• Light/Dark
  • Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.

PS5 and Xbox Series speculation launch thread |OT9| - For flops sake!

Status
Not open for further replies.
Reader mode
MrKlaw

MrKlaw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,038
Thorrgal said:
Well, we'll see what kind of games MS delivers. If theres a more steady flow of AA games, which would make sense for a subscription model like GP, then it wouldn't matter as much if they have to run in this gen's hardware
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Good point. But at some level if they're trying to sell a 4k monster, they need to show people why.

If they're very scalable for a couple of years, that could look like high end PCs where its 4k native and 60-120fps. Not something particuarly exciting to me and doesn't necessarily push me to update from a X1S. But I know lots of people would be interested in that
 
Thera

Thera

Banned
Feb 28, 2019
12,876
France
Tonky said:
Note that some of the early PS5 exclusives likely began development as PS4 games and then were shifted to target PS5, perhaps even cross-gen. I don't think we'll see something built "for the ground up" for next-gen until 2021.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I don't think so. The oldest first party game from first party studio is Horizon. The sequel wasn't planned on PS4 so, no.
What is important to keep in mind isn't the hardware but game engine. Most game engine are iteration of themselves. The RAGE engine, for exemple, is used by Rockstar since 2006.
gundamkyoukai said:
They will be build from the ground up once they had PS5 in mind only even if they started years ago or shifted .
For eg if any game used the SSD fully even if it started as a PS4 game would then become from the ground up since that has a bigger impact than gfx.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yep
 
Diarrhea Day-Lewis

Diarrhea Day-Lewis

Member
Oct 27, 2017
20,755
d3ckard said:
I understand he said for next two years when interview was a couple of days ago.

""As our content comes out over the next year, two years, all of our games, sort of like PC, will play up and down that family of devices," Booty explains."
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I don't understand what you're trying to say. Are you trying to say he said this in the waning days of 2019? That was 10 days ago. I really doubt he meant two years from the day he said it, why would he? It would be 1-2 years from the day XSX is released to public. I could be misinterpreting tho.
 
d3ckard

d3ckard

Member
Dec 7, 2017
212
bonesawisready5 said:
I don't understand what you're trying to say. Are you trying to say he said this in the waning days of 2019? That was 10 days ago. I really doubt he meant two years from the day he said it, why would he? It would be 1-2 years from the day XSX is released to public. I could be misinterpreting tho.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

That I think. He basically said content will keep coming for next two years and selected titles(Halo Infinite) will be pimped up on XSX. I doubt you will see only cross gen titles in 2022.
 
zedox

zedox

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,215
bonesawisready5 said:
I don't understand what you're trying to say. Are you trying to say he said this in the waning days of 2019? That was 10 days ago. I really doubt he meant two years from the day he said it, why would he? It would be 1-2 years from the day XSX is released to public. I could be misinterpreting tho.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
The interview was at X019.

"That confidence came through in every interview, and casual chat, we had at Microsoft's X019 meeting late last year."
 

Deleted member 59519

Banned
Aug 26, 2019
6,342
gundamkyoukai said:
They will be build from the ground up once they had PS5 in mind only even if they started years ago or shifted .
For eg if any game used the SSD fully even if it started as a PS4 game would then become from the ground up since that has a bigger impact than gfx.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
That's not true, it depends on whether they had time to actually redesign the gameplay or world around the SSD. If a given developer is making a PS4 game and then switches the target platform to PS5 2 years into a 3 year development cycle, they may not have time to rework things to actually take advantage of the new features in ways that the PS4 couldn't handle.

To me, "built for the ground up" means that the game was conceptualized based on the next-gen hardware. Gameplay and world systems were designed around it.
 
Anastasis

Anastasis

Teyvat Traveler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,603
The Brad Sams report "Loading is a minute faster on the Series X and the Xbox One S"? Doesn't tell us much.

I looked up load times and it seems GTAV is the only one I see that had constantly longer than a minute load times on the S (according to https://www.windowscentral.com/xbox-one-x-loading-times). So the series X would still load GTAV in the 40 seconds range if you take a minute off?
 
gundamkyoukai

gundamkyoukai

Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,088
Tonky said:
That's not true, it depends on whether they had time to actually redesign the gameplay or world around the SSD. If a given developer is making a PS4 game and then switches the target platform 2 years into a 3 year development cycle, they may not have time to rework things to actually take advantage of the new features in ways that the PS4 couldn't handle.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...


Which is why i used the SSD as a eg .
If they change mid development but then make the game around the SSD it would be like a ground up game.
Even if the gfx not doing so fully.
 

M3rcy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
702
Windows Central reported that there would be no Scarlett exclusives at launch months ago.

It makes sense in the context of MS's (apparent) overall strategy, which extends past the console space. It will mean PS5 should have more true next-gen experiences during that first year.

I am a strong proponent of generational shifts when it comes to software support, but the fact that MS is effectively de-coupling their push for this transition, via exclusive first-party titles, from the launch period of the hardware that will run these eventual next-gen exclusive games is an interesting one. It basically reduces the scale of the disruption of the market by the new hardware launching by spreading the full impact over a longer time period. I wonder how publishers/developers feel about this.
 
Last edited:
disco_potato

disco_potato

Member
Nov 16, 2017
3,145
Dictator said:
Not what I wanted to say. I wanted to say, rhetorically, do not expect it to be better than what we currently have in terms of ray per pixel.


AMDs patent does not address things NV did not implement, since our knowledge of the HW implementation NV has is surpisingly limited. We cannot say things with such certainty. What can be done or not done with RT core in Turing and what is possible is informed by what the APIs allow. We know you can program custom interesection - just the question is the performance consideration for it. Also RT LODing - I have talked with a dev who work on an RT game about it. They did indeed look into its implementation but found the performance boost not of great significance in the current API.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Don't the patents suggest TMUs handling the outer traversal loop? NV doesn't/didn't.
As for dxr I remember something about BHV being black boxed with no box query available, hits from diffused reflections being completely scattered resulting in poor code convergence. Which I think the last one ties to TMUs and the outer traversal loop.

Are these not valid anymore or do they just not matter?
 
Proven

Proven

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
5,841
I've heard a lot of people in the know that say the Series X UI will be a continuation of the Xbox One X's UI and it will just be a lot faster.
 
Dictator

Dictator

Digital Foundry
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
4,930
Berlin, 'SCHLAND
disco_potato said:
Don't the patents suggest TMUs handling the outer traversal loop? NV doesn't/didn't.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
We know how AMD does it via the patent. But we do not know a lot about RT core set up and such is what I meant.
disco_potato said:
As for dxr I remember something about BHV being black boxed with no box query available, hits from diffused reflections being completely scattered resulting in poor code convergence.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
That is just an inherent quality of divergent rays - they are always more expensive as far as I know. Nothing to do with the API.
 
Thera

Thera

Banned
Feb 28, 2019
12,876
France
Tonky said:
I don't expect Horizon until 2021 though.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I know, but ATM, we have no clue on which studio will bringing an exclusivity. I don't think GT7 will made it at launch, they will release a special GT Sports version.
There is the blue point game, but we don't know if it is a launch title (and it is not from a first party studio).
We will see something from SIE Japan Studio and I think we will have a Knack 3 (design from the ground to showcase some features of PS5).
 
DriftingSpirit

DriftingSpirit

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,897
AegonSnake said:
not a fan of this strategy. the entire point of the first party studios is to take risks. to make games deemed too ambitious by third party publishers. to release expensive AAA games on a platform with a small userbase when no one else would. thats the whole point.

i can understand halo being cross gen. it started in 2015. but everything else until 2022? what the hell. note to phil, you dont owe the xbox one owners anything. you gave them 7 years. if there are some late adopters buying your console in the last year, they have 7 years of games to play. you dont have to keep supporting them for another two years because they didnt bother buying your console 7 years ago.

what about the people who buy your last gen console in 2021 or 2022? are you going to then starting making cross gen games until 2024?

i am not buying it tbh. no one is this stupid. there is no way they are putting out games that are handicapped by 1.6 ghz jaguar cpus, 1.3 tflops gpus, and 40mbps ssd read speeds. especially when sony comes out with next gen only exclusives that make every last gen game look dated by comparison.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
They got to support Game Pass.
 
riotous

riotous

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,321
Seattle
DriftingSpirit said:
They got to support Game Pass.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
And their PC strategy.

I'm getting now why people think Lockhart might come out down the road; that's an interesting approach. Wonder if they will treat Xbox One S as their "lowest your game HAS to support and corresponding PCs" and then move that up to Lockhart.

Although surely some of their games will be able to support older PCs for a long time; they do have popular PC franchises that aren't console ports.
 

Deleted member 8196

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
9,859
unknown.png


Is this what PS5 SSD is going to perform or better? Since Sony said that they have the never seen before SSD solution.
 
riotous

riotous

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,321
Seattle
Stygr said:
Is this what PS5 SSD is going to perform or better? Since Sony said that they have the never seen before SSD solution.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

They'll probably be able to fill their RAM so fast that within 1 second they can get more than enough data to render an initial area in any game. They can then background load the rest. *

The only thing then holding back load times is if a game needs to do a lot of calculations (procedural stuff, randomized stuff) or if it isn't designed to only load an initial area on screen and instead is designed to fill the RAM. Which might take like.. 2-3 seconds lol

* this partly depends on the CPU usage of the SSD.. but that might be part of their secret SSD sauce, low CPU usage.. although games can do loads when they don't need as much CPU too.
 
androvsky

androvsky

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,501
Bits N Pieces said:
If Xbox games are going to continue to be released on PC, which they will, then supporting the XB1 is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I don't see how, it's common for there to be a minimum spec jump when next-gen games come out. Almost nobody has a PC with a CPU as bad as the one in current consoles, most games don't use the extra cores that well. A lot of PCs still only having 4 cores might be an issue going forward this gen, but the single-threaded performance jump will be huge. If it was just a matter of the GPU, then sure, it'd still be a reasonable low end on PC even today.

On the other hand, if Sony's the only one actually putting out next-gen required games next year, then Unreal and Unity are also probably still assuming a modest baseline.


Stygr said:
Is this what PS5 SSD is going to perform or better? Since Sony said that they have the never seen before SSD solution.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It was faster than anything on PC as of April last year, before the PCIE 4.0 SSDs came out.
 

Deleted member 59519

Banned
Aug 26, 2019
6,342
AegonSnake said:
not a fan of this strategy. the entire point of the first party studios is to take risks. to make games deemed too ambitious by third party publishers. to release expensive AAA games on a platform with a small userbase when no one else would. thats the whole point.

i can understand halo being cross gen. it started in 2015. but everything else until 2022? what the hell. note to phil, you dont owe the xbox one owners anything. you gave them 7 years. if there are some late adopters buying your console in the last year, they have 7 years of games to play. you dont have to keep supporting them for another two years because they didnt bother buying your console 7 years ago.

what about the people who buy your last gen console in 2021 or 2022? are you going to then starting making cross gen games until 2024?

i am not buying it tbh. no one is this stupid. there is no way they are putting out games that are handicapped by 1.6 ghz jaguar cpus, 1.3 tflops gpus, and 40mbps ssd read speeds. especially when sony comes out with next gen only exclusives that make every last gen game look dated by comparison.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Listen man, if Halo 2 at 12K/500fps isn't next-gen for you then idk what to tell you
 
Navid

Navid

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,018
BitsandBytes said:
Ah, in that case February for Sony and April for Microsoft. At least for RAM, GPU, CPU specs.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Thanks for the info, that's far earlier than I remember in that case...

For some reason I always thought they talked about spec in very general terms (like for example we are using x86 architecture or our RAM is GDDR5) without releasing detailed info like clock speeds or CU counts until between E3 and actual release.

So I guess I was just wrong.
 
Burrman

Burrman

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,633
d3ckard said:
Gamers for years: Ms kills old consoles too fast, they're not respecting their customers.
MS changes strategy.
Gamers: we need next-gen games now, you bastards!

2 years is until 2021 ends. Nothing truly next-gen is showing up sooner that Holidays 2021(as always...). I'm good.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Ya I feel like I'm in la la land. This is a very pro consumer move. I thought most here would be happy about this news
 
panda-zebra

panda-zebra

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,735
Mitchman1411 said:
It's typically only done to protect the brain during neural surgery, but if you want it enough, make sure you have pentobarbital or thiopental at hand, someone to make sure you get food stuff (typically through a tube) and can wake you up the day after the reveal. Side effects can be significant systemic adverse effects such as completely lose respiratory drive and require mechanical ventilation, so best done by professionals. I'm not but I'm sure I could wing it :)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I'm sorely tempted, it's getting to be too much. But who's going to make sure my digits are up to the task when I wake up? I know if I don't run for a good few weeks, next time I go out I'm all kinds of broken and have the aerobic capacity of a small asthmatic child. I'm not seeing this waking up on ps5 morning thing working out too well if I can't even R1 thanks to resistive triggers. Just gonna have to stick it out like everyone else, bah.
 
Pasha

Pasha

Banned
Jan 27, 2018
3,018
Stygr said:
unknown.png


Is this what PS5 SSD is going to perform or better? Since Sony said that they have the never seen before SSD solution.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Those SSDs need heatsinks on them because they get so hot, I doubt Sony or MS will bother with a solution like this since actual game loading speeds don't benefit a lot from just a high sequential read speeds.
The only reason I could see them going in with this is if they want near instant suspend/resume for multiple games.
 
foxbeldin

foxbeldin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
747
Does anyone think they could reduce the bom by not packaging a controller with every console, since current gen controllers seem to be forward compatible ?
 
Kyoufu

Kyoufu

Member
Oct 26, 2017
16,582
foxbeldin said:
Does anyone think they could reduce the bom by not packaging a controller with every console, since current gen controllers seem to be forward compatible ?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

That'd be assuming buyers have last gen controllers at hand, which then means any new features on the new controller would not be supported as much because developers can't rely on every next gen owner having that controller as well. Controllers probably don't cost much to make anyway.
 

TitanicFall

Member
Nov 12, 2017
8,262
M3rcy said:
Windows Central reported that there would be no Scarlett exclusives at launch months ago.

It makes sense in the context of MS's (apparent) overall strategy, which extends past the console space. It will mean PS5 should have more true next-gen experiences during that first year.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I'm not saying you're wrong, but how do we know the same won't be true about Sony's first party titles? They are still going to want to support the PS4 over the next few years.
 
BitsandBytes

BitsandBytes

Member
Dec 16, 2017
4,576
Navid said:
Thanks for the info, that's far earlier than I remember in that case...

For some reason I always thought they talked about spec in very general terms (like for example we are using x86 architecture or our RAM is GDDR5) without releasing detailed info like clock speeds or CU counts until between E3 and actual release.

So I guess I was just wrong.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

No problem, Navid. I should correct the Xbox One specs reveal to May though. For some reason I think the full Series X reveal will be in April and mixed them up!
 
Reader mode
Status
Not open for further replies.