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Put random encounters back in my JRPG
- Thread starter Dreamboum
- Start date
What about a non-random encounter system makes it so you can't see the general strength of the enemy and plan for them?
In a Xenoblade game for example, you can clearly see the enemy's levels floating above their head from a distance. How is that being blindsided as opposed to walking into an empty space and suddenly being in a battle?
Do it like Bravely Default and I'm definitely in. Otherwise I'm okay with the industry leaving random encounters behind
I don't miss random encounters. Most are poorly balanced and being able to see what Im fighting to see if its worth killing or not is pretty appreciated. The transition from the overworld to the battle field to press escape takes more time than just running away from enemies most of the time anyway and there is still ways to outmaneuver enemies with items so yeah. Don't hate random encounters but I feel it's not for me.
Outrunning a Gyarados while surfing on your Walrein actually sounds pretty amazing... Pokemon overworlds need more Pokemon in them.
I can't imagine Paper Mario with random encounters. It seems so... lifeless.
Too many RPGs have done a decent enough job of placing enemies on the playing field for me to ever want to go back to those jarring random encounters.
Agree with op 100%. Random battles are only bad if they're excessive for significant portion of playtime
OP, I love you.
And yeah, either go TWEWY/Bravely Default or go oldschool. Most games without random encounters either make it so you have/want to fight all/the majority of the fights anyway or tease you with the idea of avoiding monsters without having proper tools/level design for that.
People like the illusion, I guess.
And yeah, either go TWEWY/Bravely Default or go oldschool. Most games without random encounters either make it so you have/want to fight all/the majority of the fights anyway or tease you with the idea of avoiding monsters without having proper tools/level design for that.
People like the illusion, I guess.
Also, I like being able to go out into the field and spot the rare monster I'm trying to track down instead of initiating 50+ long ass battle transitions to see that no, it's not the rare monster yet.
・Not sure how random encounters make the exploration of an area more enjoyable.
・A lot of monsters are animal-like creatures, so it kinda makes sense for them to wander around. Anyway, this is not the case necessarily. I am playing Dragon Quest 11 right now and you can see monsters sleeping and doing other stuff, so it comes down to design.
・Also comes down to design, good developers (again DQ 11 does a perfect job with this) can find the right balance between the number of enemies on screen and size of the area.
・Can you give examples of games where the areas are so cramped with enemies? Maybe i am jaded by DQ11 right now, but you can move faster than 95% of monsters, so you can actively avoid fighting whenever you want.
Pretty much totally agreed. Time ta bring the axe down on visible baddie encounters outside of action/rpgs! Their time has come an they must die!
I can feel DQ11 sucking somewhat because of those, just like 9 did and 7 3DS an ya know what? That bites! Feeling a game you're pumped for isn't gonna be as good as it could be due to one simple "modernization" (despite visible encounters being just as old as randoms themselves) really stinks!
I can feel DQ11 sucking somewhat because of those, just like 9 did and 7 3DS an ya know what? That bites! Feeling a game you're pumped for isn't gonna be as good as it could be due to one simple "modernization" (despite visible encounters being just as old as randoms themselves) really stinks!
I think having to fight a encounter i could see but failed to avoid because i was bad, was blocking my path, decided to do a 180° when i was trying to get past it or whatever other fun scnenario is one of the things i hate the most in rpg, yes more than random encounters.
Personally i think the only gendra that still make good use of random encounters are drpg, but ultimately i do find the other option just as, if not more frustrating sometimes, i know some games are smart and make it so the worthless encounters will just die on contact or stay away, but when they don't it's annoying as hell. OP complaint is valid as far as i'm concerned, it's almost always badly done, but then again both suffer from this, random encounters stigmata is overblown though.
Also alot of games with random encounters have items to reduce or increase the chance of them happening, or flat out making one happen or protect you from them for a certain amount of time. Bravery Default was bad but had a interesting way to deal with them.
Personally i think the only gendra that still make good use of random encounters are drpg, but ultimately i do find the other option just as, if not more frustrating sometimes, i know some games are smart and make it so the worthless encounters will just die on contact or stay away, but when they don't it's annoying as hell. OP complaint is valid as far as i'm concerned, it's almost always badly done, but then again both suffer from this, random encounters stigmata is overblown though.
Also alot of games with random encounters have items to reduce or increase the chance of them happening, or flat out making one happen or protect you from them for a certain amount of time. Bravery Default was bad but had a interesting way to deal with them.
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YEP. coupled with a huge stretch of land to traverse. It gets better after you get the sabrecat.
Sometimes I think I do prefer random encounters... With on-screen enemies I always feel compelled to slay every monster in sight. I hate when I enter a little side room or walk a few feet away and suddenly all the enemies have respawned. Must... stay... CLEAR!
Bravely Default's encounter slider is game breaking. That's not a good way to design encounters in a game.
I'm fine with either approach as long as they're well implemented and balanced. I do prefer a good implementation of visual encounters over random encounters as sometimes I just want to explore/backtrack without being bothered, but random encounters with skills/items that lowers the encounter rate are good enough too. Generally speaking, I think I've played more games with good implementations of random encounter design (considering balance, challenge, etc) than visual ones, though there have been some good examples of the latter recently.
Games with bad implementations of them are almost equally annoying (very high encounter rates vs enemies constantly blocking the way in cramped locations with no real way to avoid them), though I have to give the edge to high encounter rates being worse as they just really kill the pacing and make you not want to explore.
I also agree with this.
Games with bad implementations of them are almost equally annoying (very high encounter rates vs enemies constantly blocking the way in cramped locations with no real way to avoid them), though I have to give the edge to high encounter rates being worse as they just really kill the pacing and make you not want to explore.
I also agree with this.
I agree that placing enemies carelessly in a cramped area is crap, and not necessarily a better solution, but no. No more random encounters. They're the ultimate pace-killer and are just a complete buzzkill. There's just no quick or phoned-in way to go about it without it showing. We need visible enemies, but placed with care in regard to space and map.
Yeah same here. RPG by default for me are RPGs from Japan. Anything else is the "non standard" and gets an identifying prefix.
Yeah same here. RPG by default for me are RPGs from Japan. Anything else is the "non standard" and gets an identifying prefix.
Given that I fight 99 percent of the time. I dont really much care. The main differrnce between visible and random encounters for me is that I have a visualization of how many I still have to fight to get through versus either getting lucky barely having any enemies or being bombarded.
I'd prefer the former over the chance of being bombarded.
Seeing enemies on the map also adds to the personality of the game. It populates an otherwise completely empty place. An empty place where a million enemies are actually fighting you takes you out of the experience. A visual representation is 100x better.
Also, random battle now felt like a hardware limitation than a design choice. I thought the chrono games were amazing to have implemented this.
I'd prefer the former over the chance of being bombarded.
Seeing enemies on the map also adds to the personality of the game. It populates an otherwise completely empty place. An empty place where a million enemies are actually fighting you takes you out of the experience. A visual representation is 100x better.
Also, random battle now felt like a hardware limitation than a design choice. I thought the chrono games were amazing to have implemented this.
Holy water only works on lower level monsters, which is never the case when you reach a new area unless you've been grinding.
That said, I can see how it can be annoying. I played Chrono Trigger recently and it's pretty apparent here. It's annoying because you feel like the game gives you a chance to avoid encounters, but it is almost always impossible. Battles are piss easy so it feels like the game is wasting your time.
Give the player complete control is better than any other way encounter rates could be designed. For players that don't want to use it can just leave it at default setting.
Hell, I want the option even in non-random enc games. Like give me an option to decrease enemy numbers to 0 on the field if I want to.
Nope. It completely breaks dungeon design. It's the devs giving up and giving the player a cheat code. It's something that should be locked behind a late game or NG+ wall, not be given out at the start.
Nope. It lets the player choose how they want to play. Stop trying to force your way of playing on everyone.
Random encounters only work when the fights are very very difficult.
They lifted the mechanic from Wizardry but then neutered the difficulty so much that they are just dull. In Wizardry, every encounter was a very real possibility of a party wipe, which with limited save capability (only in town) could cause you to lose literally hours of progress. If you play the original versions of Wizardry dead characters could be *wiped from your save file forever* if they were eradicated. This created a level of tension you would not believe, and made walking down hallways waiting for that next random battle incredibly nerve wracking.
They lifted the mechanic from Wizardry but then neutered the difficulty so much that they are just dull. In Wizardry, every encounter was a very real possibility of a party wipe, which with limited save capability (only in town) could cause you to lose literally hours of progress. If you play the original versions of Wizardry dead characters could be *wiped from your save file forever* if they were eradicated. This created a level of tension you would not believe, and made walking down hallways waiting for that next random battle incredibly nerve wracking.
I can live with Turn Based combat, but there's no meaningful reason to continue to utilize such an antiquated design.
Honestly, what benefit is there to wandering an area randomly to engage in combat when you can grind freely by seeing them wandering around the map?
Honestly, what benefit is there to wandering an area randomly to engage in combat when you can grind freely by seeing them wandering around the map?
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Then hide it behind a super easy mode that unlocks a bunch of cheats. It's not a substitute for real encounter design. There's all sorts of things I'll use cheat engine for to speed up a game, but I wouldn't even suggest they actually be a core element of the design.
op makes some good point. i think what bravely default did (encounter slide) is a better solution than putting enemies and map that you have to dodge
at the same time you'll have to deal with empty maps, that weren't a problem back in prerendered background jrpgs and the 3ds one but it would be on bigger console rpgs
at the same time you'll have to deal with empty maps, that weren't a problem back in prerendered background jrpgs and the 3ds one but it would be on bigger console rpgs
Often you can see the enemies forming and just run past them (although in a few spots they do spawn in a way that blocks the corridor, making them basically obligatory battles disguised as random enemies). Alternatively, even when that isn't possible, you can hit them to guarantee a first strike, while with random encounters it'd be just luck.
Lol, real encounter design. Seems like you have epeen issues, even in a single player game.
How does someone else using this encounter slider affect your experience?
Dungeon crawlers and blobbers are like the one genre that uses random encounters to any real effect. If there's no threat of wipe or any real danger of running out of resources, they don't serve much purpose.
Now this is a weird response. This entire thread is about game design. Sorry, but having optional cheat codes to bypass encounters is not a good solution for the limitations of random encounters. Put them in the game if you want, but it's not something to point to.
User banned (48 hours): Personal attacks.
Again, how does someone else using sliders affect your experience?
The only weird responses here are yours given your mental issues about how everyone should suffer through and play it just like you.
If you've been following this thread, most people are complaining about random encounters, and Bravely slider is one of the few ways that people find random encounters acceptable.
I never said it did? The entire point is that Bravely Default's encounter slider is a cop-out and not a good defense of random encounters. If you have to completely break random encounters for it to be palatable, that's not a good thing! I don't really care how anyone played that game. Or any game for that matter, nothing I've said is about players.
And yeah, drop this "mental issues" garbage please.
"It's better because I can run in a straight line from start to my destination" is a dumb argument when you consider it would still take far longer due to having random encounters every few steps.
I'll put it this way: there are few rpgs that have on field monsters that have an unreasonable amount of them. And too many rpgs that have random encounters that have an unreasonable amount of them.
So no, keep that shit in the past where it belongs.
I'll put it this way: there are few rpgs that have on field monsters that have an unreasonable amount of them. And too many rpgs that have random encounters that have an unreasonable amount of them.
So no, keep that shit in the past where it belongs.
Yes, you do care about how others play. Coz otherwise we wouldn't be having this argument. Since you have the choice of not using the slider at all, you can play this game just like any other game with random encounters. But your problem is others can use the slider, and somehow that makes your experience worse.
Get help.
Uh no. I've said none of this. Learn to read. And please stop accusing people of having mental issues.
No thanks.
Random encounters were by far the worst aspects of old-school JRPGs. They're dying for good reason.
I can only tolerate them in Etrian Odyssey these days. In that series, you can actually plan around them and adjust the rate if you want.
Random encounters were by far the worst aspects of old-school JRPGs. They're dying for good reason.
I can only tolerate them in Etrian Odyssey these days. In that series, you can actually plan around them and adjust the rate if you want.
It's clear from your posts what you are saying. Stop trying to back pedal now.
If you don't care for the slider, just don't use it. Other like it, so let them use it. What's your problem?
