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i_am_ben

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,012
That finale was the craziest and most nonsensical episode of a TV series that I've seen in a long long time.

I was alright with the drop off in writing throughout the series because I thought they could turn it around next season, but this took all of the problems and ramped them up to 100.

The only reason I'll tune in next year is because it was so incredibly bonkers that I need to know where the writers go with this train wreck.
 

Jinroh

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,189
Lausanne, Switzerland
It's a little bit bullshitty.

Time travel has to be involved. Did they travel in time when they emerged? Maybe they didn't go through the core (it's impossible), but it might have been a portal to the past or something like that.

And the cyborg in the jar might have been Mother in the future?
 

Dennis8K

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,161
When Mother told Father how the Creator impregnated her and gave her an Android orgasm was *chef's kiss*

Father was PISSED.
 

Narroo

Banned
Feb 27, 2018
1,819
I wouldn't call this series a "trainwreck" so much as a "train that ran out of steam."

The series was always crazy bullshit since episode 1; just look at the whole atheists versus religion thing, or the crazy super-powered cyborg shenanigans. Rather, the series has pacing and focus issues, along with dialogue and character issues.

For starters, the series has odd pacing where it feels like that scenes or information is missing at times, leading to what appears to be silly melodrama. For example, Tempest killing and eating the creature raw, and then freaking out because it's pregnant? That comes of as silly, ridiculous and melodramatic because as far as we know they've only gone a day or so without eating. And why would Tempest care about the thing being pregnant? Thus, it feels like something is missing and thus melodrama.

This is despite the episodes being long. The series can't focus properly on it's characters, so the dramatic moments often lack the proper setup to sell them, resulting in an arbitrary melodrama to them.

This could be passable if the issue was that it focused on the characters and made them entertaining to watch. But the series is very unbalanced with it's focus with many of the characters barely appearing or talking. And when they do, most of them are not entertaining to watch; there's not enough dramatic relief to counter balance the dramatic tension. For a serious story this could work; except then you need good pacing and setup to sell the melodrama which it doesn't.

Thus, the episodes come off as a bit overly long and filler-ish.


That said, it's not a bad series; it's okay, and interesting enough to watch. But there's wasted potential and I understand why some people are done with the show. The plot is going nowhere fast while simultaneously feeling nonsensical despite the ample time it should have to sell the plot.
 

Dennis8K

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,161
I really liked the series. Yes, it did lose some steam. Yes, some of the writing on the characters is weak. Yes, it is being intentionally obtuse with its mysteries. Yes, the religion vs. atheism is hamfisted at times.

And it never really captured the grandeur of the first episode where they clearly spent most of the money but the show sill looked great. Yes even the Snake Baby birth scene looked amazing but unfortunately the CGI on Snek was very rough towards the end of the episode.

But overall it was very entertaining and I'm hoping they are smart enough to do a Season 2 justice.

And I have to say, even though some of the writing is bad and it is little too LOSTy for my taste, it is still amazing to me that we can have 10-hours of a Sci-Fi show with these kind of production values on TV.
 

Narroo

Banned
Feb 27, 2018
1,819
I really liked the series. Yes, it did lose some steam. Yes, some of the writing on the characters is weak. Yes, it is being intentionally obtuse with its mysteries.

It never really captured the grandeur of the first episode where they clearly spent most of the money but the show looked great. Yes even the Snake Baby birth scene looked amazing but unfortunately the CGI on Snek was very rough towards the end of the episode.

But overall it was very entertaining and I'm hoping they are smart enough to do a Season 2 justice.

And I have to say, even though some of the writing is bad and it is little too LOSTy for my taste, it is still amazing to me that we can have 10-hours of a Sci-Fi show with these kind of production values on TV.
I think this is a good concise summary of my opinions. If we're lucky, they'll throw in some better writing for next season.
 

a secret boss

Member
Oct 25, 2017
92
I was sad when Father and Mother died then happy again when the lander went through the other side of the planet 😆

I enjoyed the season.

there's your Paul vs. Campion
 

TheNatureBoy

Member
Nov 4, 2017
10,785
That was entertaining as hell to watch

Yup, the Mother/Father dynamic is easily the best part of the show.

Father was tight hearing about how the Creator 'downloaded' into Mother, lol. No android ass for him :(

I do kinda feel bad for him that he is trying to prove his usefulness to her and the kids.
 

TheNatureBoy

Member
Nov 4, 2017
10,785
It's a little bit bullshitty.

Time travel has to be involved. Did they travel in time when they emerged? Maybe they didn't go through the core (it's impossible), but it might have been a portal to the past or something like that.

And the cyborg in the jar might have been Mother in the future?

Anything is possible if Sol guides your actions. Only when we accept his divine guidance can we truly maximize our greatest potential.

No time travel, they did indeed go through the core and emerged in the tropical zone.
 

Kinthey

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
22,270
What exactly did the Sol guys give Marcus at the end of the last episode? Apparently it did a bad job at killing him
 

CatAssTrophy

Member
Dec 4, 2017
7,611
Texas
I didn't have any problems with the last episode, I thought it was great.

Though I do think they could have done more to set up Paul as the fundie believer considering how much awful things he's witness the Sol people do- you'd think he'd have his view of Sol shattered by all of that but somehow he's even more of a believer? Doesn't make sense, but if they really need him to be that character moving forward to be the opposite of Campion they could have done it more smoothly and given us little hints as to why he'd become even more of a believer.

I'm sure once mother/father/serpent encounter the boys again Paul won't believe the serpent was mother's child considering he thought it would be the new jesus.
 

Dennis8K

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,161
Anything is possible if Sol guides your actions. Only when we accept his divine guidance can we truly maximize our greatest potential.
praise-the-sun_o_2404559.jpg
 

KarmaCow

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,154
There was a lot of dumb shit but the de-evolving line was the final straw. It might be because I just saw that episode of Enterprise where Phlox decides to doom an entire species due to similarly idiotic ideas of evolution as a ladder but that line was too much for me. Nothing in the finale made me excited for a season 2 either outside of I guess Mother and Father not dying. Too many bullshit mysteries stacked on top of each other for me to care.
 

ReginaldXIV

Member
Nov 4, 2017
7,782
Minnesota
I'm cool with the show and my interest is piqued for season 2. I'm also glad that I like the kids especially Tempest sans Paul. Though Paul is suppose to be disliked so it's all good.
 

AniHawk

No Fear, Only Math
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,140
There was a lot of dumb shit but the de-evolving line was the final straw. It might be because I just saw that episode of Enterprise where Phlox decides to doom an entire species due to similarly idiotic ideas of evolution as a ladder but that line was too much for me. Nothing in the finale made me excited for a season 2 either outside of I guess Mother and Father not dying. Too many bullshit mysteries stacked on top of each other for me to care.

mystery stacking is a good descriptor.

if there is a point to this show, it appears to be how clever the writers thought they were in using mythology to craft mystery on top of mystery. and that's it. character development has not been subtle when it isn't meaningless. it's so hard to care for any one person either. the androids, and father in particular, are fine, but mother was a more interesting character before she was a killbot (i love the visual design of the killbot).

i would have watched a show that was all about the androids trying and failing to raise a family. i would have watched a show about the awesome apocalypse war on earth with necromancers and other androids. but this show lacks focus.
 

blanton

alt account
Banned
Jul 28, 2020
1,576
Watched the first two episodes this afternoon. Not really feeling it. Some stuff is just laughably bad to the point that I'm convinced it's intentionally campy.
 

Sobriquet

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
9,831
Wilmington, NC
I loved it, and I'll go wherever it takes me. Apparently the show runner has the entire arc mapped out over 5-6 seasons, but is able to truncate it if he has to.
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
Enjoyed the show, willing to make plenty of excuses for it.

There's just not enough weird sci-fi TV like this and it never got bad enough for me to want to stop. I was always curious where they were going with it. And i was often surprised!

The acting is hammy as hell. The writing and the directing got worse as the show went. Even the music seemed to get worse. Still, i got a kick out of it.

opening credits are a never-skip for me, GOAT-tier

I just want to say the clumsiest bit of filmmaking in the whole show was when they added that "it's morse code" memory voice over when Hunter needed Father's password. Absolutely baffling. There was so much clumsy filmmaking in this show but that took the cake for me. Like bro, you clearly laid the ground work out for that scene. You've got a lot of crazy shit going on but I think we got that one.

How 'bout instead you focus more on establishing how little dude digs through 15 feet of solid clay in about 3 hours with rotting corpse hands.
 
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i_am_ben

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,012
The one thing that really bugged me about the finale is that it felt that father took a giant leap forward in character developed to suddenly being a jealous husband.

It didn't feel natural. It felt as though we skipped like half a season of progression.
 

starcourt84

Member
Aug 4, 2019
223
I could not watch Westworld past the first three episodes but I absolutely loved Wolves. Was reading in that Collider article, they have enough story to do 5-6 seasons so that's exciting!
 

gforguava

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,695
The one thing that really bugged me about the finale is that it felt that father took a giant leap forward in character developed to suddenly being a jealous husband.

It didn't feel natural. It felt as though we skipped like half a season of progression.
The whole show had this writing problem. So, so much of the show is characters doing stuff and behaving in ways that are completely unmotivated by anything the show shows us.

Mother's initial trip to the hibernation bed makes no sense, she just finds it and decides to jack in and from then on she just starts acting like a completely different person. One can guess that her experience learning about Campion(her maker) and all that changed her but I have no idea why or in what way. But, hey, second half of the season needs this pregnancy story so gotta get Mother on her new narrative path now.

Same goes for the "voice of Sol" that turns Marcus on a dime and then at the very end of the season does the same to his son. Paul goes from being friends with Campion, breaking him out of the silo, escaping with everyone and then *pfft* he is a completely different person in the end. The voice is such a weak narrative choice that just allows the story to move in these awkward leaps that the show doesn't build to. Paul learns his mother is an impostor off-screen, for crying out loud.

And Father gets the same treatment, which is crazy because the show did set up his feelings of inadequacy but instead of following that thread from its inception to the finale they instead mindwipe Father in the run-up to the finale for no real purpose(remember that Morse code finger that they set up and then it didn't really matter?). The only thing mindwiping Father did was take the wind out of his story and then he kind of has get back to where he was heading in a single scene or two.

This show is amazingly bad at very basic A --> B storytelling.
 

NightShift

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,999
Australia
I liked the show overall but I have never seen a story where the issues multiply as consistently as they do in this. Each episode gets progressively worse to the point where I really don't believe they can course correct. I bet there is no way the answer to the mysteries of the planet and mother will be satisfying in the slightest.

Although it's one of those things where I dig the atmosphere and weirdness of it enough that I'm down to watch another season. They just need to get better at their character writing because holy fuck that last episode had a lot of baffling and frustrating shit.
 

Deleted member 21709

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
23,310
It's a little bit bullshitty.

Time travel has to be involved. Did they travel in time when they emerged? Maybe they didn't go through the core (it's impossible), but it might have been a portal to the past or something like that.

And the cyborg in the jar might have been Mother in the future?

I think that whatever is happening, happened before.
 

JaseC64

Enlightened
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,008
Strong Island NY
I just watched the last episode. I thought when they went into the lava...they somehow ended up in the "tropical zone" sort of like the ship was able to blast through to the other side lol. I guess they shot into the past somehow?

And that Snake...how was Mother able to birth it. Like she had a code inside her to bring it to life. Was Campion(the creator) responsible for such "code" or was it that once she logged into the pod, she caught a virus meant to do just that....make the "killbot" an even deadlier machine by making it give birth to an even deadlier "weapon"?

I honestly didn't like how Paul learns about his fake mom. This Sol thing is too OP. It means that Fake dad really heard the voice and wasn't insane. (When he "fought" himself it was Sol controlling him thus injuring himself to buy time for others)

But how is this Sol omnipresent ghost doing all this?

Now one scene has Fake dad find other atheist. This dude is half dead but can noscope heads hot everyone? Cmon. Sure its ironic he just killed his own kind but its like a bit out there.

This show was interesting for sure but its out there. Like reaching in certain situations.
 

Deleted member 21709

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
23,310
I just watched the last episode. I thought when they went into the lava...they somehow ended up in the "tropical zone" sort of like the ship was able to blast through to the other side lol. I guess they shot into the past somehow?

And that Snake...how was Mother able to birth it. Like she had a code inside her to bring it to life. Was Campion(the creator) responsible for such "code" or was it that once she logged into the pod, she caught a virus meant to do just that....make the "killbot" an even deadlier machine by making it give birth to an even deadlier "weapon"?

I honestly didn't like how Paul learns about his fake mom. This Sol thing is too OP. It means that Fake dad really heard the voice and wasn't insane. (When he "fought" himself it was Sol controlling him thus injuring himself to buy time for others)

But how is this Sol omnipresent ghost doing all this?

Now one scene has Fake dad find other atheist. This dude is half dead but can noscope heads hot everyone? Cmon. Sure its ironic he just killed his own kind but its like a bit out there.

This show was interesting for sure but its out there. Like reaching in certain situations.

Didn't they end up in the tropical zone? I don't see how they time travelled.. they just went through the planet. Why is everyone thinking time travel?
 

JaseC64

Enlightened
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,008
Strong Island NY
Didn't they end up in the tropical zone? I don't see how they time travelled.. they just went through the planet. Why is everyone thinking time travel?
I just read it here lol. My first thought was they just went to tropical zone by accident. They meant to die obviously unless they purposely did this to get away from the kids?
 

just_myles

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,453
Started out great but fell flat on its face. A lot of the story points were obvious and sometimes stupid. I love the ship designs though. Love the opening.
 
OP
OP
RatskyWatsky

RatskyWatsky

Are we human or are we dancer?
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,931
Tidbits:

"There'll be more flashbacks [in Season 2] and perhaps some present day Earth peeks as well to see what might be going on there after everything's over, because there are still necromancers on Earth. They were left behind, most of them. The Mithraic obviously didn't want to bring any with them. They were done with them, didn't trust them. So they left them on Earth except for the one they found waiting for them on Kepler-22b."

we'll see another [pentagonal temple] in Season 2, and I think we'll get a lot more kind of into what it is and how it works, and all that good stuff."

Marcus was already a former child soldier who then changed his face and spent 12 years pretending to be this religious captain and has all of these issues to begin with, and then he starts hearing the voice and goes where he goes. I think that's kind of a clue, the idea that if you really look at it, there is some connection to be made in terms of who hears the voice and when, and how many… Really, I think only one person can hear it at a time."

"It remains to be seen, but it was always going to be 10 [episodes] for Season 1. Season 2, we'll see. It could potentially be eight, but we'll see. Eight or 10. I think eight is the new 10 now is what I'm hearing for streaming… I think eight is enough. I think that's about as short as I could go and still feel like we're telling a complete novel of a story."

more here

collider.com

Raised by Wolves Season 2 Story Teased by Showrunner

Raised by Wolves showrunner Aaron Guzikowski reveals what fans of the HBO Max series can expect in Season 2, which may only be 8 episodes.
 

Deleted member 21709

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
23,310
I just read it here lol. My first thought was they just went to tropical zone by accident. They meant to die obviously unless they purposely did this to get away from the kids?

They wanted to kill the worm I believe, I don't think they expected the ship to survive the trip.. unless they calculated it to survive and thought the heat would kill the worm. But going by their reaction I'd say it is the former.
 

gforguava

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,695
Why is everyone thinking time travel?
Well nothing is conclusive but you have stuff like:
  • Cave painting showing Mother and Father arriving with their embryos.
  • Mother gives birth to a flying serpent...on a planet with mysterious serpent skeletons.
  • The weird "devolved" humans.
  • The weird metal "Tarot" that gives Mother visions of a milk-spewing being with a Space Jockey style mask.

Once again, not conclusive in the least, but it definitely reeks of "These characters/events are the beginning of a cycle" nonsense. And considering that the finale was titled "The Beginning" and knowing this show and its modus operandi, it doesn't seem particularly farfetched that ending "The Beginning" with Father and Mother and a Serpent in a lush land is meant to be a reference to Adam, Eve, the Serpent, and the Garden of Eden.

And it is all too easy to imagine watching a season 2 where Mother and Father are trying to get back to Campion and the rest only for the show to have the two separate storylines reach the same location and , the horror!, Mother and Father realize they are in the past.
 

beelulzebub

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,583
Yes, very sad that people get to keep their jobs. /s
I work in TV. Projects I work on fail all the time, I merely move on to another one, as do most others. TV and film is just a constant hustle where crews get built up and torn down regardless of whether the show gets another season or not. Didn't this season wrap production in 2018? Hell, just about everybody has moved on already, and hopefully are scraping by OK since very little is currently shooting.

Don't have much to say about the finale aside from WOOF that was such a fucking mess. At least this show was worth it for that fucking excellent pilot episode. I'll let y'all let me know if season 2 is a waste of time.
 
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Oct 27, 2017
1,257
I really liked this show but I wish this episode felt like more of a season finale. It didn't really answer anything, just piled more questions on top.
 

CreeperBlocks

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,081
Canada
I want this show to get more strange and uncomfortable. I am ready for season two. I wasn't Expecting THAT coming out of mother like WTF. The minute I saw the "baby" I was like... okay I'm in let's get more weird.

The most enjoyable sci-fi show I've watched in awhile. I don't want things explained to me in the first season what's the mystery in that? Did we get everything explained in Lost in the first season? Fuck No. It's about the journey not the destination right now.
 

orava

Alt Account
Banned
Jun 10, 2019
1,316
"De-evolved" was the only cringey part but otherwise 10/10 show.