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Rare has been with Microsoft for 17 years and yet are still known for their 8 years with Nintendo above all else. Will that ever change?
- Thread starter Jawmuncher
- Start date
Their games on Nintendo consoles were treated as events, because Nintendo seemed to view them as a valuable partner. Even the good games that Rare has put out since the Microsoft purchase were never treated with anywhere near the level of respect as their other first party releases, because I think Microsoft just viewed them as the key to attracting a different demographic to their consoles.
No, thats a myth. While a small group did leave, Lots of people stayed when they moved to MS. But over 17 years, a ton of people will naturally leave a company. I'm sure a ton of people who made Spyro are no longer at Insomniac.
OP
OP
This is something I've thought about and wonder if it has been impacting the studio's choice in titles.
MS pushes Kinect
- Let's focus on Kinect
MS pushes service games
- Let's focus on making our own service games.
Can't really blame them for wanting to stay in MS's good graces rather than take a risk that might not pan out.
They have shown little interest in going back. Sea of Thieves was Microsoft giving them the opportunity to make whatever they wanted.
Microsoft needs them to make another Perfect Dark. Third person stealth action adventure. Fill the void left behind by Metal Gear and Splinter Cell.
I don't really think they will.
Rare had a good opportunity to re-assert their ability for unique classics by the time the 360 era rolled around, but after Nuts & Bolts sort of came out with a collective sigh it felt like they needed to hurriedly win back a lot of their brand image which was sort of completely lost once the Kinect / Don Mattrick era happened. The end result is a whole console generation that saw them put out a couple of decent games at the start but then completely fall into a shell of their former self, and game development isn't getting any easier. Back in the day they could squeeze out two games a year, but post-Rivals we had to wait four more years until we finally got Rare's attempt at a return to form - Sea of Thieves - and while it was clearly the financial success they needed, the overall reception seems fairly in line with the "okay-ish" output they've been putting out on the 360 era.
I think there's a good reason why we've had people like Chris Seavor speculate that Rare IPs coming back to Nintendo was an inevitability. At this point, their biggest fans are those who latch onto those golden days, and it's fairly certain that Nintendo are better at creating avenues for franchises to reach that cult of personality status than Microsoft are. That's not to discount Rare's forward thinking mentality and genuinely talented artistry, but I think we're well gone beyond the point where they'll be anywhere near that peak when they provided imaginative games that created icons and were also classics. Right now I get the sense that their current trajectory is more likely to have them becoming more of Microsoft's answer to Media Molecule; a studio that seems to put more value in visionary products more than anything, rather than necessarily trying to make the next classic franchise.
Rare had a good opportunity to re-assert their ability for unique classics by the time the 360 era rolled around, but after Nuts & Bolts sort of came out with a collective sigh it felt like they needed to hurriedly win back a lot of their brand image which was sort of completely lost once the Kinect / Don Mattrick era happened. The end result is a whole console generation that saw them put out a couple of decent games at the start but then completely fall into a shell of their former self, and game development isn't getting any easier. Back in the day they could squeeze out two games a year, but post-Rivals we had to wait four more years until we finally got Rare's attempt at a return to form - Sea of Thieves - and while it was clearly the financial success they needed, the overall reception seems fairly in line with the "okay-ish" output they've been putting out on the 360 era.
I think there's a good reason why we've had people like Chris Seavor speculate that Rare IPs coming back to Nintendo was an inevitability. At this point, their biggest fans are those who latch onto those golden days, and it's fairly certain that Nintendo are better at creating avenues for franchises to reach that cult of personality status than Microsoft are. That's not to discount Rare's forward thinking mentality and genuinely talented artistry, but I think we're well gone beyond the point where they'll be anywhere near that peak when they provided imaginative games that created icons and were also classics. Right now I get the sense that their current trajectory is more likely to have them becoming more of Microsoft's answer to Media Molecule; a studio that seems to put more value in visionary products more than anything, rather than necessarily trying to make the next classic franchise.
A lot of the Rare's old guard have gone, but they're not all gone. A lot of miscellaneous staff have remained (such as Louise Ridgeway of Conker), Robin Beanland is still employed there as their lead musician/sound engineer, and notably Gregg Mayles seems to have maintained every bit as much creative director duties now as he had during the Banjo days.
Can't really blame Rare for not wanting to focus on a past that hasn't worked out under the Microsoft banner and isn't really ever coming back.
Part of me feels like Rare would be producing better games if they were working on multiple smaller projects rather than absolutely massive undertakings like Sea of Thieves—reel in their scale and put out fun, quirky titles that are full of ideas and clever writing but not especially asset-intensive
...yes I'm asking for a bunch of low-poly games that capture the N64 era when they made weird games like Blast Corps.
Hmmm once I'm able to make threads maybe I'll make one on the idea of scaling back games in general; anyway I think this would do wonders for Rare just in terms of how good their games would feel and how often they come out
...yes I'm asking for a bunch of low-poly games that capture the N64 era when they made weird games like Blast Corps.
Hmmm once I'm able to make threads maybe I'll make one on the idea of scaling back games in general; anyway I think this would do wonders for Rare just in terms of how good their games would feel and how often they come out
Hey, you won't hear a disagreement from me. What I would want from a modern Perfect Dark doesn't seem to be what I would expect from modern Rare. I'm happy to have some other studios work on old Rare properties if they dont want to. I will also be waiting to see what Rare does next. Not always a home run but I have enjoyed Rare's output under MS.
Looking at that list, Rare really doesn't do a lot of sequels. Only Donkey Kong got past 2.
Too bad many didn't appreciate Nuts and Bolts.
Too bad many didn't appreciate Nuts and Bolts.
It wasn't until many years later that I knew, but my first Rare game was:
As a note, just looking at that image, I can hear the music in my head lol
I seriously doubt it. Most of the talent that made Rare so special during the Nintendo days has long since left the company. The Rare we knew simply can't be compared to today's Rare. It bears the same name but it's not the same company anymore. Overall it's not the same people with the same spirit and the same goals.
I actually really liked Nightmare on Elm Street and feel like it was a misunderstood game.
Here's is a review that helps explain a little better what I mean by misunderstood.
I disagree with your assessment that less people will remember them because anybody who does know Rare as a developer probably has deep reverence for their early works. All of their work on Xbox have come and gone, how many people are talking about any of that? Only Sea of Thieves left any kind of impression. Viva Pinata was critically acclaimed but seems to never come up, especially in comparison to the ridiculous amounts of hits they strung together in the 90s.
Fewer and fewer people will remember Rare period before they remember the Xbox era before Nintendo.
God no. Old Rare were bespoke technical geniuses that crafted technically and mechnically top-end hit-after-hit across wildly different genres. That Rare is long gone (besides which, nobody can expect that kind of output in today's world).
There are hints another PD is in development. I don't think it's being done by Rare, though. And I think that's for the best - Sea of Thieves has elements of brilliance, but its FPS mechanics are terrible.
There are hints another PD is in development. I don't think it's being done by Rare, though. And I think that's for the best - Sea of Thieves has elements of brilliance, but its FPS mechanics are terrible.
It doesn't need to change. It's a part of their history and I don't see them trying to recapture that "magic" to prove to the nostalgia crowd that they still make those games.
I could see this being a problem if they were trying to prove they make those games in today's market.
They'll always get bashed by folk who want them to go back decades.
I could see this being a problem if they were trying to prove they make those games in today's market.
They'll always get bashed by folk who want them to go back decades.
He also says he's got at least one more platformer in him. Honestly I believe Rare still has the same potential it's always had
I liked the Nightmare on elm street game lol the music was great!
It takes too long to make games now for the most part to have such a quick deluge of excellent titles. I would love, however, for Rare to just make one generation-defining or a title that's one OF the generation-defining titles. I still like Rare. Post-2008 was when I dropped off for a little bit, though.
They were so innovative back then, making things people hadn't seen before and releasing across multiple genres. They also peaked at a time when the industry was exploring new ideas in 3D and there was no indie scene. The world of game development was smaller back then with much more attention focused on fewer studios.
I think games like Sea of Thieves (updated) and Viva Pinata are among their best work. I think the ideas and spirit are still there, it's just not feasible for them to explore like they used to due to rising costs in AAA game development. I'd love to see Rare staff up to get back to having multiple teams, maybe even go AA so they could explore more ideas and release more games more often.
I think games like Sea of Thieves (updated) and Viva Pinata are among their best work. I think the ideas and spirit are still there, it's just not feasible for them to explore like they used to due to rising costs in AAA game development. I'd love to see Rare staff up to get back to having multiple teams, maybe even go AA so they could explore more ideas and release more games more often.
No it won't change that snes to n64 was golden age for platformers where Rare really shined.
I'll quite happy they are with Microsoft and am excited about the variety of games they will bring in the future.
I love Sea of thieves and I think Rare will make more unique experiences.
I'll quite happy they are with Microsoft and am excited about the variety of games they will bring in the future.
I love Sea of thieves and I think Rare will make more unique experiences.
Right.... Because 90s consoles are all the rage with the young crowd.
Banjo 3 was in development but got cancelled soon after the buyout.
It doesn't help that, with the exception of Viva Pinata, Rare more of less squandered the 360 generation.
- Perfect Dark Zero is awful, even as a launch game
- Banjo Nuts & Bolts wasn't great despite what Giant Bomb will tell you, and was definitely not what Banjo fans wanted
- Kameo went nowhere
- No one wants to remember the Kinect, not even Microsoft
Nobody aside from videogame enthusiasts discuss Rare period. I assure you the young crowd largely has no clue who makes Sea of Thieves.
give it more 17 year and maybe they have a shot. I mean, not like rare didn't produced stinkers under nintendo belt, but we got nothing from the microsoft nearwhere close to goldeneye, dkc trilogy or killer instinct. And with the focus on live game now, i doubt we will get it anytime soon.
Fixed!!
Seriously tho. A open-space narrative, merc/bounty hunter style Jet Force would give me life!!
Nothing would change even if Rare went back to Nintendo in some fan-fiction scenario, best to just let them do what they want.
I'd prefer to see other developers try their hand at a dormant Rare IP like Double Helix and Iron Galaxy did for Killer Instinct.
I'd prefer to see other developers try their hand at a dormant Rare IP like Double Helix and Iron Galaxy did for Killer Instinct.
Great point. I don't think it worked well for Starfox Adventures, but outside of that it probably was a special ingredient.
All the love for Viva Pinata here is wonderful. The idea that the "modern" Rare isn't incredibly talented is some utter nonsense.
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Personally I think Viva Pinata was up their with their classics, and some of their great games were from before 1994 (I love Battletoads) even without having played any Amiga stuff. But... Can't really argue they never matched up to their heyday after splitting with Nintendo.
Rare and Nintendo struck a collaborative culture and enjoyed a level of chemistry that helped produce byproducts of their collective vision and ingenuity. They learned from one another and helped each other. I'm not at all familiar with the cultural characteristics of Microsoft's game studios back in the day but given it was their first foray in the console business at the time of the acquisition it wouldn't be a stretch of the imagine to believe it might have been too chaotic, visceral, and political compared to the established climate Rare was accustomed to at Nintendo.
