fire, but I would do it again.

I got a lot of free shit and it was good money for a broke college kid.

Them working there kinda made me want to apply too as I seemed to get lucky store wise but with my anxiety worse then then it is now and the horror stories I heard and things that you experienced made me too afraid to apply.
 

Pirate Bae

Edelgard Feet Appreciator
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
6,792
??
Them working there kinda made me want to apply too as I seemed to get lucky store wise but with my anxiety worse then then it is now and the horror stories I heard and things that you experienced made me too afraid to apply.
Honestly, going through all that really helped me learn how to stand up for myself. I never got any help in the harassment department from my coworkers who just watched as it happened, so it forced me to take a stand and tell them to get lost. I was too nice, and too naive in a lot of ways. It was awful at the time, and super uncomfortable, and I still kind of feel grossed out, but now I know how to not let it happen anymore.
 

HyperFerret

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,140
When I was at Game Stop I used to get asked all the time if I played games

Like...dude...

In computer repair they think I'm not a tech for some reason or don't know anything.

Nah I just walked back behind the counter and started opening up computers. You caught me.

The most recent dumb comment was a guy who said, "I'm not saying this just because you are a girl, but it's awesome how much you know about this kind of stuff." Was that first half really necessary?
 

Deleted member 1287

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
613
Jeez, I didn't have it nearly that bad. Maybe cuz I dressed like a boy. Guys would still crush on me and talk to me for way too damn long though.

It was always worse with sales and cars, usually people trying to trick me so they can overcharge me on putting in an air filter. But guys usually believed me when I said I knew how to do it myself. Usually.
 
Oct 25, 2017
185
I partook in that thread myself, I often roll my eyes at some of the responses. It's weird how some straight men are so quick to defend some designs without looking at the bigger picture. Most of the responses seemed okay in that thread from when I last saw though. Someone posted a picture of Rosalina and used it as an example of a "positive sexualized character" and I'm like oh honey, there is nothing sexualized about her. There's not really a lot of positive examples of sexualized women that I could think of though, most of them are created by straight men for straight men, 99% of the time this leads to some form of titlation.
 

Pooh

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,849
The Hundred Acre Wood
And this is why I stopped playing Magic. Seriously.

Hey do you want me to teach you how to play?

Kid I've been playing since beta step off.

Nice you come here to support your boyfriend!

Bitch I got him into this game.

Ugh

My ex-wife was getting into Magic during the last year of our marriage. Had the same issues whenever she went into a game story without me. Every time she went to buy cards, "hey, do you know how to play this game? Are these for you or your boyfriend?" etc etc.

She said it was very noticeably different when I went with her, in that the guys went from being super attentive to practically ignoring her since they saw she was with me.

On that note, I am offering my services to anybody here who wants fake boyfriend shield so they don't get harassed at game shops! Free hugs included, plus I will talk up how awesome you are at games. I'll even throw in carrying your purchases for you to your car at no additional cost! ACT NOW
 
Oct 27, 2017
399
I often wonder what the reception would be if a huge game were to have an important non-playable male character who is presented as a melee combat guy, but for some reason the outline of his huge, semi-erect penis is clearly visible and jiggles around in his man-panties. And almost every cutscene shot starts with his crotch as the focal point, before panning over to the actual important things going on in the scene. And occasionally he goes into strange poses, seemingly with no purpose other than to further emphasize whatever's going on down there, all while this is just treated as nothing notable at all by the game itself, like it's totally normal.

I think there'd be an uproar and it would make men uncomfortable, but who knows. Maybe they would be totally cool with it because "the developer's vision" etc.
 

Pooh

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,849
The Hundred Acre Wood
I often wonder what the reception would be if a huge game were to have an important non-playable male character who is presented as a melee combat guy, but for some reason the outline of his huge, semi-erect penis is clearly visible and jiggles around in his man-panties. And almost every cutscene shot starts with his crotch as the focal point, before panning over to the actual important things going on in the scene. And occasionally he goes into strange poses, seemingly with no purpose other than to further emphasize whatever's going on down there, all while this is just treated as nothing notable at all by the game itself, like it's totally normal.

I think there'd be an uproar and it would make men uncomfortable, but who knows. Maybe they would be totally cool with it because "the developer's vision" etc.
Personally I'd be laughing hysterically the whole time.

Also there's a Skyrim mod for this. Not necessarily the poses but the "physics."
 
Oct 25, 2017
185
I often wonder what the reception would be if a huge game were to have an important non-playable male character who is presented as a melee combat guy, but for some reason the outline of his huge, semi-erect penis is clearly visible and jiggles around in his man-panties. And almost every cutscene shot starts with his crotch as the focal point, before panning over to the actual important things going on in the scene. And occasionally he goes into strange poses, seemingly with no purpose other than to further emphasize whatever's going on down there, all while this is just treated as nothing notable at all by the game itself, like it's totally normal.

I think there'd be an uproar and it would make men uncomfortable, but who knows. Maybe they would be totally cool with it because "the developer's vision" etc.

Men had this reaction back when that Male character from that mobile Final Fantasy game was revealed. He was basically in a stripper outfit and everyone lost their collective shit. People are such hypocrites honestly.

As a profusely gay male, I would love the type of game you're describing lmfao but there is such a massive double standard when it comes to these things.
 
Oct 27, 2017
399
Personally I'd be laughing hysterically the whole time.

Me too. I mean it would be such a novelty but it's amazing what people can take seriously when it's a woman jiggling around everywhere and doing playboy bunny poses while poking things with a sword lol

People are such hypocrites honestly.

Yeah, there are audiences who would love that kind of game I describe. But no one would ever think it could fly in a mainstream game. But then there's Quiet. So. lol
 

kliklik

Member
Oct 26, 2017
330
Me too. I mean it would be such a novelty but it's amazing what people can take seriously when it's a woman jiggling around everywhere and doing playboy bunny poses while poking things with a sword lol

Um excuse me, this is her clothing expressing her personality, and it's all about the importance of the silhouette; how are you supposed to tell the female character apart from the male ones without massive jiggling tits and a playboy bunny pose?? Puhhhleeeze stop policing women's clothing choices (that were likely made by male designers). It's pretty much sexist to *not* take her seriously because of her clothing and body type! Wow, so much for body positivity! I guess the only people who *really* respect women are the otaku.

eyeroll-gif.gif
 
Oct 27, 2017
399
Um excuse me, this is her clothing expressing her personality, and it's all about the importance of the silhouette; how are you supposed to tell the female character apart from the male ones without massive jiggling tits and a playboy bunny pose?? Puhhhleeeze stop policing women's clothing choices (that were likely made by male designers). It's pretty much sexist to *not* take her seriously because of her clothing and body type! Wow, so much for body positivity! I guess the only people who *really* respect women are the otaku.

Guys, she breathes WITH HER SKIN. If she's not naked she'll die!

pffffft
 

kliklik

Member
Oct 26, 2017
330
Guys, she breathes WITH HER SKIN. If she's not naked she'll die!

pffffft
And so when that man was raping her that was very empowering for her, because by removing her clothing to do it she gained her power back and was brought back to life. So you see this is a very positive and empowering depiction for all the ladies out there about how rape doesn't need to be disempowering for you! Oh please, no thanks needed. Just doing the cosplay of it is enough thanks.
 

faircure

Member
Oct 27, 2017
631
Guys trying to give sentience to fictional women is so funny, pff. But my fictional girlfriend woke up and chose her clothes like any other woman!! I see ladies walking the streets in less! I can't believe you'd slut shame her like this. Feminism these days!
 

HyperFerret

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,140
If people have to argue if a character has agency and therefore it isn't apparent from the get-go that means the character didn't have agency.
 

sabrina

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,174
newport beach, CA
Maybe this is cynical but I think a misunderstanding of female motivation is not something you can fix with an internet argument. That's often bred from circumstances, such as having few women in real life to casually interact with. So I've pretty much given up trying to have that argument with internet randos.
 

kliklik

Member
Oct 26, 2017
330
I think at this point it's mostly just a waste of time to argue about it (sorry Dice). Everyone has their own personal limit of what they can put up with, where they draw the line. I'm fine with Hina from Danganronpa and Lara Croft, but I'm not cool with Alice from VLR and won't play Bayonetta. And no amount of people telling me I'm being closed-minded for not playing games because of those characters is going to convince me to slog through something I don't enjoy because it was aimed at a different audience in my downtime.
 
Oct 25, 2017
185
How do you girls feel about Bayonetta? A lot of people tout her as a positive example of a sexualized woman but I can't say I agree. I love that's she's super confident and extremely powerful but the "get naked while attacking" thing and the way the camera pans her body makes me hard to see her as a sexual power fantasy for women as opposed to a sexualized woman for the male player to gawk at.

How come we never get men who undress while attacking? Why is that a "woman" thing? I think we know why. Developers always find mundane reasons to sexualize women, it's almost comical. Besides that, I do think Bayonetta is a fierce and badass character, but I don't think they had women in mind when creating her.
 

HyperFerret

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,140
I actually really like Bayonetta, and to a similar extent Zero from Drakengard 3 (as in, Zero took no shit from anyone and dominated the area around her). Although Drakengard 3 was a bizarre setting where the gender roles were reversed and men were the more objectified gender.