Shit's real obvious. Especially with the way certain posters still bend over backwards to undermine him in whatever way they can.
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Ray Fisher open's up about the racial discrimination encountered at WB and the drastic reduction of Black presence in JL
- Thread starter Principate
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Yes but vague statements like he continued to do for the longest time didn't do anything to help him.
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???
He said he is under NDA and can not give specifics about his direct abuse publicly.
He was not vague with Warner in private.
What he says today is perfectly consistent with what he always said.
And he only got more details from other people in 2020 during the investigation, after he had spoke out publicly.
Ok and it's great he finally was able to provide that information.
part of the mythos of Cyborg is that he became quite recluse and ashamed/angry after his accident. His origin story tells how the New Teen Titans (replace with Justice League) helped him to overcome those issues and become proud of him again (remember he was an athlete before). This emotional journey could be told in the movie but it is no excuse to sideline the character or actor.
Yeah, I'll clap back.
Zack Snyder's movies are bad. WB is in disarray. The racism Ray Fisher experienced is emblematic, representing what black people, specifically black men, face on a day to day basis unbeknownst to many.
I know from personal experience.
Come at me again.
This sucks and the executives should be ashamed of themselves. Im glad this is coming to light.
Cant wait to see his performance in Zack Snyders Justice League, where it is said that Cyborg is supposed to be the heart of the film. I havent seen the Whedon cut of Justice League in its entirety, but from the little Ive seen Ray Fishers performance is really excellent and its a great idea to make his performance the center-piece of Justice League, similar to how Ben Afflecks performance was one of the center-pieces of Batman v Superman. When I found out that Cyborg was actually supposed to be the heart of the movie, my excitement grew by quite abit for the new release.
Cant wait to see his performance in Zack Snyders Justice League, where it is said that Cyborg is supposed to be the heart of the film. I havent seen the Whedon cut of Justice League in its entirety, but from the little Ive seen Ray Fishers performance is really excellent and its a great idea to make his performance the center-piece of Justice League, similar to how Ben Afflecks performance was one of the center-pieces of Batman v Superman. When I found out that Cyborg was actually supposed to be the heart of the movie, my excitement grew by quite abit for the new release.
Honestly, it still felt like Cyborg was the most important part of that film to me from what I remember. Whedon's edits likely lessened his role but it was probably impossible to excise him completely from the movie, which may be why I remember him being so important even after the edits. Somebody more knowledgeable will correct me here.
We support you Ray. WB needs to get its shit together. What is AT&T doing?
This is correct. He was under NDA. It appears something has changed.
I saw the movie a couple months ago and I don't really remember him being that important to the movie. But based on the amount of reported cuts and reshoots they could have easily have downplayed his role in the finished movie.
A shit ton of victim blaming has gone on and some people here going out of their way to undermine Ray Fisher. Lots of posters happy to brush it aside claiming lack of evidence which is never really a good reason.
Insane how many people here were willing to believe WB's bullshit though.
Insane how many people here were willing to believe WB's bullshit though.
Secondly: Snyder has repeatedly said Cyborg's the heart of the film. A simple google search would show this:
Cyborg's Story Is the 'Heart' of Justice League, Snyder Says
Director Zack Snyder addresses the team dynamic, and how he decided what role Superman will play in "Justice League."www.cbr.com
Cyborg actor Ray Fisher is the "heart" of the Justice League Snyder Cut, says Zack Snyder
Snyder had previously called Cyborg the heart of the director's cut, but now he says it's actor Ray Fisher himselfwww.gamesradar.com
Zack Snyder Calls Cyborg 'The Heart' of His 'Justice League,' Drops Joker and Deathstroke Hints - TheWrap
The director previewed his upcoming 4-hour HBO Max movie during IGN's Fan Festwww.thewrap.com
It makes me very happy that I'm finally going to see the real Justice League Snyder intended, despite the usual tired, boring whining about how much it's going to suck, never bothered with the Whedon version.
This place was a similar shit fest when ray fisher was brave enough to come out name and shame joss whedon and it's so fucking lame and disappointing that it's literally repeating itself again, WB was hella complicit in the bs and Geoff is an ass
Yup even on here people were defending whedon and weaseling around and haven't even had the decency to say a simple my bad , and now the same nonsense is repeating itself with this
The thing with people complaining about Fisher's reluctance to provide explicit details up to now is that he clearly was waiting for others involved in the investigation to come forward and have their voices heard by speaking for themselves, instead of him speaking for them and possibly putting information out that they weren't comfortable sharing publicly. Once Carpenter came out with her story, the floodgates opened and people were emboldened to share their stories using their own platforms, with Fisher being the last to speak once everyone else had their turn.
He could have gone scorched earth and just thrown everyone's stories out there, but he didn't do that and instead let people tell their own. I don't see how that in any way shouldn't be commendable.
He could have gone scorched earth and just thrown everyone's stories out there, but he didn't do that and instead let people tell their own. I don't see how that in any way shouldn't be commendable.
People just want to shit on Zack Snyder for making a movie they didn't like so badly. His accusations should still be taken seriously, even if it's for a film you don't think will be good.
User Banned (2 Weeks): Drive-by in Sensitive Thread
Swear to god, you Snyder fans find a way to make everything about your Christ figure. These two things are completely unrelated, and lots of people who FUCKING HATE Snyder believed Fisher from the start.
"I'm not going to say a word about the actual topic at hand, or ever post in a topic about what happened to Ray Fisher. But believe you me, the second literally a single person posts about "Snyder haters" I'll sure as fuck be there to bitch about it!"
So calling out someone for derailing a thread is worse than starting a derail?
Someone who has actually talked about what has happened to Ray Fisher is better than someone who has literally never coming into a topic to bitch about that person five minutes later, yes. You aren't a mod. No one needs you whining about qhat you consider a thread derail. Especially when you're juat using that as an excuse to cover your desire to whine avout something else. That post was the most hypocritical bullshit in this topic and it ain't even close. You don't give a fuck about what happened to Ray Fisher because you have literally never posted once about Ray Fisher in this forum prior to this topic. So you can take that disingenuous nonsense somewhere the fuck else if you don't want to get called out for it.
Someone feel free to correct me if I'm off base here, but Black Sexuality has been treated like a taboo in entertainment for the better part of a century now. When Johns was helming the Justice League book in 2011, it didn't escape notice that Cyborg was the one League member who lacked much of social life, supporting cast, or even a love interest. That first arc even had Superman, Green Lantern, and Flash rather shamelessly jocking to try and get with Wonder Woman but Cyborg remained.
And like, that type of writing is sexist and childish but you can't help but notice the sub-conscious bias in play of keeping the one black character in the book from having a sexual drive.
And then when David Walker was finally given the go-ahead to write a Cyborg solo years later, he actually did put focus on Cyborg regaining his human body and actually having a sex life and Geoff reportedly hated it.
Which kind of leads to my above point. Geoff didn't "get" why his handling of Cyborg was getting criticized so this read like him trying to address the criticism in a really ignorant way.
If that is the case, the Cyborg sex scenes on Doom Patrol are worth it for pissing off Johns after he used Doom Patrol to belittle Fisher.
The real question is why are you making a thread about the awful shit Ray Fisher had to endure you about what you had to endure at the hands of evil maniacal snyder fans or who or what you hate? Swear to god.
Kind of makes me wonder about Geoff John's insistence on Hal Jordan being the main Green Lantern now.
Starting to think it was less about him loving all the legacy characters and more to do with him disliking how John Stewart became the most well known Green Lantern due to the JLU cartoons
Starting to think it was less about him loving all the legacy characters and more to do with him disliking how John Stewart became the most well known Green Lantern due to the JLU cartoons
And were you the one who quoted me from a whole different thread when the Charisma allegations came out? Because not all of us are victim blaming, I feel like it wasn't unreasonable to want a clearer picture of what actually happened before throwing anyone under the bus. After stuff like Heard and Depp I'm a lot more cautious with this kind of stuff. The shit is obviously fucked but I don't like this narrative that we were trying to cancel Fisher, we just wanted to know what happened.
And now that the picture is clear, it's quite obvious wrong was done to Ray by various people and they need to be dealt with. But I'm not gonna apologize for wanting the full picture before crucifying someone
Totally out of nowhere dude, your irrational hate towards Snyder and his fans numbs your mind, you need to meditate and question your ways bruh, you need to seek Jesus (Snyder)
Johns is a producer on Doom Patrol. If they're in the series I doubt they bothered him that much.
Seriously? So is their an implication that the characters peee pee was purposely removed/excluded from his design on account of his race/skin color? Idk what textual evidence exists to support that conclusion but that seems like a real stretch imo.
Now with regards to ray fishers charge. I have no doubt that something serious happened behind the scenes, but tbh what he writes here doesn't not seem to tell the whole tale....or at least imo doesn't seem to be ring any serious bells in my mind. Like the removal of black characters part? Which character is he refering to ?
All of Iris's scenes and most of Cyborg's story.
Iris's scenes got cut when Whedon was brought on for reshoots and a scene that of Barry falling into wonder woman's boobs got added. Gal Galdot refused to do the scene and they had to have the double do the whole scene.
An executive producer. Especially with his focus being more on stuff like Stargirl I doubt he was very involved in season 2.
Perhaps. But I also doubt that he was fuming over Cyborg having sex scenes.
I find it telling that Fisher gives the long-awaited more direct account of the type of discrimination he was facing on set, and people care more about arguing about Snyder still.
A lot of these topics about black actors giving their opinion (Fisher about Whedon/Snyder, Boyega about Johnson/Abrams) are posters here explaining how they are wrong and that potentially racist choices (diminishing black roles to side characters) were actually for the better of the movie, so it is just because their favorite director is smarter.
Fuck Geoff Johns and Joss Whedon and anyone allowing this shit to happen.
I do wonder, though, maybe I'm missing something but what exactly is the racial/problematic connotation behind "Play Cyborg like Quasimodo"? Unless the connotation would be "Quasimodo = ugly, black character = ugly", but that seems like a stretch.
The other stuff is clearly terrible though.
I do wonder, though, maybe I'm missing something but what exactly is the racial/problematic connotation behind "Play Cyborg like Quasimodo"? Unless the connotation would be "Quasimodo = ugly, black character = ugly", but that seems like a stretch.
The other stuff is clearly terrible though.
Ray Fisher seems like an incredibly nice dude, his joy surrounding the Snyder Cut seems so genuine. Really hope it does him justice, and, more importantly, that justice is served with regard to this mistreatment (for all victims).
The comments over at superherohype on this news post are incredibly racist.
Yucky. And the proportion of sane vs insane comments is quite baffling as well.
"Weird" fandom.
Yucky. And the proportion of sane vs insane comments is quite baffling as well.
"Weird" fandom.
Quasimodo is more monstrous thing that needs to be hidden from the world.
Oooh that's right, I forgot that removed iris totally and that gal Gadot scene was totally stupid. What I'd like to know (and we possibly never will) is what led to the removal of that scene? In his message, ray fishers seems to imply that cyborg and his grief was possibly going to be central to the story ? And that the executives didn't like the they idea of a black man's grief taking center stage ? I wonder how those Kris scenes figure into all of that, or maybe it's additional scenes with his dad that were removed? So many questions so little answers
Yes but the question is, was race a motivating factor, of was that just simply their vision of the character.
Tbh it doesn't help that the movie itself really really really really really sucks so trying to peel subtext from what was shown in the final product is a nightmare
