• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
  • We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.

Doran

Member
Jun 9, 2018
1,847
Per my understanding, if Mexico signed a safe third country agreement, Central American migrants would no longer be able to cross the U.S.-Mexico border to surrender to U.S. authorities and stay in the country while they await asylum proceedings.

Again, I'm not saying if this policy ultimately benefits the US or not for the reasons you cite or if it will be effective in practice, but it is/was a current demand from the Trump administration that Mexico had historically been opposed.

Exactly, and I don't know if it is beneficial for anyone either. When I brought it up I was speculating, that would be the only "real" thing he could do.

Most likely scenario is both countries pay some lip service to "working together and doing something", nothing actually changes and Trump pretends he won some grand victory.
 

ChippyTurtle

Banned
Oct 13, 2018
4,773
1. We don't have any details

2. Articulate. Why does a safe third country agreement (which, again, is PURELY SPECULATION being repeated in this thread) benefit the United States? Keep in mind that this doesn't actually mean people won't continue to try to enter the US by crossing through mexico. Keep in mind that IF this has the "desired" impact, it has consequences for the population growth rates in the US. It affects the supply of unskilled labor in agriculture and construction industries. And so on. Can you explain the benefits? Do you have studies and figures and data? Or is it simply whether or not immigration is bad or good?

Racists don't like migrants at the border applying for asylum and being required to hold them while processing. Third safe country allows Trump to toss the migrants and force them to be handled in Mexico instead in camps at the border.
 

Cation

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
3,603
Really anyone who hates trump doesn't see this as a victory

And anyone who loves trump, has been thinking he has been winning all this time.

So nothing is gonna come out of this aside form a slight bump in stock prices on Monday
 

Bliman

User Requested Ban
Banned
Jan 21, 2019
1,443
Really anyone who hates trump doesn't see this as a victory

And anyone who loves trump, has been thinking he has been winning all this time.

So nothing is gonna come out of this aside form a slight bump in stock prices on Monday
I hate Trump and I still see it as a win for him.
 

ChippyTurtle

Banned
Oct 13, 2018
4,773
Forgot to mention, this agreement means anyone seeking refugee or asylum status is barred from seeking it in the U.S if they arrive from Mexico. They are required to ask Mexico for the status and are Mexico's responsibility. Tbh, it truly effectively cuts off the migrants convoys that went past Mexico to the U.S border to register for asylum.
 

ChippyTurtle

Banned
Oct 13, 2018
4,773
It won't stop people attempting to sneak to the U.S but those highly visble and publicized convoys of people arriving seeking asylum status, there's no point in them under the Third Safe Country agreement.
 

Ogodei

One Winged Slayer
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,256
Coruscant
AMLO is weak if the Mexicans blinked, but he appeased him with the new NAFTA bs so wouldn't be surprised. American public opinion, Democrats, and even major Republicans were against this move....why appease a bully when you had a lot going for you?

AMLO's concerned about his own politics. It could be that Mexican opinion polling is against the asylum seekers more heavily than it is in the US. AMLO's good on economics and may not be as good on other things.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,762
Here: (Spanish) https://www.elfinanciero.com.mx/nac...-unidos-para-evitar-la-aplicacion-arancelaria

Looking for an English source, since this one is light on details but it states that Mexico will allow asylum seekers to wait in Mexico while the US processes their requests, which historically has not been accepted.

That is very different than Safe Third Country status. Very very different. And the article states it's to help with the humanitarian effort.
 

Doran

Member
Jun 9, 2018
1,847
That is very different than Safe Third Country status. Very very different. And the article states it's to help with the humanitarian effort.

Yeah it seems like they want to basically catch and release into Mexico instead of into the US and the National Guard (on the southern Mexico border) thing that was already talked about this week. Tariff threat remains if Mexico doesn't keep up their end with a 90 day review process.
 

Casa

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,520
I hate Trump and I still see it as a win for him.
No, you don't hate Trump. In literally every Trump related thread I read, you're in there spinning everything as a positive or "win" for him. Then you feign ignorance or do the old "I hate Trump but..." shtick to make it seem like you aren't.

It's insufferable. Just admit you support him.
 

Trup1aya

Literally a train safety expert
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,356
I don't understand, how is Mexico going to just get people to stop trying to cross the border? Curious what they told Trump and how much of a "wink wink yeah sure we're going to do that eye roll" was involved.

They aren't. Trump just threatened with crazy talk, Mexico does some theatrics to appear to comply with Trumps terms, Trump touts a victory.

Ultimately nothing changes beyond the US walking back from sabotaging it's own economy - but people desperate for a Trump "win" will think something happened.
 

Deleted member 25702

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
370
The idea that Trump got a favorable/desired outcome in a contract negotiation would be considered a win for/to Trump (not necessarily to the people of this board or the country), and that's not exclusive to the idea that this is not a net-benefit to the country. He'll be able to spin it as a win to the people who want wins for him and it'll do pretty much nothing at all for the good of the country. These two things don't need to be argued against each other on semantics, I would think.
 

Killthee

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,169
Here: (Spanish) https://www.elfinanciero.com.mx/nac...-unidos-para-evitar-la-aplicacion-arancelaria

Looking for an English source, since this one is light on details but it states that Mexico will allow asylum seekers to wait in Mexico while the US processes their requests, which historically has not been accepted.
They've been doing this for 6 months already, this isn't new.

A federal appeals court ruled Tuesday the controversial White House policy known as "Remain in Mexico" can continue while litigation over the policy plays out in federal courts.

The policy, officially called Migration Protection Protocols, requires some Central Americans who are seeking asylum in the United States to wait in Mexico for their immigration hearings.

A federal judge in California temporarily blocked the program April 8, but a three-judge panel of the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals later put that order on hold later that month pending the Trump administration's appeal. Tuesday's decision means the program will continue and that hundreds — if not thousands more asylum seekers — will be sent back pending future hearings.

The program began in California in January and was expanded to the El Paso ports of entries in March. Lawyers, faith-based groups and non-profit organizations in El Paso have since highlighted the significant impact the policy has had on being able to provide adequate representation to their clients, who they said are hard to track down in Mexico because shelter space is limited there and it's often unclear where their clients are staying from one day to the next. Lawyers also say their clients face threats and have expressed fear of living in border cities that are prone to violence.


Dec 20 2018 said:
In a major Trump administration win, migrants seeking asylum in the U.S. will now wait in Mexico as they wait for an immigration judge to rule on their case. Under the new plan, asylum seekers will be sent back to Mexico until they are scheduled to appear in front of an immigration judge, a process that can take up to four years, according to the American Immigration Council, a legal group.

 

AlexBasch

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,310
So not only he walked all over Peña Nieto but AMLO as well? Man, Mexican presidents ain't worth shit.
 

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,620
Here: (Spanish) https://www.elfinanciero.com.mx/nac...-unidos-para-evitar-la-aplicacion-arancelaria

Looking for an English source, since this one is light on details but it states that Mexico will allow asylum seekers to wait in Mexico while the US processes their requests, which historically has not been accepted.
That would be different from a Safe Third Country agreement though. For Safe Third Country, migrants coming through Mexico would have to make their asylum request for Mexico. What you posted means that migrants would still be making asylum requests for the U.S., but would have to wait in Mexico while the request is processed (and, given this admin, obviously rejected).
 

Bliman

User Requested Ban
Banned
Jan 21, 2019
1,443
No, you don't hate Trump. In literally every Trump related thread I read, you're in there spinning everything as a positive or "win" for him. Then you feign ignorance or do the old "I hate Trump but..." shtick to make it seem like you aren't.

It's insufferable. Just admit you support him.
What? There are people here that think I am a supporter of Trump. That's laughable. It is also an ad hominem attack. So maybe stick to the issue. And tell me why this isn't a win for Trump. Hasn't the Mexicans made concessions?
 

Midnight Jon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,161
Ohio
and now for the sealioning. just ignore all the posts demonstrating how literally no part of this "deal" is a new arrangement so you can get casa to post a few more times and also continue to dodge your weird reticence to out yourself as a trump supporter when you keep falling over yourself in every single fucking policy thread to claim it's a win for him
 

ChippyTurtle

Banned
Oct 13, 2018
4,773
That would be different from a Safe Third Country agreement though. For Safe Third Country, migrants coming through Mexico would have to make their asylum request for Mexico. What you posted means that migrants would still be making asylum requests for the U.S., but would have to wait in Mexico while the request is processed (and, given this admin, obviously rejected).

Thanks for the translation. Eh...the meat is basically "they aren't our responsibility". Remember asylum seekers are required to be housed and placed under U.S responsibility while their application goes through. Those images of those masses of people arriving at the border were for asylum applications. If Trump can say he stopped them from appearing, that's a win for his base.
 

Sqrt

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,880
AMLO is weak if the Mexicans blinked, but he appeased him with the new NAFTA bs so wouldn't be surprised. American public opinion, Democrats, and even major Republicans were against this move....why appease a bully when you had a lot going for you?
AMLO is facing very big short term problems in Mexico atm and doesn't want more. His moronic move of Mexico City's Airport just got blocked by a judge and hist austerity policies are doing a number on the economy. That's all there is to this.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,762
Thanks for the translation. Eh...the meat is basically "they aren't our responsibility". Remember asylum seekers are required to be housed and placed under U.S responsibility while their application goes through. Those images of those masses of people arriving at the border were for asylum applications. If Trump can say he stopped them from appearing, that's a win for his base.

The caravan disappeared after the elections though!

This also won't stop asylum seekers from coming. There are also no details about what percentage of those seeking asylum will stay in Mexico.
 

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,620
Thanks for the translation. Eh...the meat is basically "they aren't our responsibility". Remember asylum seekers are required to be housed and placed under U.S responsibility while their application goes through. Those images of those masses of people arriving at the border were for asylum applications. If Trump can say he stopped them from appearing, that's a win for his base.
Everything is a win to his base! He has never not spun something into a victory that his base ate up as a victory.

In any event, all I was talking about whether or not this is Mexico agreeing to Safe Third Country status, which as far has been reported so far, isn't the case.

(I didn't translate anything btw, just going off what Operations posted)
 

ChippyTurtle

Banned
Oct 13, 2018
4,773
Everything is a win to his base! He has never not spun something into a victory that his base ate up as a victory.

In any event, all I was talking about whether or not this is Mexico agreeing to Safe Third Country status, which as far has been reported so far, isn't the case.

(I didn't translate anything btw, just going off what Operations posted)

Remember when ACA failed to be removed as law and the Republicans were collectively throwing lead at each other? That's a loss no one can deny.
 

Bliman

User Requested Ban
Banned
Jan 21, 2019
1,443
Do more critical thinking then. He said he was going to put tariffs on and then didn't because of lip service.

He's not being clever and neither are you.
I love thinking. So help me out with this one? The Republicans hated if he would go through with this. But I don't think they would veto him. He only cares about his base. He then was called bluff by the Democrats. And you know by now that Trump hated it. So he was not afraid to use it. He rather would go through with this to show how tough he was. Mexico said they were going to send 6000 guards. But that wasn't enough for Trump. And it now seems that Mexico gave even more. So tell me where did I get it wrong?
 

Becks'

Member
Dec 7, 2017
7,467
Canada
This is horrific to those who are actually fearing for their lives.

But, if economic migration is the goal for some of the asylum seekers, they should just try to immigrate legally if they are qualified.
 

Dark_EMT

Banned
Apr 19, 2018
571
Trump was more desperate to cancel the tariffs than Mexico was, that's for sure.
I highly doubt that. Mexico exports so much to the US and the tariffs were going to increase every month. Mexico caved here. Their economy would have crumbled. Not only Mexico caters to Americans but also Mexicans living in the US. Have you seen the amount of Mexican products available pretty much everywhere?

Edit: meant to say Mexicans living in the US.
 
Last edited:

Bliman

User Requested Ban
Banned
Jan 21, 2019
1,443
I highly doubt that. Mexico exports so much to the US and the tariffs were going to increase every month. Mexico caved here. Their economy would have crumbled. Not only Mexico caters to Americans but also Mexicans living in Mexico. Have you seen the amount of Mexican products available pretty much everywhere?
You must be a Trump supporter to many here.
 

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,620
Remember when ACA failed to be removed as law and the Republicans were collectively throwing lead at each other? That's a loss no one can deny.
Trump has never framed that as a loss for him, but a failure of McCain's. Anytime he brings it up in rallies it's never "We lost on Obamacare," it's "McCain betrayed us but that's ok because I have some great, big beautiful healthcare coming soon."

Thank you. It seems like they didn't gave much. So it seems not so great win for Trump. But I bet some will see me as hiding again. But if you don't belief I am not a Trump supporter then that is your problem.
lol

Maybe next time wait for some details before showing your ass again.
 

xolsec

Member
Feb 18, 2018
1,685
I highly doubt that. Mexico exports so much to the US and the tariffs were going to increase every month. Mexico caved here. Their economy would have crumbled. Not only Mexico caters to Americans but also Mexicans living in the US. Have you seen the amount of Mexican products available pretty much everywhere?

Edit: meant to say Mexicans living in the US.

Tariffs were going to devastate México, of course they caved in. There was no other option.
 

Bliman

User Requested Ban
Banned
Jan 21, 2019
1,443
Trump has never framed that as a loss for him, but a failure of McCain's. Anytime he brings it up in rallies it's never "We lost on Obamacare," it's "McCain betrayed us but that's ok because I have some great, big beautiful healthcare coming soon."


lol

Maybe next time wait for some details before showing your ass again.
Why don't you say that to all people who responded after the deal broke. Or did they have more informartion. Or is it because I am honest.
 

AimLow

Member
Dec 10, 2017
969
I think his base has already made up their minds if they are voting for him again (the majority are), so even if this is considered a victory, it's really not adding any fuel to his campaign fire on that front. How this looks in the eyes of swing voters/undecideds, however, is far more important.
 

Dark_EMT

Banned
Apr 19, 2018
571
Tariffs were going to devastate México, of course they caved in. There was no other option.
Yeah, it's sad to see Mexico depend so much on the US. I wish Mexico would had developed better since it's independence. But the constant attacks from other countries (specially the US) to Mexico and the corruption never let Mexico fully develop to a world super power.
 

Doran

Member
Jun 9, 2018
1,847
Yeah, it's sad to see Mexico depend so much on the US. I wish Mexico would had developed better since it's independence. But the constant attacks from other countries (specially the US) to Mexico and the corruption never let Mexico fully develop to a world super power.

It can still grow! Beautiful country.